Heating System Replacement

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by Charlie T

I would think that technology has improved efficiency over the past 28 years. The problem I have to overcome is to find the boiler that hasn't been "value engineered" by the bean counters to the point that long term reliability suffers.

I"m hoping to find a reputable local installer who can help me select that unit.

Low mass and post purge... what's value engineered?

[Charlie T]

Originally Posted by swnoel

Low mass and post purge... what's value engineered?

The overwhelming issues that appear to be showing up with modern hi efficiency boilers is cracking and leaking. The units they replaces lasted 30, 50, 70 years and were probably functional when they were replaced. The issues with the newer ones appear to be lower quality materials and fllaws in design and QC that allow them to get out the shipping dock. That to me is the result of Value engineering.

This is a worldwide problem in virtually every industry where bean counters calculate the overall cost of warranty costs vs building a better product. Part of the calculation is income from replacement parts for non warranty repairs, this is the reason our homes are filled with junk that doesn't last as long as it should. A prime example is automobiles, as the manufacturers quality increased the warranties were extended to 100K miles, in the past few years the trend has been to reduce the warranty. Try to find a new car now with a 100K power train warranty today....... What was the norm 5 year ago is now extinct. Build the product only as good as you have to and expect / hope for a return customer when it breaks once out of warranty

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by Charlie T

The overwhelming issues that appear to be showing up with modern hi efficiency boilers is cracking and leaking. The units they replaces lasted 30, 50, 70 years and were probably functional when they were replaced. The issues with the newer ones appear to be lower quality materials and fllaws in design and QC that allow them to get out the shipping dock. That to me is the result of Value engineering.

Welcome to my world... wait till those Mitsubishi mini split evaporator leak from substandard materials. They're already happening , but I shouldn't tip anyone off yet.
I agree, most US boiler manufacturer have reduced the thickness of their castings and many leak prematurely or crack. This is why steel is a good option. Quality Control??? LOL Stay away from wall hung units that claim 95% efficiencies on Baseboard systems...you'll be lucky to get 10 years out of them!

[Charlie T]

Originally Posted by swnoel

Welcome to my world... wait till those Mitsubishi mini split evaporator leak from substandard materials. They're already happening , but I shouldn't tip anyone off yet.
I agree, most US boiler manufacturer have reduced the thickness of their castings and many leak prematurely or crack. This is why steel is a good option. Quality Control??? LOL Stay away from wall hung units that claim 95% efficiencies on Baseboard systems...you'll be lucky to get 10 years out of them!

It's my hope to get at least 20 and hopefully 30 + years out of this boiler. Thats why I"m doing my due diligence now.

If I can only compile a list of local contractors that people have had good luck with. Does anybody have any names they can share / recommend?

Thanks

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by Charlie T

It's my hope to get at least 20 and hopefully 30 + years out of this boiler. Thats why I"m doing my due diligence now.



Thanks

No guarantee you'll get 30 years, but you should get 15-20 years. There's a lot more options with propane direct vent, but there are options with oil and I'd suggest a Riello burner for direct venting and whatever block you decide, a domestic one or foreign. 3 pass would be better than pin style if you're looking for a bit more efficiency. If you want the most efficient it's this one, the problem you'll have is finding someone with the knowledge and expertise. https://energykinetics.com/wp-conten...solute-oil.pdf No matter what you decide on, the installer, one servicing it and yearly maintenance is critical to longevity of any system.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Charlie T

It's my hope to get at least 20 and hopefully 30 + years out of this boiler. Thats why I"m doing my due diligence now.

If I can only compile a list of local contractors that people have had good luck with. Does anybody have any names they can share / recommend?

Thanks

A quality American made cast iron boiler such as Weil Maclain or HB Smith will last 20 to 30 years. Plus cast iron holds heat much longer. I don't believe you will get that out of a steel boiler, esp the ones that are made with Chinese crap steel.

I've busted up a few Weil Maclain boilers that were 25 plus years old, to get them out of a basement or crawlspace, and the were still pretty solid and leak free.

Finding an installer that won't cost you and arm and a leg will be the difficult part.

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by Biggd

A quality American made cast iron boiler such as Weil Maclain or HB Smith will last 20 to 30 years. Plus cast iron holds heat much longer. I don't believe you will get that out of a steel boiler, esp the ones that are made with Chinese crap steel.

I've busted up a few Weil Maclain boilers that were 25 plus years old, to get them out of a basement or crawlspace, and the were still pretty solid and leak free.

Finding an installer that won't cost you and arm and a leg will be the difficult part.

LOL... they use to built well.... just like cars, appliances, etc. you're living in the old days if you believe they last 30 years!

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by swnoel

LOL... they use to built well.... just like cars, appliances, etc. you're living in the old days if you believe they last 30 years!

I guess time will tell. I installed my new HB Smith boiler 4 years ago, no issues yet. It looked to be the same quality as one I installed 30 years ago in another home I owned.

As far as cars go, I'm an auto mechanic by trade and most of the cars today are far superior to any cars made 30 years ago. As a matter of fact some of the worst cars ever built where made in the 80's. I will agree that appliances are crap today though.

I'm 65 so as long as it outlasts me I'm fine.