CFL Light Bulbs

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

Is "warm to hotish" the same thing as "very hot"? I'm not trying to be difficult, but if you want to back up your claim, you might want to provide your own substantiation, as opposed to asking others to find it for you.

I'm not particularly concerned if you believe me or not. I was trying to provide helpful information based on my own knowledge. You posted a link to a site with very vague information, and even that site really only says that the LED bulbs run cooler than incandescent bulbs.

If you do any research on LED bulbs beyond the basics you will find the same things out.

Part of the problems encountered with bringing LED bulbs to market as a viable incandescent replacement has been related to getting sufficient light output for a palatable price, and doing so in a manner that didn't overheat the diodes and cause premature failure.

If you want to learn something, do some actual homework, I gave you some ideas to start a search with. If you simply want to argue with me, you are coming unprepared.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

If you want to learn something, do some actual homework, I gave you some ideas to start a search with. If you simply want to argue with me, you are coming unprepared.

Your earlier statement that LED bulbs "run very hot" struck me as strange, given that they are supposedly so much more energy efficient than standard incandescent bulbs. I commented on this, and you then said that LED bulbs "will get warm to hotish." Does this change in language mean that you have also changed your position?

Support your own argument with verifiable facts, otherwise I'm leaving the BS flag lying on the field.

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

Your earlier statement that LED bulbs "run very hot" struck me as strange, given that they are supposedly so much more energy efficient than standard incandescent bulbs. I commented on this, and you then said that LED bulbs "will get warm to hotish." Does this change in language mean that you have also changed your position?

Support your own argument with verifiable facts, otherwise I'm leaving the BS flag lying on the field.

LED bulbs in current, and upcoming products, run the diode at a high temperature relative to where it would be optimally. This is a problem that is being solved with various approaches to cooling the diode/diode junction so that enough light output can be achieved to make the bulb useful without also dramatically shortening it's useful life.

Save your 'BS flag' for a topic that you have some knowledge to actually make a call on.

Again, if you did some research of your own instead of making stupid forum arguments you would understand what I was describing without needing more clarification. Most people enjoy researching things they have an interest in. You seem to want others to do your homework.

This is my last response to you on this topic, as you have not contributed anything of value whatsoever.

[Lakepilot]

We had 60 Halogen bulbs in our motorhome that were replace by LED's. In the past LED's had a color temperature far different then sunlight. The LED's that were used in our motorhome very closely approximate the color temperature of sunlight. They are very pleasing.

The LED's run very very cool. You can't feel anyn temperature rise with the. Our's was also one of the first motorhomes in which you could dim the LED's. The LED's used in our motorhome are not your fathers LED's and are much better then CFL's or standard light bulbs.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

LED bulbs in current, and upcoming products, run the diode at a high temperature relative to where it would be optimally. This is a problem that is being solved with various approaches to cooling the diode/diode junction so that enough light output can be achieved to make the bulb useful without also dramatically shortening it's useful life.

“Relative” may be the important word here, as well as with your earlier statement that LED bulbs “run very hot.” Without quantifying what “run very hot” means (or your later description of “warm to hotish”), there is no basis for comparison. Perhaps when you wrote “run very hot” you meant in comparison to the normal operating temperature of a diode. As a lay person, I took it to mean in comparison to a traditional incandescent bulb, which in my opinion runs very hot; too hot to grab a 100 watt bulb without being burned after it’s been on for more than several seconds. Unfortunately, you’ve refused to clarify your statement or provide any kind of substantiation. I have no idea at what temperature a diode normally operates or how warm a diode in an LED bulb gets. You appear to be the expert and one would think that you would therefore have much easier access to the information than I, and yet you insist that I should be doing the research to prove your point for you.

Save your 'BS flag' for a topic that you have some knowledge to actually make a call on.

I have some knowledge of basic physics. If an LED bulb puts out approximately the same amount of light and a lot of heat (“runs very hot”) at 20% of the energy required for an incandescent light, something doesn’t add up.

Again, if you did some research of your own instead of making stupid forum arguments you would understand what I was describing without needing more clarification. Most people enjoy researching things they have an interest in. You seem to want others to do your homework.

My “research” to refute your claim that LED bulbs “run very hot” (whatever that means) is below. I haven’t found anything that would lead me to believe that LED bulbs “run very hot,” especially as compared to incandescent bulbs and even CFLs. If you think that I’ve made “stupid” arguments, than I suggest that you counter them with your own arguments, based on supportable facts. And please, there’s no reason to get nasty. Doing so only makes it clearer to me that you’re unable to defend your statements and therefore you feel the need to make it personal. You’re entitled to your opinion that LED bulbs “run very hot,” but until you quantify this statement and support it with facts, that’s all it is, an opinion. It’s not my job to do your homework.

This is my last response to you on this topic, as you have not contributed anything of value whatsoever.

Ah, the taking-my-ball-and-going-home ending, usually included because the poster is unable to make a reply that supports his position and that is based in reality. I’ve already provided one link; below are four more that I think add some value.

I have an open mind, and I was and continue to be willing to consider verifiable facts (not opinion) that support your position. But since it’s your position, they also have to be facts that you present.



http://news.cnet.com/8301-11128_3-20...ed-lightbulbs/

http://greenliving.about.com/od/scie..._choices_4.htm

http://www.gizmag.com/ge-40-watt-replacement-led/14765/

http://blog.nularis.com/2011/05/how-...ulbs-work.html

[brk-lnt]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=switch+led+bulb+cooling

[Jonas Pilot]

... in the beginning, until it was turned into a p***ing match.

This is from the forum FAQ ,

If you don't agree with something expressed on the Forum respond with your opinion, don't get personal! Your comments and opinions are welcome, personal attacks, insults or flames are not.

[upthesaukee]

Well said, Jonas Pilot.

We have had cfl bulbs for a few years, and have found that the multi-wattage (3 way) just haven't worked that well. Single wattage just take a little getting used to with the "warm up" aspects. We do have outside CFL's in a motion detector fixture on our garage. Again, a warm up feature, but it does throw enough light to see where you are going even early on. Just can't read the newspaper for a few minutes.

Care of bulbs is not any different than the regular flourescent bulbs we have in our house. We exercise extra care to ensure we do not break them.

[Jonas Pilot]

When it's really cold, mid winter cold, do you get enough light from the garage cfl, before it warms up, to "get to the house"?

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by Jonas Pilot

When it's really cold, mid winter cold, do you get enough light from the garage cfl, before it warms up, to "get to the house"?

The garage faces the street, and when we come out of the garage, we turn to the right and cross the front of the garage. We will be picking up light from the garage door opener as the door closes, and if we take stuff out of the car and take a minute or so to do that, it probably does. Once we clear the front of the garage, the motion detector spot on the front of the house (not CFL) usually kicks on and we have a well lit path.

I would say that there is no doubt that the colder it is, the longer it takes to get to full brightness.

[ITD]

The "runs very hot" contest is getting very old. I understood what Bkr-Int meant when he said the present LEDs run very hot. This is an issue for the long term reliability and could possibly be a safety issue as these "bulbs" incorporate plastics in their design as opposed to an incandescent bulb that is made mainly from glass and metal. It's important to remember that even at 20 watts, that amount of power concentrated in a small area can produce high temperatures. Designers can work to keep those temperatures away from skin, but it can still be an issue as I mentioned above.


Personally I am livid about incandescent bulbs being forcibly removed from shelves at the end of this year. I don't like the light from CFLs and haven't seen an LED light I've liked yet. The federal government is granted a very specific range of powers in the constitution and deciding which type of light bulb we should buy is not one of them. Our freedoms are slowly being taken from us........

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by ITD

The "runs very hot" contest is getting very old. I understood what Bkr-Int meant when he said the present LEDs run very hot. This is an issue for the long term reliability and could possibly be a safety issue as these "bulbs" incorporate plastics in their design as opposed to an incandescent bulb that is made mainly from glass and metal. It's important to remember that even at 20 watts, that amount of power concentrated in a small area can produce high temperatures. Designers can work to keep those temperatures away from skin, but it can still be an issue as I mentioned above.

Thank you; that explanation makes sense.

Personally I am livid about incandescent bulbs being forcibly removed from shelves at the end of this year. I don't like the light from CFLs and haven't seen an LED light I've liked yet. The federal government is granted a very specific range of powers in the constitution and deciding which type of light bulb we should buy is not one of them. Our freedoms are slowly being taken from us........

You don't want to get into a debate about interpreting the Constitution, do you? (The Commerce Clause, the Necessary and Proper Clause, etc.)

Just kidding. This is neither the time nor the place.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

You don't want to get into a debate about interpreting the Constitution, do you? (The Commerce Clause, the Necessary and Proper Clause, etc.)

Just kidding. This is neither the time nor the place.

You're right, this is neither the time nor the place...... but regulation of commerce between states should never have evolved into banning lightbulbs or anything else for that matter by the federal government. There are very clear remedies in the constitution for Federal government run amok, it is up to us, the citizens of this country, to see to it our elected officials respect us and those remedies. Due to apathy, indifference and acquiescence we have allowed DC to get away with too much and our economy and citizens are paying the price. Time to wake up.

[Merrymeeting]

All these bulbs are reviewed and assessed in this months Consumer Reports magazine.

[Jonas Pilot]

Anybody out there have any experience with LED night lights?

[Slickcraft]

Yes, that is a perfect application for LEDs.

We have a sensor model:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_141426-53058...ght&facetInfo=

The 3 LED light is fine but the motion sensor on this specific model is a little touchy, too many false turn-on events but that is not a fault of the LEDs.

[Jonas Pilot]

Thanks Slick, Do you know how many watts they burn? I couldn't find it in that link. All the night lights I have, and it's a bunch, burn a 4 w. I have used 7 w and they threw a lot of light but burned out quickly. Using nite lites is an important safety tool.

[Slickcraft]

Originally Posted by Jonas Pilot

Thanks Slick, Do you know how many watts they burn? I couldn't find it in that link. All the night lights I have, and it's a bunch, burn a 4 w. I have used 7 w and they threw a lot of light but burned out quickly. Using nite lites is an important safety tool.

The packaging is gone but the back of the device says 0.3W and it gives out a good amount of light.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=switch+led+bulb+cooling

It's obvious from my first post in this thread that what I take issue with is your statement that LED bulbs "run very hot." You haven't explained or clarified what you mean by that, although in a later post you did modify your description to "warm to hotish."

Without quantifying the term "very hot" (more than 200' F? more than 300' F?) or comparing it to something else that operates at a relatively high temperature (like a standard incandescent bulb), your statement makes no sense.

It's my opinion that a standard incandescent bulb runs very hot. You can easily burn yourself if you touch one. To me, it sounds like you're saying that an LED bulb gets just as hot as an incandescent bulb. That's what I'm taking issue with, because that is false.

Your link to the article on Switch Lighting says nothing about how hot their LED bulb gets. It talks about their use of new liquid-cooling technology to cool the LEDs, but nothing about what kind of temperatures are present.