Too quiet? Too loud?

KonaChick · 08-17-2005, 05:42 PM

In theory MovieStar is correct in saying we should all feel lucky to be able to be a part of Lake Winni and stop complaining about the loud boat noise. In reality though those complaining don't stop and think "Gee, it's 2 a.m. and that's the 3rd time that GFBL boat has woken me and my family from a sound sleep this week..oh well..there are plenty of children starving in Calcutta so what am I complaining about!" They're thinking how hard they work all week to be able to enjoy a little peace and quiet on the weekends, they're thinking why should something you enjoy doing at 2 a.m. ruin my quality of life, they're thinking about their children and the amount of sleep they've missed that night and how they will be miserable the next day..the list goes on. So while we all should probably be doing a little less complaining about this issue, I can understand the emotions involved and why folks feel so passionately about this issue.

Woodsy · 08-18-2005, 01:18 PM

People on both sides of the issue need to have some respect for the other side. At 2am any loud noise will be aggravating, but people don't have the right to absolute quiet.... When you live on an island, you are essentially living on the side of a roadway. Some roads are busier than others. Occasionaly a loud 18 wheeler is going to go by your house late at night. Not too much your going to do about it, especially if the 18 wheeler is legal.

I really think 98% of the boats with thru hulls are legally muffled. The problem is at 2am, even a "legal" boat can be essentially too loud for some. Sound carries very well across water, especially at night when the ambiant noise level is very low. A switchable exhaust would at least give the guy an option to quiet his already legal exhaust.

Woodsy

KonaChick · 08-18-2005, 02:25 PM

Woodsy..we all know the boats i'm speaking of..and they aren't your average boats. Loud enough to wake the dead.

rickstr66 · 08-20-2005, 08:37 PM

I just got back from a weeks vacation on a beautiful lake in Maine. Here is my point. Every single morning without exception we were awoken at the crack of dawn by the sounds of..... yes you guessed it..... Birds, all kinds of birds. Crows ( the most annoying, well loudest), loons, wood peckers and many more I can't identify.They would start their annoying calls outside our windows at daybreak and not stop till 9 or 10 am. I say we hunt them all down and kill them. Who was it that let this problem fester and get out of control. It is clear that these birds are overpopulated on this once quiet lake. I'm entitled to my peace and quiet. Arn't I?

Now I say this with tongue firmly in cheek as this was the best summer vacation our family has ever had. Yes we could have done without the morning wake up calls every day but I wouldnt trade the opportunity we hade to have a wonderful time for anything. We are already counting the days till next year at the same time.

MovieStar · 08-26-2005, 01:15 PM

That's a very good point rickstr

KonaChick · 08-26-2005, 07:12 PM

When chickadee's can start driving GFBL boats we might have an argument here!!

Let's all enjoy the last few weeks of summer here in this enchanted place some of us are lucky to call home.

SAMIAM · 08-27-2005, 09:30 AM

I love the whisper of my canoe slidding through the lily pads.....the gentle slap of wind on the sails of my Kestrel day sailer........but I also love the sweet rumble of a BIG BLOCK.........my wife says I need help.

Waterbaby · 08-27-2005, 08:21 PM

Just curious, have you ever been out here and on the Lake?

Lakewinniboater · 08-28-2005, 12:55 AM

I gotta say....... I have to agree with some. Although, I love my sleep and hate to be woken up. However, if you chose to live in certain area's things will happen. I live near a train. Some of the drivers are great at night and give a short blast.... some are not so concerned about those sleeping and there are 4-5 loud blasts.

I try to think.... hey, maybe there was something on the tracks. Maybe that is what they are mandated. I chose to live here.... no sense in getting mad. If I get mad they win.

A legal boat that late at night is going to sound annoying and illegal. NOT saying that it is muffled appropriately.... however, if it is..... is it worth getting yourself in an uproar. Or is it better to let it go and stay positive... enjoy the fact that we are able to enjoy the area? I think it is worth it. Nothing is perfect. Try and see the positive side. It isn't like the constant roar of a highway. It is momentary. Don't get your blood pressure up over it. Move on. Look at the wonderful parts of the lake. Let the negative be underplayed.

None of us with ever get our way all the time. There are some that will never be as polite as others. We are not all right all the time. Don't let it ruin a good thing!!!!!!!!!

Boater · 08-28-2005, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakewinniboater

if you chose to live in certain area's things will happen. I live near a train. Some of the drivers are great at night and give a short blast.... some are not so concerned about those sleeping and there are 4-5 loud blasts.

What if a train started coming through every night making 5 times the noise of the other trains, engine unmuffled, squealing wheels and a continuous horn blast. Wouldn't you object to that and ask some questions? Most people accept the normal sounds of fast boats and jetskis on a busy lake like Winni. It's the excessive noise at inappropriate times that is a problem.

Lakewinniboater · 08-28-2005, 09:21 AM

However, to complain about it is what I don't understand. If that were to happen..... I would sell the property and find a place that made me happy.

Complaining and finger pointing will never stop the things that annoy you. It is better to either not let it bother you or remove yourself from the situation if it is that bothersome.

Although, it does not mean that the others are right.......you can't control others. You need to do what makes you happier.

That was my only point.

Cal · 08-28-2005, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakewinniboater

That was my only point.

And a good point it is for a less stressful life

Boater · 08-28-2005, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakewinniboater

However, to complain about it is what I don't understand. If that were to happen..... I would sell the property and find a place that made me happy.

Wow, I disagree 110%. I will fight for what I love and cherish. That includes my home and the lake.

I guess the word excessive just isn't in your vocabulary. You won't even acknowledge that some things (like the train I mentioned) are over the line.

It appears that what you are really saying is that you can do whatever you like, at any hour and volume, and if you disturb 1000 people, too bad, they should just leave. What a narrow minded and selfish view.

This is like talking to a wall, I won't try again.

KonaChick · 08-28-2005, 04:53 PM

Boater....... you've stated it much better and explained your point more clearly than I did. If you hadn't guessed I echo your thoughts exactly! Thank you.

Lakewinniboater · 08-30-2005, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boater

Wow, I disagree 110%. I will fight for what I love and cherish. That includes my home and the lake.

I guess the word excessive just isn't in your vocabulary. You won't even acknowledge that some things (like the train I mentioned) are over the line.

It appears that what you are really saying is that you can do whatever you like, at any hour and volume, and if you disturb 1000 people, too bad, they should just leave. What a narrow minded and selfish view.

This is like talking to a wall, I won't try again.

When did I infer or say I didn't acknowledge "excessiveness"? Honestly, before making accusations that I believe I can do whatever I like no matter how it effects others..... PLEASE, go back and READ what I wrote.

If you then decide to have an intelligent debate then fine. Until then, you only make yourself look foolish.

Seriously, I said that I don't appreciate it at times.... but I CHOSE not to allow it to get me upset. It is a momentary annoyance. If it got to the point that I didn't feel I could deal that I would move to make myself happier instead of being annoyed.

I did not tell you to "just move". I take offense to the misuse of my words.

However, as I stated before..... just a momentary annoyance and will not allow it to remain in my mind or ruin my day.

Have a good day all!

Woodsy · 08-29-2005, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boater

What if a train started coming through every night making 5 times the noise of the other trains, engine unmuffled, squealing wheels and a continuous horn blast. Wouldn't you object to that and ask some questions? Most people accept the normal sounds of fast boats and jetskis on a busy lake like Winni. It's the excessive noise at inappropriate times that is a problem.

Boater,

The train scenario really doesn't work, as the railroad was there long before you or Wendy were. The railroad has a right to run trains, who by their nature are noisy. Thats like complaining about airplane noise when you move next to an airport.... or truck noise when you live next to a highway. If you don't like the noise, move to a quieter area or don't let it bother you. You have a choice.

The problem is that EVERYONE has a different definition of "Excessive Noise" and "Innapropriate Times". Thats why we have an RSA that defines excessive noise and sets a max db limit for boats. This limit is enforced with regularity. I know of several boats that have had to take the "Noise Test". My boat is perfectly legal and in compliance with the current noise statutes. However, if I were to go thru the Broads at 2am on plane I can just about guarantee I would be annoying a few people. But I wouldn't be breaking any laws.

Nobody has the right to peace and quiet! Lake Winnipesaukee is a shared resource, and as such sometimes you have to share with those who don't share the same opinion or beliefs. When you live along the lakeshore, you essentially live by the side of a road. When you live on the side of a roadway, on occasion. loud vehicles are going to pass by. There is absolutely nothing you can do about it except perhaps lobby for a change in the noise statute. That might reduce the noise some, but certainly not eliminate it. A little tolerance and repect for others goes along way. This goes for both sides as Orion pointed out below. (I was typing that when you posted

) Because swithcable exhaust is still illegal, the late night boater doesn't have much choice in quieting down his boat. Even at headway speed, I think my boat would be too loud for some, especially late at night.

Woodsy

Orion · 08-29-2005, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

Boater,

A little tolerance and respect for others goes along way.

Woodsy

.....and that goes for the boatowner making the noise as well.

MovieStar · 08-29-2005, 02:31 PM

I don't think that anyone is disputing cranking on a V8 at 2:00 am is the wrong thing to do. I have a car with a V8 that screams. The nights that I get home late, I keep it as low as possible becasue it's just the right thing to do. During the day is a different story.

Some people have no consideration for others and that's too bad.
I hate rap music with a passion. I have to listen to it at every stop light, every street I walk down and just about every store I walk into that has a young kid behind the register. I don't let it infuriate me and ruin my day. I don't walk around showing these people noise ordinances telling them that what they are doing is inconsiderate and rude. They know and they don't care. So I just drop it and laugh it off.
Those of you who don't like loud engines are in the right. However unless you have law enforcement that will enforce the laws or boaters and bikers with consideration, your up a creek without a paddle and that's unfortunate. And no I have not been to the Lake, Yet.

Boater · 08-29-2005, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

The train scenario really doesn't work, as the railroad was there long before you or Wendy were. The railroad has a right to run trains, who by their nature are noisy. Thats like complaining about airplane noise when you move next to an airport....

You seemed to have missed that I was not talking about normal train traffic. Of course people who move near train tracks have to accept the normal noise that trains make and people who go to the lake have to accept the normal noise of boats, jetskis and other sounds of people having fun. My hypothetical was about a new train that suddenly raised the noise level X5. I was trying to make the point that some boat (or train) noise is excessive and unacceptable.

The same applies to airports. If you were used to the normal sounds of airplanes and suddenly one day new planes started creating much louder noise late at night you would be justified to complain. Many airports place limits on excessive noise and either don't allow certain aircraft in or place strict noise abatement requirements on them. This is because they cross the line of what is reasonable or tolerable by the airport's neighbors. Airports don't just tell their neighbors "just move" when new noise concerns arise, they try to be understanding and mitigate the problem as much as possible.

Recently in Boston many people living along the Comm. Ave streetcar line complained that the streetcars were now making an unacceptable amount of noise. I'm sure that you would have told them "too bad, move somewhere else". Fortunately the city acted more reasonably and tried to identify the cause (new kinds of wheels) and fix the problem.

It's too bad that you can't acknowledge that some noise crosses the line instead of answering every concern with "just move". You really want us to move so you can do whatever you want unchallenged. I'm not leaving.

Woodsy · 08-30-2005, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boater

It's too bad that you can't acknowledge that some noise crosses the line instead of answering every concern with "just move". You really want us to move so you can do whatever you want unchallenged. I'm not leaving.

Actually Boater, I don't want anyone to leave, nor do I care to "do anything I want unchallenged." I have no problem with the lake at all. I guess you would call that tolerance, something some people don't seem to get. What you may deem as excessive and inappropriate noise may actually be quite legal. My boat is in complete compliance with the noise statute. I also pointed out that at 2am I would probably annoy some people with the exhaust noise even though I am legal. My point was a completely legal boat at 2am can sound illegal and will no doubt be annoying. This is because the ambient noise level on the lake at 2am is very low, and because there are very few obstructions noise carries particularly well over water. How do you know if the boat is legal or not? You are just assuming the boat isn't legal.... because it bothers you.

My justification for "just move" is that Lake Winnipesaukee is not a quiet lake, and never has been. Many, many people use Lake Winni. Some use it late at night and in doing so create noise. (for the record, my boat hasn't been out past 10pm) If you want peace and quiet go move someplace where there isn't anyone around for miles. Not because I care if you stay or move, but because you seem to want peace and quiet.

I like Lake Winnipesaukee just the way it is. I for one, am quite frankly sick and tired of people who seem to have zero tolerance for anyone else and want to change the Lake to suit themselves. I personally don't care what anyone else does as long as they (for the most part) abide by the law. For example I have witnessed numerous 150' violations, but if the offending boat is far enough away that there really isn't any chance for a collision, who cares? If they don't abide by the laws, they are the MP's or town/state police problem. I don't let these boneheads ruin my time. There will always be those that don't abide and don't care. We see these people everyday driving like lunatics on our highways, why would we not see them doing the same on the Lake? The MP cannot catch every bonehead. Whining about what they do is like a 5 year old tattling on his older sibling. Nobody likes a tattletale. I am sure there isn't a person here, except maybe APS who has never pulled a Bonehead move.

Live and let live!

Woodsy

KonaChick · 08-30-2005, 12:50 PM

Ladies and Gentleman...I respectfully request we put this post to bed (quietly of course).

Things are getting nasty on this one.

Lakewinniboater · 08-30-2005, 03:39 PM

not really. There is no name calling or anything. Just a debate.

However, I would agree that there is no getting anywhere with this one. Everyone is entitled to there own opinion

Drummer Girl · 08-30-2005, 04:52 PM

So many different thoughts. If I heard the boat noise in the middle of the night I would listen to the sound grow louder then fainter, wondering what the boat might look like and what fun or special thing may have kept people out so late. I would be thankful for another glance up at the stars, snuggle under the covers and go back to sleep with pleasant thoughts and being very thankful for yet another chance to think about how special being up at the lake is.

Cal · 08-30-2005, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drummer Girl

So many different thoughts. If I heard the boat noise in the middle of the night I would listen to the sound grow louder then fainter, wondering what the boat might look like and what fun or special thing may have kept people out so late. I would be thankful for another glance up at the stars, snuggle under the covers and go back to sleep with pleasant thoughts and being very thankful for yet another chance to think about how special being up at the lake is.

That's the spirit

trfour · 08-29-2005, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakewinniboater

I gotta say....... I have to agree with some. Although, I love my sleep and hate to be woken up. However, if you chose to live in certain area's things will happen. I live near a train. Some of the drivers are great at night and give a short blast.... some are not so concerned about those sleeping and there are 4-5 loud blasts.

I try to think.... hey, maybe there was something on the tracks. Maybe that is what they are mandated. I chose to live here.... no sense in getting mad. If I get mad they win.

A legal boat that late at night is going to sound annoying and illegal. NOT saying that it is muffled appropriately.... however, if it is..... is it worth getting yourself in an uproar. Or is it better to let it go and stay positive... enjoy the fact that we are able to enjoy the area? I think it is worth it. Nothing is perfect. Try and see the positive side. It isn't like the constant roar of a highway. It is momentary. Don't get your blood pressure up over it. Move on. Look at the wonderful parts of the lake. Let the negative be underplayed.

None of us with ever get our way all the time. There are some that will never be as polite as others. We are not all right all the time. Don't let it ruin a good thing!!!!!!!!!

My family lived in a home near the tracks, no problem until the 3:00 AM train came through and shook it as well..... Only took a few weeks for us to stop getting up, and opening the doors, to let the train go through!!!

Good old Northfield, Vermont!!

Thanks for the reminder!

Love,
T.

08-26-2005, 01:15 PM	#5
MovieStar Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	good point. That's a very good point rickstr

08-27-2005, 08:21 PM	#8
Waterbaby Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Kensington, NH and Paugus Bay Marina Posts: 656 Thanks: 323 Thanked 17 Times in 13 Posts	Question for Moviestar......... Just curious, have you ever been out here and on the Lake?

08-28-2005, 12:55 AM	#9
Lakewinniboater Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Westford, MA and Alton Bay, NH Posts: 225 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	here we go again! I gotta say....... I have to agree with some. Although, I love my sleep and hate to be woken up. However, if you chose to live in certain area's things will happen. I live near a train. Some of the drivers are great at night and give a short blast.... some are not so concerned about those sleeping and there are 4-5 loud blasts. I try to think.... hey, maybe there was something on the tracks. Maybe that is what they are mandated. I chose to live here.... no sense in getting mad. If I get mad they win. A legal boat that late at night is going to sound annoying and illegal. NOT saying that it is muffled appropriately.... however, if it is..... is it worth getting yourself in an uproar. Or is it better to let it go and stay positive... enjoy the fact that we are able to enjoy the area? I think it is worth it. Nothing is perfect. Try and see the positive side. It isn't like the constant roar of a highway. It is momentary. Don't get your blood pressure up over it. Move on. Look at the wonderful parts of the lake. Let the negative be underplayed. None of us with ever get our way all the time. There are some that will never be as polite as others. We are not all right all the time. Don't let it ruin a good thing!!!!!!!!! __________________ Wendy "Wasn't Me!"

08-28-2005, 09:21 AM	#11
Lakewinniboater Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Westford, MA and Alton Bay, NH Posts: 225 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I do not disagree However, to complain about it is what I don't understand. If that were to happen..... I would sell the property and find a place that made me happy. Complaining and finger pointing will never stop the things that annoy you. It is better to either not let it bother you or remove yourself from the situation if it is that bothersome. Although, it does not mean that the others are right.......you can't control others. You need to do what makes you happier. That was my only point. __________________ Wendy "Wasn't Me!"

08-29-2005, 02:31 PM	#18
MovieStar Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Some people are just rude. I don't think that anyone is disputing cranking on a V8 at 2:00 am is the wrong thing to do. I have a car with a V8 that screams. The nights that I get home late, I keep it as low as possible becasue it's just the right thing to do. During the day is a different story. Some people have no consideration for others and that's too bad. I hate rap music with a passion. I have to listen to it at every stop light, every street I walk down and just about every store I walk into that has a young kid behind the register. I don't let it infuriate me and ruin my day. I don't walk around showing these people noise ordinances telling them that what they are doing is inconsiderate and rude. They know and they don't care. So I just drop it and laugh it off. Those of you who don't like loud engines are in the right. However unless you have law enforcement that will enforce the laws or boaters and bikers with consideration, your up a creek without a paddle and that's unfortunate. And no I have not been to the Lake, Yet.

08-17-2005, 05:42 PM	#1
KonaChick Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 518 Thanks: 19 Thanked 62 Times in 15 Posts	In theory MovieStar is correct in saying we should all feel lucky to be able to be a part of Lake Winni and stop complaining about the loud boat noise. In reality though those complaining don't stop and think "Gee, it's 2 a.m. and that's the 3rd time that GFBL boat has woken me and my family from a sound sleep this week..oh well..there are plenty of children starving in Calcutta so what am I complaining about!" They're thinking how hard they work all week to be able to enjoy a little peace and quiet on the weekends, they're thinking why should something you enjoy doing at 2 a.m. ruin my quality of life, they're thinking about their children and the amount of sleep they've missed that night and how they will be miserable the next day..the list goes on. So while we all should probably be doing a little less complaining about this issue, I can understand the emotions involved and why folks feel so passionately about this issue.

08-18-2005, 01:18 PM	#2
Woodsy Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weirs Beach Posts: 1,966 Thanks: 80 Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts	People on both sides of the issue need to have some respect for the other side. At 2am any loud noise will be aggravating, but people don't have the right to absolute quiet.... When you live on an island, you are essentially living on the side of a roadway. Some roads are busier than others. Occasionaly a loud 18 wheeler is going to go by your house late at night. Not too much your going to do about it, especially if the 18 wheeler is legal. I really think 98% of the boats with thru hulls are legally muffled. The problem is at 2am, even a "legal" boat can be essentially too loud for some. Sound carries very well across water, especially at night when the ambiant noise level is very low. A switchable exhaust would at least give the guy an option to quiet his already legal exhaust. Woodsy

08-18-2005, 02:25 PM	#3
KonaChick Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 518 Thanks: 19 Thanked 62 Times in 15 Posts	Woodsy..we all know the boats i'm speaking of..and they aren't your average boats. Loud enough to wake the dead.

08-20-2005, 08:37 PM	#4
rickstr66 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boston, Ma Posts: 63 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I just got back from a weeks vacation on a beautiful lake in Maine. Here is my point. Every single morning without exception we were awoken at the crack of dawn by the sounds of..... yes you guessed it..... Birds, all kinds of birds. Crows ( the most annoying, well loudest), loons, wood peckers and many more I can't identify.They would start their annoying calls outside our windows at daybreak and not stop till 9 or 10 am. I say we hunt them all down and kill them. Who was it that let this problem fester and get out of control. It is clear that these birds are overpopulated on this once quiet lake. I'm entitled to my peace and quiet. Arn't I? Now I say this with tongue firmly in cheek as this was the best summer vacation our family has ever had. Yes we could have done without the morning wake up calls every day but I wouldnt trade the opportunity we hade to have a wonderful time for anything. We are already counting the days till next year at the same time.

08-26-2005, 07:12 PM	#6
KonaChick Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 518 Thanks: 19 Thanked 62 Times in 15 Posts	When chickadee's can start driving GFBL boats we might have an argument here!! Let's all enjoy the last few weeks of summer here in this enchanted place some of us are lucky to call home.

08-27-2005, 09:30 AM	#7
SAMIAM Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 2,896 Thanks: 334 Thanked 1,676 Times in 586 Posts	I love the whisper of my canoe slidding through the lily pads.....the gentle slap of wind on the sails of my Kestrel day sailer........but I also love the sweet rumble of a BIG BLOCK.........my wife says I need help.

08-28-2005, 04:53 PM	#14
KonaChick Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 518 Thanks: 19 Thanked 62 Times in 15 Posts	Boater....... you've stated it much better and explained your point more clearly than I did. If you hadn't guessed I echo your thoughts exactly! Thank you.

08-30-2005, 12:50 PM	#21
KonaChick Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 518 Thanks: 19 Thanked 62 Times in 15 Posts	Ladies and Gentleman...I respectfully request we put this post to bed (quietly of course). Things are getting nasty on this one.

08-30-2005, 03:39 PM	#22
Lakewinniboater Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Westford, MA and Alton Bay, NH Posts: 225 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	not really not really. There is no name calling or anything. Just a debate. However, I would agree that there is no getting anywhere with this one. Everyone is entitled to there own opinion __________________ Wendy "Wasn't Me!"

08-30-2005, 04:52 PM	#23
Drummer Girl Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 26 Thanks: 77 Thanked 9 Times in 6 Posts	So many different thoughts. If I heard the boat noise in the middle of the night I would listen to the sound grow louder then fainter, wondering what the boat might look like and what fun or special thing may have kept people out so late. I would be thankful for another glance up at the stars, snuggle under the covers and go back to sleep with pleasant thoughts and being very thankful for yet another chance to think about how special being up at the lake is.