Boating "before" ice-out?

CrownRay · 04-11-2011, 08:51 AM

Hi,
There is one question I have always wanted to ask, and I figured this would be the place...

Is it LEGAL to put your boat in the water before the actual ice-out is declared? Lets say there's a big opening of water by your dock, and assuming you have a place to launch, and you are crazy enough to want to go water-skiing (just saying!). I heard once that if something happened, technically, your insurance company could tell you "Oh well, stinks to be you!" and not cover you. Is that true?

Not that we ever would do it, but I was always curious about the answer. I do not think theres such a rule on the ocean...

RailroadJoe · 04-11-2011, 08:54 AM

Lots of fishermen in boats yesterday. At least 4 at Alton Bay.

jrc · 04-11-2011, 09:06 AM

There is no law at play, you can boat whenever there is water.

My insurance is May 1st to October 31st but I can get any date I want, it just cost a little more. Call your insurance company to be sure. My insurance company doesn't even know what ice out is.

CrownRay · 04-11-2011, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrc

There is no law at play, you can boat whenever there is water.

My insurance is May 1st to October 31st but I can get any date I want, it just cost a little more. Call your insurance company to be sure. My insurance company doesn't even know what ice out is.

When is the marine patrol officially on duty? So, is there no "laws" on the lake until they are out there?

NoRegrets · 04-11-2011, 09:43 AM

It is not about the law. It is more for safety. If you need assistance you will be SOL so to say.

Call your insurance policy holder and they should be able to send you a rider that includes the earlier date. We normally do this and have never been charged for the extra days.

magicrobotmonkey · 04-11-2011, 12:17 PM

Just yesterday a pontoon boat got hung up on some ice off the end of my street in Winnisquam. I was clued in by an LPD cruiser, and ambulance, and a fire truck pulling a zodiac heading down the dead end street. They couldn't launch the zodiac from there, and by the time they found a spot to launch, the boat was free.

topwater · 04-11-2011, 12:39 PM

Were you down there with your small daughter by chance?

Skip · 04-11-2011, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrownRay

When is the marine patrol officially on duty? So, is there no "laws" on the lake until they are out there?

Excellent question...

The Marine Patrol is on duty all year (full time staff). While they obviously do not patrol a frozen lake or river they still have fulltime responsibilities including patrol on the coastal waters year round and maintenance and administrative issues which occur year round.

As an example they were on scene and are part of the investigating agency regarding the recent hovercraft accident on Winnipesaukee.

Finally if the water is open enough for you to place a watercraft upon it, regardless of the time of year, all applicable marine statutes apply.

topwater · 04-11-2011, 01:34 PM

Originally Posted by CrownRay
When is the marine patrol officially on duty? So, is there no "laws" on the lake until they are out there?

Some may think this is a excellent question, I for one thing this is part of the reason Winnie is not as safe as it used to be, Lack of common sense.
Say what you will but that is a question that should never be asked. Not the question about when you can put a boat on the lake, the question about are there NO LAWS. I'm not questioning anyone's IQ, just their lack of COMMON SENSE.

CrownRay · 04-11-2011, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topwater

Originally Posted by CrownRay
When is the marine patrol officially on duty? So, is there no "laws" on the lake until they are out there?

Some may think this is a excellent question, I for one thing this is part of the reason Winnie is not as safe as it used to be, Lack of common sense.
Say what you will but that is a question that should never be asked. Not the question about when you can put a boat on the lake, the question about are there NO LAWS. I'm not questioning anyone's IQ, just their lack of COMMON SENSE.

Oh, come on....really. I bet I am not the only one who has ever wondered that. There are still people out there who think you can party it up 12 miles off shore on a US registered boat too....We come to the forums to be educated by others....thats what I got!

jrc · 04-11-2011, 03:13 PM

"no law at play" I could find no law saying when you could boat on Winnipesuakee.

What law are you going to break in a small area of early ice out?

150 feet...from who?
Speeding... to where?
No life jackets... are you nuts?
More than two skiers... are they nuts?
rafting... with who?

No overnight anchoring or diving without a flag

Rusty · 04-11-2011, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrc

"no law at play" I could find no law saying when you could boat on Winnipesuakee.

What law are you going to break in a small area of early ice out?

150 feet...from who?
Speeding... to where?
No life jackets... are you nuts?
More than two skiers... are they nuts?
rafting... with who?

No overnight anchoring or diving without a flag

Maybe BWI...there are some people who can't leave this stuff alone even in a small area of early ice out.

NoBozo · 04-11-2011, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip

Finally if the water is open enough for you to place a watercraft upon it, regardless of the time of year, all applicable marine statutes apply.

I wonder if the 150' Rule applies when approaching and/or transitioning from Water to ICE on a hovercraft...

Is a hovercraft considered a boat when operating on the ice..or on the beach...

I'm also wondering HOW a hovercraft would be registered with the state. As a snowmobile, boat, or ATV?. Are ATVs registered at all, since they may be considered "Off Road" vehicles. I'm so confused.

With all this confusion, the MP probably doesn't Even want to be involved at all with any kind of winter OPPs.

While Googling Personal Hovercraft I found a picture of one that appeared to have boat registration numbers on the bow. NH may be different.

NB

One step further toward insanity: If a hovercraft doesn't actually TOUCH the Water, Land, or Ice it is operating Over..it can't be any of the above...and since it doesn't get out of "ground effect", it can't be an airplane either. Is it permissable for a properly registered hovercraft to be operated on the Highway..?

Cocktails At Four.

Skip · 04-11-2011, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoBozo

I wonder if the 150' Rule applies when approaching and/or transitioning from Water to ICE on a hovercraft...

Is a hovercraft considered a boat when operating on the ice..or on the beach...

I'm also wondering HOW a hovercraft would be registered with the state. As a snowmobile, boat, or ATV?. Are ATVs registered at all, since they may be considered "Off Road" vehicles. I'm so confused.

With all this confusion, the MP probably doesn't Even want to be involved at all with any kind of winter OPPs.

While Googling Personal Hovercraft I found a picture of one that appeared to have boat registration numbers on the bow. NH may be different.

NB

One step further toward insanity: If a hovercraft doesn't actually TOUCH the Water, Land, or Ice it is operating Over..it can't be any of the above...and since it doesn't get out of "ground effect", it can't be an airplane either. Is it permissable for a properly registered hovercraft to be operated on the Highway..?

Cocktails At Four.

Actually I doubt you are confused at all.

But for those that could be, both airboats and/or hovecraft are classified by statute as boats and must be registered as same per RSA 270:2 (VIII).

And there is actually a 150 foot rule exclusive to same as defined in RSA 270:25-a (I).

ATVs & Snowmobiles must be registered with the State if operated off of your own property. A hovercraft by design cannot meet the legal definition of either a snowmobile or ATV, therefore they cannot be registered as same or legally operated on trails designated for those types of vehicles.

Finally a hovercraft cannot be operated on a roadway due to the fact that is does not meet the legal definition of a motor vehicle and hence cannot be registered for operation. And while theoretically it is "2 feet" above the road it is still operated within the legally accepted definition of the right of way and operation would be illegal.

But hey....it was fun taking a poke at some possibly perceived loopholes!

Yep, it is now 4:00 o'clock somewhere, mainly here!

MAXUM · 04-11-2011, 06:28 PM

There is no problem with going out before ice out, you just have to be really careful. I've been out many times before ice out fishing, that's pretty much what everyone is doing as you really don't want to be out there going to fast. Matter of fact that can be said for the first month or so of the boating season after ice out is declared. Many floating hazards, markers missing or way off their correct positions having been moved around by the ice, you really need to be careful. However nothing beats a nice spring day out there because it's nice and quiet. Even better when the fish are biting! One thing to be aware of though is that the weather can turn very quickly and when it does it can get very rough and cold.

Luckily my insurance covers me year round so that's not a concern but a good point for those that have a coverage window to work with.

magicrobotmonkey · 04-11-2011, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topwater

Were you down there with your small daughter by chance?

Yes, a small daughter and a big dog

NoBozo · 04-11-2011, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip

Actually I doubt you are confused at all.

But for those that could be, both airboats and/or hovecraft are classified by statute as boats and must be registered as same per RSA 270:2 (VIII).

And there is actually a 150 foot rule exclusive to same as defined in RSA 270:25-a (I).

ATVs & Snowmobiles must be registered with the State if operated off of your own property. A hovercraft by design cannot meet the legal definition of either a snowmobile or ATV, therefore they cannot be registered as same or legally operated on trails designated for those types of vehicles.

Finally a hovercraft cannot be operated on a roadway due to the fact that is does not meet the legal definition of a motor vehicle and hence cannot be registered for operation. And while theoretically it is "2 feet" above the road it is still operated within the legally accepted definition of the right of way and operation would be illegal.

But hey....it was fun taking a poke at some possibly perceived loopholes!

Yep, it is now 4:00 o'clock somewhere, mainly here!

TGF SKIP.

NB

Winnisquamguy · 04-11-2011, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip

But for those that could be, both airboats and/or hovecraft are classified by statute as boats and must be registered as same per RSA 270:2 (VIII).)

According to the article that was posted in the other thread it can be registered as either a boat or a ATV. I'm not sure where they got the information and if it is correct but I knew I read it.

Here is the link.http://lakewinnipesaukee.wordpress.c...by-hovercraft/

Skip · 04-11-2011, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnisquamguy

According to the article that was posted in the other thread it can be registered as either a boat or a ATV. I'm not sure where they got the information and if it is correct but I knew I read it.

Here is the link.http://lakewinnipesaukee.wordpress.c...by-hovercraft/

My bad...you are correct. While an airboat is a boat, a hovercraft can be registered as an OHRV if you so desire as per RSA 215-A:1 (VI).

Yep...the devil IS always in the details!

SIKSUKR · 04-12-2011, 10:41 AM

Ok, I'm marking down this day as the first time I remember Skip messing up legal info.

Winnisquamguy · 04-12-2011, 08:21 PM

Check out this link, and I have no idea who these people are!

http://www.myfishfinder.com/fishing_...?topic=42947.0

no-engine · 04-16-2011, 02:19 PM

On a very warm day many years ago, ice was almost out, and I launched my sunfish and have some sailing time! Others were nearby, for safety of the cold water. Day before, I had been skiing in Tuckerman's Ravine!

NoBozo · 04-16-2011, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnisquamguy

Check out this link, and I have no idea who these people are!

http://www.myfishfinder.com/fishing_...?topic=42947.0

Just a comment: Any boat made of something Other Than Aluminum will be "Chewed Up" by the ice. The thinner the ice... the more Knife Edge it becomes and will CUT your boat. Your choice.

NB

Winnisquamguy · 04-17-2011, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoBozo

Just a comment: Any boat made of something Other Than Aluminum will be "Chewed Up" by the ice. The thinner the ice... the more Knife Edge it becomes and will CUT your boat. Your choice.

NB

As I stated above I got that off another forum, I have no idea who those people are! I surely wouldn't do that in my pontoon boat!

04-11-2011, 08:51 AM	#1
CrownRay Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Medford MA/Blackcat Island Posts: 148 Thanks: 0 Thanked 25 Times in 16 Posts	Boating "before" ice-out? Hi, There is one question I have always wanted to ask, and I figured this would be the place... Is it LEGAL to put your boat in the water before the actual ice-out is declared? Lets say there's a big opening of water by your dock, and assuming you have a place to launch, and you are crazy enough to want to go water-skiing (just saying!). I heard once that if something happened, technically, your insurance company could tell you "Oh well, stinks to be you!" and not cover you. Is that true? Not that we ever would do it, but I was always curious about the answer. I do not think theres such a rule on the ocean... __________________ "The ocean (or lake) itself is not dangerous, it's the hard stuff around the edges that will kill you."

04-12-2011, 10:41 AM	#20
SIKSUKR Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 5,075 Thanks: 215 Thanked 903 Times in 509 Posts	Ok, I'm marking down this day as the first time I remember Skip messing up legal info. __________________ SIKSUKR

04-12-2011, 08:21 PM	#21
Winnisquamguy Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Winnisquam, NH Posts: 613 Thanks: 419 Thanked 163 Times in 115 Posts	Check out this link, and I have no idea who these people are! http://www.myfishfinder.com/fishing_...?topic=42947.0 __________________ "I'd rather be ridin than rolling"

04-11-2011, 08:54 AM	#2
RailroadJoe Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 620 Thanks: 259 Thanked 158 Times in 100 Posts	Lots of fishermen in boats yesterday. At least 4 at Alton Bay.

04-11-2011, 09:06 AM	#3
jrc Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NH Posts: 2,689 Thanks: 33 Thanked 439 Times in 249 Posts	There is no law at play, you can boat whenever there is water. My insurance is May 1st to October 31st but I can get any date I want, it just cost a little more. Call your insurance company to be sure. My insurance company doesn't even know what ice out is.

04-11-2011, 09:43 AM	#5
NoRegrets Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Hudson - NH Posts: 408 Thanks: 233 Thanked 212 Times in 88 Posts	It is not about the law. It is more for safety. If you need assistance you will be SOL so to say. Call your insurance policy holder and they should be able to send you a rider that includes the earlier date. We normally do this and have never been charged for the extra days.

04-11-2011, 12:17 PM	#6
magicrobotmonkey Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 160 Thanks: 42 Thanked 44 Times in 31 Posts	Just yesterday a pontoon boat got hung up on some ice off the end of my street in Winnisquam. I was clued in by an LPD cruiser, and ambulance, and a fire truck pulling a zodiac heading down the dead end street. They couldn't launch the zodiac from there, and by the time they found a spot to launch, the boat was free.

04-11-2011, 12:39 PM	#7
topwater Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 302 Thanks: 85 Thanked 116 Times in 48 Posts	Were you down there with your small daughter by chance?

04-11-2011, 01:34 PM	#9
topwater Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 302 Thanks: 85 Thanked 116 Times in 48 Posts	Originally Posted by CrownRay When is the marine patrol officially on duty? So, is there no "laws" on the lake until they are out there? Some may think this is a excellent question, I for one thing this is part of the reason Winnie is not as safe as it used to be, Lack of common sense. Say what you will but that is a question that should never be asked. Not the question about when you can put a boat on the lake, the question about are there NO LAWS. I'm not questioning anyone's IQ, just their lack of COMMON SENSE.

04-11-2011, 03:13 PM	#11
jrc Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NH Posts: 2,689 Thanks: 33 Thanked 439 Times in 249 Posts	"no law at play" I could find no law saying when you could boat on Winnipesuakee. What law are you going to break in a small area of early ice out? 150 feet...from who? Speeding... to where? No life jackets... are you nuts? More than two skiers... are they nuts? rafting... with who? No overnight anchoring or diving without a flag

04-11-2011, 06:28 PM	#15
MAXUM Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Kuna ID Posts: 2,755 Thanks: 246 Thanked 1,942 Times in 802 Posts	There is no problem with going out before ice out, you just have to be really careful. I've been out many times before ice out fishing, that's pretty much what everyone is doing as you really don't want to be out there going to fast. Matter of fact that can be said for the first month or so of the boating season after ice out is declared. Many floating hazards, markers missing or way off their correct positions having been moved around by the ice, you really need to be careful. However nothing beats a nice spring day out there because it's nice and quiet. Even better when the fish are biting! One thing to be aware of though is that the weather can turn very quickly and when it does it can get very rough and cold. Luckily my insurance covers me year round so that's not a concern but a good point for those that have a coverage window to work with.

The Following User Says Thank You to MAXUM For This Useful Post:
Jonas Pilot (04-11-2011)

The Following User Says Thank You to NoBozo For This Useful Post:
Skip (04-11-2011)

The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to SIKSUKR For This Useful Post:
Skip (04-12-2011), winniboy (04-16-2011)

04-16-2011, 02:19 PM	#22
no-engine Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: West side Winnipesaukee, Lakes Region Posts: 516 Thanks: 20 Thanked 52 Times in 40 Posts	On a very warm day many years ago, ice was almost out, and I launched my sunfish and have some sailing time! Others were nearby, for safety of the cold water. Day before, I had been skiing in Tuckerman's Ravine!

The Following User Says Thank You to NoBozo For This Useful Post:
KPW (04-17-2011)