URGENT: Gilford boat launch ordinance
 

Folks,
The Gilford Planning Board voted to "not recommend" the citizens petition spear-headed by Stephen & Maureen Nix. HOWEVER, the decision will ultimately be made at the Gilford Town meeting in March.

I have attached the public document from the Town of Gilford that shows the 19 people (only 14 individual residences) who signed the petition and its wording. Perhaps our webjedi Don can post a follow-up and embed the text into the thread.

What I'm not sure about is would this ordinance comply with NH state law as it involves access to a state body of water.

Do a Google of Stephen Nix. He's an attorney. The best way to fight this type of individual is to lock horns with them. If they don't like boats, don't live on a lake.

There seems to be more and folks moving to the lake and thinking they can take control. I was told this is only the beginning.

JMHO and observation:
A quick review of the petition and who signed only finds that 2 of the petition signers reside directly on the water. 82 Dinsmore Point Road - James F. Bright, MD Portsmouth, NH. 68 Belknap Point Road - Douglas P. Hill, Real Estate Closing Atty. Meredith & Gilford Conservation Commission Member...Hmmm.

Also Atty. Stephen Nix lives just to the south and off Rt 11. He could have some waterfront but I did not look into that.

I am guessing of the first 2 pages of signers that most are acquaintences or have some relationship. They do not all live near each other in Gilford and it could be that (assuming he started it) Mr. Nix, an attorney from Gilford, stood at a particular location and got people to sign. I am very doubtfull of that. More likely there is another link between them like they are his (Nix's) clients? :eek:

Of the Petioners, Dr. Bright, Atty. Hill and Atty. Nix live the closest to Ames Farm so to me it appears it is their axe to grind.

Nix was listed as the C/O Atty. in 2006 for a lobbyist, David G. Collins, for the New Hampshire Lakes Property Association. Currious! No current links to this association could be found though.

Anyone here know of Atty. Nix, Atty. Hill or Dr. Bright????

It does seem odd that the direct abutters to Ames don't have any complaints. This is more than a personal vendetta from that neighbor. There must be a hidden agenda.How is he looking to benefit from this? Ames' legal fees must be killing them !

This is what happens when Lawyers have too much time on their hands, what's next move RT 11 ??

Three of the signers are members of the Conservation Commission: Douglas Hill. Charles Coons and Lawrence Routhier.
http://www.gilfordnh.org/Public_Docu...Comm/conserve2

We're watching
 

Makes you wonder who on the forum is among the petitioners.....

I guess I do not understand... The petition as written does not say public or private boat launch. Either way, the Gilford shoreline is what it is at this point. I don't think you could find 1500' shoreline in Gilford where new construction would even be available for this to even matter (I may be wrong). In any instance wouldn't Ames Farm be grandfathered anyway??....

Please tell me what I am missing which I am sure is a lot!

For the record, Ames Farm in my opinion has always been a wonderful place for non waterfront people, NH residents and out of state residents to launch boats for many many years and should be left that way. They are and always have been a great neighbor in the Gilford community (I think???).

They also have a great restaurant!! :-)

Dan

Specifically it would prevent Ames Farm from operating as they previously did with a public boat launch. Realize that just because a facility is not "free" it is still considered a public launch. It also prevents even public boat storage as well.

Notice the language about not only residential lots but those in their "natural state" could never be used for a public launch if the luanch was within 1500 ft. That's over a 1/4 mile (0.284 mile to be exact) away. I don't know many, if any places around the lake where there is a 1/4 mile distance to a residence.

There is one gotcha that I would stick up their tailpipes that I'm going to withhold so as not to tip them about what makes the ordinance not air-tight. It actually could work against the homeowners. He must not be a very good lawyer;)

Thanks L.P.

But what about West Alton Marina or Fay's Marina... which also allows anyone who pays the minor launch fee to anyone which certainly have abutters within 1500'... Are they going to be shutdown because of this or are they grandfathered???

Sorry...Still confused...

Da

No, even if this passes they could not shutdown WAM or Fay's. This is a local zoning ordinance proposal for Gilford only. Fay's is already a legally permitted use as a marina. What I don't know is which lots/business owners would now become non-comforming. That is a big deal when owning property.

Another issue with the ordinance is how it addresses launch ramps already in operation. There are some private ramp owners who may not be getting what they are bargaining for if this passes. I'll leave it at that.

Maybe I am incorrect on this, but I think the voting in March will probably be an all day, 7am-7pm, private ballot as opposed to a show of hands at say 11:12pm. Probably, the more voters who vote makes it a better vote in that it is decided by a more democratic process.


Gilford is an SB-2 town.

Zoning articles go on the secret ballot along with election of town officials, this is true even in SB2 towns.

If passed, all existing use public ramps would not be impacted unless they wanted to expand. Ames Farm is not an existing use public ramp as they have been shut down. Passage would keep them from reopening.

In fact passage would preclude any future public ramp as there is no shoreline that would meet the requirements.

I think I've done my part ;) This is a case where the impacted parties are under-represented. Access to the lake is a big concern.

What I am still not sure of is would the ordinance comply with NH State law. There's a tangled web when you are dealing with shoreland regulations and gets out of my league quickly.

The public parking area which requires you get a permit by lottery and be a Gilford Town resident in Gilford would be a non-conforming use if this passes as I interpret that ordinance. Betcha the town fathers will love that when they realize they've been jilted :laugh:

.....hey lawn psycho.... I'm not a Gilford resident.... and I bet there's plenty Winnipesaukee trailer-boaters who appreciate your efforts with this.....

Probably one good reason why the 2nd, 3rd, & 4th largest NH lakes, Newfound, Squam, & Winnisquam all have State of NH boat launch facilities with double launching ramps, docks, toilets, and parking, while Winnipesaukee does not is because Ames Farm Inn was the defacto public ramp, along with all the various town and private marina ramps.

Did you know the NH Fish & Game Dept likes to set up at Ames Farm for fish species monitoring via the fisherman who return to the Ames dock with fresh caught fish.

Try to fish swim or boat near the point north of Ames and you will meet the petitioner. He will be out there yelling at you.

Harassment
 

Good, let him yell at me. Then he'll find himself on the other side of the law. I know where I will be spending extra time this summer. I'm not kidding.

L.P. you tell me when and I will meet you there.. Our own little "legal" protest!

Then you can join me in Braun Bay!

Sounds fun, I'll bring the whole family. :laugh: My daughter can cry on cue and my kids like to scream and splash when they swim. :D

Count me in !

I can pull my mufflers for the day if you like? :eek::laugh::D - I'm being sarcastic before anyone reads into this....

Fire-up up the barby.....
 

Sounds like we're going to have a Forum Regatta. Should be a blast. Now we just have to wait for ice-out:(

Plan on it

Re-adoption of NHF&G rules
 

Along these lines, NH Fish and Game is holding a hearing (Monday I beleive) and a public comment period (ending the 20th or 21st) for the readoption of rules regarding boat access facilities.

It does not look like any language has changed it just appears to be housekeeping, but just FYI.

I wonder if NHF&G would have something to say about the Gilford proposal?

I want in too!:D

Winter Protest
 

Does it make sense to have a "Snowmobile" Reggatta this winter, or maybe that's the BEST fishing spot on the lake for the derby........I think someone told me that's where all the big lakers are :laugh:

I like the way you think:D

Maybe I should buy an old porti-pottie and convert to a bob house.

Ice Racing
 

maybe we can return the old 'ice jalopies' to Winnipesaukee. Right off this point will be a great place. plenty of parking off the Ames Farm property!

'VROOM VROOM!' :D

Since he is retired he is most likely in a warmer climate.

Ah, but you see when he gets the ire of the neighbors because he decided to be a bully and people are protesting he'll have to deal with it from both ends.

And you can bet that anything done in that area will make the rounds of the rumor mill quickly regardless of where he may or may not be.

If we ban together we can literally drive the man insane if he's truly been known to yell at people on the lake.

We might have to have a meeting of the minds and figure out a plan to show our position on election day.

I think all who want to participate should set a date and have an impromtu forum fest winter carnival meeting at that area. Any one up for it? Maybe the fine folks at Ames will allow us to park.

I'm up for it. I don't have a snowmobile so I have to bum a ride or bring the garden tractor:laugh:

Some nice hot chocolate and walking on water would be good for some winter entertainment. I'm too fat for my skate skis, I just flatten them out now:blush:

Can someone contact Ames Farm about parking? What's a good date and when?

Gilford boat launch
 

Atty. Nix - would that be the same Nix with family property within 1500 ft. on the shoreline where Ames Farm is? Also associated with the complaints this summer.

How did you ever guess?

Mom's house is there.

OK. I won't moon! :rolleye2:

Appraisal
 

Not sure how the assessment works in Gilford but for the Nix property at 19 Riley Road but the tax card shows a purchase price of $105,000 in 1987 and now it's only assessed at $140,000. That seems really low for waterfront property.

http://gilford.univers-clt.com/view_...&series_card=1

The 2009 tax records show that the Ames Farm Motel was assessed at $2,500,000. Doesn't include all of ther cottage lots. I wonder if Ames Farm can apply for an abatement given the change in use?

You need to take a break!

That's what Nixon said to Woodward and Bernstein!

Riley Road is not waterfront. It runs west from Rt 11 (away from the lake) at the Alton/Gilford town line.

That is why I said lawn psycho needs to take a break!

Riley road
 

Even more reason why Mr. Nix's efforts don't add up. If you look at the meeting minutes from the Gilford website, he was very determined to make Ames Farm jump hoops for what in most cases would be easily fixed non-compliances. Personally I don't think Don Ames had a very good lawyer to lose his case like this. Precendence issues are all over Gilford that I am sure his attorney could have used.

I also would have had Mr. Nix's site plans, permitting, and buildings gone over with a fine tooth comb.

I was just checking the location and here's where 19 Riley Road is located via Mapquest.com:
http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=Gi...eocode=ADDRESS

Please, Hit "Start", "Shut Down" and give it a rest!

Something to hide?

Sam, do what I did with the speed limit and diamond island threads, don't open them. Nothing personal just some advise if a particular subject or poster bothers you.

I must say I am quite interested in what has motivated the efforts of Mr Nix, the problem is his efforts have hurt public access to the lake which does not sit well with me even though the end result has more or less no effect on me personally. Shutting Ames down the way it is now is a tragedy :confused:

You're right, I guess I need to practice what I preach.

Continue on. :)

I don’t know what motivated Nix but here is some factual data to consider:

Mr. Nix presented the argument to the ZBA to close down Ames see
http://www.gilfordnh.org/Public_Docu...2008/S021BB065

on behalf of Patricia Nix-Ford, Susan Belanger-Bright, Maureen D. Nix

Patricia Nix-Ford is the owner of a lakefront lot to north of Ames Farm at 94 Dismoor Point RD.

Susan Belanger-Bright is the owner of lakefront lot at 84 Dinsmoor Point

True boaters have been saying all along. There is a conspiracy going on to eliminate certain boaters off the lake. First the speed limit bill, the rafting bill, then the public launch ramp bill. Soon to follow, will be the size of boats limit and horsepower limit.
There are a certain group of waterfront owners that firmly believe that they can bring the lake back to 'On Golden Pond' days and will see their property values skyrocketed. it's all about greed. If they don't like the lake the way it is. Go elsewhere! Squam Lake has property for sale. Next best is Moosehead Lake in Maine. PLENTY of land for sale.

Here's a piece of what slickcraft's link has in it

{David Pierce stated that he has property close by and he has no connection to Ames Farm. He feels that the inn caters to families and the noise is minimal. He feels the neighbors should consider themselves fortunate to have a piece of the past in his midst and cautioned that unreasonable constraints will force the Ames family to sell the property. He finds Ames Farm much more preferable to other possible development.}

Post #49 from Slickcraft has a very interesting & informative link to the Sept 23, 2008 Gilford Zoning Board hearing on Ames Farm. It is a written detailed record of two hours and 42 minutes of a town hearing between four different attorneys, a few witnesses and the people on the zoning board......and now you the reader......a very historical look at things.

A big thankyou to Sandra Bailey, Gilford's temporary scribe for keeping the score.

Attention: Study it hard because there will be a 25-question test on the Ames Farm Inn land use issues from 1955 to present, tomorrow at 9-am. Students who receive a score below 80 will have to shovel snow off the beach for one week using just their bare hands! :rolleye1:

Heard it on the grapevine, when all the dust settles.......only 14' Alumacrafts & 15hp Evinrude tiller-handles will be the only boats allowed.....Lake Winnipesaukee 1970 - now & forever! ........... :D

Aluminum is in fishing boats moreso than in other types of crafts. The very kind used by folks launching at Ames farm ;)

Something to think about. If this ordinance passes, the Glendale docks and parking area would then become non-conforming uses. Feel free to inquire with your Town officials about this.

Like a mentioned above, there are other aspects of this that I am not going to tip my hand but there is a big hole in this oridinance that could put private lot/homeowners in a tight spot.

This ordinance was hastily drafted by a small number of residents with no due diligence (FLL, remember what I said about mob rule?). Any zoning or land-use change should require notification to any lot owner who would then become non-conforming to be notified as a minimum. I don't know if Gilford has done that or if they are required too. The Town of Gilford adminstration should be doing their homework as to number of lots impacted and whether this would preclude a future business from having a public launch anywhere other than existing lots.

Now we know precisely where to stage our winter protest!

My mistake; the hearing was not recent, it took place on September 23, 2008.
......

One more item to add to the list of Lake Winnipesaukee no-no's, will be NO FIBERGLASS BOATS.......only aluminum boats will be allowed.....excepting kayaks, of course.

Hey, there's got to be a nice aluminum kayak somewhere? Probably, down on some nice quiet lake in Alumabama!.......:D

Guess what?
 

"A quick review of the petition and who signed only finds that 2 of the petition signers reside directly on the water. 82 Dinsmore Point Road - James F. Bright, MD Portsmouth, NH. 68 Belknap Point Road - Douglas P. Hill, Real Estate Closing Atty. Meredith & Gilford Conservation Commission Member...Hmmm."


Just Sold -- regarding your astute observation: Maybe, just maybe, some of us live in Gilford but OWN property near Ames...and maybe, just MAYBE, that property is in a name other than ours or in a trust.


My name is on there. ;) And I am not an attorney. Nor am I a Commissioner. Nor am I involved in any local politics. HOWEVER...I own property local to Ames. And I pay taxes. And quite frankly I don't give a rats you-know-what if anybody disagrees or flames me. ;-)

Oh, and thanks for the 15 minutes of fame, LawnPsycho! I thought I'd never get it at my advanced age....LOVE seeing my name in lights!

Be careful what you wish for as that ordinance as written has a boomerang in it ;)

Is all that due to the fishing boats that launched from there, specifically for tournaments?

Whenever things like this happen, I always look to see if the party being targeted was offered a buyout so development could proceed. Doubtful in this case, but I don't really see the point of this ordinance.

The point of the ordinance is to put closure to the issue once and for all.

As drafted it is not spot zoning, but clearly the target is Ames Farm.

Let's not forget that there's no such thing as bad publicity for a lawyer.

The mental image of a bunch of clueless, irate, politically engaged loons buzzing Steve's lakefront dock in their bass boats makes me feel sort of funny inside.

Not "ha ha" funny, but "this meat smells funny" funny.

Go ahead, harass him.

I double dog dare you.

VtSteve, there were many articles written about this during the initial stages. Some on winni.com as well as many of the LR papers. You can also read through the Gilford planning board and zobing board meeting minutes. One thing to realize is Ames Farm made efforts to have the tournaments start farther off land and to appease abutter concerns.

However, you will see that the abutters used the classic technique of zoning to get their wish to shut down his boat launch. What they did is complain about any violation on the property. What I will tell you is that it's VERY easy to find something wrong with a property. This is especially true in small rural towns in New England where code enforcement is haphazard or was during the past. All it takes is one planning board mylar to be missing a signature and 40 years from now someone could use that to claim your subdivision or house lot did not get proper approval.

If I were Don Ames, I would have picked up the grenade and threw it right back at them by looking up every violation the abutters had. Did you really make that shed 10x10 or did you cheat and make is 12x12? There are endless things to look for. A surveyor and title research could reveal a lot too ;) They best be thankful I'm not their neighbor....

The current ordinance these folks are trying to push is like using a sledgehammer to swat a fly. Hopefully the voters of Gilford will see fit to follow the planning board recommendation and turn down the petition. Making the Glendale docks property non-conforming should send off alarm bells that the ordinance is not drafted properly.

I would actually be sympathetic with the homeowners with large numbers of boats leaving the ramp at 6:30AM every weekend. However, I think that's what the ordinance should work to address, not every potential boat ramp in Gilford. I also believe that the abutters were never going to be satisfied as long as *gasp* people were launching boats near their little seasonal cottage because they pay taxes (psst, waterfront homes aren't always the most expensive)..... Going after all public ramps in Gilford? Now I say screw the abutters.

Why not write an ordinance the goes for a direct solution rather than painting with a town-wide brush?

The point of the ordinance is to put closure to the issue once and for all.
For whom? For a few abutters at the expense of everyone else? You also make the assumption that it will pass. You'll find out in March;)

As drafted it is not spot zoning, but clearly the target is Ames Farm.That's why the petition had to be town wide or spot zoning would apply.

Let's not forget that there's no such thing as bad publicity for a lawyer.
I would firmly disagree. See aformentioned post above regarding him yelling at people.

The mental image of a bunch of clueless, irate, politically engaged loons buzzing Steve's lakefront dock in their bass boats makes me feel sort of funny inside.

Be careful with your generalizations. I would hardly call many of the posters in this thread "clueless" as we've gone right to the source for information. Funny how you call us politically engaged but it is the petition signers who are using the "politcal" process to limit access to the lake. Hello pot, meet kettle. You don't have to live in Gilford to understand why this is important to everyone. Perhaps you are clueless about why people have interest in this issue.

Not "ha ha" funny, but "this meat smells funny" funny.

Go ahead, harass him. I double dog dare you.

Is that a threat to make someone fearful of using public property? Where did anyone say they were going to buzz a dock? There has already been statements above that an individual has yelled at people while they were using the lake.

Before long we will need to get a permit to utilize public land that will be metered out by the politicians. Their families and friends will be enjoying our lake while we wait for our turn. Look how other countries have managed to create a political cast system.

The process of continuing to legislate things like Ames farm, Speed, Bfraun bay, Rafting areas, or type of boats has created a nausiating environment that some may decide to stay away from NH. What other source of income do we have?

This bill smells like a punitive process with questionable value.

Excellent article in the New Hampshire Magazine
 

About NH being the fastest growing state in NE.

The only good part of this is that we are bigger than Maine.

The bad part is that we are becoming a 'burb of Massachusetts.

The ugly part is that we lost our motto. 'Live Free or Die'.

As a true NH native, 'Progress? HELL!' :mad:

I agree totally! I am considering retitiring up there but I am also finding that it is becoming a "burb" of Assachusetts. My main reason for considering NH was because of it's formerly conservative politics. Unfortunately many that are moving there are from out east in Massachusetts with a much more liberal stance than I. I fear I may be fleeing in the wrong direction. NH is the last best hope to try and turn New England around. Once you have eaten on the government plantation it is very difficult to find the road leading off the plantation.

I do feel for the long time residents of NH that fear for the future of thier state.

I agree 100%

Free State Movement
 

Perhaps if this movement ever gathers steam, things will change.

http://www.freestateproject.org/news...chive/0004.php

That article is from 2002. Do you have anymore information on the movement?

Gilford Boat Launch Ordinance...
 

I lost track of them a couple of years ago. :look: The "Free State Movement" has annual festivals in June that have drawn as many as 600 people.

Although they seem drawn to NH's Grafton County, they had their 2008 annual Festival in—you guessed it—Gilford! :laugh:

...Ames Farm wins big!
 

"Gilford voters overwhelmingly rejected a proposal to prohibit public boat launching together with associated parking spaces and storage facilities on shorefront properties in predominantly residential neighborhoods. The vote was 1,020 to 275. Authored by attorney Stephan Nix, who led a successfull effort to limit developement of the Ames farm Inn, would have further restricted use of the property."

LaDaSun Mar 10

That is GREAT news!!!!! Seems the voters are taking back control.

Braun Bay

Ames Farm

And in only 24 hours hopefully one more!

Thanks for the update.!

YAYYYY!! Now maybe I can go back to Ames Farm for launching this summer!! I'll have to give them a call in April or May and see what their status is for public launching. :) :) :)