What Speed Limit ????????

[Bear Islander]

Originally Posted by VtSteve

I'll try this again.......

Have you discussed this year's lack of noise and speeders with BI? He posted not long ago that there are so many boats and some PWC's that go full throttle through the Bear Island NWZ that he thought it would be burdensome to call the MP every time it happened.

We discussed the BI NWZ at length last year, because I was bewildered as to why the MP wouldn't park near such an obvious violation zone. So maybe BI can give you a heads up as to how many "a select few" is.

People are still going through the NWZ at cruising speeds. It happens every day but I can't give you numbers. The Marine Patrol hang out "around the corner" quite often and do boat stops. Sometimes they get people going through at high speed but mostly they are stopping boats that are going a little to fast to be considered "no wake".

They also regularly stop multiple PWCs outside the NWZ, I assume for being to close together. I guess there is a common belief that PWCs traveling together don't need to stay 150' apart. The MP explain this error.

All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement.

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

People are still going through the NWZ at cruising speeds. It happens every day but I can't give you numbers. The Marine Patrol hang out "around the corner" quite often and do boat stops. Sometimes they get people going through at high speed but mostly they are stopping boats that are going a little to fast to be considered "no wake".

They also regularly stop multiple PWCs outside the NWZ, I assume for being to close together. I guess there is a common belief that PWCs traveling together don't need to stay 150' apart. The MP explain this error.

All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement.

I'm sure you caught heck for your last post, which seemed more like a Cowboy Mentality to me. It's far more beneficial for everyone involved in these "discussions" if people didn't feel such pressure to stick to one side or another. Except for you and me BI, there really isn't anyone else that mentions the BI NWZ, especially on your "side" of this issue. I personally, find violations of NWZ's to be irritating at best, at least very annoying.

You bring a fair game to the discussion BI, and I always respect your positions, whenever you're not reluctant to show them. Your post above, as compared to others on the very same subject, are not consistent observations. Believe me, there are many people that are against the speed limit that support your positions in some areas, particularly the safety aspect. The biggest thing we all offered for those like yourself, is a constant discussion towards enforcement of the obvious laws, and necessary MP support. One of the many areas the SL crowd is pretty weak in.

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement.

I don't think that has anything to do with the SL..... Economy trumps all.

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

People are still going through the NWZ at cruising speeds. It happens every day but I can't give you numbers. The Marine Patrol hang out "around the corner" quite often and do boat stops. Sometimes they get people going through at high speed but mostly they are stopping boats that are going a little to fast to be considered "no wake".

They also regularly stop multiple PWCs outside the NWZ, I assume for being to close together. I guess there is a common belief that PWCs traveling together don't need to stay 150' apart. The MP explain this error.

All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement.

All in all I do not believe that the SL has had any impact on the lake. I fully blame weather and economy but... as you said, who can really say. I do appreciate your posts and views. In light of what we are seeing from a select one or two individual supporters on this forum it is refreshing to have you back B.I. In the past I may have gotten heated with you over this topic but I've come to appreciate your position and the reasons you give. You have never varied from your belief. You also seem to have an open mind and at least listen and debate openly.

I'm thinking that you probably witness many a violation at that particular spot on the lake. I know I witness chaos every weekend where my Camp is. One thing that I appreciate is that you have not pretended that this law has some how solved every problem that plagues Winni.

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by hazelnut

All in all I do not believe that the SL has had any impact on the lake. I fully blame weather and economy but... as you said, who can really say. I do appreciate your posts and views. In light of what we are seeing from a select one or two individual supporters on this forum it is refreshing to have you back B.I. In the past I may have gotten heated with you over this topic but I've come to appreciate your position and the reasons you give. You have never varied from your belief. You also seem to have an open mind and at least listen and debate openly.

I'm thinking that you probably witness many a violation at that particular spot on the lake. I know I witness chaos every weekend where my Camp is. One thing that I appreciate is that you have not pretended that this law has some how solved every problem that plagues Winni.

Just wondering, this time of year how much traffic do you usually see there? Not only violations.... Just curious.. I would assume it is very very quiet like in my area.

[Formula260SS]

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

Just wondering, this time of year how much traffic do you usually see there? Not only violations.... Just curious.. I would assume it is very very quiet like in my area.

Lots of High Performance Boats out Saturday, It was like the Powerboat Races were back. Loved every second of it, one guy must have made 5 or 6 passes across Rattlesnake. Of course everyone was operating within all aspects of the law.

[Rattlesnake Guy]

We enjoyed the show as well. Kept RG busy with the camera. It was especially interesting because of how rough the water was on Saturday. The blue boat seemed to be having some real fun having the lake all to themselves.

[BroadHopper]

It was 'ROUGH' on the Broads. I haven't seen this condition in a long time. The wind was blowing from the Northwest. It was fun crossing from North to South with the wind. The wind did not die down toward the end of the day. Against the wind, it was a bit intimidatiing for a 22 footer. I had to take it slow home. There were a few 'dancers' out there having fun. I was jealous. I was surprise to see a PWC off of Welch. The guy appeared to be having trouble. I noticed he was heading back to the island. I watch to make sure he was safe.

There was one guy at the regatta preaching the speed limit. Nobody gave him a time of day. He was definitely at the wrong place at the wrong time. He was really turning people off. Good news for the opposers.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Originally Posted by Formula260SS

Lots of High Performance Boats out Saturday, It was like the Powerboat Races were back. Loved every second of it, one guy must have made 5 or 6 passes across Rattlesnake. Of course everyone was operating within all aspects of the law.

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

We enjoyed the show as well. Kept RG busy with the camera. It was especially interesting because of how rough the water was on Saturday. The blue boat seemed to be having some real fun having the lake all to themselves.

I totally loved seeing the high Performance Boats this past weekend! The first three shots are from Saturday out on The Broads.
The last one was taken as we were leaving Smith Cove.

I wish the Powerboat Races would return!

[tis]

I wish the powerboat races would return, too, RG. Weren't they great? And you must have had the best seat in the house!

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by tis

I wish the powerboat races would return, too, RG. Weren't they great? And you must have had the best seat in the house!

I am jealous.... I have friend on the arm of Rattlesnake and for the races we used to climb the mountain to see the entire field... It was fun but you couldn't see anything up close obviously. Your vantage point must have been AWESOME!

[Rattlesnake Gal]

The races must have been very cool from our spot. Sadly they stopped just before we arrived.

The closest I've come to a race our various poker runs. This year it was quite fantastic seeing so many boats coming down The Broads all at once. I snapped a few pictures, but didn't the best vantage point - need to get higher next time.

As far as the 45 mph speed limit goes this year, it seems that many of us, especially me, cannot judge what 45 mph looks like. Case in point; just after the Dozi Poker Run, a thread popped up; Where was the Marine Patrol? Lots of people thought they were exceeding the speed limit, but they weren't. Scroll down to post 11 - they were all traveling at 45 mph.

Don’t get me wrong, there are definitely some speeders out there, but I don't think there's as many as perceived. I definitely believe there is far less speeders on the lake than there are captain boneheads. Is there law of common sense?

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Gal

The races must have been very cool from our spot. Sadly they stopped just before we arrived.

The closest I've come to a race our various poker runs. This year it was quite fantastic seeing so many boats coming down The Broads all at once. I snapped a few pictures, but didn't the best vantage point - need to get higher next time.

As far as the 45 mph speed limit goes this year, it seems that many of us, especially me, cannot judge what 45 mph looks like. Case in point; just after the Dozi Poker Run, a thread popped up; Where was the Marine Patrol? Lots of people thought they were exceeding the speed limit, but they weren't. Scroll down to post 11 - they were all traveling at 45 mph.

Don’t get me wrong, there are definitely some speeders out there, but I don't think there's as many as perceived. I definitely believe there is far less speeders on the lake than there are captain boneheads. Is there law of common sense?

Well Rattlesnake Gal... If the poker run is not held the same time as last year, and I don't have a full boat you are welcome to join me in mine... I can't guarentee it won't break the barrier but will do my best

[onlywinni]

This boat is AWESOME!!!!!!

http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...1-09_045-2.jpg


It is dead quiet and barely creates a wake...

He made me feel real small and real slow a few weeks back...

Of course we were well under the 45mph speed limit

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by onlywinni

This boat is AWESOME!!!!!!



Of course we were well under the 45mph speed limit

Yes definately under 45 with only the last 1/6 of the boat in the water...

[onlywinni]

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

Yes definately under 45 with only the last 1/6 of the boat in the water...

Exactly!!!

[VtSteve]

I knew it could be done right. OCD, does that boat have some sort of proper muffler systems on it? I'd like to find out.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Kracken

I am not sure why there are fewer “For Sale” signs on Rattlesnake, but I do know for sure…The speed limit is NOT the reason.

And the better reason is?

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

RG and I took a ride around the island Saturday and counted 12 places for sale. I don't have official statistics on what the 10 year average is but this actually seems higher than usual to us.

For sale signs are down (perhaps by half) on the Broads side of Rattlesnake.

I watch there carefully because I get a charge out of watching wind-driven waves and spray and consider the idea of owning there someday. It can be like living on the exciting ocean—without low tide! Yet one can enjoy a quick ride to nearly anywhere else on the lake when it's not rough. I scan that shore on nearly every outing, which I've been doing for as long as I've been afloat.

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

"...The blue boat seemed to be having some real fun having the lake all to themselves..."

That blue Fountain "fun-boat" only thinks he has the lake to himself. (Check again).

Originally Posted by codeman671;

"...If I lived on the broads side of Rattlesnake, speeding boats would be the least of my concerns..."

1) But where would speeding boats NOT be the least of your concerns?

2) But maybe you're right:

Broad-side Rattlesnake Island residents have very steep shorelines and are unlikely to be victims of collision injury, damage or fatality: plus, Rattlesnake is an easily-seen island.

Nearby Parker Island is small, yet has a disproportionate number of collisions onto it—one involving a fatality.

3) Why are all these names so readily-linked to tragedy among the speed crowd...on the inland-waters we all wish to protect...?

deTourillon
Cody
Colann
Cameron
Rush
Frisbie
Mastronardi
Gibson
Mineo
Littlefield
Blizzard

Yet all we can recall is "Thorndike" when it comes to non-fatal misadventures with Winnipesaukee's performance boats?



This photo is just one example of serial "Broads" crashes since 2002, has an unknown, un-named "driver", and is not Mr. Thorndike's boat—which is a similar boat that ran onto Parker Island. The scenery includes Mt. Shaw in the background.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

This photo is just one example of serial "Broads" crashes since 2002, has an unknown, un-named "driver", and is not Mr. Thorndike's boat—which is a similar boat that ran onto Parker Island. The scenery includes Mt. Shaw in the background.

Accident on the Broads ~ flipped off shore boat. July 3, 2004

A speed limit wouldn't have made a difference in this case. This guy was just being reckless.
The Accident on The Broads can be seen here, scroll down to posts #4 and #6.

For those who haven't been on the Forum long enough, Acres Per Second used to post under madrasahs.

[NoRegrets]

Should I show a picture of my kayak or canoe in a similar prone position and what would we deduce from that?

There was also a similar "bow up" picture of an older MFG boat being attended to in aAlton bay that was attributed to a "big wave" in one article.

Thanks to RSG's technical response we can probably show this was a BONEHEAD move......

[onlywinni]

Well the boat is layed up for the winter....

I can report that I operated in a safe manner all season long. I was respectful of my fellow boaters..even those in kayaks and sailboats

On occasion I gave my big block Mercruiser a workout while all alone in the broads and even convinced my wife this year that it is safe to do so and the speed limit is not necessary.

--------------------------

Now I cant wait until the snow and ice so I can blast across the lake at 100mph+ on my sled


Have a safe winter everyone...

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by onlywinni

Well the boat is layed up for the winter....

I can report that I operated in a safe manner all season long. I was respectful of my fellow boaters..even those in kayaks and sailboats

On occasion I gave my big block Mercruiser a workout while all alone in the broads and even convinced my wife this year that it is safe to do so and the speed limit is not necessary.

--------------------------

Now I cant wait until the snow and ice so I can blast across the lake at 100mph+ on my sled


Have a safe winter everyone...

Glad to hear she is away safe and sound for her long slumber. Do you drain the engine? or do you fill with antifreeze?

I guess those in the broads won't be tormented by your rath anymore

See you out there next year...

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by onlywinni

--------------------------

Now I cant wait until the snow and ice so I can blast across the lake at 100mph+ on my sled


Have a safe winter everyone...

We will be there with you!! My son is chomping at the bit already

[Yosemite Sam]

I can see Hazelnut when he went to the Woodshed for an evening out with his family. Here is how it probably went:

Hazelnut: Attention everyone, I said attention everyone; Hi I’m conducting an informal poll to see who is for or against the new Lake Winipesaukee speed limit. If you say no then I will not ask you anymore questions. If you say yes, then please explain why you are for it.
Ok, you over there are you for it or against it?
Customer enjoying his meal: No I am not for it!
Hazelnut: Good, you are my kinda folks, you can continue eating.
Hazelnut: Ok, you over there who seem to be enjoying your meal, are you for it or against it?
Customer enjoying his meal: Yes I am for it.
Hazelnut: OMG please explain to me why you are for it. I just can’t believe that anyone in their right mind could be for it. Don’t you understand that there are thousands of people who are not for it and you are the first ones that I have run into that are for it. Stop enjoying you meal and give me 1000 reasons why you are for a speed limit. I said stop eating your food.
Customer enjoying his meal: Oh I’m sorry, I am not for the speed limit anymore, now can I enjoy my meal.
Hazelnut: Great, another one to add to my poll for being against that darn speed limit.
Hazelnut: Hey you over there in the corner………….!!!!

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

I can see Hazelnut when he went to the Woodshed for an evening out with his family. Here is how it probably went:

Hazelnut: Attention everyone, I said attention everyone; Hi I’m conducting an informal poll to see who is for or against the new Lake Winipesaukee speed limit. If you say no then I will not ask you anymore questions. If you say yes, then please explain why you are for it.
Ok, you over there are you for it or against it?
Customer enjoying his meal: No I am not for it!
Hazelnut: Good, you are my kinda folks, you can continue eating.
Hazelnut: Ok, you over there who seem to be enjoying your meal, are you for it or against it?
Customer enjoying his meal: Yes I am for it.
Hazelnut: OMG please explain to me why you are for it. I just can’t believe that anyone in their right mind could be for it. Don’t you understand that there are thousands of people who are not for it and you are the first ones that I have run into that are for it. Stop enjoying you meal and give me 1000 reasons why you are for a speed limit. I said stop eating your food.
Customer enjoying his meal: Oh I’m sorry, I am not for the speed limit anymore, now can I enjoy my meal.
Hazelnut: Great, another one to add to my poll for being against that darn speed limit.
Hazelnut: Hey you over there in the corner………….!!!!

Exactly! My wife was pretty embarrassed to say the least! The management was none too happy either. I'm not welcome back there anytime soon. DO you think the bullhorn was overkill?

[Yosemite Sam]

Originally Posted by hazelnut

Exactly! My wife was pretty embarrassed to say the least! The management was none too happy either. I'm not welcome back there anytime soon. DO you think the bullhorn was overkill?

You're a good sport!

[sunset on the dock]

This is Doc' Sunset reporting from Foxwoods Casino in beautiful rural Connecticuit for WFRM news. We're here today to ask people to weigh in on a bill that would make gambling illegal, but so far I've yet been unable to find a single person who would favor such a move. I've interviewed patrons, bartenders, waitresses, and just about anyone I can find. It seems clear to me that gambling in New England enjoys unequivocal and unanimous support.
In another unrelated story, we're receiving early reports of a fatal high speed boating accident...details at 11.



Seriously though, did Hazelnut interview anyone at any of the summer camps? With such a long list of businesses and organizations who supported the SL and Winnfabs ,I'm sure you might understand my skepticism of the results of the informal Hazelnut poll at such odds with the ARG poll and my own observations.

[DEJ]

Hey Hnut, don't yo know by now that facts mean nothing to those who support the SL?

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

T


Seriously though, did Hazelnut interview anyone at any of the summer camps? With such a long list of businesses and organizations who supported the SL and Winnfabs ,I'm sure you might understand my skepticism of the results of the informal Hazelnut poll at such odds with the ARG poll and my own observations.

I can see your point. I never looked at any list of supporting business or organizations before I shopped, ate, visited at locations.

Seriously though, my "poll" was no "poll." All I did this summer was engage people in conversation about the SL. I call it an informal poll because it was really not a poll at all. The conversations with people usually began with me playing like I knew nothing of a speed limit.

Me: "Is there a speed limit or not on this lake?"
Waiter: "yup" (Roll eye) "45/25"
Me: "45/25?"
Waiter: "45 day, 25 at night?"
Me: "wow, that's pretty interesting"
Waiter: "Pretty dumb if you ask me."
Me: "Thanks for the info."

That is a paraphrased typical conversation I had several times this summer. I urge you to do the same thing while shopping, dining, etc in the area. Your results will be the same.

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by onlywinni

--------------------------

Now I cant wait until the snow and ice so I can blast across the lake at 100mph+ on my sled

Ummmm excuse me but I do believe there are limits for snowmobiles... I am calling the fish and game. Don't you know you will be terrorizing the ice fisherman? This could severly damage their well being and ruin the peace and tranquility! It isn't like you won't see them coming from 3 miles out.... I think I should start a poll that is designed only to come out in my favor because safety may be compromised..

Example:

Q: Mr. Smith, have you ever snowmobiled?
A: No
Q: have you ever been to lake winnipesaukee?
A: No
Q: Don't you think traveling over 40 mph in a congested walmart parking lot could be considered dangerous to the general public because you may hit children.
A: Of course
Q: Do you think that this should also apply to snowmobilers on a lake?
A: Yes
Q: So I can assume you would be in favor of speed limits
A: Yes

Thank you for your time.

[Kracken]

Thanks OCD, just inhaled coffee up my nose.

I am not sure but I thought there was no speed limit on the lake for sleds. Althought there is a 150 rule for bob-houses..10 mph I think.

[OCDACTIVE]

[QUOTE=Kracken;110198]I am not sure but I thought there was no speed limit on the lake [QUOTE]

I are you sure? I thought there was a state wide one? My god the chaos this could bring!!!! Lets start a group called the Snowfabs! We can not have this. I can not believe that there is a part of the world that is unregulated. I don't know what we could end up doing with our lives! Anarchy I tell you! Anarchy!!! Thank god there are no penguins! but oh my! what about those seagulls that I see in the winter! or the squirrls! They need protection!

Call the NH house as we speak!

[onlywinni]

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

Ummmm excuse me but I do believe there are limits for snowmobiles... I am calling the fish and game. Don't you know you will be terrorizing the ice fisherman? This could severly damage their well being and ruin the peace and tranquility! It isn't like you won't see them coming from 3 miles out.... I think I should start a poll that is designed only to come out in my favor because safety may be compromised..

Example:

Q: Mr. Smith, have you ever snowmobiled?
A: No
Q: have you ever been to lake winnipesaukee?
A: No
Q: Don't you think traveling over 40 mph in a congested walmart parking lot could be considered dangerous to the general public because you may hit children.
A: Of course
Q: Do you think that this should also apply to snowmobilers on a lake?
A: Yes
Q: So I can assume you would be in favor of speed limits
A: Yes

Thank you for your time.

....good laugh...

re my 496HO..it has a closed anti-freeze system

[chipj29]

There is a 45 MPH snowmobile speed limit on trails. There is no speed limit on lakes/ponds, with a couple exceptions.

[Lakegeezer]

The speed limit on state trails is 45. There is no speed limit on frozen water.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

There is no speed limit on frozen water.

This needs to change.

How can we just let these SnowCowboys ride at unlimited speeds.

I can't believe that nice Senator from Belmont failed to see that this frozen water is unregulated!!!!!!

[Kracken]

We need to make the snow/ice of our lake more tranquil and peacefull than it has been in recent years. We need to make sure people on ice skates and flying saucer sleds feel safe without having noisy quater ton machines of death flying by them at speeds not seen since…….

Wait a second, as I was typing this I realized some people might actually think it’s a good idea and start sending letters to the Laconia Sun.

Originally Posted by Kracken

We need to make sure people on ice skates and flying saucer sleds feel safe

I'm sure that once a few entrepreneurs recognize the highly profitable but yet untapped "winter cowboy" market and start designing ever-faster, ever-louder, and ever-larger snowmobiles to attract them, then when those cowboys start getting sucked into the "need-for-speed" marketing program for these vehicles and start buying them in larger and larger numbers and start operating them (often while drinking) more and more recklessly on the ice during the more crowded winter events, and we have a few fatal accidents, we will then need to start talking about speed limits for them too....of course. It only makes sense that as environments change and risks increase, safety laws need to evolve to keep up. How can anyone with even a modicum of common sense not understand and agree with this logic? Oh wait...
Besides, don't snowmobiles at least have brakes?

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by Kracken

We need to make the snow/ice of our lake more tranquil and peacefull than it has been in recent years. We need to make sure people on ice skates and flying saucer sleds feel safe without having noisy quater ton machines of death flying by them at speeds not seen since…….

Wait a second, as I was typing this I realized some people might actually think it’s a good idea and start sending letters to the Laconia Sun.

Good Call Kracken... Next thing they will do is try to install tolls on trails to service them.

Ooops there we go again throwing out ideas that they might actually use...

We have to stop that..

[sunset on the dock]

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

Ummmm excuse me but I do believe there are limits for snowmobiles... I am calling the fish and game. Don't you know you will be terrorizing the ice fisherman? This could severly damage their well being and ruin the peace and tranquility! It isn't like you won't see them coming from 3 miles out.... I think I should start a poll that is designed only to come out in my favor because safety may be compromised..

Example:

Q: Mr. Smith, have you ever snowmobiled?
A: No
Q: have you ever been to lake winnipesaukee?
A: No
Q: Don't you think traveling over 40 mph in a congested walmart parking lot could be considered dangerous to the general public because you may hit children.
A: Of course
Q: Do you think that this should also apply to snowmobilers on a lake?
A: Yes
Q: So I can assume you would be in favor of speed limits
A: Yes

Thank you for your time.

I heard something interesting this AM on the radio on the way to work. It had to do with a poll on legalizing gambling in a certain state and how support seemed uncertain and varied with education, college educated more in opposition than non college educated and blah blah blah but it struck me as funny, and I said to myself..."hey, they should only be polling gamblers...how can someone who has never gambled be allowed to decide such a matter" (according to Winni.com forum rules, of course)

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

I heard something interesting this AM on the radio on the way to work. It had to do with a poll on legalizing gambling in a certain state and how support seemed uncertain and varied with education, college educated more in opposition than non college educated and blah blah blah but it struck me as funny, and I said to myself..."hey, they should only be polling gamblers...how can someone who has never gambled be allowed to decide such a matter" (according to Winni.com forum rules, of course)

Sunset.. valid point.. A very good example... However, I feel that gambling is understood more so by the general public then a specific body of water that someone may have no experience with. Would you agree?

[sunset on the dock]

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

Sunset.. valid point.. A very good example... However, I feel that gambling is understood more so by the general public then a specific body of water that someone may have no experience with. Would you agree?

No analogy will be perfect, but it seems that some on the forum are unwilling to admit that swimmers, elderly people who may wish to just sit on the dock (my parents), people who live near the lake(and for that matter, all NH taxpayers because their taxes are affected by tourist dollars), ...really just about anyone in NH should have a say as well(and even kayakers and sailors).

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

No analogy will be perfect, but it seems that some on the forum are unwilling to admit that swimmers, elderly people who may wish to just sit on the dock (my parents), people who live near the lake(and for that matter, all NH taxpayers because their taxes are affected by tourist dollars), ...really just about anyone in NH should have a say as well(and even kayakers and sailors).

Yes and No. I do agree all recreational users of this lake should have say. No matter what their favorite activities are. That is where I draw the line. I just don't see any validity to a poll that asks the question of a person who has absolutely no knowledge of the subject matter at hand other that what the polls leading questions led them to believe.

I used the “headlight use at night” example a while back. Any boater with any clue with regard to nighttime operation of a vessel understands how dangerous it would be to operate with “headlights” on the lake. However, I proposed that I could formulate a question in a poll that would most definitely return results that would favor nighttime headlight use as an issue of safety. If I were to poll the entire state of New Hampshire I am positive my numbers would reflect support of such a proposal. Conversely I believe that the educated recreational users of this lake would mostly return an emphatic NO to that silly question.

Resident: Hello?

Me: Good Evening Ma’am

Resident: Good Evening

Me: May I have a moment of your time?

Resident: Why, what is this about?

Me: Ma’am this is a poll regarding safety on our inland waterways.

Resident: Well of course I have time for that I am a concerned citizen that cares about safety.

Me: Good. Ma’am are you aware that there are no current laws on the books requiring boaters to use headlights at night while operating their boats.

Resident: Oh my goodness! There isn’t?

Me: Would you support a law that would require boaters to use headlights while they operate at night?

Resident: Of course I would! Why would they ever even think about not using headlights at night? That seems so dangerous.

Me: Thank you for your time Ma’am.

[Kracken]

Sunset I would have to respectfully disagree with your analogy.

Polling gamblers to find out if they wanted the state to pass legislation to make gaming legal would be more like polling Winnfabs to find their views on the speed limit.

But seriously,

Gaming would have an effect on just about everyone in the state whereas the speed limits on Winnipesaukee effects only a small percentage of the population.

[gtagrip]

I think someone has to much time on their hands after spending 600+ hours boating on the lake this year, now that the boating season is some what over!:

Two dead in this one;
http://www.theage.com.au/articles/20...368981679.html

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

No analogy will be perfect, but it seems that some on the forum are unwilling to admit that swimmers, elderly people who may wish to just sit on the dock (my parents), people who live near the lake(and for that matter, all NH taxpayers because their taxes are affected by tourist dollars), ...really just about anyone in NH should have a say as well(and even kayakers and sailors).

I agree, although this analogy was very good.

I will agree with you to a point that everyone in NH has a right to a say being taxpayers. However my issue is many also are unwilling to admit that this forum may give a better sample of individuals who understand the lake and the laws that govern it.

if you look at the number of people who have voted, it isn't even close. Now if you subtract out this phantom # of people that came in from other sites (which I believe is not true or if it is makes any signficant differenc), subtract out any duplicate votes, It still shows that predominantly it is not wanted IF you had to choose one way or the other.

Now that being said I do feel that after the compromise poll was shown that there are more people wanting a compromise then those wanting all or nothing.

As far as those you say (people on the dock, residents, etc) You have to look at how many people have voted! If you count up all the people who have contributed in the speed limit forums over the past 6 months it may account for 50 people at a max 100. You can't say that eveyone who voted does not represent people around the lake. Also, after the poll was done showing how fast your boat goes MOST people don't have a GFB or are directly effected. So why does their votes not count as part of those you say are not being counted.

You have said time and time again that those people on your road contribute to winnfabs and want the speed limit. Those on mine do not want them. Does that mean that I should think the majority of people on the whole lake does not want them? Absolutely not. There are different sections of the lake and cultures. Many people are attracted to those people with similar tastes and likes. This may be why your road are supporters and my opposers.

[Rattlesnake Guy]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

No analogy will be perfect, but it seems that some on the forum are unwilling to admit that swimmers, elderly people who may wish to just sit on the dock (my parents), people who live near the lake(and for that matter, all NH taxpayers because their taxes are affected by tourist dollars), ...really just about anyone in NH should have a say as well(and even kayakers and sailors).

While I can understand that your parents might object to the "potential" sound associated with a boat going fast, I am at a loss as to why the speed of the boat they might see would be of particular concern while they sit on the dock. If anything it would be visible for a shorter period of time.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Gal

"...The races must have been very cool from our spot..."

I only discovered the event was taking place because my cottage began shaking.

They were very cool, but it was more of a parade than "a race", and were quite distant from "your" side of Rattlesnake Island. To watch, I chose NOT to anchor, but floated next to a one anchored boat and a Lake amphibian aircraft.

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Gal

"...The closest I've come to a race our various poker runs. This year it was quite fantastic seeing so many boats coming down The Broads all at once. I snapped a few pictures, but didn't the best vantage point - need to get higher next time..."

The very best vantage point is where I snapped a few pictures four years ago—stopped—and right in the middle of 'em!

I had taken my smallest powerboat, and elected to row the ¼-mile home for the exercise. The MP made a stop—of me!

Originally Posted by Bear Islander

"...All in all things were a lot quieter this summer. I like to think the SL is a big part of that but who can say? I do think the SL is at least a little part of the improvement..."

I'd agree. Those who speak of "rampant" sales of properties around the lake need to look again at those properties most effected by the SL.

Right in the middle of the lake—Rattlesnake Island—has many fewer "For Sale" signs than in previous years.

[Kracken]

APS,

I am not sure why there are fewer “For Sale” signs on Rattlesnake, but I do know for sure…The speed limit is NOT the reason.

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

I had taken my smallest powerboat, and elected to row the ¼-mile home for the exercise. The MP made a stop—of me!

They must have been reading your posts on here... LOL!!

J/K

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

Right in the middle of the lake—Rattlesnake Island—has many fewer "For Sale" signs than in previous years.

And this is related to the speed limit, less performance boats or the lack of offshore powerboat racing?

Did you ever think that maybe it has to do with the economy and real estate market? Rattlesnake has a history of having a lot of lower priced island properties which make it more affordable for the average consumer. In general there are not a lot of island properties for sale anywhere, far less than a normal season.

The lesser amount of island properties for sale everywhere has NO correlation to your dream that performance boats are the root of all evil and are scaring residents off the lake...

[Rattlesnake Guy]

RG and I took a ride around the island Saturday and counted 12 places for sale. I don't have official statistics on what the 10 year average is but this actually seems higher than usual to us.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by codeman671

"...And this is related to the speed limit, less performance boats or the lack of offshore powerboat racing...?"

Rattlesnake Island's NE shore is the former site of Rattlesnake Island's "measured mile", and is the longest "straight" along Winnipesaukee's shorelines where offenders can get a sense (and the thrill) of top speed operation. Another straight one mile stretch is directly off my shoreline; fortunately, large swim rafts keep most offenders at a distance.

I don't recall seeing Rattlesnake Island's NE shore having any large swim rafts. (At least not for very long! )

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

RG and I took a ride around the island Saturday and counted 12 places for sale. I don't have official statistics on what the 10 year average is but this actually seems higher than usual to us.

To clarify, there are fewer homes for sale on Rattlesnake Island's Broads-side than in recent years—fewer "official" signs, and fewer "home-made" signs.

The Broads NE shoreline has the largest concentration of offenders in my usual area of fair-weather boating. I'd expect that most islanders who must boat off that shore previously had to look both ways as though they were trying to cross I-93—on foot!

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

Rattlesnake Island's NE shore is the former site of Rattlesnake Island's "measured mile", and is the longest "straight" along Winnipesaukee's shorelines where offenders can get a sense (and the thrill) of top speed operation. Another straight one mile stretch is directly off my shoreline; fortunately, large swim rafts keep most offenders at a distance.

I don't recall seeing Rattlesnake Island's NE shore having any large swim rafts. (At least not for very long! )

To clarify, there are fewer homes for sale on Rattlesnake Island's Broads-side than in recent years—fewer "official" signs, and fewer "home-made" signs.

The Broads NE shoreline has the largest concentration of offenders in my usual area of fair-weather boating. I'd expect that most islanders who must boat off that shore previously had to look both ways as though they were trying to cross I-93—on foot!

And your point is????

Trying to correlate a smaller amount of properties for sale on Rattlesnake today compared to years past to a newly imposed speed limit is ludicrous. The two have NOTHING in common. If I lived on the broads side of Rattlesnake, speeding boats would be the least of my concerns.