Winnipesaukee Forum - View Single Post - Where is the money for HB-162 going to come from?

Woodsy · 02-08-2006, 01:01 PM

I really don't see the issue here. I don't think the Senate is going to be all that put off by the costs of enforcement. I am pretty sure it is the the House of Representatives that will have to find the money to pay for HB-162. They are the ones who control the purse strings. I don't think the Senate has much control over financials other than approval. I am just wondering how they intend to pay for it.

The MP only has 15 FT officers, and hires approximately 100 PT officers for the summer. Spending the money to train PT officers is a waste of money, given the high attrition rate of 25%. As for training the 15 FT MP officers, I think its the best thing to do. If we only train one officer in the use of radar, thats only 1, 8 hour shift per day, located anywhere in the state, for 5 out of 7 days a week. That is essentially not enforcing HB-162 at all. If we train all 15 officers, then we start to see coverage of at least 1 radar trained officer on Lake Winnipesaukee per shift, just about every day in the summer. You need a team of about 5 radar trained officers dedicated to Lake Winnipesaukee just to maintain 1 radar trained officer per 8hr shift every day in the summer. I am assuming 3, 8 hour shifts per day. Training the 15 officers also gives the MP the opportunity to put 2 radar trained officers per shift on lake Winnipesaukee during the busy July 4th and Labor Day weekends. This leaves the other officers free to cover the other parts of the state covered by HB-162, and allows for flexible scheduling for the MP.

You guys keep saying that signs aren't required, and that its the operators responsibility to know the law. You guys keep bringing up the myriad of boating laws that are specific to NH that have little if any signage. With the exception of BWI, any violation of those laws results in a fine. None of those violations are tagged to your motor vehicle record (driver's license).

How many Judges, acting fairly, are going to hand out $500 speeding fines (as proposed by Fat Jack and others) and ding a persons driving record with the resultant insurance rate penalty for a violation that has not been widely defined or explained to resident and non-resident individuals? The state bears the responsibility to inform people of the new law.

Here is a prime example of how education works...

You are leaving the lake driving south from NH to MA down the Everett Turnpike to Rt 3, when you get to the MA border there is a sign informing you that seatbelt use is required in MA. NH doesn't have a seatbelt law, but MA is educating all of those drivers as to what is expected of them as they drive in MA. Those signs are there at every major border crossing in MA. If those signs weren't there how would anyone who lives in NH know the law existed?

It has been the contention of many in this post that most people are law abiding. I tend to agree. However, people cannot obey a law they know nothing about. Island Lover proves this point in his post above. I think signage about our Boater Education Certificate requirement and if HB-162 should pass the speed limit, should be required at all public boat launches, town docks and all marina gas docks. Education is the key to eliminating ignorant behavior, and unfortunately education costs money. If person launches thier boat, they will see a sign. When they get gas for thier boat, they will see a sign. When they visit other communities on the lake, they will see a sign. When they rent a boat or PWC, they will see a sign (as well as fill out the questionaire) Signage is an extremely important part of educating a motor vehicle operator as to what behavior is appropriate and expected. I seriously doubt a judge is going to levy a $500 fine and ding a persons drivers license for what is essentially an unposted speed limit.

Quite frankly, I think that if we had signs explaining our SBC requirement, and the 150' rule posted at public launches, town docks and gas docks we would have a lot less issues with Capt. Bonehead.

Everybody has alot of Capt. Bonehead stories, but nobody wants to pay to educate him? Thats kind of funny. Your saying you want safety, but you don't want to have to pay for it?

Woodsy

The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid.

02-08-2006, 01:01 PM	#31
Woodsy Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weirs Beach Posts: 1,968 Thanks: 80 Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts	I really don't see the issue here. I don't think the Senate is going to be all that put off by the costs of enforcement. I am pretty sure it is the the House of Representatives that will have to find the money to pay for HB-162. They are the ones who control the purse strings. I don't think the Senate has much control over financials other than approval. I am just wondering how they intend to pay for it. The MP only has 15 FT officers, and hires approximately 100 PT officers for the summer. Spending the money to train PT officers is a waste of money, given the high attrition rate of 25%. As for training the 15 FT MP officers, I think its the best thing to do. If we only train one officer in the use of radar, thats only 1, 8 hour shift per day, located anywhere in the state, for 5 out of 7 days a week. That is essentially not enforcing HB-162 at all. If we train all 15 officers, then we start to see coverage of at least 1 radar trained officer on Lake Winnipesaukee per shift, just about every day in the summer. You need a team of about 5 radar trained officers dedicated to Lake Winnipesaukee just to maintain 1 radar trained officer per 8hr shift every day in the summer. I am assuming 3, 8 hour shifts per day. Training the 15 officers also gives the MP the opportunity to put 2 radar trained officers per shift on lake Winnipesaukee during the busy July 4th and Labor Day weekends. This leaves the other officers free to cover the other parts of the state covered by HB-162, and allows for flexible scheduling for the MP. You guys keep saying that signs aren't required, and that its the operators responsibility to know the law. You guys keep bringing up the myriad of boating laws that are specific to NH that have little if any signage. With the exception of BWI, any violation of those laws results in a fine. None of those violations are tagged to your motor vehicle record (driver's license). How many Judges, acting fairly, are going to hand out $500 speeding fines (as proposed by Fat Jack and others) and ding a persons driving record with the resultant insurance rate penalty for a violation that has not been widely defined or explained to resident and non-resident individuals? The state bears the responsibility to inform people of the new law. Here is a prime example of how education works... You are leaving the lake driving south from NH to MA down the Everett Turnpike to Rt 3, when you get to the MA border there is a sign informing you that seatbelt use is required in MA. NH doesn't have a seatbelt law, but MA is educating all of those drivers as to what is expected of them as they drive in MA. Those signs are there at every major border crossing in MA. If those signs weren't there how would anyone who lives in NH know the law existed? It has been the contention of many in this post that most people are law abiding. I tend to agree. However, people cannot obey a law they know nothing about. Island Lover proves this point in his post above. I think signage about our Boater Education Certificate requirement and if HB-162 should pass the speed limit, should be required at all public boat launches, town docks and all marina gas docks. Education is the key to eliminating ignorant behavior, and unfortunately education costs money. If person launches thier boat, they will see a sign. When they get gas for thier boat, they will see a sign. When they visit other communities on the lake, they will see a sign. When they rent a boat or PWC, they will see a sign (as well as fill out the questionaire) Signage is an extremely important part of educating a motor vehicle operator as to what behavior is appropriate and expected. I seriously doubt a judge is going to levy a $500 fine and ding a persons drivers license for what is essentially an unposted speed limit. Quite frankly, I think that if we had signs explaining our SBC requirement, and the 150' rule posted at public launches, town docks and gas docks we would have a lot less issues with Capt. Bonehead. Everybody has alot of Capt. Bonehead stories, but nobody wants to pay to educate him? Thats kind of funny. Your saying you want safety, but you don't want to have to pay for it? Woodsy The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid.