What Speed Limit ????????

Originally Posted by Airwaves

I was surfing the net looking for the average boat registration payment to NH when I stumbled across a study completed in June 2003.It addresses the economic impact of NH's surface water uses and breaks it down into various subsections ie: Boating, Fishing, Swimming etc.We've been down the road of statistics vs emotion before. Now let's through money into the equation and then ask, does New Hampshire want to kill the goose that lays the golden egg?

Funny you should bring this up. The lead partner at this firm, the guy most involved with this project, was one of the biggest and most vocal supporters of a permanent 45/25 speed limit. He spoke at several events and hearings about the negative impact that high speed boating was having on our "golden egg". He talked about how hard the state has worked for so long to market our lakes and mountains and to project a "natural" image for NH to attract tourists. He worried aloud about the destruction to that image that such a contrary, aggressive, and "unnatural" activity was having and how much of a negative economic impact it was having. Why do you think we don't have photos of 6-ton cigarette boats blasting across the water on the font of our tourist brochures? The very experts you are quoting are some of your most avid opponents on this issue.
Now, please tell us what you found about the registration payments and how, assuming they have increased, that is the fault of a SL that the state has not yet invested $10K into.

Originally Posted by VitaBene

I will ask any SL supporter that feels someone who breaks the 45/25 is a criminal and scofflaw to please honestly tell me you obey every roadway SL. If you do not, do you consider yourself a criminal and scofflaw?

Scoff⋅law [skawf-law, skof-] –noun 1. A person who flouts the law. Fool [fool] - noun 1. A person who brags openly about being a scofflaw. I am neither a scofflaw nor a fool.

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

How did you know that one/some of us are Law enforcement officers?????

I know you aren't, from your PM.

Originally Posted by onlywinni

Dont worry I plan on admitting in a public hearing my blatant disregard for the law.

Of course you will. I can read the headlines the next day ..."Law-breaking go-fast boater tells legislators what they can do with their speed limit - Permanent speed limit bill passes in historic landslide".

Originally Posted by onlywinni

I just hope you show up, because once you open your mouth my points will be confirmed.

I don't need to show up. My work is done. My points are already confirmed.

Originally Posted by Pineedles

That just shows how committed he is to a compromise I guess. I think the SL opposers really are trying to work out a solution IMHO.

I am committed to a compromise and a solution; the compromise we worked out already, and the solution it proved to be. 45 is a pretty darn fast speed in a boat..fast enough for any reasonable boating activity on a crowded lake. Yet is it slow enough to provide for mutual enjoyment of the lake by all...a perfect compromise... and it has proven to be the perfect solution to the problems that so many complained about before last summer.

Originally Posted by Chimi

I will be filming all weekend, and will be sending the film to every state rep and senator. The film will be enlightening to these reps and senators that have never been on a boat, let alone spent the weekend on Winnipesaukee. The documentary will clearly show that the problem is not excessive speed GFBL boats, but rather will provide proof that there are far more serious problems, that jeopardize safety on the water. If these people are going to vote on something, they should vote on facts, not fiction created by a core group of people with an agenda. I'm going to document what really goes on out there and how dangerous these conditions are. If a GFBL boat passes too fast or too close, he'll get filmed too. It's time that the truth be told, and video does not lie.

PLEASE tell us when we are going to see this documentary. The suspense is killing me.

Here's a guy "tossed out of his speedboat". No, he wasn't going too fast Maybe he was drunk;
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/cent...3Q0SNA0HNQ2BM1

[onlywinni]

Originally Posted by elchase

Of course you will. I can read the headlines the next day ..."Law-breaking go-fast boater tells legislators what they can do with their speed limit - Permanent speed limit bill passes in historic landslide".

You are probably correct-we finally agree

I will just send my Father in Law. He has captained a boat on Winni for the last 60+ years. He has never operated any boat in excess of probably 40mph.

When he hears the nonsense that comes from the speed limit supporters he is amused. He probably makes a much better witness than I

Thanks for the advice. You are good for something.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by elchase

Funny you should bring this up. The lead partner at this firm, the guy most involved with this project, was one of the biggest and most vocal supporters of a permanent 45/25 speed limit. He spoke at several events and hearings about the negative impact that high speed boating was having on our "golden egg".

This same guy is the guy that withheld evidence of Littlefield bar tabs. So that he can protect his liquor license. Never once have I consider him a law abiding citizen. You should go to some of the Planning board hearings. Some of the things he ask for zoning changes. And you say he wants to change the lake to 'Golden Pond'? His establishment is an eye sore if you ask me...............

The only Golden egg he wants to protect is his own.

[sunset on the dock]

Things are getting a little intense around here...here's something to lighten things up. That boating accident link from EL above...I was unable to open the article itself but did you see the "discussion" from readers contained in the link. It makes all of us seem downright wholesome and civilized. The grenades that they lob at one another make us look like a bunch of choir boys.Check it out if you didn't get a chance.

[jmen24]

Why did you choose Lake Winnipesaukee as your home, second home or place to bring your boat or yourself? And which decade in which YOU (not your family) started using it regularly? I am not talking about, went up with my parents, I am talking each one of us personnally.

As we all know there are many other lakes in this region and I am interested to know why some have choosen this lake and when.

I am personally in the market to purchase a boat that will be on Winni full time for the first time this year. We never took our smaller boat on the big lake as we always felt it was undersized for the lake. We primarily boated on Merrymeeting as it was much quiter and more relaxing and closer. The reason we will be choosing Winni for our new boat is access to amenities, dining and entertainment for the kids. The lake has not changed at all in the ten years since we used our old boat heavily to now. I have spent my younger years living 15 minutes south of the Lake and could not call any other area home as the mountains, seasons, towns and scenery keep me close.

Basically we all have our reasons for saying Lake Winni is the place for me, but I really get the feeling that some peoples enjoyment has changed since that decision to come here and if that is the case what was it or when and really what keeps YOU here. (I would like to keep this to each individual posters response, instead of picking apart everyones reasons)

If nobody wants to play, that is fine, I WILL TAKE MY BALL AND GO HOME!!

[DoTheMath]

Originally Posted by jmen24

Why did you choose Lake Winnipesaukee as your home, second home or place to bring your boat or yourself? And which decade in which YOU (not your family) started using it regularly? I am not talking about, went up with my parents, I am talking each one of us personnally.

As we all know there are many other lakes in this region and I am interested to know why some have choosen this lake and when.

I am personally in the market to purchase a boat that will be on Winni full time for the first time this year. We never took our smaller boat on the big lake as we always felt it was undersized for the lake. We primarily boated on Merrymeeting as it was much quiter and more relaxing and closer. The reason we will be choosing Winni for our new boat is access to amenities, dining and entertainment for the kids. The lake has not changed at all in the ten years since we used our old boat heavily to now. I have spent my younger years living 15 minutes south of the Lake and could not call any other area home as the mountains, seasons, towns and scenery keep me close.

Basically we all have our reasons for saying Lake Winni is the place for me, but I really get the feeling that some peoples enjoyment has changed since that decision to come here and if that is the case what was it or when and really what keeps YOU here. (I would like to keep this to each individual posters response, instead of picking apart everyones reasons)

If nobody wants to play, that is fine, I WILL TAKE MY BALL AND GO HOME!!

I have a really nice 2007 Cobalt 222 (now called the 232) with 10 hours, YES 10 hours on it for sale! Sitting on a custom trailer - PM for more deets!)


And I'm all for a meeting - enough of the "hide behind the keyboard /screen" BS. Man (or woman) UP and show yourself - it's easy to sit at your desk and type, but who's really interested in being heard AND seen!? Name the time and place and I'm there (if I'm not traveling for personal / biz.) and I will be the first person to shake EVERYONE'S hand, offer a warm greeting and an offer for a genuine debate on the SL. It's the off season up the lake, so there should be plenty of places (restaurants, etc...) to accommodate as many of us that want to meet up and chat.

[OCDACTIVE]

for meeting I am thinking the weekend of January 9th at the lake.

This way we will be beyond the holidays.

Would this work for everyone?

Maybe over in Meredith?

[OCDACTIVE]

Or the 2nd if everyone is going to be up there after new years???

[BroadHopper]

I choose to stay at the lake. My family had a place on the lake since 1892. When the Claremeont education BS flared up, our taxes have quadrupled. My family had to sell a great fishing lodge that looks like the lodge on the movie 'On Golden Pond'. It is a shame as a 'fat cat' bought the property, tore down the lodge and built a McMansion.
Now I have 'laketop' property. The family is already 'railroaded' out of our lakefront property, I be be d@%n if I am 'railroaded' out of my laketop property. All because of a bunch of non NH natives that thinks they can 'railroad' their way into NH.

That is why I am putting up a fight. My family suffered enough! 'Live Free or Die trying!'

As for a meeting after the New Years. I usually leave for Breckenridge. The annual ULLR festival is on the second week of January. For those who have not seen this, add it to you 'bucket list'. You won't be disappointed!

I usually stay for about a month or more. Depending on the snow conditions and how the rental is going. I have a 4500 sq ft ski lodge for rent with 4 bed rooms, 1 bunk room, and 4 bath rooms. I usually rent the lodge out to a family. Due to the economy, I have been running it as a rooming house last year. A lot of work.

The lake is my 'home' and I intend to live there for the rest of my life. I will fight the laws that take me off the lake because I am poor and the fat cats can take over.

[LIforrelaxin]

Unfortunately for me the first two weekends in January are very busy. My girl friend gets her Children Back from their Dad the first one, and the Second one is her Son's Birthday.
In short I wouldn't be able to do either of those weekends.

[gtagrip]

Right now, any weekend in January works for me.

[OCDACTIVE]

I believe that the weekend of the 16th is a long weekend. I assume a lot of people have plans... I am off to Virginia at the end of Jan. Have to visit the boat.. She gets lonely.. but seriously there is a kickoff party for next years poker run so I will be heading down to that... Then off on a cruise and the Miami International Boat Show in Feb.

I know we will not be able to accomodate everyone but the 2nd or 9th seems to be the best. Let me know between the two....

[BroadHopper]

So that will work for me. I believe the Winnilakers are having their annual winter get together on the 9th and 10th. OCDACTIVE should go. They are over 200 members and counting. All against the speed limits. They remain to be anonymous like the bass federation. But when there is legislation going on. Watch out!

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

So that will work for me. I believe the Winnilakers are having their annual winter get together on the 9th and 10th. OCDACTIVE should go. They are over 200 members and counting. All against the speed limits. They remain to be anonymous like the bass federation. But when there is legislation going on. Watch out!

OOOh sounds like fun!!! Sign me up.. LOL..

BroadHopper Congrats on your 1000 post!

[BroadHopper]

Right now about 50 Winnilakers are in Key West for the Offshore World Championship. I usually go but lack the funds this year. It is quite the sight when we wear our Winnilakers T at the Miami airport. They rent a B&B as headquarter off Duval St. In the past, we use to sneak 'Winnilakers' bumper stickers on to the race boats. Surprisingly the owners keep them on till the end of the race. Someone has to let people know our pride of the lake!

Back in 2005? at a poker run on Lake Havasu, the local Fountain dealer displayed a huge Winnilakers logo on his Poker Run Special. That was the highlight of the poker run. My neighbor in Breckenridge, who was there, still talk about it!

"If it's fun we're there!"

[VtSteve]

Sounds like a fun group BH. Quite a large group from Winni down there. I had done some tentative planning to be in KW this week, but it didn't work out. I'm also trying to see if I can finally make the Miami Boat Show, although the Ft. Lauderdale show is a bit easier for me to get to.

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

Right now about 50 Winnilakers are in Key West for the Offshore World Championship. I usually go but lack the funds this year. It is quite the sight when we wear our Winnilakers T at the Miami airport. They rent a B&B as headquarter off Duval St. In the past, we use to sneak 'Winnilakers' bumper stickers on to the race boats. Surprisingly the owners keep them on till the end of the race. Someone has to let people know our pride of the lake!

Back in 2005? at a poker run on Lake Havasu, the local Fountain dealer displayed a huge Winnilakers logo on his Poker Run Special. That was the highlight of the poker run. My neighbor in Breckenridge, who was there, still talk about it!

"If it's fun we're there!"

Very nice.. The Active Thunder Cult is there as well.

OK... After talking with a few people... I realize this wont work for everyone but it seems to be the best for the majority.


January 2nd.... Speed limit group meet up.. (not sure where, maybe mill falls market place and hit that italian resturant / bar (forget name right now))

This is open to everyone.. Oppossors, Supporters just to get to know each other. we don't have to debate but things may be a lot more civil in here if we can put the face with the name. Maybe Don may even like to join us.

Let me know if you plan on coming.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

Let me know if you plan on coming.

I would really love to join all of the anti-SL crowd (let's be honest, Mr. Chase is not coming) but I will be welcoming a future member of the anti-SL crowd on or about Jan 1! I will try and send a representative in my place.

Even better, maybe this meeting could take place in Concord during one of the upcoming debates on the sunset provision. We're going to need more support against the lies and spin of the pro SL crowd in Concord rather than at Giuseppe's....

[VtSteve]

I think the best way to treat a situation like this Ryan is with an open mind. We've all had our issues on this forum at one time or another. After the holidays is a great time to meet people. I think you'll find that in general, face to face contact mends quite a bit. I don't know about you,

I don't think anyone intended this to be a Pro This or Anti That type of meeting. In fact, it would probably be great if the subject never came up. Opposing attorneys and other such factions meet all the time outside work. It soothes the spirits, mends the soul.

As for Ed? OK, so we differ in our methods and opinions on some things. But he's obvious a smart and articulate guy, so why not get together with him and others and see how things go? I haven't been in any business yet that permits me to work with only those I choose, or only those that agree with me. That's life, pure and simple. This is precisely why I wanted a safety, or just a boating thread to thrive. You'll never get a group of people to agree on everything, so why not start with discussions on things most do agree with?

January 2nd is a pretty tough time for me to truck over, that's my weekend with the kids. But January 2nd doesn't have to be the last meeting ever does it? Perhaps some friends will be made, and everyone becomes on big happy, lake-loving family


Try it, you may like it.

[sunset on the dock]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

Has this room off to the side. A family room atmosphere. That will be a great place to meet. There is no traffic in and out. So we can talk without being disturbed. The owners are not SL supporters.

Originally Posted by Ryan

Even better, maybe this meeting could take place in Concord during one of the upcoming debates on the sunset provision. We're going to need more support against the lies and spin of the pro SL crowd in Concord rather than at Giuseppe's....

This doesn't sound like anyone is putting out the welcome mat to the opposing side to attend but maybe that's what you want? Hardly a good omen for enhancing communications between the 2 sides.

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

So that will work for me. I believe the Winnilakers are having their annual winter get together on the 9th and 10th. OCDACTIVE should go. They are over 200 members and counting. All against the speed limits. They remain to be anonymous like the bass federation. But when there is legislation going on. Watch out!

And I ran into one of the members at the Patriots Game on Sunday. He had a Pats Game Jersey and on the back instead of a player name it read "WINNILAKER" So we struck up a conversation.

I'm up for a meeting. Let me know I'm probably good for any of those dates discussed.

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

Things are getting a little intense around here...here's something to lighten things up. That boating accident link from EL above...I was unable to open the article itself but did you see the "discussion" from readers contained in the link. It makes all of us seem downright wholesome and civilized. The grenades that they lob at one another make us look like a bunch of choir boys.Check it out if you didn't get a chance.

I did read them, pretty bad indeed. One guy was the brother of the deceased. The accident discussed was determined to be cased from mechanical failure, a fact ignored by those cheering about the demise of the person. I've seen this on many newsgroups, where a tragic boating accident (regardless of the reasons), have led to some pretty outrageous attacks on that entire segment of the boating world.

I might add Sunset, I have tried to engage in a rational discussion of many of the accidents force fed on this forum. I think Yosemite Sam was the only person that actually looked at the rebuttal, and read the ensuing follow up to the incident. APS is still bewildered.

There is a great deal of prejudice in the pro SL crowd amongst the most vocal members. We've been unable to get through the prejudice, and I think that's why a meeting was suggested to break the ice. There's at least one supporter that is trying his level best to make sure that the message of hate and prejudice is not snuffed out. You've probably been given instructions to not deal with these people. If you met some of the opponents, you'd most likely find out their intentions are good, and they all share a camaraderie with boaters of all kinds.

It's not about agreeing, it's about discussion and rational thought. The accidents were pretty easy subjects for rational thought, because you can generally follow them to their conclusion. The 21' versus 40' boat accident generated discussion that I thought would point out the problems inherent with applying prejudice to law and/or opinions. It pointed out the problems for sure. I'm sure the only reason it was posted in the first place is that the OP doesn't read the articles

Let's face it, some people love to target one group or another. There are some GFBL people that poke fun at others, and vice versus. I choose not to associate with those people, but I don't throw whatever group they're in to the wolves either. People that engage in this behavior cannot have any camaraderie with the other side. They require constant opposition to whatever is said to keep the level of vitriol up. It's not about the issue, it's mostly about them and whatever agenda they have. Nothing gets accomplished of course, and they'll be the first ones gone if proven wrong.

There is a better way, and everyone can well choose to be part of the solution, not part of the problem. This was a first step in at least creating civility and letting everyone know that there are real people behind these keyboards.