Meredith NWZ Petition / Hearing
 

I stumbled upon the following petition this morning and thought the greater community should be aware as it has a significant impact on the NWZ in Meredith. I would like to add that the NWZ currently in place is big, this only makes it bigger!

Petition:
https://www.nh.gov/safety/divisions/...e-petition.pdf

Hearing:
https://www.nh.gov/safety/divisions/...ay-hearing.pdf

The public hearing is September 30, 2016 at 5:00 pm, Meredith Community Center, Room B, 1 Circle Drive, Meredith

Current NWZ:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/jx...A=w643-h347-no

Proposed Based on Tax Map:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/ZT...A=w643-h357-no

I would also point out there appears to be a discrepancy between Tax Map U15, Lot 45B and the wording indicating 65 Pleasant Street, Meredith, NH 03253

Tax Map U15:
http://www.meredithnh.org/Joomla/pdf...axmaps/U15.PDF

Tax Map U02:
http://www.meredithnh.org/Joomla/pdf...axmaps/U02.PDF

that is absurd, the current one is about 1000 feet two long, no need for it other than biz and Money on the area have an agenda for themselves

I'm not usually in favor of tighter restrictions and have no dog in this hunt except that I valet out of Meredith Marina.
I have been on that gas dock and operating in the zone and witnessed boats that come into the NWZ at speed, only to shut down after the buoy is passed and also boats inside the zone that seemingly, ignore or have no clue what "no wake" means.
This happens all over the lake, however, not just in Meredith.
I believe this is an enforcement problem as in my short time on the lake, there is never any law enforcement in sight where these issues are most, prevalent.
Residents and businesses that have to endure the aftermath of ignorance of the speed laws, will eventually take action.
We'll see how this pans out I guess...

Make all of Meredith Bay NWZ
 

Might as well make the whole bay a NWZ. :eek: Anchor Marie and Akwa Marina could make the very same case. The marina and club has existed all this time and boat traffic on the lake as many have stated on this site is NOT at its peak. This would set and extremely bad president.

What's the fuss...?
 

Sorry, but I don't see the big deal on this one. If you draw the imaginary line from the last "No Wake" buoy over near Church Landing, across in front of Meredith Marina to Bayshore Road, that is an area that is pretty tight and fairly close to shore anyway. There are always lots of paddleboarders and kayakers in there, as well as boaters going slow anyway to approach Meredith Marina gas dock and rental slips. You also have the folks that have rented boats from MM, many of whom could be novice, less-skilled boaters, who could use the "calm" waters before heading out.

I'm not one for more regulation, and I love the thrill of hitting the gas on my Formula, but I don't see making that tight section over in the corner an extension of the NWZ as a huge issue. It is not a section of lake that lends itself to higher speed boating anyway. Just one dude's opinion...:)

I will say the gas dock issue at Meredith Marina noted in the petition is quite true. I never stop there for gas on any busy day unless absolutely necessary as you do get pounded by boat waves. Same holds true for Shep Browns...

Dan

I call BS! This problem can be better solved by enforcing the existing NWZ.

Woodsy

Woodsy, You are spot on with your solution of enforcing what is there for NWZ. We are on the west side of the bay and see the violations of the NWZ every weekend. The sad part is that more than 75% of the violators are coming in /out of the Marina, Yacht Club or Gas Docks. If the MP would put a couple more buoys between the western shore and the current buoys this line would be better to see.

But Woodsy, people will have to learn that no wake means no wake, not 6 MPH.

You are absolutely correct that changing the current NWZ is absurd. Boaters will need to be present at the hearing on September 30th to voice concerns against this proposal.

I think the issue here is monster of their own creation... the existing NWZ is so long that people wait until the last minute to slow down when entering and speed up as soon as possible when exiting. This is causing some big waves right at the NWZ line. Adding on a few hundred feet of NWZ just moves the problem a few hundred feet more up Meredith Bay. Then those folks further up will start to squawk!

A few more buoys down the existing NWZ line and some better enforcement is all that is needed. Or shorten the existing NWZ.

Woodsy

I agree 100%

Dan

With no enforcement...
 

Every law is useless.

If the MP let people know that they will enforce this NWZ, then people will become wary of it and will respect it.

It's sort of like some of the small towns in my area. One town is very TOUGH with speeders and their roads are driven almost always at or under the posted speed limit, but this took a lot of tickets, and the resulting word of mouth over a few years. They have a reputation of being tough, and they continue to be someone tough, with warnings or tickets.

Other small towns aren't as rigorous in enforcing the posted speed limits and people tend to drive essentially the same road (just a couple of miles down) at what the road will support (which often a bit over the posted speed limit).

IMHO, if the MP enforced the current area, and it had a reputation of such, the word will get out and it will be an improved situation for everyone. Perhaps even people will slow down well before the NWZ.

But just changing the NWZ out a further distance doesn't solve anything if it's not enforced.

But it's too late for this now, as a hearing is already scheduled, and most would prefer to talk about it, rather than show up at the meeting to voice their concerns or opposition to this.

This is not a new NWZ, and as such, I don't have a strong feeling in one way or the other, but in general, as a boater, I prefer fewer NWZs and NRZs than more.

In this case, all those in this area are aware of the issues when they purchased (or rented/leased) their slip, as they have been like this for years. It's almost like someone buying a home next to an airport or gun club and then complaining about the noise. The lake has been much busier in the past, it's just that we've had a lull in most recent times.

Why do something like that when it is much easier to create a new rule to make it look like you did something?

Well the idea is to make you feel better. Do you? ;)

I feel something, but it's not better, at least to me. ;)

Where is that defined? I've only ever seen No Wake Area defined in NH law as headway speed and headway speed defined as 6mph or the slowest speed that a boat can be operated and maintain steerage way. But unfortunately, that doesn't say if it's the lesser or the greater of the two. But in either case, "not leaving a wake" isn't part of the definition.

Your post is true, though to avoid scrutiny, its been my experience to have relatively flat water at your stern in no wake zones.

depasseg....

I am pretty sure Tis was referencing my many posts on the subject of Headway Speed / No wake. Every summer here it becomes a hot topic. :) I am a big fan of rewriting the definition.

The issue they are having in Meredith really isn't about headway speed /NWZ but more of the water disturbance caused by the boats coming on/off plane at the entrance/exit of the NWZ.

Woodsy

Meredith's NWZs Aren't THE Problem...
 

That "monster" is actually the growing number of "over-sized" boats. You may recall that ten years ago, I called for a doubling in registration fees—and doubling them again—for boats over 24-feet long.

Huge wakes are being produced all over the lake—even Winter Harbor is suffering, as it has become a mecca for every type of boating.

This is especially true of recent years, as Johnson's Cove has become jammed with huge (and illegally spaced) rafters: most of whom "mush" their way past eroding shorelines to their rafter's safe haven.

Below is a wake recorded that, while it was not the biggest we've witnessed, is still one of concern to those who want their lakeshores to avoid ending up filling the lake with fertilizer, road salt, dirt, loam, forest duff, moss, and (worse) silt. Shoreline moss is not supposed to appear floating on the surface of the lake—but it does! :(

I calculate this particular wake at 46-inches—something we never see when thunderstorms storms hit directly upon our shoreline.

Your attention to the "wet part" is requested. :rolleye1:

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...pshl9no55y.jpg
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i1...psudkr6bzc.jpg

Surface areas of our 35-year-old dock are now so covered with wet, slippery, algae, that they've become hazardous. :eek:

The problem here is mostly "over-sized" boats seeking haven from their own hazardous local waters. :eek2:

This photo-disguised boat (below) is not the largest one we saw this weekend towing tubes, but it should give pause to those who think "over-sized" boats are free of this recent anathema to peaceable boaters and shorelines.

So you want to keep large boats off the largest lake in the state? Makes perfect sense. :rolleye2:

Perhaps the problem isn't the "oversized boats", but it is the oversized homes that then install their own dock and its surrounding landscaping that is disturbing the natural forest that took years to grow and which surrounds the lake?

Fertilizer, road salt, dirt, loam, forest duff, moss, and (worse) silt, are not falling off the back of boats, but are the certainly the result of homes being built on the shores of the lake. Perhaps you should look in the mirror before casting stones from your glass house?

See, it can go both ways. ;)

24 feet is large? I think you need a reality check.

Go watch some of the recent wind wave videos this year and tell me they aren't causing as much or more damage.

So, who gets to decide if there is such a thing as "over sized" for Winnipesaukee?

Who will determine what the maximum acceptable size is?

Why is it acceptable to financially penalize people who need enough room to stay overnight on their boat with their kids and want to enjoy Winnipesaukee?

Perhaps you may want to adjust to the times and raise your dock by a foot or so. The lake has changed from what it was 30 or 40 years ago and it will always be changing. It is predominantly a power boat lake with a very small percentage of sailboats. People who cannot accept the changes and think you should be able to kayak across the broads on the Fourth of July may be happier on a smaller lake that better fits with their needs and expectations.

I would not want to look out at the lake every day and have complaints about what I see. I enjoy seeing all of the different types and styles of boats go by.

Yes, I agree with this whole post!

And I want to add, why is it ok to financially penalize people who choose to buy a larger boat to weekend on, instead of a waterfront or island property to do about the same thing?

The lake is a wonderful resource that we all can share. When you hear kids laughing (screaming), boats enjoying the water (loud engines and wakes), music (too loud or not your choice of genre), it's all people enjoying the lake.

Instead of looking at these people with a sour face and trying to say that they are enjoying the lake in a way that you do not approve, just be happy that we have such a wonderful resource to enjoy.

No, I'm not promoting that everyone should be too loud, or too damaging, or too obnoxious, but these are the sounds of summer on the lake. If you don't like this sort of activity, perhaps you should own property on a much smaller lake or perhaps a pond where there isn't enough water depth to allow for such activities. Don't try to make Lake Winnipesaukee something different than what it is. It's use and activities will always evolve with time.

Enjoy and be appreciative. Fill your camera with photos of people that are enjoying the lake, and smile while doing I, instead of wasting your your time by trying to capture photos of people doing things that you don't like. Your life and heart will be filled with much more joy! You'll probably even smile more! :D

Now back to the Meredith NWZ discussion ;)

Speaking of large wakes.....I'm amazed at the size of the wakes produced by the wake board boats.They are designed with to take on extra weight in the ballast tanks and it keeps them on 3/4 plane.
Wakes appear to be 3' to 4'

they can add ballast (pump in water to ballast tanks) to their hulls to create wakes, some have multiple tanks

I really think the problem is that the NWZ here is way too long and so people try to get speed as far as they can so it does not take them 10 minutes to get to the docks. there really is no reason for an area of that size to have a no wake zone in the first place, I think those proposing the larger nwz are being undone by their own doing in the first place with the large one they already have and most would not have a problem if they actually pushed back the NWZ further into the bay say the church landing point over to just past the little island

The good ones have multiple tanks or bags! :laugh:

My opinion is the Meredith NWZ should be made smaller, not larger. It is already too large and when you look at what is going on and do some thinking about what you are seeing, the only real solution is to reduce its size and to change the angle of the current NWZ line so that boats would want to come off plane farther away from the docks near MM.

R2B

I agree! They make a huge wake!

We have one that goes around and around in the Barber Pole!!

The wake board boat's wakes are absolutely horrible. Our loon chicks have been separated from their parents by these waves.We lost one chick. Not sure if the wake was the culprit or not. One of these boats resides in a residence in Green's Basin and several came in over and over during the summer to wake board in the basin. A friend will not even paddle board when they are out there. Another friend's boat was damaged. Let's not even mention the erosion to our shorelines. I have been on the lake for 60+ years and I have never seen anything like it! I think the wakes could lead to a safety problem if someone ( especially a youngster) is in the water near shore. They are like ocean waves.

Really? I don't see that in any of your pics. Just sayin...

I have to chuckle at that one...WTH is the all-fired, rush for heaven's sake?
There's no way it takes 10 min to reach the docks at headway speed...it only takes 9! :D
I have been there and approaching the docks and have had people cruise by me to attempt to get there first...obviously, doing faster than headway.
I just shake my head...

Action?
 

Complaining here won't change much If you really want change:
1. Contact your local rep/senator to require speed limit changes, NRZ, etc. by the legislature, not the Commissioner of Safety.
2. Mandate that hearings be held in July/August, not September 30
3. Mandate that at least two hearings be held, 12 months apart

There is no reason that those who are complaining about the size of the Meredith NWZ can't file a petition to reduce the NWZ to some other size and produce a second set of hearings and give the Commissioner pause for thought. These changes occur because the petitioners show up and the opponents do not. Simple.

I don't want to re-start the issues over speed limits, but the process is the same in terms of who shows up, and who yells the loudest.

Call (not email) your state Reps and Senators (candidates) instead of whining to each other.

Vote on September 13.

12 months?
 

Maybe 6 months apart? 12 months would just bring it up at the same time a year later.

Wake Board boats
 

Absolutely agree Green Basin Girl. Camp Belknap went from a ski boat to a Wake Board Boat last year being leased from Melvin village Marina. The boat creates huge waves and is very loud especially at 6:30 AM. The point being they don't wake board. They use the boat just for tubing and occasionally water skiing. Melvin Village Marina leased the wrong boat for what they use it for. The neighbors are getting frustrated with the large waves it produces and the open exhaust. Yes complaints have been submitted to the Director. We love everything about one of the best YMCA camps in the country but it is the wake board boat we don't love.