Navigating Winni for new boaters

[LIforrelaxin]

Originally Posted by 4Fun

I have been boating on the lake for 20 years and have visited virtually every cove without fully understanding the Spar system. The Bizer map makes it reasonably simple. You just need to follow the suggested route lines on the chart. The only trick is to realize where you are on the chart at all times and look ahead for the next marker..
A couple seasons of this and you will have most areas memorized and a quick glance at the chart will remind you exactly where to go. Using the colors and compass to determine every buoy is a ton of extra work. Bizer has already done the work for you.

While I don't disagree with this in full.... Understanding the navigation aids will help you on other Lakes in NH where Bizer or others haven't created charts... But then again if you don't go boating other places well.......

I am sorry and I am not trying to make light of the truth of your statement, but that is like saying, you don't need to know the rules of the road to drive a car!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't imagine trying to help other people navigate around the lake, let alone teach my kids to do so with out understanding the SPAR system... And how are my kids doing with it ??? They are learning, and we discuss where north is and what side of the mark they are on etc. even when I am driving....

In reality you shouldn't need to rely on a map... or chart plotter, yes they are helpful, but they are really just aids, just like the markers themselves... It does really bug me when people start relying on modern means, instead of learning the basics which are really easy....

Now with that said, if anyone wants to go out in a boat for an on the water lesson with me and my kids, I love teaching people how to get around the lake, and to do so with confidence...and be able to tell someone why they are on the side of a marker they are on.....

[4Fun]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

While I don't disagree with this in full.... Understanding the navigation aids will help you on other Lakes in NH where Bizer or others haven't created charts... But then again if you don't go boating other places well.......

I am sorry and I am not trying to make light of the truth of your statement, but that is like saying, you don't need to know the rules of the road to drive a car!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't imagine trying to help other people navigate around the lake, let alone teach my kids to do so with out understanding the SPAR system... And how are my kids doing with it ??? They are learning, and we discuss where north is and what side of the mark they are on etc. even when I am driving....

In reality you shouldn't need to rely on a map... or chart plotter, yes they are helpful, but they are really just aids, just like the markers themselves... It does really bug me when people start relying on modern means, instead of learning the basics which are really easy....

Now with that said, if anyone wants to go out in a boat for an on the water lesson with me and my kids, I love teaching people how to get around the lake, and to do so with confidence...and be able to tell someone why they are on the side of a marker they are on.....

I guess I can't argue against having a full understanding of the nav aids, but the Bizer chart really does take the guess work out of knowing what side of the marker to be on at least on Winni. Like I said as long as you know where YOU are the chart is basically foolproof. Relying on a GPS is definitely not best practice. At least with the chart you will have a better memory of where the markers are on your next time out.

With that said I can't believe how many people I saw on the wrong side of markers this weekend. The part be Eagle island is painful to watch. I am surprised more people don't hit the rocks in there. Must be just deep enough for most although it looked really shallow when I was in there last year helping a fellow boater out...

[Phantom]

Originally Posted by 4Fun

With that said I can't believe how many people I saw on the wrong side of markers this weekend. The part be Eagle island is painful to watch. I am surprised more people don't hit the rocks in there. Must be just deep enough for most although it looked really shallow when I was in there last year helping a fellow boater out...

As I have said numerous times in the past -- this particular spot absolutely AMAZES me !!

And no one can convince me of "they have local knowledge" !!

I too have towed a many from this area through the years ... and as 4Fun indicates, is painful to watch at times


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[SIKSUKR]

Having never boated outside of NH and hearing about how we should be like the rest of the country, I looked to find out what the marking system is on inland(lakes). All I can find are buoys that reference returning from sea/upstream and leaving which I'm well aware of. How does that relate to a lake? It doesn't. Can somebody show me what the typical marking system looks like on other state lakes and how an area is marked?

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

Having never boated outside of NH and hearing about how we should be like the rest of the country, I looked to find out what the marking system is on inland(lakes). All I can find are buoys that reference returning from sea/upstream and leaving which I'm well aware of. How does that relate to a lake? It doesn't. Can somebody show me what the typical marking system looks like on other state lakes and how an area is marked?

The old USWMS black port side channel markers are now GREEN can buoys.

The old USWMS red starboard side channel markers are now red NUN buoys.

The old USWMS red and white vertically striped buoys have been replaced by one of the following:
a red or green channel marker directing safe passage, an orange and white regulatory marker,
or a red and black isolated danger marker.

The old USWMS white buoys topped with black or red bands, have been replaced by one of the following: a red or green channel marker directing safe passage, an orange and white regulatory marker, or a red and black isolated danger marker.

[chipj29]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

Having never boated outside of NH and hearing about how we should be like the rest of the country, I looked to find out what the marking system is on inland(lakes). All I can find are buoys that reference returning from sea/upstream and leaving which I'm well aware of. How does that relate to a lake? It doesn't. Can somebody show me what the typical marking system looks like on other state lakes and how an area is marked?

I was on Long Lake in Maine for a week last year, and found the markers to be very simple. I think the best one was the one that is white with black vertical stripes, that tells you at a glance not to go between the marker and the shore. But they were all good, way better than NH in my opinion.

http://www.maine.gov/dacf/parks/wate...nal_aids.shtml

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by chipj29

I was on Long Lake in Maine for a week last year, and found the markers to be very simple. I think the best one was the one that is white with black vertical stripes, that tells you at a glance not to go between the marker and the shore. But they were all good, way better than NH in my opinion.

http://www.maine.gov/dacf/parks/wate...nal_aids.shtml

Did you go down the river too? It's very well marked and easy to understand.

[SIKSUKR]

I must be kind of dumb here. The link Chip posted has the same info that I've been finding, they all talk about a channel or upstream/downstream. Apply these to a Winni chart is what I'm looking for where there is no upstream/ downstream in the middle of the lake. Do you just stay one side of the green and another side of the red?

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

I must be kind of dumb here. The link Chip posted has the same info that I've been finding, they all talk about a channel or upstream/downstream. Apply these to a Winni chart is what I'm looking for where there is no upstream/ downstream in the middle of the lake. Do you just stay one side of the green and another side of the red?

Greens and reds are always in pairs and you always go between them. Hazards in the middle of an open area are marked with unambiguous and big danger buoys all the way around. Hazards near shore are marked with big white and black vertical striped buoys that indicate "don't pass between me and shore". It's very simple when you get used to it.

[persistence]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Greens and reds are always in pairs and you always go between them.

Where are green and reds always in pairs?

[Dave R]

Edited to indicate that I thought it said:

Originally Posted by persistence

Why are green and reds always in pairs?

So that you know to go between them; it's really hard to go between just one, unless you are drunk.

It really said:

Originally Posted by persistence

Where are green and reds always in pairs?

The answer is anywhere there's a safe channel surrounded by underwater obstructions. On Winnipesaukee, if they used the currently accepted practice, reds and greens would be used in the obvious places like the 6 pack and the Graveyard, but they would also make sense in places like the path between Spectacle Island and Nine Acre island.

[Phantom]

Originally Posted by persistence

Where are green and reds always in pairs?

Weirs Channel for one place !

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[KPW]

Originally Posted by persistence

Where are green and reds always in pairs?

On Winnipesaukee, there are no green and reds. They are black and red.

[Phantom]

Originally Posted by KPW

On Winnipesaukee, there are no green and reds. They are black and red.

KPW -- although the buoys are white, the Weirs Channel marker lights blink Green & Red at night





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[KPW]

Originally Posted by Phantom

KPW -- although the buoys are white, the Weirs Channel marker lights blink Green & Red at night





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Are they black and white topped? Its been a while since I have been there, and never at night.

[Phantom]

They are "No Wake" buoys ..... similar to any other FL ... with Red/Green flashing lite versus white.



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[Orion]

They should replace all the black spars with green. There is virtually no white showing on many of the blacks now as the white is underwater (waterlogged styrofoam?). When there is any heavy chop, even in daytime, it's almost impossible to see in the dark water. I have a few I travel buy several times each week for years, so I know exactly where they are (in relatively open water north of Cow), but when it's rough you don't see them until you're about 75' away. Green would be much more visible or at least have more white showing.

[Descant]

Bright fluorescent green, not forest green. And maybe red should be fluorescent orange. Of course, if we're going to spend all that effort to repaint , maybe we should just swap to the "international plan"?

I agree. In areas where I travel frequently, I rarely look at the buoys to see color, and when in unfamiliar waters, caution abounds.

[4Fun]

Originally Posted by KPW

On Winnipesaukee, there are no green and reds. They are black and red.

It guess it was was too hard to see the flashing black lights

[chipj29]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Did you go down the river too? It's very well marked and easy to understand.

Yes we did, and yes it is well marked. I thought that Long Lake was very well marked, and the part of Sebago that we were on was as well.

Siksukr, I don't recall which side of the channels which markers (red or green) were on, but they were always side by side, making it very clear to pass in between them. The hazard markers that you see on that link were very prominent. To be clear, I only went close enough to one of them to read what it said. Otherwise, I just stayed far away!