Ice Airport 2014

[riverat]

Won't be long now before airport is up and running, talked to Paul today as he was coming off the ice from checking ice thickness and it was atleast 12" everywhere he checked. He said he would start leveling off the bumps on the runway as best he could and get things laid out.
It will be nice to see the bay in full swing again.
I've added another bobhouse this year and have them set up in the same general location and my doors are always open to anyone that wants to visit.
Hope to see you on the ice and wear your ice creepers it is icy out there.

[upthesaukee]

Hopefully those who are snowmobiling in Alton Bay will stay to the west side of the bandstand and avoid the runway that runs due north and south from the band stand to a point west of Sandy Point (or to a point 3000 feet out from the bandstand.

Ditto to those with bobhouses...keep them to the left of a north south line going out from the bandstand.

The runway designation is rwy 1/19, which means the runway heading (direction) is 010 degrees heading out, and 190 degrees. Lets all share the lake, and give the planes some space who give our Alton Bay businesses much needed business.

And Riverrat, I qualify for a free fishing license, and my wife bought me a hand auger for Christmas, and a tip up. Gotta go to Amilynne's and let Brian get me my license, and then I will see you on the lake.

[RLW]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

Hopefully those who are snowmobiling in Alton Bay will stay to the west side of the bandstand and avoid the runway that runs due north and south from the band stand to a point west of Sandy Point (or to a point 3000 feet out from the bandstand.

Ditto to those with bobhouses...keep them to the left of a north south line going out from the bandstand.

The runway designation is rwy 1/19, which means the runway heading (direction) is 010 degrees heading out, and 190 degrees. Lets all share the lake, and give the planes some space who give our Alton Bay businesses much needed business.

And Riverrat, I qualify for a free fishing license, and my wife bought me a hand auger for Christmas, and a tip up. Gotta go to Amilynne's and let Brian get me my license, and then I will see you on the lake.

Sounds like a lot of fun. Don't forget to fill the bait bucket up while with Brian getting your license.

[Just Sold]

"upthesaukee;217447]Hopefully those who are snowmobiling in Alton Bay will stay to the west side of the bandstand and avoid the runway that runs due north and south from the band stand to a point west of Sandy Point (or to a point 3000 feet out from the bandstand.

Ditto to those with bobhouses...keep them to the left of a north south line going out from the bandstand.

The runway designation is rwy 1/19, which means the runway heading (direction) is 010 degrees heading out, and 190 degrees. Lets all share the lake, and give the planes some space who give our Alton Bay businesses much needed business."

The sign has been up for a while opposite the boat ramp.

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by Just Sold

"upthesaukee;217447]Hopefully those who are snowmobiling in Alton Bay will stay to the west side of the bandstand and avoid the runway that runs due north and south from the band stand to a point west of Sandy Point (or to a point 3000 feet out from the bandstand.

Ditto to those with bobhouses...keep them to the left of a north south line going out from the bandstand.

The runway designation is rwy 1/19, which means the runway heading (direction) is 010 degrees heading out, and 190 degrees. Lets all share the lake, and give the planes some space who give our Alton Bay businesses much needed business."

The sign has been up for a while opposite the boat ramp.

I know the sign has been up, but as long as I have lived here (1996), people have disregarded the runway area, like the two icehouses that are now pretty near where the runway is. In defense of those who have never been out here in the wintertime, the sign only mentions the fact there is an active runway on the bay, which encompasses a rather large area. There are a few cones out there, perhaps not enough to really define the runway until it gets plowed if there is snow out there.

In any case, I hope the rain this weekend doesn't scuttle the airport this year. They have had some bad luck in the past few years.

[Scott's Yott]

I am curious as to why the ice runway is created, and what does it do for Alton Bay. Does it attract planes from near and far? or is it just a neat novelty?

[upthesaukee]

Pilots will fly in from near and far. They will fly in and land from New York, Vermont, Ct, PA, NH, and other locations as well.

On President's Day Weekend, many planes will come in and land. Several years ago, it was reported to have over 50 airplanes on the ice at one time. I believe that in recent years, there have been days where there were 100 or more landings, although not all the planes were on the ground at the same time.

Alton's ice runway is the only FAA sanctioned ice runway in the country. It has its own airport designator (B18), and is maintained by volunteers here in Alton. Before any airplanes can land, an FAA inspector comes out and checks out the runway to make sure it is in accordance with the FAA guidelines for this airport.

Typically, airplanes land to the north, coming in over Parker Marine and Gillan Marine. They depart the same direction. After landing, often times the planes will have to turn around and taxi back to park between the bandstand in the bay and Gillen's.

And as final note, it is also a seaplane runway in the summer, or at least with no ice on the bay. Occasionally, a seaplane will land, but traffic in the bay gets a little interesting.

The businesses in the bay get quite a bit of business from the pilots and their passengers, and they are always willing to talk to you about where they came from and what it is like to land on ice.

There are UTube videos...search Alton Bay Ice Runway..

Thanks for your interest.

[Scott's Yott]

Great info ...Thanx

[riverat]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

Hopefully those who are snowmobiling in Alton Bay will stay to the west side of the bandstand and avoid the runway that runs due north and south from the band stand to a point west of Sandy Point (or to a point 3000 feet out from the bandstand.

Ditto to those with bobhouses...keep them to the left of a north south line going out from the bandstand.

The runway designation is rwy 1/19, which means the runway heading (direction) is 010 degrees heading out, and 190 degrees. Lets all share the lake, and give the planes some space who give our Alton Bay businesses much needed business.

And Riverrat, I qualify for a free fishing license, and my wife bought me a hand auger for Christmas, and a tip up. Gotta go to Amilynne's and let Brian get me my license, and then I will see you on the lake.

Thats Great! Was hoping to get out today but my back still won't allow me the pleasure. and by the looks of the weather I probably cannot make it until sunday or monday. but sounds great.

[Brad Z]

Originally Posted by Scott's Yott

I am curious as to why the ice runway is created, and what does it do for Alton Bay. Does it attract planes from near and far? or is it just a neat novelty?

I hope to fly up from Virginia and spend the weekend. Landing on a frozen lake is an experience we don't get to enjoy down this way. I've been hearing tales of Alton Bay Ice Runway for years from NE flyers and simply must check it out for myself.

Brad

[RLW]

Brad Z, I just noticed that you are fairly new to posting on the forum and glad you have joined us. Have fun and enjoy the Winni Forum while making many new friends.

Great!!!! We will be looking for ya and I'm sure you will enjoy the comrade here in the Bay

[rscalzo]

Flew up there today with a friend who mentioned it. I never knew it was an actual runway. years ago ice diving we saw a plane land but I thought they were just trying it for the fun of it.

Im was surprised at the spots with open water this late.

[RLW]

rscalzo, I just noticed that you are fairly new to posting on the forum and glad you have joined us. Have fun and enjoy the Winni Forum while making many new friends.

Thanks for coming into the forum. Hope that you come up for the fly in as we would love to see you and it is a good chance to meet many of your counter parts with wings on their chests.

[NoBozo]

There used to be a NICE WebCam overlooking the lower end of Alton Bay. You could PAN the camera. What happened to that... NB

PS: The "Mount Cam": Has been OUT for Five weeks. Whats up with that.....Just wonderin...NB

[RLW]

It has gone down the tubes as has the business that had it. The real state company is seeing some hard times and many of the sales people have left and gone to Wolfeboro and they said upon leaving many months ago that the system was down and most likely would be the very last thing that got repaired and/or continued to operate at all.

[thistleb]

Topic has me thinking of something very stupid that I did as a kid. Been coming to to Alton since 1976 when my grandparents built the house I have recently been so fortunate to buy. In the late 80's I was up for New Years with friends and we thought it would be fun to drive out on the ice. At that time I guess I didn't know about the run way, which was strange, but I ended up with my dads truck on its side in the middle of the run way! You can imagine my mindset as me and my buddies are trying to roll the truck back on its wheels when a guy yells from an ice house , "do you know you are on a runway"!! We got the truck up and out of there quick!! Thank god there was no cell phone cameras and you tube back then.

[Slickcraft]

Nice to see it open. Looks like good conditions.

[upthesaukee]

Paul has plowed out a taxiway on the east side of the runway. Runway itself is a little rough in spots from use of the area when it was soft from rain and warm weather, but not real bad. Also, a few ice holes were drilled, but they seemed to freeze over ok.

It is great to see it open, and hopefully the weather will cooperate through President's Day weekend. Fingers are crossed here.

[joann721]

My Dad is in his 90's and he loves coming up to see the planes. Are there specific weeks that it is open, I know it depends on ice conditions, but now that it is open does it stay open or is it only open at specific times.

We want to drive him up for the day to see it again so we want to make sure we come at the right time..

[upthesaukee]

Right now the ice is just that: ice. It would be very slippery to try to walk on, unless you have grippers that go on over your shoes (boots).

With that being said, the runway is open daylight hours. You can park in the parking lot by Shibley's at the pier and the bandstand, and if you are lucky, get a spot on the water side of the parking lot.

Warm temps that soften the ice, rain, wet snow, etc can all create a problem where they may find the need to close the runway, either for a short term, or for the rest of the season.

Looking at the long range forecast, tomorrow is forecasted to be around 30 for a high, with scattered snow showers. May not be a great day to see planes. Sunday is supposed to be windy, with the forecasted winds from the west southwest at around 20 MPH. This would make for almost a direct crosswind, and again, may not be conducive to good landing conditions at the airport. Long range ends up being pretty nice through next Sunday. Of course, this being New England, it is all subject to change.

[riverat]

Originally Posted by joann721

My Dad is in his 90's and he loves coming up to see the planes. Are there specific weeks that it is open, I know it depends on ice conditions, but now that it is open does it stay open or is it only open at specific times.

We want to drive him up for the day to see it again so we want to make sure we come at the right time..

Feb 16th is the Alton Winter Carnival and there is also a fly-in on the same day and normally lots of planes and helicopters. see this link - http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/...ad.php?t=16983

[webmaster]

Buckle up:

[Slickcraft]

Umm Rochester, New Hampshire? The pilot was lucky to find the lake.

[Tank151]

Has a plane ever gone through the ice and into the lake?

[mikea]

Can anybody advise of what weight and type restrictions apply to aircraft using the ice runway?

TIA...

[Slickcraft]

Originally Posted by mikea

Can anybody advise of what weight and type restrictions apply to aircraft using the ice runway?

TIA...

NOTAMS: https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/PilotWeb/
The location is KB18 Alton Bay and the NOTAM has the airport manager's phone number.

Locations:
Sort By: Keyword Sort:
KB18
Data Current as of: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 16:38:00 UTC
KB18 ALTON BAY
[Back to Top]
!BGR 01/242 B18 RWY 1/19 FICON PATCHY THIN DRY SN OVER ICE BA POOR FOR UPDATES CALL 603-875-3498 OBSERVED AT 1401192200. 1401192225-1401202222EST

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by Tank151

Has a plane ever gone through the ice and into the lake?

they will not open the runway until they have 12 inches of ice, enough to support larger pickup trucks to plow. That should be plenty for small single engine planes.

Can anybody advise of what weight and type restrictions apply to aircraft using the ice runway?

I believe I have seen a small twin engine, like a Cessna 310. Common sense would dictate not to go with much bigger. Of major concern is the length of the runway, approx. 3000 ft in length. As noted in Slickcraft's item showing the Notice to Airman (NOTAM), it shows the runway to have a light coating of snow on the runway, braking action (BA) poor. Larger airplanes may not have enough runway to stop.

thanks Slickcraft for the NOTAM>

[Legionnaire70]

Originally Posted by Slickcraft

Umm Rochester, New Hampshire? The pilot was lucky to find the lake.

No, but I have seen 2 separate accidents. Both planes had to be dismantled and taken away on a flatbed.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by webmaster

Buckle up:

That was an exceptionally good landing...thanks for posting.

[8gv]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

they will not open the runway until they have 12 inches of ice, enough to support larger pickup trucks to plow. That should be plenty for small single engine planes.

Can anybody advise of what weight and type restrictions apply to aircraft using the ice runway?

I believe I have seen a small twin engine, like a Cessna 310. Common sense would dictate not to go with much bigger. Of major concern is the length of the runway, approx. 3000 ft in length. As noted in Slickcraft's item showing the Notice to Airman (NOTAM), it shows the runway to have a light coating of snow on the runway, braking action (BA) poor. Larger airplanes may not have enough runway to stop.

thanks Slickcraft for the NOTAM>

An aircraft with beta mode can stop in a very short distance. Down at 7B9 (Ellington CT) there's a mighty big jump plane with beta that turns off in about 1000'. The runway there is 1800'.

[riverat]

Originally Posted by webmaster

Buckle up:

Don when was that taken? Hopefully not today I hope, because if so my bobhouses are gone.

[NoBozo]

Once you click on the Webmasters link..and watch it you will get Many You Tube videos of the Alton Ice Runway....from years past. NB

There have been crashes in the past which have required the planes to be dis-mantled and carted away on trucks. The last one i remember was a "Prop Strike" which will require an engine overhaul. Back in 1988 an engine overhaul for a 160HP Cessna 172 was about $15,000.

I wonder what insurence company's think of Ice Landings. NB (Licensed Private Pilot since 1988)

ADD: When you have a Prop Strike, there is a significant possibility that internal damage will occur to the engine requiring Mandatory overhaul...just to be safe. The FAA is adament in this situation..

[Legionnaire70]

February 2010, this plane was taking off and a gust of wind blew it off the runway. All the prop blades wrapped around the cowl. After speaking to the pilot he told me this was his 3rd airplane mishap...

[HellRaZoR004]

Originally Posted by Legionnaire70

February 2010, this plane was taking off and a gust of wind blew it off the runway. All the prop blades wrapped around the cowl. After speaking to the pilot he told me this was his 3rd airplane mishap...

3rd!...I wonder when the insurance companies going to drop him...

[NoBozo]

Here's the problem with ICE landings.

On a paved runway, If you have a Cross Wind..you can "Crab" the approach...ie: You are floating in with the plane cocked sideways to compensate for the crosswind...up to a point.. No problem... .

Just before touchdown....you then straighten the plane out ..with the rudder..touch down...and depend on Lateral (sideways) Traction...to keep the plane ON the runway.

ON ICE...NO Lateral Traction. You quite likely slide off the runway....Bang Ding Ow... NB

PS: Today's planes have Steerable nose wheels.. or tail wheels in some cases for ground ops. Differential brakes are also used. ON ICE..Brakes are pretty much useless...

[8gv]

I wonder, if the ice was really slick, could you hold the crab through touch down and kick it out as you start to feel the side load on the gear?

We need a volunteer...

[camp guy]

I know nothing about private flying, but, can a runway be treated with a light coating of plain sand?

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by camp guy

I know nothing about private flying, but, can a runway be treated with a light coating of plain sand?

Number one in this case, you are adding sand to the lake.

Number 2, the prop wash would cause that sand to act like a sand blaster, taking off paint.

Number 3, the sand could get into moving parts like the aerilons, elevator, gear on retractable gear aircraft, brakes, etc. . Not such a great idea.

Probably other reasons, but essentially, it is the same reason that "regular" airports do not put anything on their runways either.

[NoBozo]

NO local airports put down anything for ice ....because of the SALT. Salt and Aluminum..with rivets in the airplane..and crevices between the layers of aluminum...and the rivet holes..NOT GOOD.

Alton is a Special Case: The Alton runway is a specific DIRECTION that you are Confined to land on...AND there are hills and trees on both sides which will cause wind turbulence.

I have landed on ice in a Citabria (Tail Dragger) on a large lake. I landed directly into the wind. I was not confined to a specific RUNWAY direction. Also: the ice was Snow Ice...Later in the season..not Glare ice...maybe a little more traction.... NB

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

NO local airports put down anything for ice ....because of the SALT. Salt and Aluminum..with rivets in the airplane..and crevices between the layers of aluminum...and the rivet holes..NOT GOOD.

Alton is a Special Case: The Alton runway is a specific DIRECTION that you are Confined to land on...AND there are hills and trees on both sides which will cause wind turbulence.

I have landed on ice in a Citabria (Tail Dragger) on a large lake. I landed directly into the wind. I was not confined to a specific RUNWAY direction. Also: the ice was Snow Ice...Later in the season..not Glare ice...maybe a little more traction.... NB

I have seen a few planes land on rwy 19, that is landing towards Gillen Marine. Only problem coming in that way is the terrain just west of Rte 28A.

Taking off on rwy 19, well that is another story. If the winds are that strong to warrant a south takeoff direction, probably shouldn't have been there in the first place.

The advantage of landing on an open lake, vs a specific ice runway airport is exactly that. You can often times land directly into the wind. Bush pilots in Alaska will make every effort to land into the wind, regardless of whether they are landing on water, snow, tundra, or a river bank. The latter is a tough choice sometimes.

[RLW]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

I have seen a few planes land on rwy 19, that is landing towards Gillen Marine. Only problem coming in that way is the terrain just west of Rte 28A.

Taking off on rwy 19, well that is another story. If the winds are that strong to warrant a south takeoff direction, probably shouldn't have been there in the first place.

The advantage of landing on an open lake, vs a specific ice runway airport is exactly that. You can often times land directly into the wind. Bush pilots in Alaska will make every effort to land into the wind, regardless of whether they are landing on water, snow, tundra, or a river bank. The latter is a tough choice sometimes.

QUESTION:::: I would like to know who is correct. I purchased a hat from Brian at Busy Corners last year towards donation to the guys who maintain the runway and it states runway B18 Ice Runway Alton Bay, NH. Is it correct or the one listed above correct. Just yanking ya as I believe the hat is correct and us senior citizens do make mistakes far and between.

[Slickcraft]

Originally Posted by RLW

QUESTION:::: I would like to know who is correct. I purchased a hat from Brian at Busy Corners last year towards donation to the guys who maintain the runway and it states runway B18 Ice Runway Alton Bay, NH. Is it correct or the one listed above correct. Just yanking ya as I believe the hat is correct and us senior citizens do make mistakes far and between.

See the NOTAM (Notice to Airmen) in post #26. The "Airport" designator is KB18, shortened to B18 in the text of the NOTAM. The "runway direction" is designated as 1/19. Meaning either an aircraft heading of 10 degrees with northerly wind or a heading of 190 degrees with a southerly wind.

So the hat is correct and upthesauke is also correct.

[RLW]

Ok Slickcraft, now you brought the subject up again and the fun needs to continue. If one were to look up the runway in Alton Bay, which number would you look for. The runway number B18 or the wind direction number 1/19. Couldn't the 1/19 pertain to any airport that has the same conditions as Alton, but there is only 1 B18 runway???? Dam, I haven't a clue to what the heck I'm saying, but it makes sense to me..

[upthesaukee]

The Airport Identifier for the Alton Ice Airport is B18, or KB18. It has two runways, runway 1 and runway 19. Runway 1 is the runway that heads out the bay, and runway 19 is the runway that heads from the bay to Gillen Marine.

Using Laconia airport as an example of another airport. It's identifier is LCI, or KLCI. Its runways are runway 8, which runs from Lily Pond to Patricks, and runway 24, which runs from Patricks to Lily pond.

The identifier only identifies the airport itself, B18 for Alton ice runway, LCI for Laconia, MHT for Manchester-Boston Regional, PSM for Pease, etc..

The runways at each airport will be reciprocal number, 180 degrees different for each runway. Manchester, for instance, had multiple runways, as does Logan airport in Boston, to accommodate the airplanes as much as possible to land and depart into the wind.

The runways for airports are designated by the magnetic heading of the runway, taking the magnetic deviation into consideration. When I worked down in Louisiana, we had 3 airports that were no more than 9 miles apart, and all three had runways 14/32. If we were helping an aircraft to an airport, we would tell him to fly a particular heading for "vectors to runway 14 at Downtown airport", or to Shreveport Regional airport, or to Barksdale AFB.

By the way, the K prefix indicates that the airport is a US airport. The identifier for Alton is B18, but to further delineate it, it can also be shown as KB18, Alton airport in the USA. Hope that helps.

[8gv]

There are many US airports that don't have the "K".
Examples include:
2B2...Plum Island (Newburyport MA)
7B9...Ellington CT
0B5...Turners Falls MA
and...
B18...Alton Bay Ice

Why no "K"?

If there is no weather broadcast via a radio frequency from the airport there is no K.

K?

This is but a piece of the ICAO airport identifier protocol. I believe that weather reporting is required (among other things) to conform to ICAO. The K means it conforms and thus has the weather reporting.

I reserve the right to be wrong though...

[upthesaukee]

thanks 8GV.

[Happy Gourmand]

Originally Posted by 8gv

There are many US airports that don't have the "K".
Examples include:
2B2...Plum Island (Newburyport MA)
7B9...Ellington CT
0B5...Turners Falls MA
and...
B18...Alton Bay Ice

Why no "K"?

If there is no weather broadcast via a radio frequency from the airport there is no K.

K?

This is but a piece of the ICAO airport identifier protocol. I believe that weather reporting is required (among other things) to conform to ICAO. The K means it conforms and thus has the weather reporting.

I reserve the right to be wrong though...

HMMMM, so there is weather broadcast from KB18? therefore it gets the "K" designation?

[Slickcraft]

Originally Posted by The Phantom Gourmand

HMMMM, so there is weather broadcast from KB18? therefore it gets the "K" designation?

I think that 8gv is correct and that the designation should be just B18. In past yeas some pilots have referred to KB18 so I used that to look up the NOTAM and the FAA site did recognize the K. Entering just B18 also gets the correct airport.

Searching for why the K, there is conflicting discussion on many flying forums. It does look like the K is only used for US domestic airports. Some say that this is the only meaning. Others say the airport must be US and have a weather broadcast. In any case, the orientation designators like 1/19 indicate the magnetic heading of the runway(s) with the zeros omitted.

[rdant]

Originally Posted by 8gv

Why no "K"?

I reserve the right to be wrong though...

The "K" refers to the ICAO code for continental "USA".

Airports ID's with numbers in them do not normally have the "K", because the number format is not ICAO standard. It does not have directly to do with weather.

And in this case, B18 really refers to the Seaplane Base at Alton Bay, but of course, we use it for the ICE, too.

I am proud to say that I have landed at Alton Bay on both the water and the ice.

[8gv]

Originally Posted by rdant

The "K" refers to the ICAO code for continental "USA".

Airports ID's with numbers in them do not normally have the "K", because the number format is not ICAO standard. It does not have directly to do with weather.

And in this case, B18 really refers to the Seaplane Base at Alton Bay, but of course, we use it for the ICE, too.

I am proud to say that I have landed at Alton Bay on both the water and the ice.

Agreed. The K is about ICAO. Numbers in the identifier indicate non with ICAO. No weather, no conformance, no K. The lack of weather reporting may not be the only reason the airport is not ICAO but you'll not find an ICAO (K) without weather. I believe that there are likely no "numbered" airports with weather.

I'd like to read the AFD cover to cover to prove (or disprove) my hypothesis but alas, I have to paint my son's bedroom...

[chipj29]

Any ideas on how much airplane activity there will be on the Saturday before the Alton Carnival? My son is an airplane-junkie, so I want to get him there to watch some take-offs and landings, but he works on Sundays (at the Concord Airport).

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by chipj29

Any ideas on how much airplane activity there will be on the Saturday before the Alton Carnival? My son is an airplane-junkie, so I want to get him there to watch some take-offs and landings, but he works on Sundays (at the Concord Airport).

Assuming good flying weather, favorable winds, and a surface that does not get damaged by weather or humans over the next two weeks, expect a fair amount of activity each day on the weekend, perhaps more on Sunday than Saturday, but still a good amount of traffic.

Should be enough planes on the ground at a time, that your son would be able to meet and greet with the pilots. Most seem to be more than happy to tell you about landing here in Alton.

[LakeSnake]

Just counted 23 planes and one heilo one ice. A busy day so far.

[riverat]

It was a great day to be on the bay today, finally was able to get out for a few hours today and there were dozens of aircraft from helicopters to ultra lights landing and taking off pretty much non-stop from 10am till 2 pm when I left. Stop in and say Hi if you see me out there.

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by LakeSnake

Just counted 23 planes and one heilo one ice. A busy day so far.

(L to R) Cessna "Bird Dog" (Ex military: Many of them built under license in Japan, during the Vietnam Era), Piper Cherokee 140, Cessna 177 "Cardinal", Cessna 150/152. NB

EDIT: looking further at that "Cardinal"..No Wheel Pants..I'm going to guess it's an "RG".. (Retractable Landing Gear). Watching the gear retract on takeoff in that plane IS....Different..

[dogma]

I am coming in from California the weekend of Winter Carnival for my own winter vacation. Born a long time ago, in Laconia and have not been back for winter in way too long. I am looking forward to seeing planes come and go and visiting RiverRat at his bob house.

[NoBozo]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessna_...l#Cessna_177RG

Almost bought one back in the day. Distinction: "Unbraced High Wing"...no struts like all other Cessna's. (Save one..the Larger Centurion). The first "Cardinal" introduced had a 150 HP engine which turned out to be underpowered. The next one was 180 HP..better NB


EDIT: Video of a Cessna Cardinal RG taking off. Look Closely at HOW the undercarriage retracts. Kinda like a Bumblebee retracts it's legs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyz-rRHiVRI

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessna_...l#Cessna_177RG

Almost bought one back in the day. Distinction: "Unbraced High Wing"...no struts like all other Cessna's. (Save one..the Larger Centurion). The first "Cardinal" introduced had a 150 HP engine which turned out to be underpowered. The next one was 180 HP..better NB


EDIT: Video of a Cessna Cardinal RG taking off. Look Closely at HOW the undercarriage retracts. Kinda like a Bumblebee retracts it's legs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyz-rRHiVRI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=mllEyvx4Hm8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV7ngv5TNWs

[riverat]

Originally Posted by dogma

I am coming in from California the weekend of Winter Carnival for my own winter vacation. Born a long time ago, in Laconia and have not been back for winter in way too long. I am looking forward to seeing planes come and go and visiting RiverRat at his bob house.

Hi Dogma, It would be great to meet you! we'll pull up a chair and shoot the breeze. I am as close to the airport as you can get safely so you will see lots of activity from the planes and helicopters and I am surrounded by the carnival activities also. It is a great time if the weather cooperates. See you than.
riverat

[Lakesrider]

Here is a little video I grabbed today of a take off from the Ice runway.... Sorry a bit shaky but I had to jump out of the truck just in time to get it. Taken with my point and shoot camera. Not a video camera.

Click on the link or the picture below. Saves bandwidth.



http://s40.photobucket.com/user/midg...4fa45.mp4.html

[magicrobotmonkey]

My wifes coworker has a couple small planes and he graced us with a ride when we met him at the pond hockey tourney in Meredith last weekend. It was pretty cool! Let's see if this link works... https://plus.google.com/+AaronBassett/posts/Q4ut3fKPK4K

[Sky-Hawk]

I flew onto Alton Bay on January 31st, landed, had a delightful lunch, talked with Donna Marie Comeau at Facets where I was given a certificate that stated that I was crazy enough to fly from Philadephia (Pottstown actually) just to land at Alton Bay. I have been watching this activity for four or more years, but this is the first time my schedule, the weather, the ice, and the airplane were all in the "go" mode.
I am a private pilot with 500 hours of flying time, and flew Piper Archer N4306B in to a smooth landing. I also happen to have spent two of the best years of my youth at Belknap College in Center Harbor way back in the '60's.
My reason for saying all this is to preface my saying "Thank you" to Paul and all the volunteers who work with the State of New Hampshire and the FAA to keep B18 open in the winter. My Thanks also to Donna Marie and Paul for listening to all those phone calls that come in.
I flew up last October and landed on a normal runway at Laconia so my wife and I could attend a reunion at Center Harbor and Meredith for Belknap. The College may be gone, but the Spirit is great.
One year, I hope to make it to the Alton Winter Festival. Thanks
Mike

[upthesaukee]

Glad you had a chance to make it up to B18 and enjoyed your day.

Paul, I'm sure, would tell you that just hearing "thanks" is good enough for him. It has become a labor of love for him and the others, and hearing from the pilots how much they enjoyed coming up is great.

Maybe you can make it back in again this year.

[RLW]

Sky-Hawk, I just noticed that you are fairly new to posting on the forum and glad you have joined us. Have fun and enjoy the Winni Forum while making many new friends.

Thanks for your input and I for one is very happy to hear you enjoyed the ice runway as it is people like you coming make it a success and helps the economy for the small business people. Again thanks for joining in on the forum and your input for the ice runway.

[8gv]

Originally Posted by Sky-Hawk

I flew onto Alton Bay on January 31st, landed, had a delightful lunch, talked with Donna Marie Comeau at Facets where I was given a certificate that stated that I was crazy enough to fly from Philadephia (Pottstown actually) just to land at Alton Bay. I have been watching this activity for four or more years, but this is the first time my schedule, the weather, the ice, and the airplane were all in the "go" mode.
I am a private pilot with 500 hours of flying time, and flew Piper Archer N4306B in to a smooth landing. I also happen to have spent two of the best years of my youth at Belknap College in Center Harbor way back in the '60's.
My reason for saying all this is to preface my saying "Thank you" to Paul and all the volunteers who work with the State of New Hampshire and the FAA to keep B18 open in the winter. My Thanks also to Donna Marie and Paul for listening to all those phone calls that come in.
I flew up last October and landed on a normal runway at Laconia so my wife and I could attend a reunion at Center Harbor and Meredith for Belknap. The College may be gone, but the Spirit is great.
One year, I hope to make it to the Alton Winter Festival. Thanks
Mike

Hey Mike, fly on up to LCI this August and I'll take you out in one of the smallest boats on the lake. PTW is my fuel stop from BAF to OFP where my mother lives. There are some pretty birds in the main hangar at PTW. You may have seen me there with my Diamond DA-20. I'm the guy running like hell to the restroom.

To keep this ice runway related...

Sorry guys but I can only steer on the ground with differential braking and as such I'm too timid to land at B18.

[riverat]

Originally Posted by dogma

I am coming in from California the weekend of Winter Carnival for my own winter vacation. Born a long time ago, in Laconia and have not been back for winter in way too long. I am looking forward to seeing planes come and go and visiting RiverRat at his bob house.

Thanks for the visit Dogma it was nice meeting you.

[Broken Glass]

Originally Posted by Legionnaire70

February 2010, this plane was taking off and a gust of wind blew it off the runway. All the prop blades wrapped around the cowl. After speaking to the pilot he told me this was his 3rd airplane mishap...

About ten years ago, I took my daughter to LWM one snowy Christmas eve so we could shovel out my Cherokee 180 and take a late day flight. While shoveling, we were approached by a gentleman who asked me how I liked my Cherokee. He proceeded to tell us that he had a Piper Dakota, and it was the third similar aircraft (PA-28) he has owned (I think he said his first one was a 140 Cherokee, and then a 150 Warrior) Anyway he told us how he had crashed his first plane into a hill while trying to land at Laconia. He had others on board and they all walked away. The second time he crashed, was into the chimney of his own house during takeoff from a private airstrip. Again he had others on board, and they all walked away. He said forgot to deploy his flaps before takeoff. So in his opinion the PA-28 aircraft was a real rugged airplane. After he walked away, my daughter said to me "dad, is that guy a crash dummy or something?" To this day whenever I see a PA-28 I think of that very lucky gentleman on that snowy ramp. I wonder if that is his Dakota with the collapsed nose gear and an appointment for a total engine overhaul?
Happy flying !!

[upthesaukee]

WMUR is advertising a segment of Monday's Chronicle dealing with landing on Alton's ice runway.

http://www.wmur.com/new-hampshire-ch...unway/24580804

Looking forward to it. Hope I am home from the boat show in time to see it.

[HUH]

Whaaaaeeerrrrahhhhhhhaaaaeeeerrrraahhhhhhhhhwhaaaa uuuuuuuuuu..
All day over your head.. its great

[JMR]

Nice video on Chronicle tonight. May try to drive up tomorrow just to watch

[Slickcraft]

Originally Posted by JMR

Nice video on Chronicle tonight. May try to drive up tomorrow just to watch

Right now it is closed, there had been a lot of new snow and probably slush this weekend. You can look here for the Notice to Airmen (NOTAM), type in B18 as the location.

https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/PilotWeb/

!BGR 02/291 B18 RWY 1/19 CLSD 1402191114-1402201115EST

Yes it was a nice video.

[LakeSnake]

Plane mishap on runway, pilot unhurt

http://m.wmur.com/news/plane-crashla...n-bay/24877016

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by LakeSnake

Plane mishap on runway, pilot unhurt

http://m.wmur.com/news/plane-crashla...n-bay/24877016

According to the article: The plane is "Experimental". That means it is a "Home Built"..probably a KIT Plane. The pilot/owner built the plane ..and is authorized to do any work required to keep it flying.

IF the plane had been ..let's say a "Piper Cub" ..the owner would have to have "Licensed People" do the work at great expense.

PS: A P-51 Mustang is also classified as .."Experimental". NB

[riverat]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

According to the article: The plane is "Experimental". That means it is a "Home Built"..probably a KIT Plane. The pilot/owner built the plane ..and is authorized to do any work required to keep it flying.

IF the plane had been ..let's say a "Piper Cub" ..the owner would have to have "Licensed People" do the work at great expense.

PS: A P-51 Mustang is also classified as .."Experimental". NB

Yes it was a kit plane, I have a friend that has a similiar plane called a Kit Fox. pretty much a heavy ultralight which you do not need a pilots liscense to operate. Lots of pilots who develope medical problems such as heart surgery can no longer acquire a pilots liscense, but can fly an ultralight aircraft. any crash landing that you can walk away from is a good one, I believe that his landing gear absorb most of the impact, if the snowbank had been a foot higher, may have been muich worse.
Overall, with the hundreds of take-offs and landings that I have witnessed over the years at runway B18, I would consider it a very well maintained and safe runway.

[NoBozo]

Did that Kit Plane have a "Tail Number"...Like N-1234....on the rear fuselage.. or on the tail fin..?? Just wondering. NB

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

Did that Kit Plane have a "Tail Number"...Like N-1234....on the rear fuselage.. or on the tail fin..?? Just wondering. NB

When the call went out on the scanner, the dispatch gave the "N" number.

[playinghooky]

The number is N12979

[NoBozo]

Here's a description of the basic plane. Technically, a plane which is registered with the FAA (ie: Has an "N" number), would not be considered an ultralight, although in Canada and some other country's it would be.

At 600 pounds, this plane is well over the Max weight of 254 pounds for an Ultralight in the US. In the US a pilots license is required. NB

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisher_Dakota_Hawk

PS: There is a New special "Light Sport License" which is Not a FULL Private Pilots license that might apply here.

[Brad Z]

Originally Posted by Brad Z

I hope to fly up from Virginia and spend the weekend. Landing on a frozen lake is an experience we don't get to enjoy down this way. I've been hearing tales of Alton Bay Ice Runway for years from NE flyers and simply must check it out for myself.

Brad

After a three hour flight, I finally made it up on Saturday. What a great time I had! Everyone was so friendly. I never felt so welcomed to pop in somewhere on a Saturday afternoon. Lunch at Shibley's was very good too.

Here's my obligatory video:


http://youtube.com/watch?v=RMKuUb3lO0k

And a better quality video from a guy who landed literally right after me...


http://youtu.be/_OPuM7Q2M4M

Now I'm really wanting to get a hold of some floats so I can come back up in the summer. Alton Bay is a neat little spot.

Brad N182V

[upthesaukee]

In the shorter video, when you rolled out on downwind, you were just about over my house, just a little south of it.

Nice videos.

[Rusty]

When they finally got parked the pilot said: "Don't worry Dude we're not the usual".

I wonder what he meant by that? Are there some unusual planes that fly into Alton Bay?

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by Rusty

When they finally got parked the pilot said: "Don't worry Dude we're not the usual".

I wonder what he meant by that? Are there some unusual planes that fly into Alton Bay?

IF that Cirrus Aircraft that he's flying is an SR22, it's valued at quite a bit more than the average plane landing at Alton..@ $765,000. NB

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_SR22

PS: Actually I think it might be an SR20 @ only $320,000.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

IF that Cirrus Aircraft that he's flying is an SR22, it's valued at quite a bit more than the average plane landing at Alton..@ $765,000. NB

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_SR22

The plane is more valuable so they aren't the usual cheap plane that lands there. Nice.

Just before they parked their plane this is what the conversation was about between (I assume) the pilot and passenger:

Pilot: “You F**king smoking crack”

Passanger: “There going to push us around”

Pilot: “I get F**king tired of that”

Pilot: “Don't worry Dude we're not the usual”

[upthesaukee]

No injuries, 3 persons on board. no other info at this time.

[upthesaukee]

Looks like the plane went into the snowbank while on the ground, perhaps a brake locked up.

[Lakeboater]

We just came through the bay and it looked like WMUR was out on the ice filming a story on the second plane. Will have to check the news tonight.

[NoBozo]

My Disaplined and Practiced Aircraft ID Mode... suggests that plane may be a Cirrus. As indicated earlier..not an inexpensive aircraft...and this guy will NOT be allowed to do his own work. NB

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by Brad Z

Now I'm really wanting to get a hold of some floats so I can come back up in the summer. Alton Bay is a neat little spot.

Brad N182V

Hi Brad: Great Video: I'm guessing that Floats are not an option for the Cirrus.....but I'll bet they would work on say..a Cessna 182..... NB

[Lakeboater]

MUR just had tease for the story coming up on 6 pm news

[Cindido]

Hi Brad -

Excellent video! Nice meeting you and your furry friend (Baxter?) on Saturday. My husband and I have some great photos of you two (if the ones I took on your iPhone are insufficient). If you'd like them PM us with your email and we'll forward them. Glad you enjoyed your visit to Alton Bay !!

[upthesaukee]

It said he was landing. I would guess he was landing on rwy 19, heading toward Gillan's, and from the skid marks at the end of the runway, looks like he skidded off the end of the runway into the snow bank.

A Cirrus' wings cannot be easily removed, so it will be interesting to see how they remove it and transport it.

Glad no one was hurt.

[NoBozo]

Apparently the Cirrus Aircraft Corporation is one of the best selling general aviation aircraft in the world in recent years. Started in America....and now owned by the "Government Of The Peoples Republic of China" NB


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_Aircraft

[RailroadJoe]

Isn't that just ducky?

[SunsetPointWentworth]

Not to be a smartass. (OK, it is to be a smartass) But, at the very end of the second video of the planes landing and taking off. It's not "Yee haw Chesters dead". His call sign was Jester.

[NoBozo]

Google WMUR News/Plane Crash for a video report of the Cirrus SR-22 crash at Alton. I tried linking to the report but it was not successful. NB

Try Again: http://www.wmur.com/news/plane-crash...n-bay/24910512

[upthesaukee]

We passed the experimental aircraft being hauled away on a flatbed truck. Then we went by the end of the bay and saw the Cirrus had been removed from the snowbank at the end of the runway. It is now parked in the parking area of the airport. So the runway should be open now, and that's a good thing. In fact, we just heard a plane, sounding like it had just taken off.

Second good thing is the planes have been removed before the bad weather comes in Wednesday into Thursday, and that is a second good thing. Would hate to try to move the airplanes after 6-14 inches or whatever amount we are getting.

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

We passed the experimental aircraft being hauled away on a flatbed truck. Then we went by the end of the bay and saw the Cirrus had been removed from the snowbank at the end of the runway. It is now parked in the parking area of the airport. So the runway should be open now, and that's a good thing. In fact, we just heard a plane, sounding like it had just taken off.

Second good thing is the planes have been removed before the bad weather comes in Wednesday into Thursday, and that is a second good thing. Would hate to try to move the airplanes after 6-14 inches or whatever amount we are getting.

Are you suggesting that the Cirrus wasn't damaged, and has now flown away..? If true that is Great News. I wonder if the FAA NTSB ever showed up to have a look. I'm going to guess that if there was no damage affecting airworthiness, there would be "No Incident." NB

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

Are you suggesting that the Cirrus wasn't damaged, and has now flown away..? If true that is Great News. I wonder if the FAA NTSB ever showed up to have a look. I'm going to guess that if there was no damage affecting airworthiness, there would be "No Incident." NB

the plane was removed from the snow bank at the approach end of runway 01 and moved over into the parking area. With the other plane also removed, there should be no reason to keep the runway (which was not damaged in either accident) closed.

And then as I was typing, I heard a plane take off. I am pretty sure it is not the Cirrus. I'm sure it will have to be inspected to make sure there is no problem, having skidded sideways into the snow bank. Only saying that the runway appears to be open.

[Slickcraft]

The NOTAM still shows as closed but that may change.


!BGR 03/047 B18 RWY 1/19 CLSD 1403102201-1403152359EST

[upthesaukee]

I noticed some standing water out there this afternoon. Maybe that's why.

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