Mooring weight question??

[camp guy]

In addition to the actual weight of the mooring (more is bertter), you also want to remember to provide plenty of scope for your line between the mooring and the boat. I used a substantial length of heavy chain with swivels at either end, and then a heavy nylon line to the boat. The chain will act as a shock absorber mitigating the effect of heavy winds. I agree that having a professional install the mooring may be a very wise idea.

[Formula260SS]

I've been told Granite's density over concrete makes for a higher "wet" weight, that's what mine is on the broads. No issues so far but I oly put a 24' pontoon boat on it.

[Pineedles]

I believe in FLL method whenever possible. At 42.5 lbs. and $1.59 per concrete block. (That's 25 lbs. under water), about 7 of these blocks with a stainless steel chain looped through them would cost $11.00 plus the chain, shackles, etc, would wind up costing about $50.00 for the whole setup. getting a bigger boat? Add more blocks.

[Excalibur]

Originally Posted by Pineedles

I believe in FLL method whenever possible. At 42.5 lbs. and $1.59 per concrete block. (That's 25 lbs. under water), about 7 of these blocks with a stainless steel chain looped through them would cost $11.00 plus the chain, shackles, etc, would wind up costing about $50.00 for the whole setup. getting a bigger boat? Add more blocks.

This works for about 2 seasons until the chain cuts through the blocks like a saw with all the movement. One thing that is very important. INSPECT your mooring completely on a regular schedule.


Or you may end up like me having my neighbors calling saying your boat drifted away. I was lucky, when the boat got close to shore the mast hung up in a tree branch and held the boat there for a few days away from the rocks.

[NoBozo]

I am finding it difficult to remain silent with this discussion. I recommend that ALL those who have posted here (and listened here) to go to your local LIBRARY and find "Chapman's.. Seamanship and Small Boat Handling".

Look up Moorings.

Those who are promoting Stainless Steel for a mooring are likely Selling Stainless Steel. Stainless Steel is not cheap and is completely UNNECESSARY for a mooring. NB

[Winnipesaukee Divers]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

I am finding it difficult to remain silent with this discussion. I recommend that ALL those who have posted here (and listened here) to go to your local LIBRARY and find "Chapman's.. Seamanship and Small Boat Handling".

Look up Moorings.

Those who are promoting Stainless Steel for a mooring are likely Selling Stainless Steel. Stainless Steel is not cheap and is completely UNNECESSARY for a mooring. NB

Hello Mr. Bozo.

Looks like you missed something here in the conversation... We're talking about moorings here on Lake Winnipesaukee not Manhasset Bay, NY. I'll say it again I service 50 moorings per year; some are in Kittery, ME some are in Portsmouth, NH some are in Newbury Port, MA but most are here on the lake. I get to see firsthand what works best for each location. The lake has a high acid content which eats up steel components at an accelerated rate. I highly recommend the use of S/S or like it says in Chapman you need to pull it for inspection every year or so.

BTW: Did you also miss the part where I said I do underwater investigations for insurance companies. Guess why they want a detailed evaluation of the failed ground tackle?

One last comment: I'm not in the business selling stainless steel, I sell diving services. This old expression applies here: You can pay me now or pay me later...

[NoBozo]

Howdy Mr. Diver. I try to stay away from confrontations on this board because they usually result in a Cat Fight. Your response to my post is well taken and you have some points to be considered.

You ARE in the Mooring Business so you do have a financial interest...NO..?? You make recommendations to mooring owners who know nothing about moorings.... So they have no choice but to rely on your good advice.

I have NO Financial Interest in moorings or anything else I may comment on on this board. I just speak from my own perspective and personal/professional experience... with perhaps some knowledge about boating that I have gained during my 69 years.

Best regards Diver. NB

[trfour]

Let alone in the Lake, And you need hardware, stainless steel is the way to go.

Early sixties, I worked two part time jobs while going to school and decided to pay my way and learn how to weld.
Got my certificate and landed a full time job at Taunton Engineering Works and subsequently learned about steel through a great Swedish teacher in [ Knute Zarr ] whom was shop foreman there at the time. Together we built everything from huge industrial mixers, storage tanks to Stop & Shop's all stainless steel potato chip line that cleaned, peeled, sliced, cooked and packaged them. From Baker Chocolates in Boston, to Bird & Sons roofing in Walpole Ma. and beyond.

Nuts & bolts, stainless are not that much more expensive. Pay a little more and relax knowing that they will outlast their expense!



Terry
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[ApS]

Thank you, Terry. I agree.

Originally Posted by NoBozo

"...Those who are promoting Stainless Steel for a mooring are likely Selling Stainless Steel. Stainless Steel is not cheap and is completely UNNECESSARY for a mooring..."

As WD mentioned, you don't need to make your mooring "all-chain". A nylon rode connected to several feet of chain is sufficient.

My SS chain was bought at an outdoor retailer's—off a near-empty reel of the stuff. I estimated what remained to be about 30', and told the employee I needed 25' . Rather than laborously cut the remaining 5' (losing one link and having only 5-feet left to sell) at my request he threw-in the extra footage at the 25' price!

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

Always thought that you could find anything except the kitchen sink in Winni but I guess APS has that one covered.Love the Yankee ingenuity but I think it would work even better if you left the cast soil pipe attached at the house.

1) SS can't be economically recycled, so the SS sinks were headed for a landfill—somewhere.

2) When SS rubs against SS (as it will—endlessly—at a mooring), wear is greatly reduced.

3) Concrete cures best when it is covered. Pictured is a carefully sealed tin can sealing the only opening—and not a soil pipe.

[NoBozo]

I did some research the other day after my last post, into the cost of Stainlass Steel chain Vs. Galvanzed chain. When I got all done..... I said to myself.....NB.......LET IT GO. So I did. Well here we are again.

GO to West Marine.com and look it up. Just in round numbers. 3/8 SS Chain costs about $36 per foot compared to $4 per foot for galvanized. It's your money. NB

[trfour]

Galvanized? Just go to you're nearest Dunkin Donuts, and they will link some of those puppies together for you and make a stronger chain than galvanized!... Galvanized coated steel is low end and very cheap. Most of us that buy a chain for anything, want it to last for, and secure what we are buying it for, in the first place!...

Everyone needs to know and understand what is called the [ tensile strength, will give most an idea of how long it will last and endure for any given situation.] [ Mild steel and some others ]... Now, and if you are looking for cheap, by all means, get the galvanized. If you want it to last longer, pay some more and do look at both tensile strength and also consider that Stainless Steel in the waters of Lake Winnipesaukee, or in our Atlantic Ocean will outlast and endure ANY Galvanized Apparatus...


Terry
_______________________________

[Winnipesaukee Divers]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

I did some research the other day after my last post, into the cost of Stainlass Steel chain Vs. Galvanzed chain. When I got all done..... I said to myself.....NB.......LET IT GO. So I did. Well here we are again.

GO to West Marine.com and look it up. Just in round numbers. 3/8 SS Chain costs about $36 per foot compared to $4 per foot for galvanized. It's your money. NB

You'll get no argument from me about the cost of S/S hardware. I struggle with price also, since I need so much of it. However, what I don't get is why you would be advocating, "Take the cheap way out". It's one thing, when it's your own boat and ground tackle at stake, but totally different when someone (who doesn’t know) ask for advice. I didn't tell him "this is the way it has to be done", but rather explained what works best in Lake Winnipesaukee based on my years of experience servicing moorings.

The key thing here is: How long do you need to mooring to be dependable and safe? If it a year, two years or even five years then good galvanize is fine. But here's one last point: "temporary most often turn to permanent". How much is your boat worth?

[NoBozo]

Stainless Steel, like every material, has applications best suited to the characteristics inherent that material. One excellent application for SS is in sailboat rigging. It's use in that application is universal.

There are times when a material may be ideal in a special application where that material is not normally used. A mooring may be one of those applications.

Carbon Fiber is one such material that is used in special applications where safety, strength and light weight is the main requirement...such as in structural members and body parts in Formula One race cars. We don't usually use carbon fiber in the family sedan, although the extra strength and light weight would certainly be Nice.
We are now using Carbon Fiber in custom built racing sailboats for masts, which are normally made of aluminum in production boats. Anyway, the list can go on and on where certain materials are suited to certain applications and cost is not a factor.

There is probably nothing wrong with using SS for moorings but I just feel that there are much more practical alternatives. For example, I wouldn't use Kevlar for docklines.


BTW: If you are buying marine related supplies, such as chain and fittings in bulk....or even in small quantities, have you tried Jamestown Distributors, in Bristol, RI. Their prices have always been competitive and their service excellent. NB

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com...675960.ajp13w1

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Winnipesaukee Divers

"...How long do you need a mooring to be dependable and safe? If it's a year, two years or even five years then good galvanize is fine. But here's one last point: "temporary most often turn to permanent". How much is your boat worth?

A serious saltwater friend says there are differences in galvanized chain quality. He advised,

"Don't buy galvanized chain at a hardware store ".

(So I haven't—I buy Stainless Steel instead).

Originally Posted by trfour

"...Let alone in the Lake, And you need hardware, stainless steel is the way to go...Nuts & bolts, stainless are not that much more expensive. Pay a little more and relax knowing that they will outlast their expense...!"

Heck, you can pass stainless steel down through the family!

[LIforrelaxin]

Originally Posted by camp guy

In addition to the actual weight of the mooring (more is bertter), you also want to remember to provide plenty of scope for your line between the mooring and the boat.

Scope is definately an important consideration. However if you are in an area where every home owner has a morning out, and docks etc. All of which have there own unique scope, it is difficult to provide proper scope with out presenting the danger of collisions.

Being able to use truely optimal scope only really works in a laid out morning field.

The issue we have with my uncles situation, is that to prevent interfearing with nieghbors moorings, and dock access, and of course our own dock access, we are not able to provide proper scope. Hence we have the issue with the block getting dragged in very severe storms.... it never drags far but we do notice it has moved.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

Scope is definately an important consideration. However if you are in an area where every home owner has a morning out, and docks etc. All of which have there own unique scope, it is difficult to provide proper scope with out presenting the danger of collisions.

Being able to use truely optimal scope only really works in a laid out morning field.

The issue we have with my uncles situation, is that to prevent interfearing with nieghbors moorings, and dock access, and of course our own dock access, we are not able to provide proper scope. Hence we have the issue with the block getting dragged in very severe storms.... it never drags far but we do notice it has moved.

If you are just using weight, not a mushroom, you can overcome some scope issues with a bigger mooring ball. The buoyancy of a bigger ball will dramatically reduce side loads on the mooring by transferring the load to a more vertical plane. It also reduces shock loads my absorbing increased tension from wave motion affecting the boat.