Re cap of a very sad day

[allmostthere]

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...JpI/story.html

[fatlazyless]

Say hey...check out the 'Tyr aquatic flotation belt'...... price $17-dollars.... at swimoutlet.com ....black and blue color....the blue belt can do double duty, holding ice self-rescue picks, whistle, cell phone, water bottle, flashlight, even a small hand gun....worn under your parka.

For extra flotation, get two $17 belts and combine the total twelve black float cubes all onto one belt....or ten....or eight...whatever works for you....depends how you set it up.

Is that a good, el cheapo, light weight, comfortable, easy-to-wear, durable, usefull flotation idea or what, plus it can be used in summer, fall, winter, or spring!

Unlike a pfd, it centers your balance buoyancy, so it is good to go for swimming the breast stroke, side stroke, overhand crawl, and backstroke....plus it is light weight and comfy to wear.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Say hey...check out the 'Tyr aquatic flotation belt'...... price $17-dollars....black and blue color....the blue belt can do double duty, holding ice self-rescue picks, whistle, cell phone, water bottle, flashlight, even a small hand gun....worn under your parka.

For extra flotation, get two $17 belts and combine the total twelve black float cubes all onto one belt....or ten....or eight...whatever works for you....depends how you set it up.

Is that a good, el cheapo, light weight, comfortable, easy-to-wear, durable, usefull flotation idea or what!

Better still, stay off the lake.

[fatlazyless]

Looking at the ice on a frozen lake or river, there is no way to tell how thick or safe it is.....it's always a bit of an unknown... quickly plunging into cold water with a small amount of cold water getting into your lungs and ears.....is a fast drowning.

With the seventeen dollar, (16.94 & shipping - swimoutlet.com) Tyr float belt, you get a second chance, plus it can be used for swimming in the summer.

Today's Feb 26 Boston Globe has a front page article "Death on Derby Day at Lake Winnipesaukee" 'The morning of Feb 11 was the beginning of the worst day in the lakes history.' It is an unusually lengthy article, starts on page 1, and then takes up entirety of pages 12, and 13, and includes two photos, and one map; have yet to read it but just actually caughed up $4.50 to buy the paper....so that makes it a very special newspaper article......LAKE WINNIPESAUKEE.....the largest Boston Globe article ever, ever written about the lake in the last 122-years....or something!

[Top-Water]

So your encouraging people to take a chance on the ice with a toy rather than a genuine "Personal Flotation Device" designed and engineered to keep you afloat in an upright position under a wide variety of situations to get your rocks of in this thread by posting one of your outrageous get it cheap at someplace replies.

Your a jackass.

Previous post cleverly edited 3 hours and 19 minutes later to disguise the original post that promoted my original reply that you see above.

[fatlazyless]

Is way better to be wearing a Tyr float belt than having no flotation, and a pfd which goes around the shoulders, neck, upper body probably does not get used so much because it is too bulky.

If you want to wear a pfd, then go ahead and wear a pfd....but it seems like a float belt is easier to wear while riding a snowmobile.....it's a choice....

[Top-Water]

Originally Posted by allmostthere

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...JpI/story.html

(Sincerely) Thanks for the interesting article.

Hopefully some meaningful reflection about this day will take place from this post forward.

[MAXUM]

What is really sad about this is never before has there been so much information readily available about the overall conditions of the ice out there. It almost seems as if the number of these accidents should be on the decline.

I would just make a suggestion - this forum is a very good source of information as many of us post good and updated information especially when it comes to ice conditions, why not exploit that? Think the F&G or even the Derby organizers be interested in partnering with this web site to provide links to the forum thread that is ongoing every year monitoring the ice situation? It's hard to imagine that both accidents in these articles could have easily been avoided had the people involved known the ice or lack thereof was so well documented and no doubt they would not have made the decision to traverse those areas had that been widely known.

What we don't know is how many DID NOT venture out into these areas based on reading and seeing the information posted here. This information is invaluable so why not try to get that into as many hands as possible. I'm sure all who have an ability to, myself included, are more than happy to provide this information whenever possible as a public service to all who bother to read it.

[JADAQ]

If people really want to venture out on the ice the best bet would be to ask a local! Someone like me who lives, boats and ice fishes here. I watch and take note as the ice forms so I myself know where to and where NOT to go. To many people just hop in the lake and see ice and think all is good.

When was the last time you saw a snowmobile' r on Winni with a full blown PFD?
Not me....

[Cobalt]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

What is really sad about this is never before has there been so much information readily available about the overall conditions of the ice out there. It almost seems as if the number of these accidents should be on the decline.

I would just make a suggestion - this forum is a very good source of information as many of us post good and updated information especially when it comes to ice conditions, why not exploit that? Think the F&G or even the Derby organizers be interested in partnering with this web site to provide links to the forum thread that is ongoing every year monitoring the ice situation? It's hard to imagine that both accidents in these articles could have easily been avoided had the people involved known the ice or lack thereof was so well documented and no doubt they would not have made the decision to traverse those areas had that been widely known.

What we don't know is how many DID NOT venture out into these areas based on reading and seeing the information posted here. This information is invaluable so why not try to get that into as many hands as possible. I'm sure all who have an ability to, myself included, are more than happy to provide this information whenever possible as a public service to all who bother to read it.

Excellent suggestion. A network of frequent reports generated by volunteers from various areas of the Lake are invaluable for all venturing out on the ice.

Hopefully, a member of the Governor's Office will take notice.

Count me in.

Cobalt

[tis]

What I don't understand is why is Tuftonboro the only town with an airboat? Why doesn't Fish and Game have an airboat? They had enough money to buy Downing's, they should be able to afford an airboat. And now they say they need more officers. I think they need an airboat.

[fatlazyless]

Here's another way to make an el cheapo pfd, for about 5-dollars or less; take a foam flotation noodle ...... you know, one of those summer water toys.....a colorful foam noodle.....can be 2", 3" or 5" diameter x about 48" length....whatever works for you......and trim off one end so it's the correct length to be worn as a somewhat tight waist belt......and thread a sturdy line down through the center hole that runs the length of the noodle.....and tie it off.....making it into a foam noodle waist belt.

If you end up in the lake, chances are the noodle will rise up under your arm pits, under your arms, and do a good positive flotation to keep you up top the water.

Reading the Boston Globe article, it says something like the F & G officers watched through their binoculars from a distance, as the 15 year old-snowmobiler repeatedly struggled getting himself up out of the water and onto the thin ice, with the ice repeatedly giving way, and dumping him back into the water, until he disappeared below the surface.

So, would a home-made, el cheapo noodle pfd have helped him or what?

In addition, a usable set of ice rescue picks can be made using two six inch steel nails and an old shoe lace .....the nails cost about 60-cents each....plus attach a good loud whistle to the ice picks shoe lace....all very useful for getting out of the water and up onto the ice, and getting rescued, or doing a self-rescue.

If you really want to plan ahead, maybe pack a high quality p,b & j sandwich, Teddy super crunch - Smuckers red raspberry jam-dark pumperknickle bread into a water tight freezer bag.....and you are good to go eat'n your sandwich......and toot'n on the loud whistle while you await a rescue.....way out there on the ice ....... helloooooooo NH F&G airboat ....... such a great looking airboat......nice to see you!

You know that a home made noodle pfd could maybe be worn either on the outside of a parka, or underneath a parka......maybe use a blue noodle to go with a grey parka or so....for color coordination.....and either hang the shoelace-nails ice picks around your neck, or tied loosely to the noodle belt.......that seems like it would probably work very good, plus a foam noodle could provide a good soft cushion under your chest, between you and the ice surface, as you claw your way across the thin ice using the ice nail picks...... toward stronger ice. Noodles are probably surprisingly strong, and durable, when used like this with a good quality 3/8" line threaded down through its' center hole, to make it a noodle pfd belt.

[Top-Water]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Here's another way to make an el cheapo pfd, for about 5-dollars or less; take a foam flotation noodle ...... you know, one of those summer water toys.....a colorful foam noodle.....can be 2", 3" or 5" diameter x about 48" length....whatever works for you......and trim off one end so it's the correct length to be worn as a somewhat tight waist belt......and thread a sturdy line down through the center hole that runs the length of the noodle.....and tie it off.....making it into a foam noodle waist belt.

If you end up in the lake, chances are the noodle will rise up under your arm pits, under your arms, and do a good positive flotation to keep you up top the water.

Reading the Boston Globe article, it says something like the F & G officers watched through their binoculars from a distance, as the 15 year old-snowmobiler repeatedly struggled getting himself up out of the water and onto the thin ice, with the ice repeatedly giving way, and dumping him back into the water, until he disappeared below the surface.

So, would a home-made, el cheapo noodle pfd have helped him or what?

In addition, a usable set of ice rescue picks can be made using two six inch steel nails and an old shoe lace .....the nails cost about 60-cents each....plus attach a good loud whistle to the ice picks shoe lace....all very useful for getting out of the water and up onto the ice, and getting rescued, or doing a self-rescue.

If you really want to plan ahead, maybe pack a high quality p,b & j sandwich, Teddy Bear super crunch-Smuckers red rasberry jam-dark pumperknickle bread into a water tight freezer bag.....and you are good to go eat'n your sandwich......and toot'n on the loud whistle while you await a rescue.....way out there on the ice ....... helloooooooo NH F&G airboat ....... such a great looking airboat......nice to see you!

Try to remember as you make a fool of yourself that a family is devastated by the loss of there son, not to mention the first responders who had to helplessly watch by and the folks that had to recover the body.

Not funny.

[MOXIE]

I do not post often, but I do read new posts daily. I can not imagine the father of the 15yr old boy, reading this thread.
Fat-N-Lazy is a BAFOON with no compassion for anybody. If anyone knows his real name and address, I would like to discuss this with him personally.
Peace My Friends, MOXIE

[Top-Water]

From wikipedia

In Internet slang, a troll (/ˈtroʊl/, /ˈtrɒl/) is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[2] or of otherwise disrupting normal, on-topic discussion,[3] often for the troll's amusement.

Sadly he has accomplished his objective, just as some meaningful discussion was beginning to come forward with solutions to help prevent something like this from happening again.


MAXUM really has a great idea it just needs to be discussed. Something I take out of this is if the community comes up with some viable solutions that make the lake safer and educate people and reverse the trend of tragedies taking place, it might discourage Concord from overreacting and making new laws and rules that just shut the lake down from all winter activities ...... because its an easy feel good fix.

[MAXUM]

I don't see any legislation coming about that will curb use of the lake in the winter time. That serves no purpose and will put a huge damper on the area during a time of the year where most businesses really need that extra revenue from people that are attracted in the off season. I think there would be a huge uproar if it was even suggested. I would however like to see if there is any movement towards either the towns or F&G in getting themselves a little better equipped to handle these situations. Even that is useless if the time it takes to react to a call is not immediate. They can't be everywhere all the time to bail people out when they do something ill advised. So long as folks venture into the great outdoors especially in the winter time, if they are not prepared it could very easily cost them their lives. Can't lay that at the feet of the first responders those guys do the best they can with what they got and I for one am thankful they are there even if they cannot be miracle workers every time an accident occurs.

That said one forum member pointed out to me in a private conversation the potential legal ramifications Don, the site owner, could face via lawsuit based on information that would be gleaned from information posted here. It is a pretty valid concern however my thought is a simple legal discloser stating any information posted is provided as a courtesy and basically throw in the typical language saying the site and posting members are not in any way responsible for the accuracy of the data posted. Ultimately the responsibly lies with anyone that heads out on the ice. I do see a significant value in making it known that this is a good source for people to use at their own risk. Again I point out we do not know how many actually did watch the ice in thread and acted based on that which very well could have saved lives.

FLL - I know you like to stir the pot at times, seem obsessed with inexpensive solutions to everything, but honestly making the suggestions you have is beyond irresponsible. I sincerely hope nobody takes these seriously.

[webmaster]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

That said one forum member pointed out to me in a private conversation the potential legal ramifications Don, the site owner, could face via lawsuit based on information that would be gleaned from information posted here.

Thanks for your concern but the person who posts the information is responsible, not me.

Immunity for Online Publishers Under the Communications Decency Act - Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act grants interactive online services of all types, including blogs, forums, and listservs, broad immunity from tort liability so long as the information at issue is provided by a third party.

If that were not the case it would be nearly impossible to provide an interactive forum or bulletin board.

[garysanfran]

Is not, and should not be sought after as, the answer.

I so miss those days when a 6 yr. old kid could walk home from school with Child Protective Services not getting involved. My parents taught me what not to do. Most of the time I did it anyway, but with the knowledge of the danger(s) involved.

Today, we want our kids to "get out more" and leave the electronics behind. Would it be parental negligence, today, if your kid went out without a cell phone and wandered more than two blocks away?

Tragedies are a consequence of life, not always someone's error for lack of control.

[wifi]

I like the idea in Moultonboro, where they took their radar sign, put in the middle of town warning of thin ice (it should be changed to "dangerous" now) is an excellent use. More, cheaper (paper) signs should be out in all the popular entry/hangout spots to the lake. I don't regularly stop sledding to check texts or email or go on the net, only at my final destination, but I would see signs.

As far as the Weirs channel, time for a camera there, monitored by LPD/BCSO/F&G or in the summer by the MP.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by wifi

As far as the Weirs channel, time for a camera there, monitored by LPD/BCSO/F&G or in the summer by the MP. It has been the holy grail for illegal activities for too long.

Really? I don't see it, and that is a pretty broad brush to paint an entire area of the lake. Please elaborate with specific examples.

[wifi]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Really? I don't see it, and that is a pretty broad brush to paint an entire area of the lake. Please elaborate with specific examples.

I have edited my post, apparently, it is being taken the wrong way by some.


As far as FLL, I don't see much hope... LOL

[persistence]

Do people take / wear life jackets when travelling across ice?

[Alton Bay]

FLL, you need to think long and hard about what you post.

[Onshore]

Originally Posted by tis

What I don't understand is why is Tuftonboro the only town with an airboat? Why doesn't Fish and Game have an airboat? They had enough money to buy Downing's, they should be able to afford an airboat. And now they say they need more officers. I think they need an airboat.

The article notes that NH Fish and Game has an airboat but it was in Meredith and the Tuftonboro boat could respond more quickly.

[tis]

Originally Posted by shore things

The article notes that NH Fish and Game has an airboat but it was in Meredith and the Tuftonboro boat could respond more quickly.

Thank you. I missed that somehow.

[CGI3]

Should FLL be banned???...Yes or no??..Or at the very least be put in "Time out" for at the very least 90 days??

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by CGI3

Should FLL be banned???...Yes or no??..Or at the very least be put in "Time out" for at the very least 90 days??

You can "ban" people yourself, just add them to your ignore list.

[fatlazyless]

Have not seen a snowmobile out on the lake now for weeks, until Saturday, March 18, when a lone snowmobiler, going about 25-mph showed up. As it approached Horse Island and flasher buoy #3, it suddenly made an abrupt 180-degree u-turn in the slushy snow, and reversed direction. Probably, must have got a fast heads-up seeing the small area of open water up ahead, and larger area of grey, soft, slushy looking water.

That was a surprise to see that.....I was thinking.....will he be going in for an icy, cold swim, or what?

http://www.unionleader.com/Snowmobil...ngs-for-riders ...... published March 18, 2017 .... have you read it? .... it goes into some detail on the February 11, Derby Day, triple snowmobiler drownings in frozen Lake Winnipesaukee

[fatlazyless]

http://www.concordmonitor.com/snowmo...y-year-8886070


from Sunday, March 27, 2017.

Have to wonder......does anyone actually wear a pfd under their winter coat when snowmobiling the lake? ..... and you can buy an adult sized USCG-approved pfd in red or blue from Walmart for $9.94, that looks to be made well enough...beats the heck out of drowning, plus can be used in a canoe or something...as well...for summer use...

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

http://www.concordmonitor.com/snowmo...y-year-8886070


from Sunday, March 27, 2017.

Have to wonder......does anyone actually wear a pfd under their winter coat when snowmobiling the lake? ..... and you can buy an adult sized USCG-approved pfd in red or blue from Walmart for $9.94, that looks to be made well enough...beats the heck out of drowning, plus can be used in a canoe or something...as well...for summer use...

Seriously? Enough with the PFD and ski belt crap already! Its getting old.

12 different posts from you in this one thread about noodles, pfds and belts is really ridiculous.

[MOXIE]

codeman671, You have been reading my mind. I would like to ask the website monitor to shut down this thread. In my opinion it is showing disrespect to the boy who lost his life. As far as "fatlazyass" goes, you have made your colors crystal clear to me.
Peace My Friends, MOXIE