Speed Limits

[Just Sold]

OK, Like Grant here I go and throw my 2 cents into the already flaming waters.

I have read most, if not all, of the posts in this thread. So here goes:

A.
A NWZ in those areas with heavy boat congestion is needed to make everyone feel safer. I will not go to the Eagle Island, Weirs or Weirs Channel areas very often and it has to be for a good reason that I would. Wolfeboro needs an expanded NWZ area. There are other areas too.

I believe we need increased NWZ's.

B.
A day time speed limit of 45 MPH does not seem to be the answer but maybe with some real study and not the rhetoric here or in other forums but by qualified people maybe another speed limit would be appropriate. The qualified study people should then report to the Legislative Committe that is looking at HB 162. This issue is so hot on either side of the aisle that the Legislative Committee needs more input but from qualified sources more than just we plain folk. Our intentions are good but do we have the real facts or rumors about what we perceive to be fact.

I do not think this is the year for a day time speed limit.

C.
Now a night time speed limit does seem appropriate. The Meredith accicent and some others even from years back support that view.
Such as:
1. Lack of observation by the driver of the boat that struck another. Could that be called Reckless Operation?
2. Higher Speed contributed to the accidents.

Unfortunately the Coast Guard and NH Marine Patrol do not report the accident data related to speed. Doesn't Reckless Operation seems to fit when speed is involved? I think it might come from the law enforcement point of view.

In the late 60's in Alton Bay there were 2 night time accidents in the same week no less and speed was a factor. Both were rear end accidents and all boats destroyed. Luckily no one was seriously injured or killed. I saw the damaged boats and the one who did the hitting in both cases was not going very slow for the damage observed.

So the danger at night has been there all along and is not a new issue. It is just more crowded and with more boats comes more accidents or at least close calls that do not get reported. They become rumors and tales of night time scares.

To me a 25 MPH speed limit at night is right.

D.
Congratulations on the boaters organizations that have come to our area. Both have a place for those with a similar view. I have not subscribed to either at this time. I am leaning to a more open discusion membership but I have concerns that neither group mentioned here in this Thread is heading that way at this time.

So I will wait on joining any.

Just my Humble Observations and Opinion - Others are welcome to continue this but I am finished.

[PROPELLER]

Islander, I am not ignoring the Meredith accident. It obviously was a collision. But I do not find it relevant to the speed limit debate because my recollection of the Marine Patrol investigation was that operator inattention & BWI were the contributing factors not speed.

[Woodsy]

I really didn't start this thread with the intention of it turning into another speed limit debate. I should have known better than to try to reason using scientific logic, statistical data and cost vs emotional rhetoric.

I posted some basic scientific data on radar, how it works, and some of the reasons why it really isn't feasible to use on the lake without spending some serious money. I was backed up on the scientific side with much better explanations by some others who are more qualified than I am to state how exactly the radar proposed on the Winnfabs site works.

It seems the rallying cry for the pro-speed limit side brings up the night time accident that occured in August 2002 in Meredith Bay. The driver of the boat involved in the collision was charged with and convicted by a jury of negligent homicide by failing to keep a proper lookout. The Marine Patrol's Accident Reconstruction Team put the Baja's speed at 27-28mph. I ask what would a speed limit have accomplished in this instance? It was approximately 3mph over your proposed night time limit? I doubt very seriously a 25mph limit would have changed anything that night. The accident wasn't due to excessive speed, but operator negligence. How many times to we really have to beat that horse? Especially when the operator has been tried and convicted in a court of law. If the speed was excessive for the conditions that night I am sure it would have found its way into the trial as such. If it was a large Crownline or Bayliner would there be such finger pointing?

I am not for a speed limit, and my reasons are as follows...

1. I don't like having my persoanl freedoms infringed upon with no good reason (see below) other than people in small boats not liking people in bigger faster boats.

2. Lake Winnipesaukee is really only busy about 14 WEEKENDS a year, from Bike Week 18-June to the weekend after Labor Day 10-September. The only places its congested with lots of boat traffic is the destination towns, Weirs, Meredith, Wolfeboro, and Alton. If you go out during the week, between Sunday afternoon about 3ish to friday early afternoon, the lake is pretty much deserted. I have gone out on many a beautiful summer day midweek and encountered less than 10-15 boats. We need to impose a speed limit because the Lake is busy 28 days out of a possible 167 days? (Ice out to end of September) I boat well into November, but then again, thats just me.

3. Nobody has produced any cold hard factual data on why we need one. There are no accident stats from Winnipesaukee that show excessive speed was a factor in ANY accidents. You don't need a speed limit law to cite speed as a factor in an accident report.

4. COST! Nobody has proposed how this is going to be paid for? Who is going to pay for all of the equipment, training, new officers and court time to handle the appeals? This is certainly not an inexpensive proposal.

5. Extended NWZ in the congested areas is a far better and cheaper solution to 90% of the problems. Maybe hire a few more MP officers, but again that comes down to cost and funding.

Do we want to become like Lake George and have all boaters pay some sort of access fee to use Winni? Not to sure about the legalities of that one as Lake George is a state park and Winni is not!

You need to take the emotional rhetoric out of the equation, (from both sides)! What you need to make an informed decision is facts. I have yet to see any facts that say we need to pass a Speed Limit Law, any and then spend all sorts of money to enforce it. When the pro-speed limit faction presents facts from Winnipesaukee, not some lake that belongs to NY, and these facts are presented in a clear, cohesive, non-emotional argument, then I will reconsider my position.


Woodsy

[Fat Jack]

Originally Posted by Woodsy

I really didn't start this thread with the intention of it turning into another speed limit debate.

Come again? You initiated this thread with a string entitled "Speed Limit : why it will ot work", threw out a bunch of opinions, and you did not intend for it to turn into a speed limit debate? I find that as hard to believe as the rest of your statements on this forum. You sound like an intelligent guy, so please try to give the rest of us some credit.