If this Vermont candidate gets elected she wants all motor boats taken off Lake Champlain. At 1:35 into the video she talks about it. She's my type of candidate. :laugh:

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But Today, It's The Noise on The Lake...
 

Now I'm curious what could have happened at Lake Champlain to bring this issue to such prominence in Vermont politics.
:confused:

You are correct: the video with the sharp images was located at ​http://www.brightcove.com/title.jsp?title=1155180898; however, that site is no longer available—"404".

I found references to the crash from a speedboat website that is now closed to public viewing of, the um..., speed, alcohol, drug, and moral "indiscretions" of their many members. :rolleye1: Other sites bemoaned the helicopters, as the need to show off for an aerial video camera appears too great to resist. :rolleye2:

The screenshot follows, with the areas highlighted in yellow of most interest:

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...pscf6deca4.jpg

.

Which is not to say, they are not without humor in the same thread:

:D



http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...ps3abf47c8.jpg

Again, the video and the accompanying narrative (above) is presented for members' perusal. Sometimes, proving a fact with videos and screenshots can't convince some viewers.
:look:

SIKSUKR, the driver that crossed 2½ lanes, then struck the rear of a stopped truck, and then was struck in turn by the dash-cam truck survived the ordeal! The torn roof of her car flew up to the truck's windshield, and appears below. A witness to the wreck also crossed over to the far right lane and stopped—to perhaps render EMT aid—or maybe leave a business card of his law firm.
:rolleye2:

Dash-cams have brought much scrutiny to inexcusable roadway behaviors. Here, we have only two boating videos, when there should be many more available showing the participant's attitude.

:look: headache. Cant we agree to disagree. We have plenty of laws but know plenty break them. We all have to be vigilant and careful.

That's perfect Rusty - see ya later! Vermont is nice this time of year. We'll all miss you. :laugh:

Bidding you farewell with this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM-mKx8UIGs

It would be great to see the offshore boat racing return to Winni. It was great fun watching them from the water with the helicopter following then seeing it on tv later in the year.

.....where have all the go-fasts gone?
 

Ya knows that before the 30mph-night, 45mph-day, speed limits on Lake Winnipesaukee became law in June, 2008, on just about the same day as a fatal, Diamond Island motorboat collision with the rocky island shoreline, happened at about 2-am on a rainy and foggy night....... the go-fast perfomance boaters were always out on the Lake Winnipesaukee water regardless the wind, rain, weather, day or night .....they were the hard core boaters who really wanted to be boating and were almost always out there.

Now-a-days, the number of boats and especially the number of performance boats on Winnipesaukee is no where near what it used to be before the speed limits. The personality of the lake has become a much quieter and less busy lake especially during the Monday-Friday, mid-week time.

So's, where did all the go-fasts go? Did they go to Lake Winnisquam which is the third largest NH lake and which has no speed limits, plus it has a good quality, free-to-use, state boat launch in Laconia behind Boulia Gourell Lumber on the Winnipesaukee River just about 100-yards north of Lake Winnisquam. Oh well ....where have they done gone to?

Well FLL.
 

Go fast boats may be gone but they are being replace by go fast 'toons. Ugly looking compare to the Arronow designed boats. You ask for it!

I think the real answer is the Economic collapse contributed to their disappearance !

It is not cheap, by any standards, to not just only purchase one- the least of the expense - but to run them. Remember it was not long ago that we had $4.75/gal gas prices.

Look in Paugus Bay at the amount of Real estate available ... in my humble opinion -- another example of the same.



and Broadhopper --- totally agree ....... SERIOUSLY, a Toon with twin 300's ?


.

We are still here. The lake needs rooster tails to help distribute the water properly.

A little aeration!!

So, this year I have seen 5 new Performance boats added to the lake!! 2 Cigarettes, a Fountain and 2 new Nortechs. And, I am sure that there are more. The lake is returning to its former greatness!!

Oh no, I will be edited if this thread starts up again! But yes, great to see.

That is good news. Owners of the GFBL boats have probably come to the realization that going slower on the lake is just as much fun as going fast. Glad they are coming back.

Tickets
 

And, the Marine Patrol is not going out of their way to write speeding tickets. They realize, even if some other people do not, that speed never was the problem.

I love seeing the fast boats out there. They are enjoyable to watch and it is nice that everyone can enjoy the lake in their own way.

Live free or die!!

What tickets?
 

According to marine patrol, speed has never been an issue! Only one ticket was issue when some bone head was speeding in the middle of the night! Something that any sane pilot would not do. The rest were for no wake, head way speed violations. Nothing new here.

There were a few citations giving when one goes the speed limit when it was not reasonable and prudent to do so. This foolishness was brought up many times but the supporters don't see this as a problem.

Having said that, I think the average speed on the lake may have increase! So has the number of violations and I don't see statistics that the lake is safer!

I don't think many of the GFBL boaters ever really left the lake. What you are seeing is the effect of fuel prices, and the economy. Boating as whole was down on the lake over the last couple of years. Gas Prices where high and the economy was sluggish. The economy is better, still sluggish, but better, and gas prices are down.

Even with my fuel efficient little bow rider, I was doing less boating over the last several years. And when I was boating I was not burning fuel that I didn't need to burn by running around fast. This year fuel expenses are down, the weather has been beautiful the boat is getting used, and yes I am running the boat faster and burning more fuel....

It was unfortunate that the time of the speed limit law, down turn in the economy, and rise in gas prices all came together as a package. People credit the speed limit with changes that where not really brought on by the speed limit itself.

Bottom line... GFBL boats didn't go anywhere they didn't want or intend to go anyway.... Factors such as the economy and gas prices changed the way many people used the disposable income. Thus performance boats on the lake slowed down, and weren't out as frequently... I am sure if someone had access to registry of motor vehicles, they would find that the percentage of performance boats to non performance boats registered really hasn't changed.

It funny that people believe the speed limit has made any difference at all. I still see the same nut jobs out on the lake causing the same old problems, none of which ever had anything to do with speed. I don't see anyone going any faster or slower for that matter then I did before. They only thing the speed limit has changed is perception. People Perceive the lake as safer because there is a speed limit in place. The problem is the "Cowboys" that cause the real problems are still out there, and the problems they cause have never been linked to speed.

Sorry I will step down from my soapbox.

A friend just put a Cigarette Cafe Racer on the lake, can't wait to take a ride in it!

The economy is improving, I see lots of boats at the gas dock at Ambrose Cove (I'm at $750 in fuel for the season so far:) miles per smile are much more important than gallons per mile/hour!)

Hope everyone has a great weekend!!

Do we really have to go down this path again?How many speed related deaths on Winni do we know about?a couple maybe?Certainly have been dozens of non speed related including the latest by Governors Island.

It's amazing, Rusty. As I cruise in my GFBL, I have pontoon boats, bass boats and PWC's screaming by me all the time. Outrageous!

PS: Has anyone seen that orange Nor-Tech Super Cat parked at the condos just south of the NASWA? What a SWEET machine that is!

i saw that being launched at Irwin on Sunday, and then saw it flying down the bay for its inaugural. I love it, want a ride in it, but don't want to own it

Developed in 1924...

Let's hear it for century-old discoveries.

:rolleye2:

They are part of the group we will be having fun with this morning at the Easter Seals Poker Run at NASWA. Time to let the puppies run!

That boat is gorgeous. I spent all day Saturday at a friend's house on Rattlesnake and saw that boat go by at what looked like WOT. It was awesome. Those surface piercing props really kick up monster rooster tails.

I saw countless boats totally ignoring the speed limit and it was great to see that people have realized that it's totally unenforceable out in the Broads.

...Well, SOME Folks Read The Warning...
 

So the NHMP wasted both ink and trees to print this warning in its own "NH Boaters Handbook"?

:confused:

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...psqsxtat2p.jpg

This is perfect and how speeding should be defined. I saw no mention of numbers but as to when any speed is illegal. Could be 20 mph or could be 100 mph depending on the situation.

It seems to me that the only place excessive speed causes a larger wake and potential damage is in a NWZ or at idle speeds, which seems to be a different discussion entirely.

No, they did not waste ink or trees. They essentially reiterated what we knew all along.

You are easily confused.

I am not trying to stir the hornets nest here... But with that rule in the rule book, why is it we need a speed limit???

Just thinking out loud is all....

I will not be redundant and repeat SIKSUKR comment... But I think he sums it up quite nicely.

You can go 200 MPH or even faster if you want to, but the law is this:

X. (a) No person shall operate a vessel on Lake Winnipesaukee at a speed greater than is reasonable and prudent under the existing conditions and without regard for the actual and potential hazards then existing. In all cases, speed shall be controlled so that the operator will be able to avoid endangering or colliding with any person, vessel, object, or shore.
(b) Where no hazard exists that requires lower speed for compliance with subparagraph (a), the speed of any vessel in excess of the limit specified in this subparagraph shall be prima facie evidence that the speed is not reasonable or prudent and that it is unlawful:
(1) 30 miles per hour during the period from 1/2 hour after sunset to 1/2 hour before sunrise; and
(2) 45 miles per hour at any other time.

http://gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html...-D/270-D-2.htm

As the economy improves....
 

....and gas prices remain stabilized, I believe you will see a steady return to the Lake of performance boats. The incorporation of the NHMP into the State Police didn't bring new resources or different powers, as some insinuated, it actually saved money by reducing redundant administrative staff. I have the utmost respect for the men and women at NHMP, but realize that they are understaffed and will remain so now and into the foreseeable future.

Just like on our highways and byways, most have figured out that it is fairly easy to significantly exceed speed limits ( and many other regulations ) with very little chance of being caught. There simply isn't enough, nor will there be, law enforcement on our waterways to prevent it.

Whether you are an ardent supporter or totally against the speed limit law, be prepared to see more folks driving the Lake like they've driven our roadways for years. With not enough resources to effectively enforce the new regulations, it was inevitable. Me? I hope the economy continues to strengthen and gas prices remain stable! ;)

Rusty, we all know what the law is... None of us are questioning that...

People are forgetful at times so I thought it would be a good idea to refresh their memory. ;)

Welcome back Skip. Very well written post.

Excessive Speed vs Speed Limit
 

There are a good number of boaters that actually believe the lake speed limit ruling actually supersede the excessive speed ruling. They will argue to the moon, this is so. My interpretation is that the excessive speed ruling prevails when the speed is less than the limit. Correct me if I am wrong but it is common sense.

Mr Pilliod, the bill primary sponsor actually convince the speed limit supporters that the enforcement is and will be there to enforce the law. Kind of a bold statement when the truth says otherwise.

Skip is right, administrative cost has been reduced, but staffing remains the same, actually the staffing is less today than it was when the SL became law. Somehow we need to convince the legislature the lake is no more safer today than it was before the SL law. The gold dome is convinced our waterways are safe.

The lake was NEVER unsafe...
 

I have to chime in here...

The lake was NEVER unsafe.... considering the number of boats of all types sharing lake Winnipesaukee.. we have VERY FEW to the point of almost 0% boat collisions... the speed limit has done nothing to add to nor detract from the safety of the lake. It is a "feel good" law passed by people who didn't like performance boats.

IMHO this lake is as safe as it is for lots of reasons...

The first and most important being the 150' rule... no place else has this rule regarding boat vs. boat spacing on the open water. Even if they come well within 150' of you, there is very little risk of collision.

The Boater Safety Certificate has also helped... although some might argue otherwise.

If people think Performance boats left.. well they are sadly mistaken. The poor economy more than anything else curtailed their use. Not rules, not regulations.

Woodsy

I disagree with this, and my reason is essentially summed up in your next statement:
There are 4 primary things here as it relates to this and safety:

1) A rule (150' separation) that is effectively unique to Winnipesaukee
2) Boaters on the lake with no clue at all to proper "rules of the road" and boat operation
3) Boaters on the lake who are familiar with boating, but primarily due to experience on other bodies of water
4) Boaters who are mostly limited to Winnipesaukee but are seasoned and knowledgeable.

Every boater essentially falls into one categorization of 2, 3 or 4. The problem is that you never really know WHICH category they fall into. If someone falls into category 3, I don't care if they come closer than 150' to me, as long as they are overall operating safely and carefully. Someone in category 4 will probably generally try to stay 150' away, but might violate that rule in tight spaces, etc. Someone is category 2 is totally unpredictable.

So, I can't rely on other boaters to maintain a 150' separation on their own, and if someone gets too close I can't tell if they do so out of ignorance of the rule, incompetence, or something else.

There are also lots of people unable to accurately judge 150', so they come too close, or think I am too close, or they veer too far off-course and make their route seem erratic when you are trying to gauge how/where your two vessels will cross.

I don't see the 150' rule as being reliable enough to create any real safety aspect, to me it just seems like another feel-good law with good intentions but bad effect.

Brk...


I agree on your classification of boaters... but I disagree with your assessment of the 150' rule.

The one thing that needs to be considered with your assessment is the percentage of the different classifications...

1) A rule (150' separation) that is effectively unique to Winnipesaukee

Its actually Unique to NH (this changes the percentages)

2) Boaters on the lake with no clue at all to proper "rules of the road" and boat operation.

This is probably the lowest percentage of boaters on the lake... at best 3-5% These are your renters and newbies. I think they are the biggest violators, but they are the smallest % of boaters on the lake.

3) Boaters on the lake who are familiar with boating, but primarily due to experience on other bodies of water.

This is another low percentage group... probably 4-5%% We do not see a lot of out of state boats on Winni. Because they have experience, they know most of the navigational rules and the probably have some knowledge of the 150' rule. No doubt they tend to shave the distance more often than not because their experience leads them to believe there is no danger if you are closer than 150'


4) Boaters who are mostly limited to Winnipesaukee but are seasoned and knowledgeable.

This makes up the majority of the boaters on Lake Winni... a good 85% at least. Group 4 is why the 150' rule works... Group 4 is the reason there are very few Boat vs. Boat collisions on Lake Winnipesaukee. They are the majority and they know the rules.

I personally don't get too twisted when someone comes within 150' while on plane unless they are danger close... within 50'. I know of the 150' rule and I am very aware that regardless of the rules, or who violated the rules... The 1 CARDINAL rule is "the Capt is responsible for the safety of the vessel & crew". So in crossing situations, if it looks like the guy doesn't know the rules... I will slow down, alter course slightly or come to a complete stop if I have to.


Woodsy

Maybe we should only allow pontoon boats
 

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So, it looks like Winnfabbs or some other similar sorry group of individuals are not happy that the performance boats are back and have resorted to routinely bothering the Marine Patrol by calling in to complain about noise and performance boats once again. What a crock.

It must be tough to sit at your waterfront home and have to listen to a powerboat pass by. I really feel sorry for you and your outlook on life if that is how you feel.

Its just too bad that the MP has to waste their time to placate the selfish needs of the few that do not know how to get along with others or enjoy their life without complaining.

The only logical answer I can give you is that some alliances don't give up and others do.

BTW it is called "Winnipesaukee Family Alliance for Boating Safety" (WinnFABS).