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[Major]

Now we are going way off course. I don't think the debate is whether teachers work hard. Like any profession, the good ones probably do, the bad ones probably don't, and the middle of the roaders are somewhere in between. The original issue is whether public sector unions harm or help the ultimate stakeholders, i.e., the taxpayers. I think they harm us, you obvously think they help.

The size of government has proliferated over the past 50 years, when the Great Society programs were established. Public sector unions certainly are a part of this growth. Since then, we've "invested" (another word for "tax") trillions of dollars in programs designed to help the poor and the lower middle class families. What have we achieved by our "investment?" First, the destruction of the nuclear family. The National Review reports that 40.7 percent of all 2012 births were out-of-wedlock, with vast differences among racial and ethnic groups. Among non-Hispanic blacks, the figure is highest, at 72.2 percent; for American Indians/Alaska Natives, it’s 66.9 percent; 53.5 percent for Hispanics; 29.4 percent for non-Hispanic whites; and 17.1 percent for Asians/Pacific Islanders. Families are the fabric that hold American culture together.

Second, the systematic removal of organized religion from American culture. I attended Mass this last weekend, and my father happened to be there. I made a joke to him as to how it felt to be one of the younger parishioners attending Mass. My father is 70 years old! Young people, for the most part, don't belong to an organized religion any longer. I get that religion isn't for everyone, and that one of the great things about being an American is freedom of religion. However, religion is one of the structural elements that holds our culture together. As with family values, religion provides structure and order in our society.

Third, and perhaps most important, is that we've somehow come to believe that the middle class doesn't have a chance for success. Nothing could be further from the truth. I can name many, many friends and relatives who came from almost nothing to achieve varying levels of success, if only through hard work and perserverence. If there's one thing that they have in common is that they come from good families. That's the great thing about America, we can achieve anything we want.

I apologize for the rant. I am tired of hearing about how difficult it is to make it in America, and how the middle class cannot make it, or eating its own as you say. There are opportunities abound for individuals who are willing to sacrifice and work hard to get ahead. Self reliance and eliminating the notion that the government can be all things to all people is our pathway to success.

[PaugusBayFireFighter]

Originally Posted by Major

Second, the systematic removal of organized religion from American culture. I attended Mass this last weekend, and my father happened to be there. I made a joke to him as to how it felt to be one of the younger parishioners attending Mass. My father is 70 years old! Young people, for the most part, don't belong to an organized religion any longer. I get that religion isn't for everyone, and that one of the great things about being an American is freedom of religion. However, religion is one of the structural elements that holds our culture together. As with family values, religion provides structure and order in our society.

Just curious...
Who systematically removed religion from American culture???

As someone who has benefitted tremendously from union representation, I'll stay neutral on that subject.

[Major]

Originally Posted by PaugusBayFireFighter

Just curious...
Who systematically removed religion from American culture???

As someone who has benefitted tremendously from union representation, I'll stay neutral on that subject.

The press, government, school systems, ACLU . . . . That's just off the top of my head. I think we can all agree that organized religion, especially Christian denominations, is under attack, whether it be religious monuments on state/federal property, forcing Christian organizations to fund abortions, gay marriage, boycotting Christian businesses, etc. The list is endless.

In any event, I appreciate your refraining from weighing in on the union issue.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Major

The press, government, school systems, ACLU . . . . That's just off the top of my head. I think we can all agree that organized religion, especially Christian denominations, is under attack, whether it be religious monuments on state/federal property, forcing Christian organizations to fund abortions, gay marriage, boycotting Christian businesses, etc. The list is endless.

Don't forget to add to your endless list the damage that organized religion has done to itself. Maybe I'm off base here, but I'm betting that some who were previously more devout have been turned off by scandal and cover-up. I don't think I have to get more specific.

And you don't need religion to provide structure, order or morality to society. Some of us are very capable of leading structured, ordered and moral lives without being one bit religious, as hard as that may be to believe.

Also, if you think that gay marriage is contributing to "the systematic removal of organized religion from American culture," you should probably look at factors inside your church first. Churches that are more instead of less inclusive will probably find it easier to attract parishioners, instead of drive them away.

And no, we can't all agree that organized religion, especially Christian denominations, is under attack. I think what is being attacked is small-mindedness, bigotry, and those who claim to be doing things in the name of Jesus that are very un-Jesus like.