Sorry, you are wrong. We pay a local school tax and a state school tax.

And the receipts from both go right into the Moultonborough school system.
None of it is transferred to another municipality or school district.

It has not been transferred since 2011.

If we change back, then the SWEPT would be collected and redistributed... and since it would not all go back into the Moultonborough system... the local school taxes to be raised would need to make up for the difference.

The State figures the districts educational grant, minuses the SWEPT, and then should the district still need more, provides that money with the Lottery revenue (much like the Augenblick Formula) and covers the difference using unallocated funds... since the money from tobacco is drying/dried up... that is largely business taxes.

So if a district raises more than the total of its grant... it doesn't get any extra funding... but it doesn't send any money anywhere else. It is all used to offset the local school tax portion.

You have veered off topic
 

This thread started as a commentary on the HUB. We are not now a donor town, but the threat is always there because we are known as a tax rich town. We spend in excess of $30k each year for each child attending our schools. What this has to do with the HUB is probably this: when is enough enough?
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I have never viewed Moultonborough as a tax rich town. Rather it is a low tax rate town, which is one of many reasons why I choose to live here, and likely would continue to be a low tax rate town even with the addition of the HUB.

It's complicated because it doesn't actually go to the state but it raises more school money and in the richer towns cuts the amount the state gives them. It is still a mandatory STATE tax.

All State taxes are mandatory.
But since there is no ''donation'', it isn't a donor town to Franklin.

And since the Education Trust Fund grant money that does go to the other districts comes from mostly business taxes... that also would not be a significant factor in Moultonborough.

Moultonborough went from a farming community to a bedroom community, and it did so in about on half century.

But what does the next half century look like? That is the question that town voters will need to answer.
They may not get it right, but it almost certainly will not be what it is today.

Franklin was a huge mill town (city)... and it was doubtful that the voters at that time realized that the mills would not be there in the future. So it has suffered while it looks to rebuild on a different path.

What will Moultonborough be a half century from now? Right now, they are riding the Boomer Wave.

Here’s what you need to know:

SWEPT is part of a home or business property tax bill, which means it is remitted to the home or business owner’s town or city. The town or city does not give SWEPT money to the state, despite being called a “state tax.”
Since it is a “state tax,” it appears on the state budget as a part of the education trust fund. In practice and for accounting purposes, SWEPT money is counted as state funds. In reality, these funds are all locally raised dollars.
State law has required NH property owners to raise $363 million per year in SWEPT funds since 2005.
Whatever a town raises in SWEPT, is deducted from what the state would pay the town in adequate education grants and stabilization grants for their schools.
Most communities have additional local education taxes, since SWEPT funding and state funding (including adequate education grants and stabilization grants) do not cover the total cost for their local schools.
There is a legislative proposal this year to eliminate SWEPT all together.

I don't see a LSR for that...
Where did you find it?

Removal of SWEPT would require the State to raise an addition $363 million dollars through another format.

Which format are they proposing to do that through?

That was a 2019 legislative proposal...

It was voted down as the money would need to come from another tax source.
It is unlikely to be brought up, as we are attempting to lower taxation in other areas.

Moving back on topic--this is a fundamental point--Moultonborough has had very low tax rates for a long time. We can debate whether that's good or bad, or whether HUB is good or bad. But there's no question that HUB runs against the traditional approach/values of the town, an approach that current homeowners had in mind when they moved in.

As you might have sensed from some of my other posts (haha), I like change, progress, etc. But this kind of thing always rubs me the wrong way. I don't like it when people move to woodsy areas and cut down trees, or put in strip malls and shopping centers, or crank up the tax base on folks who just want to be left alone.

You just asked me where i got the info about where the money goes and so I sent you the link.

If you look at your tax bill you will see you are charged for:

Town Tax
County Tax
Local School Tax
State School Tax

That is all I am saying. I do not like to argue.

You might not have viewed it as a tax rich town but the state considered it to be one when we had the donor town taxes. Yes the tax rate is low, but the value of the town is high, thus a donor town. Little towns like Freedom which doesn't even have a school was a donor town and was contributing to town likes Manchester (not a donor town). Moultonboro, Tuftonboro, Wolfeboro, Alton---most if not all towns around the lake were donor towns. I can't remember if Laconia was or not.

It would no longer be a low tax town
 

If the HUB becomes a reality…UGH…. I don’t know how you can think that Moultonborough would remain a low tax town, given $20 million +/- for construction, plus annual maintenance costs, which will not be inexpensive.
My guess is the proponents of this will not want to charge for usage, but will want everything to be borne by the taxpayers.

No. I understand how the funding works.
I was asking about the legislative proposal ''this year'' to remove SWEPT altogether.
I could not find the LSR, so I asked for the link.

Based on bonding, probably increase the tax rate by 50 cents to $1...
that would still place Moultonborough in the bottom half of tax rates for the State.

I think the average tax rate is somewhere around $20/$21.

Not suggesting that the HUB is a reasonable expenditure; just that the low tax rate would still be a valid statement.

$1 isn't a huge sum, of course, but it would be something like a 14% increase on its own.

My biggest concern is that I just don't see it being useful to enough people. There are only two or three very small gyms in the area and what courts we have nearby are never busy.

I just don't see a need for meeting space and pools in such a small, seasonal town.

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And when these towns want to push the passage of something, they always say it will only cost .05 a thousand or .10 a thousand. But you take 400 thousand or for lake front a million and add a lot of other pet projects that only add a nickel or a dime or a dollar per thousand and it adds up.

NH tax rates
See "total rate".

https://www.revenue.nh.gov/mun-prop/...-tax-rates.pdf

And remember the operating costs will add forever

Commercial endeavor
 

In a perfect world, this HUB mania would disappear. Since that’s unlikely, I wish some group with significant financial backing would undertake this project, raising funds by selling interest in the project, and making it a for- profit project, something that many citizens from surrounding towns could use, and everyone would be happy campers, especially the taxpayers not being stiffed with the entire bill.

I think the town is too small to do that also. It won't be used enough to keep dues down to make it affordable that's why they want taxpayers to foot the entire bill . Let's hope the town will continue to vote this down

To FS's point, how many of the voting residents have million dollar lake homes?

The appeal from either side needs to be toward the voting center. They will be the ones that actually make such a decision.
In any of the voting districts, those are the people that actually set the policy and spending for the future.

So the $400K home owner that votes, may not want to spend $200 to $400 per year for something they feel they will never use.

Its all about appealing to the voters.

The problem with stuff like this is once that door is opened the flood gates are loosed. Give them an inch....

These things are inevitable as you move to a bedroom community.

Posted earlier in this thread was that the NH average cost per public school student is $18000 and that Moultonborough spends $30,000. If those numbers are correct, then Moultonborough voters are not at all afraid of being big spenders. You just have to whine a little and say "It's for the children" and you get your votes.

New preliminary tax assessments are just out in Moultonborough. From a sampling, looks like lakefront land increased 30.74%. With such large waterfront land changes, the burden for paying off the bonding on a project like the HUB further shifts onto the backs of those who do not vote ! All you need to do is "want" something and then get enough folks to support it on the basis that those who do not want or need it have to pay without any voice. When will logic and reason rule ???

When you say 30%, do you mean $.20 up from the $7 it currently is or 30% increase to assessed values?

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Waterfront land portion of assessed valuations appears up 30.74% vs last years assessed waterfront land values that are part of the total property assessed values. The tax mil rate per $1000 of valuation will be determined later in the year for the December billing.

Our assessment is up 26%. Land assessment increased 31%.

So what was the average increase?
Then you can tell if more shifted toward or away from you.

This. Be curious to see.

My assessment land up 30.7% and building up 16% ( have no idea why )

I think all the newly assessed towns went up quite a bit due to the market being so expensive. When the new assessments came out in Tuftonboro, everybody was pretty worried because they went up by these kind of amounts both on the lake and off. Everybody is just hoping the rate is much lower- with such high assessments it certainly should be-at least this year. Next year if a lot more projects get approved by voters, and therefore spending goes up, who knows what will happen to our taxes.

Not a lot of waterfront houses were on the market last year. At one point in sept there was one. Few waterfront houses raised the price but if sample is small is it valid . It doesn't look like they at all tyried to judge views etc since it seems the rising tide lifted all boats

You could argue validity of the assessment.
There is a process.

That's true. Very few for sale signs on the lake!!

New Assessments Get The Oxygen!!
 

*Moultonborough residents (year round / seasonal) take a look at the new "proposed" property assessments for 2023....the increases are staggering. We own a modest lake access home and our appraisal increased 26%! Nothing done in the way of improvements in the last 2 years....insanity! Perhaps the assessors are preparing for the inevitable housing bust?

No Lifeguards at our public beaches
No Swimming rafts
The Hub ?

Timing is everything.

perhaps at some point there will be a "need" for an indoor 18 hole golf course