Help Ward Bird of Moultonborough

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam[B

This is a very interesting read![/B]

Looks like Ward definately goes first class with both his choice of a handgun and his choice of a defense attorney.

I had been think'n that he had an old .45 WW2 style gun, but this article says it is a Sig Sauer 45 which is something that a police officer could easily be carrying. A gun like that probably costs about $750, and is made in Switzerland.

I still say that for about 8.99, he could of got himself a first class corn broom and then used the broom to be waving off any lost women look'n for directions. Besides, no way can you sweep the floor with a $750 Sig .45!

[nvtngtxpyr]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

... and is made in Switzerland.

The Sig Sauer factory is located in Exeter New Hampshire.

[fatlazyless]

Something like the individual parts get machined back home in Switzerland, and then they get assembled in Exeter, in order to save money on U.S. import fees? Or, something like that, I don't know?

Have you seen the little white oval rear windshield stickers on local cars that say Sig Sauer? What's the message there?

Anyone know where I can get a similar white oval sticker that says O'Cedar, which as you probably know, is a high-priced maker of mops and quality brooms? Protected by an O'Cedar.....so just back off....you there!

[Shedwannabe]

Curious what people think about the long article in the LDS? If it is true (i.e. the extensive police interactions re: dispute between Bird and wife's family pre-Harris incident) that would be a pretty big egg on your face to much of the pontificating going on these last 290+ posts.

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by Shedwannabe

Curious what people think about the long article in the LDS? If it is true (i.e. the extensive police interactions re: dispute between Bird and wife's family pre-Harris incident) that would be a pretty big egg on your face to much of the pontificating going on these last 290+ posts.

If Harris' past can't be used in court, why would Bird's past be used in court? Isn't that a double standard?

Even if the article is true, why would that justify a man spending 3-6 years in prison because he waved a firearm at someone running her mouth, refusing to leave, and being a pest? I could see some prison time for that, perhaps... apparently there was no reasonable doubt left that he did something wrong; but isn't the sentence just a bit extreme?

What's next? Are we going to start cutting the hands off kids who steal lollypops?

[MarkinNH]

Originally Posted by Shedwannabe

Curious what people think about the long article in the LDS? If it is true (i.e. the extensive police interactions re: dispute between Bird and wife's family pre-Harris incident) that would be a pretty big egg on your face to much of the pontificating going on these last 290+ posts.

I don't see how it would put egg on anybodys face. It doesn't change the Fact that the woman was tresspassing and refused to leave when asked and then ordered to. It doesn't change the Fact that there is No Proof that Ward ever "waved" a gun in her face or threatened her in any way. It doesn't change the Fact that Ward should not be spending a minimum of 3 years in prison.
All it means is that he doesn't or didn't get along with some of his relatives.
I am sure that the same thing can be said about 99.9% of every family in the world.

[rrr]

I agree with AW that you can't look at his past if you can't look at hers.

According to the article: Harris said she was trying to ask him if he was Steven. Steven was not the owner of the property she wanted to see. Steven was 'romantically involved' with the owner. How much information do realtors give out about the owners of property they are showing? Before they show it? I can't imagine how Harris would have known about Steven.

They waited to take his statement because he was recovering from surgery. If he wasn't up to giving a statement, what are the chances he was jumping around waving a gun?

Maybe he's not squeaky clean - but neither is she. Why was her version given more credence than his? He said he overreacted. Maybe he was referring to the language he used.

[Lucky1]

Is there a simple paragraph that would say what Ward did? I came in mid posts list and thought he shot someone. Are you saying that he just showed the gun?? And got three years in jail? I know it is early and I have not had a lot of sleep but can this possibly be what happened?

I was once in my home in Moultonborough with my daughters and heard what sounded like someone on the roof and then someone coming up the basement stairs. My daughters and I sat with our feet against the bedroom door. We were so scared that we shouted out something like, "GO AWAY. LEAVE US ALONE." I called 911 immediately. We were so terrified that I remember saying, "Please hurry" to 911 as I thought there was someone on the stairs coming up to harm us. It turned out to be a male teenager who was just trying to scare one of my daughters?? The policemen risked their lives racing down the neck road to get to us. The teenager had meant no real harm so after the police scolded him they let him go. I do know how someone feels who is thinking someone is breaking into their home to harm them. I have never been tempted to get a gun though. We are sure lucky to have such wonderful public servants such as the police and firemen who do their best to keep us all safe.

[Yosemite Sam]

Originally Posted by Lucky1

Is there a simple paragraph that would say what Ward did?

The only thing Ward Bird did was to ask someone to get off his property (which was clearly posted)….he didn’t have a gun in his hand…that’s it…..now he is spending 3-6 years in prison.

I hope that paragraph clears it up for you.


Merry Christmas!

[SAMIAM]

Lucky, you are well named. As wonderful as our public servants are, as you stated, you would have been long gone by the time they arrived if that person meant you harm. Anyone who lives in a rural or isolated location would be smart to learn how to use a gun for home protection.
911 didn't help the Cates family when their home was invaded and I wonder if that Dr in Connecticut was wishing he had a firearm on hand when his family was murdered.
The police can not be everywhere and crimes happen in a matter of minutes.

[sa meredith]

In case anyone is interested...an article in my local paper this morning.
This woman spends alot of time in court rooms...
http://www.eagletribune.com/newhamps...d-for-January#

[ApS]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

911 didn't help the Cates family when their home was invaded and I wonder if that Dr in Connecticut was wishing he had a firearm on hand when his family was murdered.

The police can not be everywhere and crimes happen in a matter of minutes.

"When seconds count, the police are just minutes away".

[Sunrise Point]

This has made the front page of today's Boston Globe.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/new...re_of_nh_town/

Mr. Bird, I hope that you are home soon.

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

Just checking, did you mean a rolleyes at Samiam's post? If so, I would love to know what you disagree with.

[songkrai]

My $0.02 cents.

The "tough on criminals" people want mandatory sentences. This case proves that this viewpoint is flawed.

But go way way back to the beginning.

If Jimmy was still chief - none of this would have progressed beyond Mr. Birds yard. Jimmy would have told the lady to leave and Jimmy would have told Mr. Bird to go back into his house. End of story.

This may be a tad oversimplified.

[wifi]

The town sure was different back then. No radar, if they thought you were speeding, they would pull you over and have a 20-30 minute talk about the weather.... you got the idea

When we'd go out on a call at night, Jimmy would show up in his overalls, with his chiefs badge on it. He was a character.

Thanks for the nostalgia trip...

[Yosemite Sam]

Originally Posted by wifi

The town sure was different back then. No radar, if they thought you were speeding, they would pull you over and have a 20-30 minute talk about the weather.... you got the idea

When we'd go out on a call at night, Jimmy would show up in his overalls, with his chiefs badge on it. He was a character.

Thanks for the nostalgia trip...

Wow!!! 12 full time police officers. Mountonboro has gone from a police force like Mayberry RFD to one like a big city would have.

Between 1972 and 2008 the Moultonborough Police Department expanded its full time ranks from one officer to twelve.

No wonder there is a crusier sitting at every corner of Moultonboro waiting to arrest you and throw you in the slammer!

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

Wow!!! 12 full time police officers. Mountonboro has gone from a police force like Mayberry RFD to one like a big city would have.

Between 1972 and 2008 the Moultonborough Police Department expanded its full time ranks from one officer to twelve.

No wonder there is a crusier sitting at every corner of Moultonboro waiting to arrest you and throw you in the slammer!

Instead of names, they should post the salary and fringe benefit cost of each member of the police department. As long as people check 'yes' at the ballot box on your town budget this is how it goes.

In Old Orchard Beach, there was a study done that showed if they got rid of all the businesses that cause the need for large police and fire departments that the tax bill to residents would go down substaintially.

[Argie's Wife]

I think you're crossing a line here with your posts about the police department, the officers' benefits, etc.

Yes, there's 12 full-time officers but there's an officer at the station 24/7. Having staff sufficient to cover that kind of schedule and not collecting overtime is part of the justification for the number of full-time officers. Considering the time spent doing paperwork, time spent in court, dealing with regular patrol, school resource officer duties, etc., having 12 full-time officers in a town of 5,035 resident (year-round only), and with a population increase of over 12% since year 2000, it makes sense. There's 2.38 officers per 1,000 residents; the US average is 3.00 officers per 1,000 residents. [SOURCE]

But stats aside...

These men and women you're complaining about making an income off your tax dollar are still residents in your community, for the most part... They're dad or mom, husband or wife, sister or brother, son or daughter - parts of our families here in the area. Just because a judge/jury made some bad decisions - or whatever - don't give the men and women who are simply doing their job a load of grief. They don't deserve it.

They don't make the laws; their job is to enforce the laws.

FYI - a police officer in NH makes about $35,000 (average experience) (about $18/hr), and their benefits are no different than any other town employee's benefits, unless they're part of a union (not the case in M'Boro). [SOURCE] They get NH state retirement, FICA, health insurance (if they chose to take it), etc.

So, think about it... $18/hr to put your life on the line - to serve and protect the citizens of your town... Would you do it?

If you begrudge them their income, perhaps you should change profession.

[Heaven]

"In Old Orchard Beach, there was a study done that showed if they got rid of all the businesses that cause the need for large police and fire departments that the tax bill to residents would go down substaintially."

All I can say to this is . . . huh?

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

I think you're crossing a line here with your posts about the police department, the officers' benefits, etc.

Yes, there's 12 full-time officers but there's an officer at the station 24/7. Having staff sufficient to cover that kind of schedule and not collecting overtime is part of the justification for the number of full-time officers. Considering the time spent doing paperwork, time spent in court, dealing with regular patrol, school resource officer duties, etc., having 12 full-time officers in a town of 5,035 resident (year-round only), and with a population increase of over 12% since year 2000, it makes sense. There's 2.38 officers per 1,000 residents; the US average is 3.00 officers per 1,000 residents. [SOURCE]

But stats aside...

These men and women you're complaining about making an income off your tax dollar are still residents in your community, for the most part... They're dad or mom, husband or wife, sister or brother, son or daughter - parts of our families here in the area. Just because a judge/jury made some bad decisions - or whatever - don't give the men and women who are simply doing their job a load of grief. They don't deserve it.

They don't make the laws; their job is to enforce the laws.

FYI - a police officer in NH makes about $35,000 (average experience) (about $18/hr), and their benefits are no different than any other town employee's benefits, unless they're part of a union (not the case in M'Boro). [SOURCE] They get NH state retirement, FICA, health insurance (if they chose to take it), etc.

So, think about it... $18/hr to put your life on the line - to serve and protect the citizens of your town... Would you do it?

If you begrudge them their income, perhaps you should change profession.

I don't want to derail this thread BUT, you're wrong. First, their salaries are public record. Second, many in small towns complain about high taxes. So when they decide to check "YES" on budget items they have no one to blame but themselves. No one is begruding anyone their pay, but when you assign a dollar figure to that headcount, and if you did that at the ballot, people would be a little more reluctant to check the yes box.

Stats? So you want to use a national average for a small New England town that goes dormant in the winter? Let's compare crimes rates in Detroit, Cleveland, Atlanta, etc.

Yankees want big town benefits but these small mini-mob towns don't have enough economy of scale. This is why NH and ME struggle to tackle their funding issues.

FYI, I have served on a town budget board so step down from the soap box honey, I've heard it all.

Carry on.

[TheProfessor]

[QUOTE=Argie's Wife;146632] I think you're crossing a line here with your posts about the police department, the officers' benefits, etc.
QUOTE]

How many officers does Center Harbor have? How many officers does Sandwich have?

Me thinks that this town is a tad bloated. How many captains, lieutenants, sargents, corporals, dectectives, canines, schools, do we have? Is their pay higher then a patrolman/woman.

The picture above says a lot. How many do we in the office doing "paperwork"?

Just a conjecture here. It seems that if a person has some run in with the force here previously - then there seems to be a presumption that action should be taken with any other activities that said person does.

As someone stated above. Jimmy would have just talked to both and that would have been the end. What happened to talking?

In the very beginning it was her word against his. Why did this progress to more? Maybe these higher ups need some negotiation skills training.

Why was the out of town ladies word taken above the word of an in town resident?

Yes we are a country of laws. But if all who drive 1MPH over the speed limit then all of us would be criminals. A little discretion goes a long way. In reading all it appears that discretion is a tad lacking nowadays.

A little discretion would have kept this case right here and gone no further.

[gtagrip]

Originally Posted by lawn psycho

Instead of names, they should post the salary and fringe benefit cost of each member of the police department. As long as people check 'yes' at the ballot box on your town budget this is how it goes.

In Old Orchard Beach, there was a study done that showed if they got rid of all the businesses that cause the need for large police and fire departments that the tax bill to residents would go down substaintially.

I have just started reading the last page of this thread and was wondering is it really necessary for M'boro to have 12 full-time police officers? I live in a Southern NH town of about 35,000 - 40,000 and me thinks that there maybe that many full-time officers in this town. Not absolutely sure of the number, but bet it's close.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by gtagrip

I have just started reading the last page of this thread and was wondering is it really necessary for M'boro to have 12 full-time police officers? I live in a Southern NH town of about 35,000 - 40,000 and me thinks that there maybe that many full-time officers in this town. Not absolutely sure of the number, but bet it's close.

I'll give my opinion. 12 officers for a small New England town that goes to sleep in the winter is a not a small expense. If voters approve it, they best not complain about the mil rate as it will fall on deaf ears.

[Heaven]

Originally Posted by songkrai

My $0.02 cents.

The "tough on criminals" people want mandatory sentences. This case proves that this viewpoint is flawed.

But go way way back to the beginning.

If Jimmy was still chief - none of this would have progressed beyond Mr. Birds yard. Jimmy would have told the lady to leave and Jimmy would have told Mr. Bird to go back into his house. End of story.

This may be a tad oversimplified.

I think someone would have had to call "Jimmy" first.
Did Mr. Ward call "Jimmy"?

[Rattlesnake Guy]

Remember when you were a kid and your sibling said that the next stage in your fight was they were "going to tell mom"? Your instinct was to preemptively tell mom that you were the victim to diffuse the trouble you were in? This strategy was best done if you were first.

I was not there, but it sounds the call to the cops was much like the kid avoiding the wrath of mom by becoming the victim before the truth be told. Who had the desperate incentive to be the victim here? I think she called first.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

Remember when you were a kid and your sibling said that the next stage in your fight was they were "going to tell mom"? Your instinct was to preemptively tell mom that you were the victim to diffuse the trouble you were in? This strategy was best done if you were first.

I was not there, but it sounds the call to the cops was much like the kid avoiding the wrath of mom by becoming the victim before the truth be told. Who had the desperate incentive to be the victim here? I think she called first.

I thought something similar to this. Maybe when she first confronted him and thought she was not to be fooled by him not being the owner and then realizing he was serious did she realize she pushed him too far and he was going to call the cops.

I am of the belief that my home is my castle. I think the cops used poor judgement in bringing charges.

Personally, I like the Joe Horn approach using the 'castle defense': http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLtKCC7z0yc

They have things the right way in Texas Joe Horn is the kind of neighbor I could only dream of having.

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by songkrai

My $0.02 cents.

The "tough on criminals" people want mandatory sentences. This case proves that this viewpoint is flawed.

But go way way back to the beginning.

If Jimmy was still chief - none of this would have progressed beyond Mr. Birds yard. Jimmy would have told the lady to leave and Jimmy would have told Mr. Bird to go back into his house. End of story.

This may be a tad oversimplified.

I would argue that its not flawed at all, just used in the wrong places!

Showing/displaying/”Brandishing a handgun (or whatever you want to call it) on ones own property is in no way a violent crime, ant that’s where you want to focus most of your mandatory sentencing efforts.

I believe in erring on the side of conservative actions, and mandatory sentencing has a place in our legal system, the question is where and when and how much.

This is a case where it was applied incorrectly (maybe intentionally so to build support against mandatory sentencing) so from my perspective it’s a good concept, but one that needs to be implemented VERY carefully!

[songkrai]

[QUOTE=XCR-700;146653]

I would argue that its not flawed at all, just used in the wrong places!

QUOTE]

So I guess some want this both ways. Mandatory sentencing but let the judge have discretion in sentencing.

An oxymoron interpretation of the laws.

[Heaven]

[QUOTE=songkrai;146821]

Originally Posted by XCR-700

I would argue that its not flawed at all, just used in the wrong places!

QUOTE]

So I guess some want this both ways. Mandatory sentencing but let the judge have discretion in sentencing.

An oxymoron interpretation of the laws.

Maybe mandatory sentencing with any deviation being approved by a panel of judges or arbitrators.

[songkrai]

"Maybe mandatory sentencing with any deviation being approved by a panel of judges or arbitrators."

A valid suggestion.

But another layer of government. Most today are seeking less government.

And if this was an option then all would appeal to this panel slowing down the legal process. And making it more costly in a day when all governments (except this town) are running a large deficit.

I go back to my original statment. Mandatory sentencing is flawed. This case is proof.

If the judge had discretion then this person probably would not be where he is. The judge had to go by the statutes as written by the General Court.

[Heaven]

I don't know the reason mandatory sentencing was implemented but I am sure it wasn't a whim, so there must be significant reason. The arbitration would only be necessary IF the original judge chose to reduce the sentence below the mandatory. I don't think that would happen a lot. Maybe each judge could have a lifetime limit : /

. . . p.s., there isn't anything on earth that isn't "flawed" ; )

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

FYI - a police officer in NH makes about $35,000 (average experience) (about $18/hr), and their benefits are no different than any other town employee's benefits, unless they're part of a union (not the case in M'Boro)...$18/hr to put your life on the line - to serve and protect the citizens of your town... Would you do it? If you begrudge them their income, perhaps you should change profession.

Keep in mind that some are also military reservists. Some municipalities elsewhere even allow LEOs full pay for the "double-dipping" of Reservists. As long as it's less than two weeks per annum, I still don't begrudge them their pay.

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Just checking, did you mean a rolleyes at Samiam's post? If so, I would love to know what you disagree with.

1) I'm sure Samiam understands that I agree with him. The rolleyes was only to indicate that such a succinct sentence will be missed—or dismissed—by too many.

"When seconds count, the police are only minutes away".

2) I support those trained in whatever one's choice of self-protection is—lethal or non-lethal. As it should, that training (which I'll dub "Rule 308") has contributed to a decreased reliance on our "Thin Blue Line".

3) The proliferation of cellphones is a different matter for law enforcement.

4) Waving a broom would never fall under the "training" I'm discussing.

Cue some rolleyes here:

[tummyman]

A road rage incident in Manchester NH on Rt 101West yesterday afternoon involved two individuals, one of which showed a 9mm handgun out the drivers side window. 911 was called and state police subsequently arrested one person. The gun was recovered and the person (21 years old) is being held on $2500 cash bail and allegedly will be arraigned later today on a charge of felony criminal threatening. Wasn't that the same charge Ward was charged with ? This should be an interesting development. See the article in todays on line Manchester Union Leader.

[Jonas Pilot]

There aren't many similarities between the two incidents.

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by Rattle Isle Windy Side

As a gun owner, I hope the driver spends a nice long time in jail..

How many times is it proven that tempers and firearms dont mix?

Road rage and pull out your 9MM? - good luck with that one kid.

Shouldn’t that depend on who has the temper and who has the pistol???

I might argue that if you are the victim being threatened by the guy with the temper, then you are fully within your right to pull, threaten to use, and use your gun in your own defense in all situations. Why is it my problem that you might have a temper problem?

Now if it’s you who has the temper and the gun, and I have neither, then I’m looking for any way out of that situation that I can find.

Its all about perspective, but be very careful giving up your right to defend yourself or making statements that someone else can use to illustrate your support of divesting yourself of your rights because I can assure you there will be someone who is watching and will use it against you at some point I the future, just take a look at our situation in MA,,, Under MA laws we are almost better off to give our guns to the criminals than to use them against them,,, Pretty sad state of affairs down here,,,

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

Keep in mind that some are also military reservists. Some municipalities elsewhere even allow LEOs full pay for the "double-dipping" of Reservists. As long as it's less than two weeks per annum, I still don't begrudge them their pay.

2:

I could be wrong but I believe there's a Federal law that protects enlistees.

If someone is willing to be a reservist and get called into service by the President at anytime, then I have no problem with them getting paid by Uncle Sam and their employer for 2 weeks of the year either.

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by Lucky1

Is there a simple paragraph that would say what Ward did?

Ward was RUDE. NB

[Lucky1]

Originally Posted by nobozo

ward was rude. Nb

was this a jury or a judge? Sounds crazy to me.

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by Lucky1

was this a jury or a judge? Sounds crazy to me.

BOTH Judge and Jury..and then an appeal, which he also lost. The moral of the story is: Don't be RUDE to an unwanted visitor on your own property.

Rudness is "Not Politically Correct". NB

[MarkinNH]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

BOTH Judge and Jury..and then an appeal, which he also lost. The moral of the story is: Don't be RUDE to an unwanted visitor on your own property.

Rudness is "Not Politically Correct". NB

I am quite sure you meant to say an UNWANTED TRESPASSER, since that is what the woman was !

This is just the type of comment I would expect to hear from a Pansy a$$ whining liberal who feels that the world needs to always play nice and never step on someone else's toes in fear of hurting their feelings or injuring their psyche. God, stand up and grow a pair !
Let me enlighten you NoBozo. This is the Real World !! Here in the real world if I find an unwanted trespasser on MY land, land that I pay for with my hard earned money ! I will be as damned rude to them as I feel necessary !!
If you want to invite them in for tea and cupcakes, go right ahead, just make sure your cell phone is handy in case you need to call 911 while your cowering in the corner.
Merry Christmas

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by [I

MarkinNH[/I];146517]I am quite sure you meant to say an UNWANTED TRESPASSER, since that is what the woman was !

This is just the type of comment I would expect to hear from a Pansy a$$ whining liberal who feels that the world needs to always play nice and never step on someone else's toes in fear of hurting their feelings or injuring their psyche. God, stand up and grow a pair !
Let me enlighten you NoBozo. This is the Real World !! Here in the real world if I find an unwanted trespasser on MY land, land that I pay for with my hard earned money ! I will be as damned rude to them as I feel necessary !!
If you want to invite them in for tea and cupcakes, go right ahead, just make sure your cell phone is handy in case you need to call 911 while your cowering in the corner.
Merry Christmas

Hey MarkinNH: I AGREE with you. I'm just illustrating Absurdity with Absurdity. It's Christmas Eve. My posts were "Tongue In Cheek"...trying to lighten up an unpleasent situation.

SO: I guess I am just Busting Your PAIR. Merry Christmas Mark. NB

PS: I have NEVER been called a LIBERAL. Wash your mouth out with soap...

[MarkinNH]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

Hey MarkinNH: I AGREE with you. I'm just illustrating Absurdity with Absurdity. It's Christmas Eve. My posts were "Tongue In Cheek"...trying to lighten up an unpleasent situation.

SO: I guess I am just Busting Your PAIR. Merry Christmas Mark. NB

PS: I have NEVER beeen called a LIBERAL. Wash your mouth out with soap...

NoBozo, My sincerest apologies for being as rude as I know my post sounded.

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by MarkinNH

NoBozo, My sincerest apologies for being as rude as I know my post sounded.

Apologies accepted... but NOT Necessary Mark. NB

[sa meredith]

Folks...is it at all possible we should be attacking the law, and the way it is written? As opposed to the Judge/Jury/ each other?
I mean...seriously..a judge can't be an uneducated fool...and probably not a jury for that matter. They determined a law was broken...and at that point there is no 2 ways to look at it. They were forced to make judgement based on the law and the way it is written...their opinions of right or wrong or common sense would have no place it the courtroom.
Merry Christmas. I'm hoping Santa brings me my first gun.
"You'll shoot your eye out, kid!"
fa wa wa wa wa, wa wa wa wa... Great movie.

[GM doc]

Well Santa just showed up uninvited!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sa meredith]

Originally Posted by GM doc

Well Santa just showed up uninvited!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yep...you're right. Santa did indeed show up, but my neighbor saw him on my roof, and took him out with a 12 gauge. Now we have quite a situation on our hands.

Hope I have not offended anyone...Merry Christmas everyone!

[XCR-700]

Wow this is indeed a very troubling situation,,,

I would not be surprised to see such madness down here in MA, but I thought (or more correctly hoped) that NH would have treated a situation like this very differently.

It looks like NH has turned to the dark side and the MA border really has moved north, sadly much farther than I had imagined,,,

I am an outsider to this, but I can tell you all that if you don’t find a way to turn this tide back, you will surly regret it.

I do not know Mr. Bird and make no attempt to use him as any example, but the situation speaks for itself. If you concede that he was on his land, then so long as he was not using his gun in any other way than displaying it as a warning (drawn or not) and this is the outcome, then you folks are in serious trouble of becoming another Massachusetts!

I don’t care to debate the folks who argue run if you have the option, we need not live in fear regardless if we are on our own land or ANYWHERE.

If you trespass you risk a serious warning which should include display of a firearm and a potentially citizens arrest until LE can respond.

If we are in a public place and face any reasonable perceived danger we must have the right to defend ourselves, which should include removing a gun from its holster. Using it is another matter and carries its own consequences, but if we continue to allow our ability to defend ourselves to be taken from us, we will surly become a people of the government, and the foundation to which our country was founded (a government of the people) will have come to pass and our way of life where personal freedom is a cherished right, not a privilege for the wealthy and powerful few, will have come to an end.

Unlike those of us in MA you folks still have a chance,,, but don’t wait too long or you will not have any say.

If what I have read here is even partially true, this is a travesty. And to that end, I salute the overwhelming majority of you who appear to be supporting the Bird family. I sincerely hope their suffering ends soon and this matter is resolved and Mr. Birds freedom is restored.

[twoplustwo]

Originally Posted by Shedwannabe

Curious what people think about the long article in the LDS? If it is true (i.e. the extensive police interactions re: dispute between Bird and wife's family pre-Harris incident) that would be a pretty big egg on your face to much of the pontificating going on these last 290+ posts.

Funny how in the "extensive police interactions", the aggressor is never Ward. When normally wonderful people turn into the poster children for not mixing alcohol, anger, and firearms, you call the cops and you get restraining orders. Nothing about the long standing feud changes my mind (and I "pontificated" about it earlier, so none of that is news to me).


FLL, your "Jailhouse Rock" joke makes me want to dope slap you. Too bad you can't buy a clue from the McD's Dollar Menu.

[Gearhead]

I've seen enough. Excuse me, I just passed judgement.

[Argie's Wife]

...If Ward hadn't come forward to confess back in 2002, - eight years ago - he probably would have gotten off, as when the officer at the scene checked the guns, it didn't appear that any had been recently fired. It sounds to me like Ward fully cooperated with the police in that incident, including admitting he was intoxicated.

Did he do the right thing? No. Firing the gun in an area like that was highly irresponsible - no doubt about it. However, he owned up to the crime, paid the price. It sounds like he could have played it cool and let it slide. After all, what police dept is going to chase down a complaint like that on Bike Week? (They'd have bigger fish to fry, I'd think...)

When Ward had the encounter he had with Harris he wasn't intoxicated (by any records I've read so far), he didn't fire the gun, and we don't know if it was loaded, even. It sounds to me like he cooperated with police.

I'd wager that in the next couple of days you're gonna see some letters to the editor flyin' in the LaDaSun in rebuttal to the article.

[Heaven]

Target shooting while drinking in a location that was not familiar? It does make one question his judgement. How many other times was his judgement questionable but there were no consequences, out of sheer luck? I guess we'll never know.

[Winnisquamguy]

Originally Posted by Heaven

How many other times was his judgement questionable but there were no consequences, out of sheer luck? I guess we'll never know.

My thoughts exactly, leave him right where he is after all these facts have come out. He deserves what he got, he is a hothead!!

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

...If Ward hadn't come forward to confess back in 2002, - eight years ago - he probably would have gotten off, as when the officer at the scene checked the guns, it didn't appear that any had been recently fired. It sounds to me like Ward fully cooperated with the police in that incident

Not exactly.

He kept "mum" about the 30-caliber shooting and showed the police his 25-caliber pistol—allowing the police to report that his 25-caliber pistol "wasn't fired recently".

[Shreddy]

If her past is irrelevant to this case, what makes his past an integral part of this case? What's so different?

[tis]

Originally Posted by Shreddy

If her past is irrelevant to this case, what makes his past an integral part of this case? What's so different?

Nothing is different. His past is irrelevant too.

[songkrai]

Listen clearly. I think he should be home right now. I think from day one all the authorities mishandled this case.

But I have read the papers today. 12/30/2010. Two papers two articles.

These newspaper articles present information that will make it extremely difficult for the pardon.

Morally he should receive the pardon. Politically, it will be very difficult for any polictician to grant that pardon - after reading those newspaper articles.

[nvtngtxpyr]

Originally Posted by songkrai

Listen clearly. I think he should be home right now. I think from day one all the authorities mishandled this case.

But I have read the papers today. 12/30/2010. Two papers two articles.

Links please?

[songkrai]

There are no links.

Print version. At store.

[RailroadJoe]

theUnionleader.com under recent news

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by RailroadJoe

theUnionleader.com under recent news

It appears to be a reprint of the article that ran in the LaDaSun yesterday: http://www2.laconiadailysun.com/stor...t-ridden-stump

[Heaven]

So in the unlikely event of a pardon, I sure hope Ward Bird would be restricted from owning or having guns.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Heaven

So in the unlikely event of a pardon, I sure hope Ward Bird would be restricted from owning or having guns.

If his felony conviction is left in place, he won't be able to have guns. Federal law.

I see the two cases as entirely different. Unfortunately people want to abide by the constitution only when it's convienient.

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

I don't know

This is the most accurate thing you've posted in this thread so far!

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Anyone know where I can get a similar white oval sticker that says O'Cedar, which as you probably know, is a high-priced maker of mops and quality brooms? Protected by an O'Cedar.....so just back off....you there!

FLL, every time you post about using a broom I have this picture go through my head about you.....

[John A. Birdsall]

I have not gone back and reread the newspaper article, but I think I read that Harris was going around the house looking in windows. If that was the case, then would not Ward think that perhaps she was casing out the place to rob it, and then pulled his gun?

Another part, was there ammo in the gun? He wanted her off his property so he took an empty gun and waved it in the air. See what I got, now get off my property.

By the way I hope you all have a Happy, Safe, and Healthy New Year, now look for Ice OUT

[SIKSUKR]

Very interesting.It seemed there had to be more to this than just a man innocently defending his property.