Lakeport Landing business

[Resident 2B]

Originally Posted by Just Sold

My observation is that Lakeport Landing do not make a reasonable offer using the conditions put forth by the City Council. They tried to alter the conditions and that move blew up in their face. They lost fair and square to the higher bidder. That is what happens in any real estate deal be it commercial or residential. Erica Blizzard and Lakeport Landing made their bed and they have to sleep in it.

I agree. I understand Erica stated that money can buy whatever you want in Laconia. Not a direct quote, but that was the jest of her statement. Open bidding is clearly top bid gets the property as long as the minimum is met. That is the way it is.

R2B

[Charlie T]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

Of course everyone is assuming they had infinite financial resources to engage in a bidding war.

If I had to guess I'd think that much of the financial reserves that Lakeport may have saved up over the years have gone to legal fees. I guess you reap what you sow

[sum-r breeze]

Originally Posted by Resident 2B

I agree. I understand Erica stated that money can buy whatever you want in Laconia. Not a direct quote, but that was the jest of her statement. Open bidding is clearly top bit gets the property as long as the minimum is met. That is the way it is.

R2B

Welcome to the real world Honey.....Time to put your big girl pants on!!

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[playinghooky]

The sale of Lakeport Landing to Irwin is unfair, reconsider it
Jun 11, 2015

In 1978, my family purchased Lakeport Landing Marina. They sold everything they had including a vehicle just for the down payment. My father came from less than nothing, but what he lacked in education and money, he made up for with hard work and determination. My parents struggled for years working every day to turn a boat yard, which looked more like a junk yard, into a marina. My father had a vision.

His vision was hindered in 1983 after he rightfully purchased the property located at 21 Elm St. from the City of Laconia for $25,000. An error was made by the city and Irwin Marine sued to block the sale. The mistake resulted in the city having to undo the transaction and return the money to my father.

We ended up with a 30-year lease instead which at the time was our only option. My father always believed that there was an understanding with the city that he had the first right to purchase the property at the end of the lease.

My father passed away on April 10, 2013. For most of my life, I have known how important obtaining this property was to him. I saw how disappointed he was at the end when he realized that his time was running out and this part of his vision from way back in 1978 had not been achieved.

Over the years, we invested over $500,000 in the property in the form of improvements, taxes and lease payments. Last fall we offered to purchase the property for $331,400, which is the assessed value. By this offer, we were essentially purchasing the showroom twice. We had made the lease payments for the last 30 years and also paid to build the building, which in 1983 was in excess of $200,000. It was the deal my father had to take 30 years ago and 30 years later, this is what the city of Laconia felt the property was worth.

I became aware that Irwin Marine also still wanted the property and intended to move aggressively to do whatever it took to obtain it. They are already the largest marina in the state of New Hampshire, so obtaining this property, which is a long, narrow strip of land less than one acre, was not going to give them any more exposure and very little additional space. I couldn’t help but think that it must be some sort of power play when their representatives bluntly told me that they would acquire the property and have much deeper pockets than Lakeport Landing to do so. They informed me that it “wasn’t personal, it was business.” After 37 years of being their neighbor it was both personal and business, bad business.

I was shocked when the City Council unexpectedly made their decision during a time where I felt we were still in the negotiation process. I believe there was a “rush to judgement” and lack of consideration when the final decision was made roughly 30 minutes after looking at the two offers.

Sure, the Irwin Marine offer was in excess of any reasonable value for the property, but I question whether the City Council really had time to consider the fairness of the two offers. Without committing to a final price, my offer included an agreement to keep a taxable building of the existing size on the property for a period of 50 years.

I also agreed to substantially increase the size of another building on Park Street, which would have added to the city’s tax roll. In the long run, the city would be making much more money with Lakeport Landing’s commitment to expand, than Irwin Marine’s one time overpayment.

The City Council took something special away from me to give to Irwin Marine, because they felt this was in the best interest of the city. Who is the city? Am I not part of the city? Is my family’s taxpaying dollars since 1978 not part of the city? Are my employees who live here not part of the city? Was it fair to view both parties as identical even though Lakeport Landing has invested hundreds of thousands into the property and Irwin Marine has invested nothing?

The City Council still has the opportunity to “get it right,” if any one of the four councilors (Bownes, Doyle, Hamel or Lipman) would move to reconsider Monday’s vote to sell the property to Irwin Marine and acknowledge that the process of our negotiations may not have been properly followed.

Erica Blizzard

Laconia

[Joebon]

It's amazing that people don't read the leases/contracts they sign. Someone that entitled deserves what has happened.

[BroadHopper]

desperately needs parking for the valet service and those who trailer their boats and use the launch ramp. I was told that was the original goal of the land purchase, for parking. Since the city is looking for more parking, this has to be the carrot on the end of the stick.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

desperately needs parking for the valet service and those who trailer their boats and use the launch ramp. I was told that was the original goal of the land purchase, for parking. Since the city is looking for more parking, this has to be the carrot on the end of the stick.

Tearing down the building and turning it into a parking lot, although suiting Irwin's needs, will lower the assessed value of the property and cost Laconia in reduced tax revenue.

[sum-r breeze]

Irwin Marine is the most respected name in the boating industry of the lakes region for reason..........They earned it..............Lakeport Landing is not.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[Little Bear]

Originally Posted by sum-r breeze

Irwin Marine is the most respected name in the boating industry of the lakes region for reason..........They earned it..............Lakeport Landing is not.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

On what do you base this assessment/opinion?

[sum-r breeze]

Originally Posted by Little Bear

On what do you base this assessment/opinion?

Personal experience with both businesses. I wouldn't be this opinionated without direct interaction with both.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[BroadHopper]

I have personal experience with both businesses. My family and the Irwins grew up together. Although Blizzard is a 'late comer', he has the family's trust and have given us plenty of business.

They are both trusted businesses with similar philosophies. The siblings are the differences, with more modern philosophies that my generation may or may not agree. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

I have bought boats and supplies from both businesses. Irwin appeals to the middle class while LL appeals to the upper class as far as sales, yet LL has lower gas prices, lower slip and storage fees. Both have excellent maintenance facilities, Bruce and Ron are excellent to deal with, but major repairs and troubleshoot goes to Dave's Motorboat Shop.

I have never had experience with PBM, although Paul and Jack has a few 'choice words' about Kevin. I am sure Kevin has a few words about their business as well. That is what competition is all about.

Business is game. Pick you battles ladies and gentlemen!

[sum-r breeze]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

I have personal experience with both businesses. My family and the Irwins grew up together. Although Blizzard is a 'late comer', he has the family's trust and have given us plenty of business.

They are both trusted businesses with similar philosophies. The siblings are the differences, with more modern philosophies that my generation may or may not agree. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

I have bought boats and supplies from both businesses. Irwin appeals to the middle class while LL appeals to the upper class as far as sales, yet LL has lower gas prices, lower slip and storage fees. Both have excellent maintenance facilities, Bruce and Ron are excellent to deal with, but major repairs and troubleshoot goes to Dave's Motorboat Shop.

I have never had experience with PBM, although Paul and Jack has a few 'choice words' about Kevin. I am sure Kevin has a few words about their business as well. That is what competition is all about.

Business is game. Pick you battles ladies and gentlemen!

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with the upper class/ middle class assessment of the cliental. Irwin marine sells entry level boats but it also sells Meridian Yachts one of which is the largest (and probably most expensive) in MVYC. This diverse boating customer base ensures that when someone gets into boating as a young family, who can only afford "so much" boat, they will continue as customers as their financial position improves with age. Irwin treats their trailer boat customers with the same caring and appreciative attitude as they do with the big end sales. I know because I've been on both ends of that spectrum. People in the service business need to think along the lines of how the person on the other side of the counter would like to be treated. I use a saying frequently in my business "You can always tell the type of business you are dealing with when you go to them with a problem." Think about what has transpired and how you can make things better instead of denying and stonewalling the solution. A satisfied customer will tell three people...a dissatisfied one will tell three hundred.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[Rich]

Originally Posted by sum-r breeze

"You can always tell the type of business you are dealing with when you go to them with a problem."

I'm glad you have had great dealings with Irwin, perhaps it was in the past?

I had a major problem brewing with one of their sales persons, I emailed all the current owners and upper management about it. Not one even took the time to say "What's going on", or "Sorry this is going on", nor even a "Thanks for being a customer".

So now I believe those that say that the sons are not running the business the same way as their father did. Just my opinion from doing business with them in the last 3 and 4 years.

Some on their staff are great, but their upper management seemed that they couldn't have cared less. Oh, I wasn't making a small purchase from them, just sayin!

I haven't had any business (yet) with Lakeport Landing, so I can't comment on them at all. But based on my personal experience with Irwin, I'm happy to tell anyone that asks that I wasn't happy with the way they handled my transaction (and several aspects of delivery). I'll give them the benefit of change, because the sales person I was dealing with is now gone, and this can only be an improvement for them. But their upper management didn't care at the time to look into what was going on, so as long as they are still in control, I don't believe their reputation is as great as they once were.

So I'll repeat your quote:

Originally Posted by sum-r breeze

"You can always tell the type of business you are dealing with when you go to them with a problem."

Exactly!

[sum-r breeze]

Originally Posted by Rich

I'm glad you have had great dealings with Irwin, perhaps it was in the past?

I had a major problem brewing with one of their sales persons, I emailed all the current owners and upper management about it. Not one even took the time to say "What's going on", or "Sorry this is going on", nor even a "Thanks for being a customer".

So now I believe those that say that the sons are not running the business the same way as their father did. Just my opinion from doing business with them in the last 3 and 4 years.

Some on their staff are great, but their upper management seemed that they couldn't have cared less. Oh, I wasn't making a small purchase from them, just sayin!

I haven't had any business (yet) with Lakeport Landing, so I can't comment on them at all. But based on my personal experience with Irwin, I'm happy to tell anyone that asks that I wasn't happy with the way they handled my transaction (and several aspects of delivery). I'll give them the benefit of change, because the sales person I was dealing with is now gone, and this can only be an improvement for them. But their upper management didn't care at the time to look into what was going on, so as long as they are still in control, I don't believe their reputation is as great as they once were.

So I'll repeat your quote:


Exactly!

Sent you a PM with some contact info

[Rich]

Thanks for the PM

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by playinghooky

The sale of Lakeport Landing to Irwin is unfair, reconsider it
Jun 11, 2015

In 1978, my family purchased Lakeport Landing Marina. They sold everything they had including a vehicle just for the down payment. My father came from less than nothing, but what he lacked in education and money, he made up for with hard work and determination. My parents struggled for years working every day to turn a boat yard, which looked more like a junk yard, into a marina. My father had a vision.

His vision was hindered in 1983 after he rightfully purchased the property located at 21 Elm St. from the City of Laconia for $25,000. An error was made by the city and Irwin Marine sued to block the sale. The mistake resulted in the city having to undo the transaction and return the money to my father.

We ended up with a 30-year lease instead which at the time was our only option. My father always believed that there was an understanding with the city that he had the first right to purchase the property at the end of the lease.

My father passed away on April 10, 2013. For most of my life, I have known how important obtaining this property was to him. I saw how disappointed he was at the end when he realized that his time was running out and this part of his vision from way back in 1978 had not been achieved.

Over the years, we invested over $500,000 in the property in the form of improvements, taxes and lease payments. Last fall we offered to purchase the property for $331,400, which is the assessed value. By this offer, we were essentially purchasing the showroom twice. We had made the lease payments for the last 30 years and also paid to build the building, which in 1983 was in excess of $200,000. It was the deal my father had to take 30 years ago and 30 years later, this is what the city of Laconia felt the property was worth.

I became aware that Irwin Marine also still wanted the property and intended to move aggressively to do whatever it took to obtain it. They are already the largest marina in the state of New Hampshire, so obtaining this property, which is a long, narrow strip of land less than one acre, was not going to give them any more exposure and very little additional space. I couldn’t help but think that it must be some sort of power play when their representatives bluntly told me that they would acquire the property and have much deeper pockets than Lakeport Landing to do so. They informed me that it “wasn’t personal, it was business.” After 37 years of being their neighbor it was both personal and business, bad business.

I was shocked when the City Council unexpectedly made their decision during a time where I felt we were still in the negotiation process. I believe there was a “rush to judgement” and lack of consideration when the final decision was made roughly 30 minutes after looking at the two offers.

Sure, the Irwin Marine offer was in excess of any reasonable value for the property, but I question whether the City Council really had time to consider the fairness of the two offers. Without committing to a final price, my offer included an agreement to keep a taxable building of the existing size on the property for a period of 50 years.

I also agreed to substantially increase the size of another building on Park Street, which would have added to the city’s tax roll. In the long run, the city would be making much more money with Lakeport Landing’s commitment to expand, than Irwin Marine’s one time overpayment.

The City Council took something special away from me to give to Irwin Marine, because they felt this was in the best interest of the city. Who is the city? Am I not part of the city? Is my family’s taxpaying dollars since 1978 not part of the city? Are my employees who live here not part of the city? Was it fair to view both parties as identical even though Lakeport Landing has invested hundreds of thousands into the property and Irwin Marine has invested nothing?

The City Council still has the opportunity to “get it right,” if any one of the four councilors (Bownes, Doyle, Hamel or Lipman) would move to reconsider Monday’s vote to sell the property to Irwin Marine and acknowledge that the process of our negotiations may not have been properly followed.

Erica Blizzard

Laconia

Is it just me or is this lady highly offensive? "An error was made" which allowed the sale to be blocked? I wonder what the lease payments were for all these years? Probably a pittance? She should have bid above the appraisal price ($480,000) if she wanted the property. Her sense of entitlement is obnoxious.

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by codeman671

Tearing down the building and turning it into a parking lot, although suiting Irwin's needs, will lower the assessed value of the property and cost Laconia in reduced tax revenue.

Not true. If Irwin outbids Lakeport by a couple hundred thousand dollars the property tax bill will be calculated on the higher sales price regardless of what is done with the building.

[HellRaZoR004]

Originally Posted by secondcurve

Not true. If Irwin outbids Lakeport by a couple hundred thousand dollars the property tax bill will be calculated on the higher sales price regardless of what is done with the building.

Until they get reappraised the following year, or the file for it to be reevaluated.

[meredith weekender]

One of the stipulations that the City of Laconia had was that the property could not be altered in a way that reduce the taxable value of the property and therefore reduce the tax due on the property. This information is in the article published by the Laconia Sun on May 28, 2015 and is in an earlier post on this thread.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by secondcurve

Not true. If Irwin outbids Lakeport by a couple hundred thousand dollars the property tax bill will be calculated on the higher sales price regardless of what is done with the building.

Not true. If someone buys a property with a building on it and rips down the building the value is worth less and can be reassessed accordingly. Sales price and assessments don't usually match 100% anyhow. My home is proof of that, so weren't my last two. In fact, probably every one I have ever owned shows the same.

From Meredith Weekender's post above it appears that Laconia already thought of this and put in a clause to prevent them from altering the property in a way that would reduce the tax base.

[Sunbeam lodge]

Originally Posted by secondcurve

Is it just me or is this lady highly offensive? "An error was made" which allowed the sale to be blocked? I wonder what the lease payments were for all these years? Probably a pittance? She should have bid above the appraisal price ($480,000) if she wanted the property. Her sense of entitlement is obnoxious.

From a financial viewpoint LL said they have spent $500k in improvements over the 30 years . $200 k for a building the rest was for taxes, lease payments. First the 200 k in building was an asset that is fully recovered through depreciation and a reduction in Fed taxes. The other $300k over 30 years amounts to $10k a year for taxes and lease payments. Can anyone sell millions of dollars of boats on that property and only pay $800 for taxes and lease payments. In addition those are normal cost of doing business and in their tax bracket the net cost after taxes would only be half that amount. They should have made a creditable bid as they have had a great deal over the years and they could then depreciate the cost of the new building over its useful life.

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by codeman671

Not true. If someone buys a property with a building on it and rips down the building the value is worth less and can be reassessed accordingly. Sales price and assessments don't usually match 100% anyhow. My home is proof of that, so weren't my last two. In fact, probably every one I have ever owned shows the same.

From Meredith Weekender's post above it appears that Laconia already thought of this and put in a clause to prevent them from altering the property in a way that would reduce the tax base.

I stand corrected. Thanks

[laketrout]

There is always room for compromise in this case between Irwin and Lakeport/Blizzard's but the deep pockets won out this time. However I do not the whole story

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by laketrout

There is always room for compromise in this case between Irwin and Lakeport/Blizzard's but the deep pockets won out this time. However I do not the whole story

Why should there be a compromise? The city was selling a property and two parties were interested. One party bid modestly above the appraised value and the other party bid significantly below the appraised value? Given the difficult fiscal condition most cities and towns face today it is incumbent to maximize value where possible. If the selectman sold the property to the lower bidder that would be equivalent to stealing from the Laconia tax payers.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by secondcurve

Why should there be a compromise? The city was selling a property and two parties were interested. One party bid modestly above the appraised value and the other party bid significantly below the appraised value? Given the difficult fiscal condition most cities and towns face today it is incumbent to maximize value where possible. If the selectman sold the property to the lower bidder that would be equivalent to stealing from the Laconia tax payers.

The problem is spending the money wisely. With the current track record it will be like throwing money down the drain!

[fatlazyless]

In today's Saturday Union Leader, article says that Erica Blizzard would have bid more had she known it would go to the highest offer, and she is asking the city council to re-consider their decision.

Sounds like there was some type of miss-communication or miss-understanding between the two parties, the City of Laconia and Erica,or maybe she just got incorrect council from her attorney?

hmmmm.....doesn't a higher price usually send the loudest message?


The vote to accept the higher offer was 4-2 city councilors, so stay tuned to see if the vote is again 4-2 to not re-consider? This seems to be getting over-complicated?

[meredith weekender]

Lakeport Landing (Erica) had her chance to put in her best and final bid. She chose to keep her bid amount the same. Irwin outbid Lakeport and therefore they won the bid. End of story, DONE.

[Resident 2B]

How can anyone running a business not understand the open bidding process? Even worse, how does she continue to carry on like she was fooled? Unbelievable in my opinion. If the bidding is re-opened because Erica did not understand what was happening and then she wins, why would Irwin not bring a costly lawsuit against the City of Laconia?

When you are in the game, you learn the rules before you play the game. Ignorance of the rules is not something you complain about after you lose.

R2B

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by Resident 2B

How can anyone running a business not understand the open bidding process? Even worse, how does she continue to carry on like she was fooled? Unbelievable in my opinion. If the bidding is re-opened because Erica did not understand what was happening and then she wins, why would Irwin not bring a costly lawsuit against the City of Laconia?

When you are in the game, you learn the rules before you play the game. Ignorance of the rules is not something you complain about after you lose.

R2B

R2B

I wouldn't worry too much about the bidding process being reopened after Blizzard called out the councilmen in the newspaper. Any chance of a second look at the matter went out the window when she chastised the councilmen publicly.

[fatlazyless]

Well ..... in a few days or so ... time will tell what happens with a possible re-consideration. As already mentioned, the vote to accept the higher offer was 4-2, so's it is probably safe to assume the two will vote yes to a re-consideration, and then it would require just ONE of the four votes to switch for a 3-3 vote. At that point, am not sure what the protocol is..... does a tie 3-3 vote then go to the mayor to decide in case of a tie vote?

And, then the bids would be higher, with more money for the city, so's the city would most likely get a higher price if a re-consideration is the outcome ..... that would make a bigger income .... for the City .... more money, more money, more money....ka-ching, ka-chang, ka-ching ... for the City!

[Lakeboater]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Well ..... in a few days or so ... time will tell what happens with a possible re-consideration. As already mentioned, the vote to accept the higher offer was 4-2, so's it is probably safe to assume the two will vote yes to a re-consideration, and then it would require just ONE of the four votes to switch for a 3-3 vote. At that point, am not sure what the protocol is..... does a tie 3-3 vote then go to the mayor to decide in case of a tie vote?

And, then the bids would be higher, with more money for the city, so's the city would most likely get a higher price if a re-consideration is the outcome ..... that would make a bigger income .... for the City .... more money, more money, more money....ka-ching, ka-chang, ka-ching ... for the City!

I believe that the reconsideration vote has to come from 2 of the councilman that were in favor of the sale to Irwin not the 2 that opposed the sale.

[fatlazyless]

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index...er-marina-vote


.... and here's hope'n that this link actually works! Say-hey....it actually works....am I good....or am I good......I am the greatest! ...ugh!

.....now, back to figuring out what the h is going on with Lakeport Landing and Irwin's as they duke it out for a long narrow .81 acre of land, owned by the City of Laconia, that is apparently very dear to both of them!

[Patiently Watching]

What a waste of time and money...

If this property were really important to her, she would have bid accordingly.

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index...er-marina-vote


.... and here's hope'n that this link actually works! Say-hey....it actually works....am I good....or am I good......I am the greatest! ...ugh!

.....now, back to figuring out what the h is going on with Lakeport Landing and Irwin's as they duke it out for a long narrow .81 acre of land, owned by the City of Laconia, that is apparently very dear to both of them!

Thanks FLL. Blizzard was surprised that the city voted to sell to Irwin? What part of "submit your highest and best offer" did she not understand? Irwin won fair and square. Further, Laconia could use these funds for any of a number of good causes such as reinvestment in the Weirs, etc. I will be dumfounded if their original decision is reversed.

[BroadHopper]

Irwin's was well aware Blizzard bid, so they bid higher. I'm surprised Blizzard did not counter offer unless Irwin bid was at the last minute and Blizzard did not have a chance to for a counter offer. I've seen this before in other bids around the country. Certainly not fair but like everything else it is a game played within the rules.

[Resident 2B]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

Irwin's was well aware Blizzard bid, so they bid higher. I'm surprised Blizzard did not counter offer unless Irwin bid was at the last minute and Blizzard did not have a chance to for a counter offer. I've seen this before in other bids around the country. Certainly not fair but like everything else it is a game played within the rules.

Aren't these sealed bids due in hand on a date and time made public to all? If so, there is no counter bidding.

This was a re-bid, so going into it, both parties knew what the other bid on the first round in which both bids were rejected by Laconia as being unacceptably low. That, in itself, told both parties to bring their bids up. Irwin increased their bid, but Blizzard did not.

R2B

[Patiently Watching]

Should have put her best foot forward - no surprise who the other bidder would be and their potential motivation.

Once again, she gambled and big. Nothing new...

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by Patiently Watching

Should have put her best foot forward - no surprise who the other bidder would be and their potential motivation.

Once again, she gambled and big. Nothing new...

And likely she will lose big, AGAIN.

[Broken Glass]

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

[sum-r breeze]

Originally Posted by sum-r breeze

Personal experience with both businesses. I wouldn't be this opinionated without direct interaction with both.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

No change... same story......balls or not

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Broken Glass

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

It has been covered over and over again. The rules were set in place, Erica didn't listen to what the city was asking for, didn't pony up and lost out. She is crying over spilt milk.

Irwin played by the rules and had bigger ones than she had.

I am a business owner in a market that takes a serious pair to be competitive in. Lots of personal financial risk involved and the reward isn't what it used to be, so I do take exception to your comment of being without balls, hiding behind a keyboard....I am sure others on this thread are not just keyboard jockeys with nothing more to do than sit around and be judgmental as well.

Many of us do know the players involved. Irwin has been a long standing name in the lakes region, maybe more so than Blizzard.

[Descant]

If posters want to keep repeating nothing new, this thread should be moved to the "Issues:" pages.

[fatlazyless]

As I understand it, there are six voting councilors and just off the top of my head, it will take two of the four councilors who voted yes to accept the Irwin-522k offer to vote yes to a re-consideration. Brenda Baer, and Armand Bolduc support the efforts of the Lakeport Landing business probably because it has been there for 30-years in its effort to purchase their .81 acre land and buildings.

These two, Baer and Bolduc, sounded pretty adamant in their suppost for the Blizzards and Lakeport Landing, so's only time will tell if they can convince two out of the other four councilors to go along with a re-consideration ..... plus, of course....it would most likely mean the City of Laconia would receive a higher price.

Oh ye all six councilors ...... take a good deep look into your hearts and just ask yourself: What is the right thing to do here?

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by Broken Glass

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

When Ms. Blizzard started pointing fingers in her editorial she opened herself up to public criticism. She obviously feels that she is entitled to preferential pricing on the asset her family has profitably leased for the past 30-years. She fails to note in her editorial that her business has earned many times the $16,666.70 in annual lease payments, taxes, building expense, etc., much of which was tax deductible, it has paid over the past 30-years. Many tax payers and forum members do not feel a substantial discount is warranted at the expense of the hard working taxpayers of Laconia. The city is under financial stress and it would be unfair to offer Blizzard preferential pricing on a valuable city asset regardless of the length of time her business has been in Laconia. The city has gone above and beyond already by extending her lease an additional 2-years to allow for a smooth transition. Hopefully, the matter will be closed once and for all in the near term. I apologize if I have offered anyone, including Ms. Blizzard, but it is best to graciously move on when things do not go one's way, especially when the playing field was level.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

As I understand it, there are six voting councilors and just off the top of my head, it will take two of the four councilors who voted yes to accept the Irwin-522k offer to vote yes to a re-consideration. Brenda Baer, and Armand Bolduc support the efforts of the Lakeport Landing business probably because it has been there for 30-years in its effort to purchase their .81 acre land and buildings.

These two, Baer and Bolduc, sounded pretty adamant in their suppost for the Blizzards and Lakeport Landing, so's only time will tell if they can convince two out of the other four councilors to go along with a re-consideration ..... plus, of course....it would most likely mean the City of Laconia would receive a higher price.

Oh ye all six councilors ...... take a good deep look into your hearts and just ask yourself: What is the right thing to do here?

The other four wants to build a new high school off Parade Road! That's a waste of money! School enrollment been declining since the '70's. Graduating class is the smallest since the '40's. And they need a bigger school? They already spent millions in the Huot Center and the sport complex at the site and they want to move the school? I have been at odds with Baer for years and this is the first time I ever commended her.

Our tax dollars at work going down the drain...................

[Tank151]

Originally Posted by Broken Glass

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

Great remark - couldn't have said it better myself!

[fatlazyless]

......like wow....and holy smokes....that's pretty amazing how this finally ended up Monday night, July 13.....with the councilor's voting 3-3, and the deciding vote cast by the mayor to not re-consider, and to accept the much higher offer from Irwin's.



Most likely, having the mayor be responsible for the deciding vote could have swayed the six councilors to split their votes by 3-3, as opposed to making the decision themselves, and serving up the ball into his court.



Is it all over, or will there be a follow up lawsuit ... and isn't that what happened originally, 30-years ago, back in 1985..... a lawsuit which lead to the creation of the three 10-year leases.



Back 30-years ago, in 1985, Irwin Marine sued the City of Laconia because it felt it had been an unfair sale, and now 30-years later, in 2015, it seems likely that Lakeport Landing will sue the City of Laconia because it feels it is an unfair sale.

[Seaplane Pilot]

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index...over-bid-award

I hope they stick it to the City of Laconia.

[fatlazyless]

So's ...... what to do with the money?

Wouldn't it be nice if the City of Laconia directs all their $528,000 Irwin Marine high offer bid toward the construction of the www.wowtrail.org ...... making several miles ..... Laconia to Meredith .... about 9-miles total .... of the Winnipesaukee waterfront available to the public for the WOW trail, walking and bicycling paved trail ...... $528,000 public money well spent! You could probably go bicycling from April 1 to December 10, give or take a couple weeks, depending on the natural snowfall. That could be a very happening bicycle and walking, public rail-trail ....... like WOW!


Once it finally gets built, people will say 'so how come we didn't do this 30-years ago .....the WOW trail is super-duper.' It would bring a lot of people on bicycles through the Weirs Beach area.

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

So's ...... what to do with the money?

Wouldn't it be nice if the City of Laconia directs all their $528,000 Irwin Marine high offer bid toward the construction of the www.wowtrail.org ...... making several miles ..... Laconia to Meredith .... about 9-miles total .... of the Winnipesaukee waterfront available to the public for the WOW trail, walking and bicycling paved trail ...... $528,000 public money well spent! You could probably go bicycling from April 1 to December 10, give or take a couple weeks, depending on the natural snowfall. That could be a very happening bicycle and walking, public rail-trail ....... like WOW!


Once it finally gets built, people will say 'so how come we didn't do this 30-years ago .....the WOW trail is super-duper.'

yeah because they should take away private property of others and give it to the public who will neglect it. that ship sailed years ago. I for one if were an owner on that proposed trail would fight it tooth and nail

next useless comment????

[Mr. V]

next useless comment????

How about this useless comment:

Why wasn't the property sold by a competitive, public bidding process, i.e. at public auction, where each prospective purchaser knows what the other bidders have bid, and has the opportunity to increase their own bid?

That would be fair and transparent.

[SAMIAM]

Originally Posted by AC2717

yeah because they should take away private property of others and give it to the public who will neglect it. that ship sailed years ago. I for one if were an owner on that proposed trail would fight it tooth and nail

next useless comment????

Wouldn't that be nice......a beautiful chain link fence all the way from Lakeport the the Weirs. Can't think of a better use for waterfront property. Bet Southdown owners would be thrilled.

[Major]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

Wouldn't that be nice......a beautiful chain link fence all the way from Lakeport the the Weirs.Can't think of a better use for waterfront property.Bet Southdown owners would be thrilled.

Phase III of the WOW trail will never happen. They can't even get financing for Phase II. The expense of connecting Lakeport to Paugus Park Road alone is cost prohibitive, let alone the warchest of funds South Down and Long Bay have collected to fight the expansion.

[Winnisquamer]

Another trail for people to do drugs and leave drug paraphernalia on. I don't even enjoy walking to my car in Laconia never mind that new trail.

[Phantom]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

Wouldn't that be nice......a beautiful chain link fence all the way from Lakeport the the Weirs.Can't think of a better use for waterfront property.Bet Southdown owners would be thrilled.

That's a shame because one thing MA does have is some pretty nice "Rail Trails" ..... including one in my town that winds between currently two towns (Hudson/Marlboro) with plans for five towns (Acton/Maynard/Stow/Hudson/Marlboro)

http://www.townofhudson.org/public_d...onma_exec/ARRT


http://www.traillink.com/state/ma-trails.aspx
.

[Woodsy]

WOW Trail is a GREAT idea...

But that being said there is NO reason why there has to be an ugly chain link fence between the trail and the railroad tracks... The state is way off on this. Its not like this is a high speed rail corridor!!!

As far as Southdown Shores goes, they can fight, bitch and complain all they want... They DO NOT OWN the RR tracks or the waterfront! The State of NH does! They might get a court to delay the project, but inevitably it will happen. The state can start by NOT renewing the leases on the docks & waterfront and revoke the existing RR Track crossings... Ultimately the state will prevail. Especially when the Right of way is in the plans originally submitted for Southdown.

Sorry if I offended some of my Southdown friends.. but I absolutely abhor the NIMBY attitude of some people... The lake is for EVERYONE!

Woodsy

[Resident 2B]

I also hope the WOW trail gets completed without a fence. This is public land that should be enjoyed by the public. It is that simple.

No idea why the SDS folks think they can stop it. They need to read the documents they should have received when they purchased. Their docks are connected to shoreline SDS does not own. Biggest reason I did not buy there.

R2B

[Major]

Originally Posted by Resident 2B

I also hope the WOW trail gets completed without a fence. This is public land that should be enjoyed by the public. It is that simple.

No idea why the SDS folks think they can stop it. They need to read the documents they should have received when they purchased. Their docks are connected to shoreline SDS does not own. Biggest reason I did not buy there.

R2B

My understanding is that the right of way does not necessarily extend to the water's edge, but is defined by a certain width. I am not an expert on SD/LB legal position, but we are certainly well funded for a fight.

Practically speaking, if the Wow trail folks can't raise $1M or so to complete Phase II, there is absolutely no way they will be able to raise the $10M+ to complete Phase III. Right now it's a pipe dream.

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index...over-bid-award

I hope they stick it to the City of Laconia.

Apparently the issue is Mr. Blizzard and now his daughter believe that there was a right of first refusal extended to them on the property but there wasn't any paperwork executed or filed with the land court. Verbal agreements, if in fact there was one, don't mean much with respect to real estate. In fact they mean nothing. I think they are wasting time and money but if you get good counsel sometimes you can prevail. It will be interesting to watch it work its way through the courts. If Blizzard is successful reversing the Pending sale, I'd imagine the city will be sued by Irwin for breech of contract. What a mess.

[BroadHopper]

When it comes to court cases has not been good. I often wonder if they ever seek legal council before they open their mouths? Or financial advise for that matter as in the case citizens are ask to fill a w-9 form so that they can receive refunds? I wonder where they got their city manager?

[BroadHopper]

A while back the good governor Hassen had the idea to 'rent' the railroad rights to the folks that actually use the land between the tracks and the water line. You heard right the state can reap in a huge sum of money in this venture. It is still in the works and legally can happen! I can see Southdown spending huge sum of money to prevent this from happening.

Oh and the state can allow the WOW trail to venture next to the tracks through Southdown legally! It will happen eventually!

Same as the old Lake Shore Railroad! A number of property owners between Glendale and up to just before Ame's Farm had to remove structures built on the old rail bed for the Winni sewer project back in the 80's. There is an effort going on to make a bike trail on the old bed between Gilford and Alton. It can happen despite property owners saying they can't use their land. If they look at their deeds the state never gave up the rights. I can see all those McMansions on Rte 11 either torn up or move for the new bike trail or the eventual goal of the Winni Basin Sewer Project to surround the lake with a sewer line.

[winnipiseogee]

My family is from Cape Cod and I can remember all the bitching when the rail trail was proposed down there. Same complaints we hear in the lakes region about derelicts using the trail, invasion of people's privacy (because apparently the property owners didn't realize they had a railroad in their back yard when they bought the place).

Of course now the Cape Cod rail trail is a huge and unqualified success. Property values of homes immediately near the trail have seen HUGE increases because everyone wants to be near the trail. Of course sometimes karma doesn't seem to work and the people that bitched the most had the biggest financial gain from the trail.

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by winnipiseogee

My family is from Cape Cod and I can remember all the bitching when the rail trail was proposed down there. Same complaints we hear in the lakes region about derelicts using the trail, invasion of people's privacy (because apparently the property owners didn't realize they had a railroad in their back yard when they bought the place).

Of course now the Cape Cod rail trail is a huge and unqualified success. Property values of homes immediately near the trail have seen HUGE increases because everyone wants to be near the trail. Of course sometimes karma doesn't seem to work and the people that bitched the most had the biggest financial gain from the trail.

The general opposition to the trail in Southdown has been the ugly chainlink fence requirement. Personally, I don't think it will get much use, I think a lot of it will end up collecting trash (just look at existing segment), and I also think the general enthusiasm from the people who started this project has died down.

It's not exactly like Southdown is some impenetrable fortress, nobody is really worried about people "sneaking" in via the WOW trail, but people ARE concerned about an ugly fence. The only upside is that the fence would likely help keep the geese off the larger green areas.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

It's not exactly like Southdown is some impenetrable fortress, nobody is really worried about people "sneaking" in via the WOW trail, but people ARE concerned about an ugly fence. The only upside is that the fence would likely help keep the geese off the larger green areas.

Amen to that! Sort of like keeping the illegal immigrants at bay!

The Lake Shore railroad bed is obvious. I can't see how land owners don't see that there was a railroad bed through their property!

[thinkxingu]

Can someone explain why they would be a fence requirement? This would be along the shore, right?

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[fatlazyless]

Opinion article about the progress of the WOW Trail from last Monday, August 17:

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index...e-we-there-yet

"The WOW Trail will be a treasure for the City of Laconia. It will help build community, provide a healthy opportunity for people to gather and exercise, and will also beautify an area near the tracks that would otherwise remain unkempt. We are proud to be part of such a community-based effort."

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Can someone explain why they would be a fence requirement? This would be along the shore, right?

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

Because of the worry that people are too stupid and/or self-involved to notice a giant, noisy train coming down the tracks. Also, running over a person on the tracks would be bad for business for the Winnipesaukee railroad.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

Because of the worry that people are too stupid and/or self-involved to notice a giant, noisy train coming down the tracks. Also, running over a person on the tracks would be bad for business for the Winnipesaukee railroad.

Gotcha. Sad state of affairs that Stand By Me moments are thwarted by fences!

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[wifi]

Wait, the lawyers need feeding too

[SAMIAM]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Opinion article about the progress of the WOW Trail from last Monday, August 17:

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index...e-we-there-yet

"The WOW Trail will be a treasure for the City of Laconia. It will help build community, provide a healthy opportunity for people to gather and exercise, and will also beautify an area near the tracks that would otherwise remain unkempt. We are proud to be part of such a community-based effort."

Beautify with a chain link fence?
There are lots of wonderful walking trails in the lakes region...they are called sidewalks

[AC2717]

now that this thread is officially hijacked why does it need to go that way
why don't they just complete the sidewalks down union ave (has lake views) then down lake st to weirs blvd sidewalks all along the waterfront down the road? SO Lakeport and down union street infront of Irwins, to the cemetery (which will give those stores business) then left at the cemetery and in front front of the margate and then bam, you are on the waterfront right after the margate and a few properties. Most of the sidewalk is already completed and then meet up with the rail over the bridge and dumps into the weirs

beautiful views and there is already a road easement and fencing down the road and it will be a lot cheaper to finish the sidewalks

oh wait it makes way too much sense

[dave603]

Most rail trails are also for Bikes.
Your not supposed to be riding a bike on the sidewalks.

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by dave603

Most rail trails are also for Bikes.
Your not supposed to be riding a bike on the sidewalks.

put a trail on the sidewalk, they do on streets

[dave603]

Is there room to do that in the route described? Probably not.

Bikers along that stretch would be a nightmare if they have to stay on the road, unsafe for them and drivers.

[LongBay]

Originally Posted by AC2717

now that this thread is officially hijacked why does it need to go that way
why don't they just complete the sidewalks down union ave (has lake views) then down lake st to weirs blvd sidewalks all along the waterfront down the road? SO Lakeport and down union street infront of Irwins, to the cemetery (which will give those stores business) then left at the cemetery and in front front of the margate and then bam, you are on the waterfront right after the margate and a few properties. Most of the sidewalk is already completed and then meet up with the rail over the bridge and dumps into the weirs

beautiful views and there is already a road easement and fencing down the road and it will be a lot cheaper to finish the sidewalks

oh wait it makes way too much sense

Or how about just posting signs pointing up to Gunstock where there are lots of under utilized walking, hiking and biking paths already funded by Belknap county taxpayer money.

Oh that idea makes too much sense also.

Now back to the original post...
How about just using the new money collected from the sale of the Lakeport property to help pay down the Laconia debt burden so that local taxes don't go up for a change.

Oh yea, this idea also makes too much sense

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by dave603

Is there room to do that in the route described? Probably not.

Bikers along that stretch would be a nightmare if they have to stay on the road, unsafe for them and drivers.

plenty of room on the waterfront side of weirs blvd

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by AC2717

now that this thread is officially hijacked why does it need to go that way
why don't they just complete the sidewalks down union ave (has lake views) then down lake st to weirs blvd sidewalks all along the waterfront down the road? SO Lakeport and down union street infront of Irwins, to the cemetery (which will give those stores business) then left at the cemetery and in front front of the margate and then bam, you are on the waterfront right after the margate and a few properties. Most of the sidewalk is already completed and then meet up with the rail over the bridge and dumps into the weirs

beautiful views and there is already a road easement and fencing down the road and it will be a lot cheaper to finish the sidewalks

oh wait it makes way too much sense

I have address the issue about turning the old lake shore railroad bed between the Water works and the old burger king property and link up to the existing bike path in back of MacDonald's. You can ask the now infamous Cafula of Hathaway House fame, owner of the Dunkin Dognuts on Union Ave. why we couldn't use the old rail bed. The city has already witness almost fatal bike/pedestrian accidents along that stretch of Union Ave. How many more accidents do we need to convince the good folks to do the right thing?

[Phantom]

Looks like a new development ..... or I'm behind in the news

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/newsx/local-news



.

[8gv]

The purchase price of $528,000 is about sixty years worth of rent at $8,750/year.

I suspect that both marinas are unhappy with the deal. That means it's a good deal.

[Outdoorsman]

Originally Posted by Broken Glass

It appears that the Irwin business has won the battle. I think that really small people will rejoice in watching a hard working successful area business, get forced out of their business home.

Don't you have any appreciation at all for what has happened to a "family owned business that has been established in the area for what seems to be an eternity" ?????? And I am not talking about IRWIN

Karma is a bitch!

[fatlazyless]

Oh well ..... looks like Erica got stopped for a first time, hands-free cell phone violation by a state trooper in Laconia in September, and she is contesting it ..... live and learn? Wonder if getting stopped and cited for a violation was enough to get her to start using the 'hands on the steering wheel' blue-tooth? Her trial has been scheduled for January 25.

A first time, hands-free violation has a $124 fine, according to the article in today's Laconia Citizen.

"If the glove don't fit, then you must acquit!" ..... or something like ..... if you get a text, then make it wait till next!

http://www.citizen.com/news/2015-12-...violation.html

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Oh well ..... looks like Erica got stopped for a first time, hands-free cell phone violation by a state trooper in Laconia in September, and she is contesting it ..... live and learn? Wonder if getting stopped and cited for a violation was enough to get her to start using the 'hands on the steering wheel' blue-tooth? Her trial has been scheduled for January 25.

A first time, hands-free violation has a $124 fine, according to the article in today's Laconia Citizen.

"If the glove don't fit, then you must acquit!" ..... or something like ..... if you get a text, then make it wait till next!

http://www.citizen.com/news/2015-12-...violation.html

Your link didn't work. Below is the article:

Blizzard contests hands-free violation
By BEA LEWIS
LACONIA – A city woman convicted in 2011 of negligent driving for nearly hitting a State Trooper attempting to stop her SUV on I-93 as she fiddled with her cell phone, is challenging a ticket for violating the state's new hands free law.

Erica Blizzard, 42, 65 Gold St., Laconia, was issued a citation by New Hampshire State Trooper Russell Holmes, after he stopped her 2013 GMC Yukon on Union Avenue, Laconia on Sept. 16, at 5:18 p.m.

She pleaded not guilty on Sept. 23 and appeared in the 4th Circuit District Division Laconia Court on Dec. 2, for a pretrial conference. Her trial has been scheduled for Jan. 25 at 8:30 a.m.

Presiding Judge James Carroll has recused himself from hearing the case. Prior to being named to the bench, Carroll was Belknap County Attorney and prosecuted Blizzard for causing a speedboat accident that killed her best friend.

In 2010, she was convicted of failing to keep a proper lookout when she ran aground on Diamond Island on Lake Winnipesaukee in 2008. Stephanie Beaudoin of Meredith, was killed in the crash, and Blizzard, and another passenger Nicole Shinopulos of Burlington, MA., were seriously injured.

She was sentenced to 12 months in jail, but was freed on work release after serving 35 days.

New Hampshire's hands-free law went into effect on July 1. Conviction on a first offense is punishable by a $124 fine. Motorists are now prohibited from using hand held electronic devices while driving, or temporarily halted in traffic for a stop sign, traffic light or other temporary delay. The ban includes cellular telephones, Global Positioning Systems (GPS’s), tablets, IPADS, IPODS, or any other devices that require data entry.

In August, Blizzard who operates Lakeport Landing Marina, filed suit against the City of Laconia, challenging the legality of the City Council's decision to sell as surplus to competitor Irwin Marine, the property her late father, Paul, built a boat showroom on and had rented from the city.

Since the hands-free law went into effect, the majority of the citations that have come before Judge Carroll have been resolved by being placed on file without a finding on the condition the defendant completes a defensive driving course within 60 to 90 days with proof to the court and the state, coupled with a good behavior mandate ranging from six months to a year.

[MalibuResponse]

I thought this thread was about a business real estate transaction and not someone getting pulled over for a traffic violation? I guess this goes to show you that there isn't much going on in the lakes region this time of year if the newspapers can only find this subject to write about.

[noreast]

How much is bluetooth? I'm sure the suv has hands free. Sometimes bad things just happen to good people. Nah, just a total lack of respect.

[Just Sold]

Warring marinas to square off in court.

http://www.citizen.com/news/2016-01-...w+News+Browser

[AC2717]

because of Stupidity (no matter which side you are on)

ding, ding, ding, lawyers win!!!!!

[BroadHopper]

Been spending an awfully lot of money of litigation fees lately. And losing! Seems like the lawyers paying PAC to the council?

[ericnh]

A lot of nice people work at Lakeport Landing and Erica is one of them. I don't think it is fair or nice to pick on her... I guarantee that there are people in your family that make mistakes and I bet you wouldn't appreciate them being called out in a public forum.

[DUSTOFF]

Originally Posted by ericnh

A lot of nice people work at Lakeport Landing and Erica is one of them. I don't think it is fair or nice to pick on her... I guarantee that there are people in your family that make mistakes and I bet you wouldn't appreciate them being called out in a public forum.

I thought the Lakeport Landing property was bought by Irwin's?

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by DUSTOFF

I thought the Lakeport Landing property was bought by Irwin's?

Irwin has bought land owned by Laconia and had been leased by Lakeport Landing. Lease ran out and there was not any extention. Irwin's and Lakeport Landing put in a bid, and Irwins was higher.

Still in litigation the last I heard, as to the legality of the bidding process.

[TiltonBB]

Lakeport Landing will still have the waterfront location with fuel, sales, service and numerous boat houses and boat slips rented to tenants.

The property that they may lose in about 18 months is the building and land on Union Ave that they have leased from the city of Laconia for 30 years.

[sum-r breeze]

Originally Posted by ericnh

A lot of nice people work at Lakeport Landing and Erica is one of them. I don't think it is fair or nice to pick on her... I guarantee that there are people in your family that make mistakes and I bet you wouldn't appreciate them being called out in a public forum.

So sorry but I beg to differ.......When you do bad things .....Bad things happen to you.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[fatlazyless]

Is hard to believe that such a contentious, long litigated ownership argument between Lakeport Landing, the City of Laconia, and Irwin Marine seems to result with a truly win-win-win outcome for all involved ..... including the Laconia property tax payer and Laconia residents and boaters and the two marina businesses and Bike Week and the Winni Railroad .... winners all around!

There was a builder's drawing of the future re-constructed Lakeport Fire Station as new home for Lakeport Landing marina ....... anyone have any information on what Irwin's plans to do with the existing Lakeport Landing building after it takes possession on November 1, 2017. Will Irwin be using it for Sea-Doo and Ski-Doo, ...... or what? ..... like will it have 200-different kayaks on display..... and 22'-long, single rowing sculls ...... maybe start selling and re-stringing tennis racquets and turn the top floor of their new building into a yoga studio?