Oil vs. Pellets

ishoot308 · 10-18-2017, 08:04 AM

With the cost of home heating oil hovering around $2.00 per gallon and the price of wood pellets still around $250.00 per ton right now in the Lakes Region, it appears oil will be cheaper again this winter to heat your home per BTU than wood pellets.

Why hasn't the price of pellets come down??

Other than the ambiance of the pellet stove, is there any other reason I should even consider burning pellets this winter for heat?? Seems like it would just be throwing dollar bills in the stove...

Thoughts from you pellet burners???.....

Dan

thinkxingu · 10-18-2017, 08:11 AM

Burning pellets has become a victim of its own success, right? In addition to being silent and not needing power, my wood stove has been filled with free wood for a decade. (Well, subtract my wood processing gear: a $400 Stihl and $450 gas splitter, and it's probably been 7 years free).

I have seen prices of $215-225 for a ton of pellets, but not sure the quality and that still seems to be, at best, breaking even.

Good luck!

Sent from my Moto G (5S) Plus using Tapatalk

Orion · 10-18-2017, 08:12 AM

Agreed....pellets should have come down in price by now. They certainly shot up fast enough when pellet stoves started to get popular. With the number of pellet providers, you'd think there would be more competition or, dare I say it, could there be collusion keeping the prices up?

I have oil heat and my pellet stove has remained cool now for 2 winters. I also recently added a Mitsubishi split heat pump so my options got even more open. It still looks most economical to heat with oil for this winter but I may run the stove a little just to keep it in working order.

Biggd · 10-18-2017, 08:38 AM

I have a wood stove but my brother inlaw has a pellet stove that he raved about for years. He had a two car garage and he use to fill up one side with pallets of pellets.
He hasn't used it in two years because oil has gone down in price and pellets haven't. It's cheaper to burn oil right now than buying pellets or wood.
I only use my wood stove now when it goes below freezing.

Slickcraft · 10-18-2017, 09:51 AM

Due to our long steep driveway, we can't count on getting oil delivered in the winter. We have our two 275 gal tanks filled in August and then use a combination of burning oil and pellets plus running two heat pumps. After installing the heat pumps our pellet use dropped from 4 ton to about 1.5 ton a year. The pellet stove now just heats the LR, about 40% of the 1st floor. Prior to heat pumps it heated all of the 1st floor plus helping with the 2nd floor.

BroadHopper · 10-18-2017, 09:58 AM

NH Heating Energy Guide

https://www.nh.gov/osi/energy/energy-nh/fuel-prices/

Interesting to note that an electric air pump cost the same as burning an equivalent btu of pellets!

Heating with oil is only $1 more per mbtu than wood.

joey2665 · 10-18-2017, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

NH Heating Energy Guide

https://www.nh.gov/osi/energy/energy-nh/fuel-prices/

Interesting to note that an electric air pump cost the same as burning an equivalent btu of pellets!

Heating with oil is only $1 more per mbtu than wood.

How accurate are the costs on this site? My propane cost and costs others are posting here are 1/2 of the listed 2.89 per gallon stated price.

ishoot308 · 10-18-2017, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

How accurate are the costs on this site? My propane cost and costs others are posting here are 1/2 of the listed 2.89 per gallon stated price.

Yup! Here's a better comparator where you enter the exact cost...It blows me away how much less it cost to heat a home with a ductless heat pump!!

https://www.efficiencymaine.com/at-h...st-comparison/

joey2665 · 10-18-2017, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Yup! Here's a better comparator where you enter the exact cost...It blows me away how much less it cost to heat a home with a ductless heat pump!!

https://www.efficiencymaine.com/at-h...st-comparison/

Wow even at my current propane price the ductless heat pump is 70% cheaper!!!!

dpg · 10-18-2017, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Burning pellets has become a victim of its own success, right? In addition to being silent and not needing power, my wood stove has been filled with free wood for a decade. (Well, subtract my wood processing gear: a $400 Stihl and $450 gas splitter, and it's probably been 7 years free).

I have seen prices of $215-225 for a ton of pellets, but not sure the quality and that still seems to be, at best, breaking even.

Good luck!

Sent from my Moto G (5S) Plus using Tapatalk

Keep in mind though not everybody has access to free wood. I'm sure the "average" wood burner doesn't get it free or even split it themselves.

Biggd · 10-18-2017, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Yup! Here's a better comparator where you enter the exact cost...It blows me away how much less it cost to heat a home with a ductless heat pump!!

https://www.efficiencymaine.com/at-h...st-comparison/

I just finished the room above my 2 car garage as another large bedroom but I didn't put heat in it.
This makes me think that when I do add heat a ductless heat pump is the way to go. Esp since my oil boiler is probably not big enough to handle another zone.

Seaplane Pilot · 10-18-2017, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggd

I just finished the room above my 2 car garage as another large bedroom but I didn't put heat in it.
This makes me think that when I do add heat a ductless heat pump is the way to go. Esp since my oil boiler is probably not big enough to handle another zone.

Sounds like a good place for Mother-In-Law (without the heat)...

Biggd · 10-18-2017, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

Sounds like a good place for Mother-In-Law (without the heat)...

I actually have 3 very young grand kids and 2 more on the way. When they come to visit we put them in there and shut the door. The room is plenty big enough for 3 beds and 2 cribs. Peace and quite after 7pm! That's when we light the outdoor fire pit and the drinks start flowing!

thinkxingu · 10-18-2017, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dpg

Keep in mind though not everybody has access to free wood. I'm sure the "average" wood burner doesn't get it free or even split it themselves.

Understood--I was just mentioning why/how wood can be a value.

Sent from my Moto G (5S) Plus using Tapatalk

pjard · 10-18-2017, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Yup! Here's a better comparator where you enter the exact cost...It blows me away how much less it cost to heat a home with a ductless heat pump!!

https://www.efficiencymaine.com/at-h...st-comparison/

Dan

I have oil, pellets and the Mitsubishi Split systems. With the app that I have for my solar panels I can see in great detail how much electricity I'm using. I did the math last year and by FAR the heat pumps are the most efficient way to heat. Even with cheap oil. In fact, my three splits systems running full use less electricity than my boiler. Again, that's just to run the boiler. I know its hard to believe but it's correct. However I do have 4 tons of pellets on the way only because my wife and I both love heat quality of the stoves.

ishoot308 · 10-18-2017, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjard

Dan

I have oil, pellets and the Mitsubishi Split systems. With the app that I have for my solar panels I can see in great detail how much electricity I'm using. I did the math last year and by FAR the heat pumps are the most efficient way to heat. Even with cheap oil. In fact, my three splits systems running full use less electricity than my boiler. Again, that's just to run the boiler. I know its hard to believe but it's correct. However I do have 4 tons of pellets on the way only because my wife and I both love heat quality of the stoves.

Thanks Paul,

Seriously thinking about going the Mitsubishi split system at my main home as an add on to my hot air oil system. Since I already have the duct work in the house I’m hoping the savings for that makes the pay back time worth it. The AC portion is just a bonus! The house is pretty new and very energy efficient...

Dan

Woody38 · 10-19-2017, 01:15 AM

Just bought the Dyson Pure Heat+Cool at Costco. Turned it on at the condo and heated in a matter of minutes. Granted it is not that cold today and night. We have considered getting another unit. Will be interesting how the cool will work on hot summer days. I figure with the cool and maybe a fan things will keep us comfortable. I would like the Mitsubishi but do not think it would be allowed in the only area it would work.

Incidently what is the would used in the fire pit. Sure does stink.

I am a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic.

SIKSUKR · 10-19-2017, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woody38

Just bought the Dyson Pure Heat+Cool at Costco. Will be interesting how the cool will work on hot summer days. I figure with the cool and maybe a fan things will keep us comfortable.
I am a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic.

Its not going to cool anymore than having a fan on you. It can't. You can't make heat disappear into the same air your taking it from.

Orion · 10-19-2017, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Seriously thinking about going the Mitsubishi split system at my main home as an add on to my hot air oil system. Since I already have the duct work in the house I’m hoping the savings for that makes the pay back time worth it. The AC portion is just a bonus! The house is pretty new and very energy efficient...

The Mitsu split would not use the ductwork. There are interior units that you mount in ceiling, on wall, or in-wall.

Orion · 10-19-2017, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Yup! Here's a better comparator where you enter the exact cost...It blows me away how much less it cost to heat a home with a ductless heat pump!!

https://www.efficiencymaine.com/at-h...st-comparison/

Most of those numbers are driven by the efficiency numbers applied (visible when you expand each device type). Where do those numbers come from and are they accurate? Showing a heat pump at 350% efficiency seems a bit optimistic and I've seen 200% for that on other sites.

Biggd · 10-19-2017, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orion

The Mitsu split would not use the ductwork. There are interior units that you mount in ceiling, on wall, or in-wall.

On the split system, can the indoor unit be placed on a ceiling? The room above my garage has 4' knee walls and slanted from there to the ceiling. I have

doors at both ends without enough space above them for the indoor unit.

codeman671 · 10-19-2017, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggd

On the split system, can the indoor unit be placed on a ceiling? The room above my garage has 4' knee walls and slanted from there to the ceiling. I have

doors at both ends without enough space above them for the indoor unit.

They do make cartridge versions that mount in the ceiling and look like a vent. They are more inconspicuous than the larger wall mounted units. They also make cartridges that duct up through the floor. If I recall though the seer rating is less on these than the wall mounted units.

10-18-2017, 08:04 AM	#1
ishoot308 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Gilford, NH / Welch Island Posts: 6,227 Thanks: 2,382 Thanked 5,275 Times in 2,049 Posts	Oil vs. Pellets With the cost of home heating oil hovering around $2.00 per gallon and the price of wood pellets still around $250.00 per ton right now in the Lakes Region, it appears oil will be cheaper again this winter to heat your home per BTU than wood pellets. Why hasn't the price of pellets come down?? Other than the ambiance of the pellet stove, is there any other reason I should even consider burning pellets this winter for heat?? Seems like it would just be throwing dollar bills in the stove... Thoughts from you pellet burners???..... Dan __________________ It's Always Sunny On Welch Island!!

10-18-2017, 08:12 AM	#3
Orion Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Cow Island Posts: 914 Thanks: 602 Thanked 193 Times in 91 Posts	"pure" economics? Agreed....pellets should have come down in price by now. They certainly shot up fast enough when pellet stoves started to get popular. With the number of pellet providers, you'd think there would be more competition or, dare I say it, could there be collusion keeping the prices up? I have oil heat and my pellet stove has remained cool now for 2 winters. I also recently added a Mitsubishi split heat pump so my options got even more open. It still looks most economical to heat with oil for this winter but I may run the stove a little just to keep it in working order.

10-18-2017, 09:58 AM	#6
BroadHopper Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Laconia NH Posts: 5,570 Thanks: 3,204 Thanked 1,101 Times in 793 Posts	NH Heating Energy Guide https://www.nh.gov/osi/energy/energy-nh/fuel-prices/ Interesting to note that an electric air pump cost the same as burning an equivalent btu of pellets! Heating with oil is only $1 more per mbtu than wood. __________________ Someday may never be an actual day.

10-18-2017, 08:11 AM	#2
thinkxingu Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 6,209 Thanks: 1,167 Thanked 2,048 Times in 1,271 Posts	Burning pellets has become a victim of its own success, right? In addition to being silent and not needing power, my wood stove has been filled with free wood for a decade. (Well, subtract my wood processing gear: a $400 Stihl and $450 gas splitter, and it's probably been 7 years free). I have seen prices of $215-225 for a ton of pellets, but not sure the quality and that still seems to be, at best, breaking even. Good luck! Sent from my Moto G (5S) Plus using Tapatalk

10-18-2017, 08:38 AM	#4
Biggd Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Waltham Ma./Meredith NH Posts: 4,080 Thanks: 2,199 Thanked 1,185 Times in 752 Posts	I have a wood stove but my brother inlaw has a pellet stove that he raved about for years. He had a two car garage and he use to fill up one side with pallets of pellets. He hasn't used it in two years because oil has gone down in price and pellets haven't. It's cheaper to burn oil right now than buying pellets or wood. I only use my wood stove now when it goes below freezing.

10-18-2017, 09:51 AM	#5
Slickcraft Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Welch Island and The Taylor Community Posts: 3,296 Thanks: 1,222 Thanked 2,080 Times in 952 Posts	Due to our long steep driveway, we can't count on getting oil delivered in the winter. We have our two 275 gal tanks filled in August and then use a combination of burning oil and pellets plus running two heat pumps. After installing the heat pumps our pellet use dropped from 4 ton to about 1.5 ton a year. The pellet stove now just heats the LR, about 40% of the 1st floor. Prior to heat pumps it heated all of the 1st floor plus helping with the 2nd floor.

10-19-2017, 01:15 AM	#17
Woody38 Senior Member Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 577 Thanks: 46 Thanked 110 Times in 81 Posts	Just bought the Dyson Pure Heat+Cool at Costco. Turned it on at the condo and heated in a matter of minutes. Granted it is not that cold today and night. We have considered getting another unit. Will be interesting how the cool will work on hot summer days. I figure with the cool and maybe a fan things will keep us comfortable. I would like the Mitsubishi but do not think it would be allowed in the only area it would work. Incidently what is the would used in the fire pit. Sure does stink. I am a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic.