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-   -   HUB status in Moultonborough (https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28246)

phoenix 11-19-2022 08:05 AM

From the minutes of the last selectman's meetings there was a discussion about using excess assessments to reduce the tax rate (had a large increase in assessed values) . Two wanted to leave the excess in additional reserve. The vote was 3-2 to reduce the tax rate. I wonder if the other two wanted to
increase in the reserve account for HUB. I am sure someone who was there might know.

tis 11-19-2022 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lakesregionguy (Post 378484)
perhaps at some point there will be a "need" for an indoor 18 hole golf course

:rolleye2: No kidding.

longislander 11-19-2022 09:02 AM

The Nov.3, 2022 discussion on the Unassigned Funds from 2022 was an attempt by two board members to "review and refill" the Capital Reserves accounts. The Capital Improvements Program Committee reviews every year, anyway. $1.9 million is the number that was discussed for this year's surplus.

Quote:

I wonder if the other two wanted to
increase in the reserve account for HUB.

More than likely.

CR148, the Community Center capital reserve account is the only one draining/drained. The Hub group talked the select board to appropriate $23,000 a while back, from this account, to pay some contractors to find out how much the cost will be for The Hub. The last town annual report shows a balance of a little over $27,000. Almost gone. A citizen at the meeting mentioned (tongue-in-cheek) they might as well use the remaining $4,000 or so to get a study on the annaul cost of maintaining the pool.

The last annual report shows a balance a total of capital reserves of $5.3 million or so with about 29 accounts or so.

Yes ... after a year, use taxpayer money to find out how much it will cost to build The Hub. Presumption is in anticipation of the May town meeting petition for the Hub and bond.

The last select board meeting of 11/17/2022 was supposed to annouce the new tax rate. A NH DRA issue temporarily prevented this from happening but should come out soon. With the 3 out of 5 select board vote to reduce the tax rate rather than take the tax money and fill some capital reserves should bring the the tax from the present 6.98/1000 to 5.xx/1000.

longislander 11-28-2022 08:38 AM

Moultonborough
Just got town eblast. Hope this tax rate is not a typo!

"Tax Collector: The confirmed Tax Rate for 2022 is $4.78. "

Year Total Municipal County Local Ed State Ed
2022 $4.78 $1.25 $0.80 $1.76 $0.97

2021 2022
$6.98 $4.78 Total tax rate

-$2.20$ -31.5%


https://www.moultonboroughnh.gov/sit...ory_-_2022.pdf

phoenix 11-28-2022 09:20 AM

well, it looks official. Good for selectmen Returning money to taxpayers

thinkxingu 11-28-2022 10:37 AM

When do assessment values change? Specifically, if residents paid half ($3.49) in July with a certain assessed value, will the assessed value be the same for the December bill?

And, if so, the equation will be assessment/1000 x 1.29, yes?

Sent from my SM-G990U1 using Tapatalk

longislander 11-28-2022 10:57 AM

The property tax year runs from April 1 through March 31. Property taxes are based on the assessed value of your property on April 1 of each tax year.

"The Town of Moultonborough bills twice each year. The first bill of the year is a partial payment, based on one-half of the previous year’s tax .,.. . This tax bill, printed and mailed out near the end of May, is usually due July 3rd every year."

"The tax rate is set in the fall of the year. The final bill is calculated using the new rate multiplied by your property’s assessed value as of April 1st less any payments made on the first bill. Printed and mailed in the middle to end of October, it is usually due December 1st each year. Interest at 8% per annum is charged on tax bills not paid by the due dates."

https://www.moultonboroughnh.gov/tax...illing-process


https://nhtaxkiosk.com/?KIOSKID=MOULTONBOROUGH

phoenix 11-28-2022 02:54 PM

so anyone whose assessed value that went up less than 31.5% should see a second half bill lower than the first half

longislander 11-28-2022 02:58 PM

Depends ....

https://www.depend.com/en-us/

longislander 11-28-2022 04:13 PM

Just got back in the house.
All kidding aside.
Just took a look at what my tax should be, if I'm doing this correctly:

old assessment X .00698 = old year tax = x 1/2 = last July tax, that I paid
new assessment X .00478 = new tax = x 1/2 = next tax for next July

This Dec tax:
new assessment X .00478 = new tax base less last July payment = this Dec.tax

Old and new assessments are on the town website property cards tax/gis.

ACME on the Broads 12-01-2022 10:12 AM

Moultonborough Tax Rate
 
Curious if anyone has been able thus far to validate if the discussed $4.78 number is in fact the new Moultonborough Tax rate?

Thank you in advance.

longislander 12-01-2022 10:17 AM

The moultonborough tax collector has posted on the town website. See attached.

https://www.moultonboroughnh.gov/sit...ory_-_2022.pdf

ITD 12-01-2022 03:35 PM

The tax rate is absolutely meaningless. What is this year's tax levy versus last year's?

phoenix 12-01-2022 03:46 PM

i guess i a confused. The assessment for each property has been finalized .My taxes for the year will be my assessed value x the tax rate. so to me its very meaningful

ITD 12-01-2022 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenix (Post 378926)
i guess i a confused. The assessment for each property has been finalized .My taxes for the year will be my assessed value x the tax rate. so to me its very meaningful

It is in that respect.

But the tax rate going up or down does not cause your tax bill to go up or down, the tax rate is merely a calculation that splits the levy among everyone.

The way that the tax collector in this town publishes the tax rate is not completely honest in my opinion. It gives the impression that taxes are going down. A more honest number would be to publish what the average value home will pay in taxes this year versus last year. I suspect the average tax bill increased this year unless something radical happened. The tax rate is meaningless.

FlyingScot 12-01-2022 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITD (Post 378928)
It is in that respect.

But the tax rate going up or down does not cause your tax bill to go up or down, the tax rate is merely a calculation that splits the levy among everyone.

The way that the tax collector in this town publishes the tax rate is not completely honest in my opinion. It gives the impression that taxes are going down. A more honest number would be to publish what the average value home will pay in taxes this year versus last year. I suspect the average tax bill increased this year unless something radical happened. The tax rate is meaningless.

When I read in comments in light of earlier extensive threads on assessments prior to tax rates being published, it sounds like you're more focused on a political point than what the actual bills will be. The assessments are finalized, the rate is critical info for every homeowner.

longislander 12-01-2022 08:33 PM

Quote:

The tax rate is absolutely meaningless. What is this year's tax levy versus last year's?
Tax Levy:IRS :
"A levy is a legal seizure of your property to satisfy a tax debt. Levies are different from liens. A lien is a legal claim against property to secure payment of the tax debt, while a levy actually takes the property to satisfy the tax debt."

tax rate X assessement = tax ... thank you! Keeps away the tax collector when paid.

Quote:

A more honest number would be to publish what the average value home will pay in taxes this year versus last year. I suspect the average tax bill increased this year unless something radical happened. The tax rate is meaningless.
When paying the town tax, most don't care about average tax bill. They care about their tax.
RE: Moultonborough, why not wait till the moultonborough taxes are sent out. Then see if tax went down. Then the conversations can begin on how "dumb" it was for the select board to return money back to the taxpayer, rather than spend on non-budgeted items.

John Mercier 12-02-2022 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITD (Post 378928)
It is in that respect.

But the tax rate going up or down does not cause your tax bill to go up or down, the tax rate is merely a calculation that splits the levy among everyone.

The way that the tax collector in this town publishes the tax rate is not completely honest in my opinion. It gives the impression that taxes are going down. A more honest number would be to publish what the average value home will pay in taxes this year versus last year. I suspect the average tax bill increased this year unless something radical happened. The tax rate is meaningless.

That is done during the annual budget, when monies are actually being allocated for expenditure.

Assessments don't change the budgeted expenditures.

TheProfessor 12-02-2022 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenix (Post 375397)
since this has been turned down for years why do we continue to elect selectmen who want it

GOOD QUESTION !

How that woman got elected is beyond comprehension.

Many years ago I had a witch for a tenant.
But was advised by the witch that witches are "good" witches.
As in the vein of Laurie Cabot below.

LINK

Go figure !

tis 12-02-2022 07:49 AM

Two reason these people keep getting elected- either people don't know how they stand or they are part of the crowd that has their pet project.

ITD 12-02-2022 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingScot (Post 378931)
When I read in comments in light of earlier extensive threads on assessments prior to tax rates being published, it sounds like you're more focused on a political point than what the actual bills will be. The assessments are finalized, the rate is critical info for every homeowner.

Please just read what I wrote and don't try to read my mind, you suck at it.

ITD 12-02-2022 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Mercier (Post 378941)
That is done during the annual budget, when monies are actually being allocated for expenditure.

Assessments don't change the budgeted expenditures.

Exactly John, I've been saying this for quite a while. Budgets also need to be voted on for the spending to happen.

Publishing a graph that shows tax rates decreasing, which is totally meaningless, makes me wonder why the tax collector does it?

ITD 12-02-2022 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by longislander (Post 378933)
Tax Levy:IRS :
"A levy is a legal seizure of your property to satisfy a tax debt. Levies are different from liens. A lien is a legal claim against property to secure payment of the tax debt, while a levy actually takes the property to satisfy the tax debt."

tax rate X assessement = tax ... thank you! Keeps away the tax collector when paid.



When paying the town tax, most don't care about average tax bill. They care about their tax.
RE: Moultonborough, why not wait till the moultonborough taxes are sent out. Then see if tax went down. Then the conversations can begin on how "dumb" it was for the select board to return money back to the taxpayer, rather than spend on non-budgeted items.

Levy means to impose, such as impose a tax on the town.

Part of the problem is that people don't want to understand this stuff. Those who want to spend more money love that. Letting people think that rising real estate prices are the reason taxes rise is deceptive. It needs to stop.

The government should not collect one penny more than it needs, having a surplus is a result of very poor planning IMO.



Side note: Is there a multi quote function in this forum?

John Mercier 12-02-2022 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITD (Post 378952)
Exactly John, I've been saying this for quite a while. Budgets also need to be voted on for the spending to happen.

Publishing a graph that shows tax rates decreasing, which is totally meaningless, makes me wonder why the tax collector does it?

I think the BOS started that.
In a City, the budget process is different than the towns... and I think the City Council wanted to somehow promote they were being conservative with tax dollars... even though the tax rate is actually not the real means to confer that.

I think the town BOS just followed along.

I would love to change town budget votes to some time right after people got a tax bill in the mail... that would really do the trick.

phoenix 12-02-2022 01:42 PM

Well for most its a drop ( my assessment went up 26% ) so this is a drop. i understand someone is paying more or at least.maybe new construction . of course John will role out his depends

John Mercier 12-02-2022 02:57 PM

Longislander did the ''depends''.

I don't know what the overall valuation increased in Moultonborough... so I don't know if 26% is good, bad, or par.

tummyman 12-02-2022 04:43 PM

Overall valuation up 24.05%........(2022) $4,892,023,118 vs (2021) $3,943,560,976

phoenix 12-03-2022 07:39 AM

Sorry john you are correct

ACME on the Broads 12-04-2022 08:58 AM

Some Input BOS
 
Perhaps one of our current (or past) selectmen could weigh in here, maybe Chuck Mcgee?

thinkxingu 12-07-2022 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thinkxingu (Post 378808)
When do assessment values change? Specifically, if residents paid half ($3.49) in July with a certain assessed value, will the assessed value be the same for the December bill?

And, if so, the equation will be assessment/1000 x 1.29, yes?

Sent from my SM-G990U1 using Tapatalk

I thought the answer to this was that the assessments stay the same for July/December, but it appears that's incorrect and that the assessments stay the same for December and the following July—at least that's what my tax bills show.

Also, December tax bills are ready!

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longislander 12-07-2022 07:44 AM

Quote:

I thought the answer to this was that the assessments stay the same for July/December
The do.

The assessmennts are effective as of April 1st ... April 1 to March 31

" ... all property taxes shall be assessed on the inventory taken in April of that year, ..."

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/V/76/76-2.htm


The tax rate changes for December

Go to this site. The assessment for both years should be there.

https://www.nhtaxkiosk.com/default.aspx




Since this thread started with "HUB status in Moultonborough", Moultonborough voters should be sure and take the survey:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1F...O4q1g/viewform

https://thehubmoultonborough.com/

longislander 12-07-2022 08:07 AM

Quote:

Exactly John, I've been saying this for quite a while. Budgets also need to be voted on for the spending to happen.
Budgets are voted on ... at town meeting. They can be changed there and modified etc. Some of us have motioned at the meetings, to change a lline item of the budget when the warrant article comes up, to change a number to 0 (zero). If majority vote agrees ... the line item changes to 0. Any other number or vote follows the same process.

thinkxingu 12-07-2022 08:17 AM

My assessment for this (December) bill was higher than for the last (July) bill.

Sent from my SM-G990U1 using Tapatalk

longislander 12-07-2022 08:42 AM

The July and December assessments should be based in the April assessment.

Your property card on the town tax/gis map should show 2020, 2021, 2022 assessments on the right side.

https://www.axisgis.com/moultonboroughNH/

If you went to the tax kiosk, there should have been the 2021 and 2022 assessments at the bottom left of each invoice.

Or, maybe you should call the tax assessor and ask what are your assessments

Name Title Phone
Thomas P. Hughes Town Assessor (603) 476-2347 x315
Tracy Cragin Assessing Technician (603) 476-2347 x306

I might have posted this prior:

https://www.moultonboroughnh.gov/tax...illing-process

tummyman 12-07-2022 11:04 AM

Maybe I do not understand your first sentence, but the June bill is based on the prior year assessed valuations. It is not updated to the new assessments as of April 1st until the December bill.

thinkxingu 12-07-2022 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tummyman (Post 379090)
Maybe I do not understand your first sentence, but the June bill is based on the prior year assessed valuations. It is not updated to the new assessments as of April 1st until the December bill.

Ok, that makes sense. I figured the April assessments would have been in place for the July bill.

Thanks!

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longislander 12-07-2022 02:06 PM

Quote:

the June bill is based on the prior year assessed valuations.
I believe it was due in July not June.
But, correcty, the 2022 first half-year tax bill was April 2021 assessment X 6.98/1000.

Maybe April of which year needs to be clearified. "Assessment" in any month, used in conversations can be confusing.

I may be wrong, but this December's tax bill is based on the April 2022 assessment x the new tax rate of the fall of 2022, less payments made against the 2021 assessment X old tax rate (2022 July bill). New tax rate doesn't happen till the fall which became 4.78/1000.

The tax that was due by 7/1/2022 was based on the April 2021 assessment x 6.98/1000 tax rate.

The December 2022 tax bill due 1/11/2023 is based on the April 2022 assessment x 4.78/1000 tax rate less payment on the July bill.

The July 2023 tax bill will be the April 2022 assessment x tax rate set in the fall of 2022 (4.78/1000)

Quote:

The tax rate is set in the fall of the year. The final bill is calculated using the new rate multiplied by your property’s assessed value as of April 1st less any payments made on the first bill.
https://www.moultonboroughnh.gov/tax...illing-process


Now, getting back to The Hub thread... How many MoBo residents on this forum have taken the survey? Why aren't you asking what is :

Quote:

Would you vote in support of building The HUB as designed, if the impact to taxpayers was LESS than $0.36/$1000 of town assessed property value?
Try extrapolating "the cost" of the Hub from that number and what did they use for assessed value.

Isn't this fun!

longislander 12-07-2022 02:30 PM

Mea Culpa!

Please note the above references to tax bills should be adjusted to acknowledge that tax bills are half year cycles.

thinkxingu 12-07-2022 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by longislander (Post 379079)
Since this thread started with "HUB status in Moultonborough", Moultonborough voters should be sure and take the survey:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1F...O4q1g/viewform

https://thehubmoultonborough.com/

I just took the survey.

Two of the questions have to do with tax increases (paraphrased): "would you vote for the HUB for $.06/$1k or $.36/$1k" tax impact? That's a pretty sizable gap.

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longislander 12-07-2022 03:01 PM

From the town eblast I got today:

"Tax Collector: The Tax Bills were mailed from our Printing Company on Monday, December 5, 2022. Please be advised that amounts will be posted online no later than Thursday, December 8, 2022. The due date for the 2nd Half Real Estate Taxes is January 11, 2023. Should you have any questions, please contact the tax office."

The kiosk seems to have the bill; at least mine seems to be correct, including the veteran's discount.

https://www.nhtaxkiosk.com/default.aspx


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