"Social Distancing" at the Lake

[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Certainly failure to perform services in my case would result in significant prejudice, i.e., loss of rights. My work involves critical sector services.

This is like arguing with a child and why the public has cynical views of lawyers. Virtually every other law firm of any meaningful size in Boston, including those working with health care clients on issues surrounding the pandemic, are working entirely remotely and have barred lawyers from coming to their physical offices. You don’t need to be in your office to do your legal work, and all you have are thinly veiled excuses to why you are disregarding the governor’s order.

[Major]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

This is like arguing with a child and why the public has cynical views of lawyers. Virtually every other law firm of any meaningful size in Boston, including those working with health care clients on issues surrounding the pandemic, are working entirely remotely and have barred lawyers from coming to their physical offices. You don’t need to be in your office to do your legal work, and all you have are thinly veiled excuses to why you are disregarding the governor’s order.

Why are you so invested in this? What do you care what I do. You live your life and I’ll live mine. If I do something illegal I’m fairly confident that as a white male over 50 the full extent of the law will be applied against me.

All because we disagree with how this is being handled. Please don’t tell my parents that you think I’m childish. They would be so disappointed in me!


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Why are you so invested in this? What do you care what I do. You live your life and I’ll live mine. If I do something illegal I’m fairly confident that as a white male over 50 the full extent of the law will be applied against me.

All because we disagree with how this is being handled. Please don’t tell my parents that you think I’m childish. They would be so disappointed in me!

Because what you do doesn’t only affect you. And if you and others still need that explained to you in the context of this pandemic, god help us all.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

Because what you do doesn’t only affect you. And if you and others still need that explained to you in the context of this pandemic, god help us all.

Oh please. I’m sorry I disagree with sacrificing the many for the possible benefit of the few. If you need the strategy of war explain to you then go back and read a little history on the subject


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[Major]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

Because what you do doesn’t only affect you. And if you and others still need that explained to you in the context of this pandemic, god help us all.

Right now based on raw numbers and with full knowledge that the Chinese coronavirus hasn’t run its full course this pandemic isn’t as nearly as bad as the H1N1 pandemic. It is a crisis created by media and social media. We did not need to destroy our economy to deal with it. I know not a single person who has the virus. The numbers in Massachusetts and New Hampshire are extremely low. Deaths total 2.

Politicians who have no risk of not getting paid are making decisions that are putting millions of hard working Americans out of work and business. Forgive me if I’m not as easily convinced that shuttering our economy is the best way to deal with this.

I’ve asked this before, show me posts from this Forum or even news articles from 2009 stating that we handled the much worse (at least as of right now) H1N1 pandemic badly. The 1500 number referenced above was the number of American deaths before Obama declared a national emergency. We did not shut down commerce and jeopardize our way of life. You and everyone else should be much more concerned about a national and global economic collapse.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Right now based on raw numbers and with full knowledge that the Chinese coronavirus hasn’t run its full course this pandemic isn’t as nearly as bad as the H1N1 pandemic. It is a crisis created by media and social media. We did not need to destroy our economy to deal with it. I know not a single person who has the virus. The numbers in Massachusetts and New Hampshire are extremely low. Deaths total 2.

Politicians who have no risk of not getting paid are making decisions that are putting millions of hard working Americans out of work and business. Forgive me if I’m not as easily convinced that shuttering our economy is the best way to deal with this.

I’ve asked this before, show me posts from this Forum or even news articles from 2009 stating that we handled the much worse (at least as of right now) H1N1 pandemic badly. The 1500 number referenced above was the number of American deaths before Obama declared a national emergency. We did not shut down commerce and jeopardize our way of life. You and everyone else should be much more concerned about a national and global economic collapse.

Good use of your epidemiology degree! For starters, the death rate is many multiples higher than H1N1. And it is spreading exponentially - each person on average spreads it to two more, and people with no symptoms are spreading it. This makes it fundamentally different than H1N1 and why getting ahead of it is important. By the time this becomes clear to you, we will be Italy.

[Major]

Italy is the wrong country to benchmark. Korea is a better example. Also the death rate is higher because confirmed cases are low. We don’t have very good information on the denominator.

Answer my question in the closing paragraph.

Also the so-called experts say that man made climate change is an existential threat. You’ll be glad to know I don’t believe them either. Government hacks like the epidemiologists you so highly think of whose best interests are to create a crisis when epidemics like this happen.

I heard a good quote today. You wouldn’t want economists managing a pandemic just like you wouldn’t want epidemiologists managing the economy. That my friend is what is happening. Epidemiologists are running the economy.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Answer my question in the closing paragraph.

...

I heard a good quote today. You wouldn’t want economists managing a pandemic just like you wouldn’t want epidemiologists managing the economy. That my friend is what is happening. Epidemiologists are running the economy.

When you answer my question of your law firm when you’re callously disregarding the governor’s order.

And I just heard another good quote about not having a lawyer run a public health crisis.

[Major]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

When you answer my question of your law firm when you’re callously disregarding the governor’s order.

And I just heard another good quote about not having a lawyer run a public health crisis.

Figure it out. You’re obviously smarter than everyone else.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Figure it out. You’re obviously smarter than everyone else.

That seems to be our fundamental difference. I don’t think I’m smarter than the entire medical and public health communities.

[JEEPONLY]

Originally Posted by Major

Mainly the restaurants and Pompano Beach being open.

If things need to be "OK", you are acknowledging the problem!

So- why the resistance to doing the right thing?

[Major]

Originally Posted by JEEPONLY

If things need to be "OK", you are acknowledging the problem!

So- why the resistance to doing the right thing?

If you’ve been following this thread I don’t think it’s the right thing. In fact I think it’s very wrong. There’s not much more to say.


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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by joey2665

I agree 1000%. We are sacrificing the future on many for the potential benefit of a few.


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Well then we should just shut down the state of NY, since that is where 50% of the cases are, to protect the rest of the country, "Why are we sacrificing the future on many for the potential benefit of a few"?

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Well then we should just shut down the state of NY, since that is where 50% of the cases are, to protect the rest of the country, "Why are we sacrificing the future on many for the potential benefit of a few"?

First of all New York is a huge and diverse state just like Massachusetts shutting down the whole state is ridiculous upstate in western New York have nowhere near the amount of population that New York City does so your statement is grossly incorrect. Just like I wouldn’t shut down the whole state of Massachusetts if there was an issue in Boston. even if I did agree with shutting down the city which I do not. And yes it’s all New York’s fault.

If you studied your economics you know if we are not back to work very shortly we are going to go into a severe depression with people losing their savings retirement accounts and if it gets bad enough possibly Social Security. We need to get people back to work now

Again this is my opinion you keep asking me the same questions over and over my opinion it’s not gonna change take it or leave it I really don’t care


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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by joey2665

First of all New York is a huge and diverse state just like Massachusetts shutting down the whole state is ridiculous upstate in western New York have nowhere near the amount of population that New York City does so your statement is grossly incorrect. Just like I wouldn’t shut down the whole state of Massachusetts if there was an issue in Boston. even if I did agree with shutting down the city which I do not. And yes it’s all New York’s fault.

If you studied your economics you know if we are not back to work very shortly we are going to go into a severe depression with people losing their savings retirement accounts and if it gets bad enough possibly Social Security. We need to get people back to work now

Again this is my opinion you keep asking me the same questions over and over my opinion it’s not gonna change take it or leave it I really don’t care


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I was being sarcastic just to show you how self centered your statement is but I'm sure it's not going to change your attitude.
I'm sensing a lot of financial stress. I too have lost a lot of wealth in the past few weeks but I put protecting peoples health ahead of their wealth. If you don't have your health it doesn't matter how much money you have. So yes, we have different views of what's most important in life.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I was being sarcastic just to show you how self centered your statement is but I'm sure it's not going to change your attitude.

I'm sensing a lot of financial stress. I too have lost a lot of wealth in the past few weeks but I put protecting peoples health ahead of their wealth. If you don't have your health it doesn't matter how much money you have. So yes, we have different views of what's most important in life.

Please do not tell me I do not value health or value wealth over health. If things get as bad with the economy as they might, remember people and businesses need money to pay for healthcare which many may not be able to do. Then we will have socialized medicine which will be an absolute disaster you will really see our mortality rate drop.

As I said and continue to believe closing the non essentials was a complete overreaction.


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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by joey2665

Please do not tell me I do not value health or value wealth over health. If things get as bad with the economy as they might, remember people and businesses need money to pay for healthcare which many may not be able to do. Then we will have socialized medicine which will be an absolute disaster you will really see our mortality rate drop.

As I said and continue to believe closing the non essentials was a complete overreaction.


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But all of your posts make it clear that you value wealth over health in this instance. I think you are wrong to do so, but I recognize that there are many people who will suffer economically, including many who will not have enough to eat--this is already happening in the UK as food banks are bare. I am on the board of a nonprofit that is struggling to maintain support for several thousand people as our supply chain is disrupted.

This is a situation where there is no attractive alternative--each of us is forced to to choose a price to pay. More isolation likely means more hungry people. Less isolation likely means more deaths. Both sides need to own up to the sacrifices their positions imply

[MAXUM]

According to some the biggest threat that this planet faces is global climate change. The leading cause humans. Why not take this opportunity to thin the population and then everyone can live 30 more years instead of the anticipated 11.5. We kill plenty of unborn babies so what's the difference? Doesn't Major and others have the 'right' to control their own body?

I also thought that "social disobedience" was fashionable these days. We've witnessed plenty of rioting in the streets, people getting beat up and hospitalized, law enforcement called pigs, businesses smashed into and stuff stolen, cars being rolled over and set ablaze, and a mob of angry out of control moonbats decrying some useless outrage of the day. If that is acceptable or better put marginalized as such, then the same pass should be afforded to those that choose to continue to work and save not only their business but the jobs of those that work for them.

[erick26]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

But all of your posts make it clear that you value wealth over health in this instance. I think you are wrong to do so, but I recognize that there are many people who will suffer economically, including many who will not have enough to eat--this is already happening in the UK as food banks are bare. I am on the board of a nonprofit that is struggling to maintain support for several thousand people as our supply chain is disrupted.

This is a situation where there is no attractive alternative--each of us is forced to to choose a price to pay. More isolation likely means fewer deaths. Less isolation likely means more hungry people. Both sides need to own up to the sacrifices their positions imply

We are now “stuck in the middle” - I do believe the social distancing will help reduce the pandemic, but coming around to the idea that the way this has been dragged out thus far could have been better. I don’t think reverting back at this point makes sense, but I am very concerned on the economic effect for years to come. I’ve talked to dozens of friends that own small businesses and this is going to be crippling for them and will trickle down and effect many others. I don’t have a solution, but I do hope in the next week or so we see things flatten out and maybe start to get back to regular life before people become rebellious and we have a mutiny on our hands.


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[joey2665]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

But all of your posts make it clear that you value wealth over health in this instance. I think you are wrong to do so, but I recognize that there are many people who will suffer economically, including many who will not have enough to eat--this is already happening in the UK as food banks are bare. I am on the board of a nonprofit that is struggling to maintain support for several thousand people as our supply chain is disrupted.

This is a situation where there is no attractive alternative--each of us is forced to to choose a price to pay. More isolation likely means more hungry people. Less isolation likely means more deaths. Both sides need to own up to the sacrifices their positions imply

You are wrong and many fail to see they go hand in hand. When I speak about wealth and not speaking just about personal wealth of individuals and speaking about the wealth of our economy and our country.You are grossly underestimating the impact of a depressed economy will have on healthcare. If the economy collapsed we will have virtually no healthcare or at best very poor healthcare even socialized. Do you know how many Americans will die do to poor and or socialized medicine unable to receive necessary prescriptions, medical treatments and surgery.

I can assure you it will be more than the Corona Virus. We are mortgaging our future health and economy for today.

Again my opinion and I am not trying to sway anyone. Belief what you want as I will and only the future will tell.


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[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by erick26

We are now “stuck in the middle” - I do believe the social distancing will help reduce the pandemic, but coming around to the idea that the way this has been dragged out thus far could have been better. I don’t think reverting back at this point makes sense, but I am very concerned on the economic effect for years to come. I’ve talked to dozens of friends that own small businesses and this is going to be crippling for them and will trickle down and effect many others. I don’t have a solution, but I do hope in the next week or so we see things flatten out and maybe start to get back to regular life before people become rebellious and we have a mutiny on our hands.


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Agreed completely. I think in a couple weeks, when we have a better sense of how things work, testing ability, awareness, etc. we need to find a way to move forward.

I'm not an economist, but it appears to me if we go too long with complete shutdown that even those jobs that are "recession/depression proof," like teachers, medical/medicine, energy, will be in jeopardy and that will just crush the economy. At this point, those (and other) jobs are still contributing to the system by spending and it's still not enough to keep many businesses alive.

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[The Real BigGuy]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

And, by the way, Major, if you are so convinced of the inapplicability of the Governor’s order to you and your disregard for the consensus of the ENTIRE public health community, step out from behind your screen name. Tell us your name and your law firm. If you have the courage of your convictions, I am sure your clients would agree with your decisions and leadership here.

Not fair! I may not agree with him but, as far as I know, this is still the United States. Don’t think social shaming is appropriate here.


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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by erick26

We are now “stuck in the middle” - I do believe the social distancing will help reduce the pandemic, but coming around to the idea that the way this has been dragged out thus far could have been better. I don’t think reverting back at this point makes sense, but I am very concerned on the economic effect for years to come. I’ve talked to dozens of friends that own small businesses and this is going to be crippling for them and will trickle down and effect many others. I don’t have a solution, but I do hope in the next week or so we see things flatten out and maybe start to get back to regular life before people become rebellious and we have a mutiny on our hands.


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I agree we have to get the economy back up and running. We are 9 days into the 15 days of the social distancing order and after the 15 days hopefully we have given the health care industry time to catch up and get ahead of the overload so we don't end up like Italy.
I have a daughter that is an RN and she is sacrificing her health night and day to help people get through this. She is working 24/7 but she's not going to be rich when this is all over. Hopefully she doesn't have to quarantine because of not having enough PP&E to protect herself. There are people sacrificing to keep people safe, not for money.
Anyone that believes in "thinning the herd" for the benefit of the masses should do us all a favor and remove themselves from the equation.

[The Real BigGuy]

Originally Posted by Major

Paying bills for one thing. Only partners can write checks. Dealing with mail is another. There are countless things that need to be done in the office. We cannot just vacate the office for two weeks. Deadlines don’t go away because of the Chinese coronavirus.


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You must not have gotten the latest talking points from the Great Pumpkin. He is no longer using the term “Chinese coronavirus.” You need to be careful not to step out of line!

And by the way, most/all law offices have the same issues with paying bills, answering phones, reading mail. My daughter’s is still shutting down at noon today. Bills paid remotely by their accountant in phone/e-mail collaboration with partners; phones forwarded to a service who is e-mailing messages to the appropriate person. Mail forwarded to a partner for his review/handling/dispersement. So it can be done if you want to follow orders. But alas, you are the Major and majors always felt they were above being responsible for their actions!


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[Major]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

Not fair! I may not agree with him but, as far as I know, this is still the United States. Don’t think social shaming is appropriate here.


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Thank you RBG!

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I agree we have to get the economy back up and running. We are 9 days into the 15 days of the social distancing order and after the 15 days hopefully we have given the health care industry time to catch up and get ahead of the overload so we don't end up like Italy.
I have a daughter that is an RN and she is sacrificing her health night and day to help people get through this. She is working 24/7 but she's not going to be rich when this is all over. Hopefully she doesn't have to quarantine because of not having enough PP&E to protect herself. There are people sacrificing to keep people safe, not for money.
Anyone that believes in "thinning the herd" for the benefit of the masses should do us all a favor and remove themselves from the equation.

Who said “thinning the herd” nobody here I’m sure wants people to perish from this disease but the overreacting in my opinion again is going to have a great effect and cost more lives if the economy is not jump started quickly.


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[The Real BigGuy]

And by the way everyone, MA courts are closed until April 6.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

Not fair! I may not agree with him but, as far as I know, this is still the United States. Don’t think social shaming is appropriate here.

Yes, it is the United States where the rule of law governs. And we have a lawyer, of all people, flaunting lawful orders of the governor designed for public safety. Disagree with officials all you want, but let’s get real at some point and stop pretending that this is ok.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by joey2665

Who said “thinning the herd” nobody here I’m sure wants people to perish from this disease but the overreacting in my opinion again is going to have a great effect and cost more lives if the economy is not jump started quickly.


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Post #218, and I've read a few others in the past week.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Post #218, and I've read a few others in the past week.

Please sacrificing the fuel for the benefit of the many does not mean I want to thin the herd or I want anybody to pass away. You can twist my words anyway you want But I never wish anybody ill will. And trust me we keep going down this path and we end up with socialized medicine and a depressed economy will be losing tens of thousands of people.

You can think what you want or smiles what you want I know what I said and what I meant I’m done with this thread


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[Major]

We make decisions as a society to accept known risks. Every year 20,000 to 80,000 Americans die of the flu and about 500,000 people are hosiptalized. We do not shut down our economy to deal with this risk. Every year 35,000 Americans die in car accidents and 3,000,000 are injured. We do not tell people that they can't commute to work or attend events by car because of this risk.

I was speaking to my dad this morning. He's 75 years old and in good health. My mom, unfortunately, is 76 years old has advanced COPD. Contracting the Chinese coronavirus would most likely kill her. (She's in Florida so my wreckless actions won't affect her. Although I went to the dentist today and my temperature was 98.5, so I think I'm okay!) My dad agreed with Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick. His quote "why are we sacrificing our children's and grandchildren's future for a bunch of old people."

I don't want to see anyone die, whether from Chinese coronavirus, H1N1, flu or car accidents. However, our approach to this as a society and a government is completely over the top.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by joey2665

Please sacrificing the fuel for the benefit of the many does not mean I want to thin the herd or I want anybody to pass away. You can twist my words anyway you want But I never wish anybody ill will. And trust me we keep going down this path and we end up with socialized medicine and a depressed economy will be losing tens of thousands of people.

You can think what you want or smiles what you want I know what I said and what I meant I’m done with this thread


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My post wasn't directed at you, Post #218 wasn't yours. Don't take this so personal.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by Major

Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick. His quote "why are we sacrificing our children's and grandchildren's future for a bunch of old people."

More on this quote from Texas Lt Gov Dan Patrick ..... http://www.nymag.com/intelligencer/2...e-economy.html ... includes the 1:44 video with Tucker Carlson from March 23, 2020, 8:21-pm and email comments down the page.

Took a look at the Wikipedia profile on Lt Gov Dan Patrick, born April 4, 1950, age-69, and he has no military service in his profile so perhaps he got a medical deferment or a high draft lottery number to avoid serving during the War in Vietnam. Is interesting how the guy who did not serve is now talking about re-starting the nation's business economy asap-pdq and willing to sacrifice some of the elderly to the corona virus.

And ditto that same 'no military service' for Tucker Carlson, born May 16, 1969, age-50.

...... talk about a MAJOR blunder! ....... is best to save lives ....... not Wall St.

[TheRoBoat]

Some myths and numbers

I have seen a lot of numbers bantered about here, and rather than address the posts individually, I’ll give you a Californian’s perspective.

Forget any social distancing numbers, timeframes, etc, that you have heard. The only number that matters is how long you will be under shelter in place. Complain or disagree all you want, it is almost assuredly going to happen. “The clock” doesn’t start ticking until then.

At that point, you are looking at probably 2-3 weeks minimum, as others have said. Probably much longer on a voluntary basis. And this is the key point - the longer you wait, the longer it will be before you come out of it. Not wait a day now, and it’s a day on the backend - it’s not a one to one trade off.

Forget "the Grandparents” meme. CA Covid Cases:

Ages 0-17: 25 cases
Ages 18-49: 837 cases
Ages 50-64: 442 cases
Ages 65 and older: 415 cases
Unknown: 14 cases

Keep an eye on CA’s numbers, and the numbers of States who waited much longer to declare shelter in place orders. We started the “draconian” measures much earlier. If they work, we will come out earlier as well. Of course a lot of that depends on medical supply availability, etc etc.

Both Bay area and LA health officials have said “the worst is coming”, which in the big picture is not the a bad thing to have happening right now. They imposed stricter restrictions on parks and beaches, since the public was not following guidelines.

Shaming - I won’t say whether I agree or not, I will say it is prevalent in CA. Prediction - this guy’s business is over - https://www.latimes.com/california/s...antine-shaming

[Major]

I'm curious, what is being done about the huge homeless encampments in LA and SF? A society that allows this type of behavior and the diseases that it spreads (most of which were eradicated a long time ago) should not be too concerned about the Chinese coronavirus. My guess is that the Chinese coronavirus is running rampant in these homeless encampments. As Maxum stated above, we tolerate this type of way more dangerous social disobedience. In fact, I wouldn't say we tolerate it, we actually enable it. And I'm being chastised because I think it's an overreaction and I want to live my life.

[TheRoBoat]

...is obviously a huge concern to health officials. They are vulnerable and arguably the greatest threat to overwhelm the system.

I would suggest you keep an eye on it, as the same dynamics might be playing out at LRGH in the very near future.

Ditto NYC.

[The Real BigGuy]

Major, I’d be curious to hear what your answer to the encampments are?


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[The Real BigGuy]

FLL, I take offense at your reference to military service as a criteria for having an opinion. (Maybe not if it was because of a draft avoidance scam.). I happened to end up with 363 my year and was never called to serve. A lot of politicians, maybe even a majority by now, don’t have military service. It shouldn’t preclude them from having an opinion whether we like it or not.

(I wonder if senility is setting in. Starting a conversation with FLL???)


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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

Major, I’d be curious to hear what your answer to the encampments are?


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Oh, this should be good!

[Major]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

Major, I’d be curious to hear what your answer to the encampments are?


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I would do just what Mayor Giuliani did in NYC -- enforce the law. Arrest or institutionalize them. I would support building more prisons to deal with the homeless issue. Just as I would support more prisons to deal with criminal behavior. We are a nation of laws, not a nation of men.

[Mr. V]

Arrest or institutionalize them. I would support building more prisons to deal with the homeless issue.

Oh, really?

Just what CRIME have all the homeless committed?

Let me guess: you believe that it doesn't matter whether or not they committed a crime, you just want them out of sight?

The courts disagree with you, they say you can't do it, but then you already know that.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Major

I would do just what Mayor Giuliani did in NYC -- enforce the law. Arrest or institutionalize them. I would support building more prisons to deal with the homeless issue. Just as I would support more prisons to deal with criminal behavior. We are a nation of laws, not a nation of me.

Unfortunately the current nyc mayor has let 300 prisoners free and set to let another 300 go in the name of the virus. It is amazing how we have become a country of no laws enforced in our big cities. There is no accountability any longer.


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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

I would do just what Mayor Giuliani did in NYC -- enforce the law. Arrest or institutionalize them. I would support building more prisons to deal with the homeless issue. Just as I would support more prisons to deal with criminal behavior. We are a nation of laws, not a nation of me.

Though I would not use this language, I sort of agree with your point. NYC has many more homeless people than LA has, but does not have California's "homeless issue"--95% of NYC's homeless are "institutionalized" in shelters, vs something like 25% in LA; plus NY has a lot more social services to help them get back on their feet. I think LA should build more shelters.

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Though I would not use this language, I sort of agree with your point. NYC has many more homeless people than LA has, but does not have California's "homeless issue"--95% of NYC's homeless are "institutionalized" in shelters, vs something like 25% in LA; plus NY has a lot more social services to help them get back on their feet. I think LA should build more shelters.

We have a breakthrough! Hell has frozen over. You made my day FlyingScot! I would support building more shelters.


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[lakewinnie]

Here's the latest down here in CT:

"Fishing season opened in Connecticut Wednesday, a few weeks earlier than usual, in an effort to shrink the size of crowds that typically gather on opening day in April. Anglers are encouraged to practice social distancing and remain six feet apart."

[fatlazyless]

Here in NH, the lakes up north and smaller lakes here & there still have enough ice to support fishing through the ice til March 31 and you can still do your social distancing all alone with a soothing bottle of Jack Daniels on the ice.

Just don't go without your foam noodle belt worn under your coat, out of sight, so people don't actually see you wearing the noodle or the bottle of jack.

[The Real BigGuy]

Prison??? When did it become a crime to be homeless? There but for the grace of god goes you & me.


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[TheRoBoat]

has been taking shape over the last week.

Here are the latest plans. https://www.latimes.com/homeless-hou...ties-confusion

[Beauport]

I suspect we can all agree that we hope our families and loved ones never catch the virus in the first place. I found this video incredibly helpful and optimistic about avoiding it. My hope is that we can all emerge from this healthy so we can argue further on the forum

It is long but well worth it...an ICU doctor talking to friends and family about how to live your life and still stay healthy.

Seems like I cannot post the link, but if you go to Vimeo and find video #399733860 that is it.

[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

Prison??? When did it become a crime to be homeless? There but for the grace of god goes you & me.


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“Homeless” is not the crime...try loitering, littering, blocking a public way, unlawful use of drugs, prostitution, deficating/exposing in public to name just a few.

[The Real BigGuy]

So, anyway you can to get those homeless “eyesores” out of your pure conservative lily white world! How about helping them find a job, or a place to live?

Sometimes people just suck!


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[rsmlp]

My son is director of computational biology at a biotech firm in Cambridge, MA so this stuff is literally his wheelhouse. Allow me to shed some light on some Covid math.

Firstly, there's PLENTY of data to extrapolate conclusions from BUT also plenty of variables. Variables make math conclusions iffy. The number one variable is "how many people in the US are infected with Covid"? We don't know since testing cannot possibly collect all the precise data but it is undoubtedly FACTORS greater than the 100K reported thus far. We DO know number of deaths caused directly by Covid; 1704 as of latest data collection. Please not a wrote DIRECTLY as that will come into play shortly.

The simple math is 1704/104000 or about 1.6% BUT that is indeed overstating the death rate as the PRESUMED number of cases is AT LEAST 250,000 and probably higher so 1704/250000 equals about .7%. My son says that the whisper number is right around .5%.

Still pretty damn deadly. The GOOD news is children under the age of 15 or so are practically impervious to Covid. We do not know why. That said, there are healthy younger people dying from Covid but MOST deaths are older or more vulnerable people.

Short of a vaccine-which we won't see for at least a year, the ONLY way to slow down Covid is isolation. There is simply no other option. It is possible that warmer weather may reduce he spread but we don't know that either.

So America has a choice; as several on this forum and our illustrious POTUS have suggested, GO BACK TO WORK! Understand that if we go down that path that 20-50% of Americans will become infected, we will completely overwhelm our healthcare system which means that INDIRECTLY (no room at the hospital) hundreds of thousands will die and DIRECTLY (let's use a 25% infection rate and be optimistic) about 500,000 Americans will die and I would guess that's on the low side.

OR

Hunker down except for absolute essential workers for 4-6 weeks and the economy does whatever it will do but it won't be pretty either. Note that this will NOT eradicate the virus but rather slow it down.

Those are the choices.

[WinnisquamZ]

Originally Posted by rsmlp

My son is director of computational biology at a biotech firm in Cambridge, MA so this stuff is literally his wheelhouse. Allow me to shed some light on some Covid math.

Firstly, there's PLENTY of data to extrapolate conclusions from BUT also plenty of variables. Variables make math conclusions iffy. The number one variable is "how many people in the US are infected with Covid"? We don't know since testing cannot possibly collect all the precise data but it is undoubtedly FACTORS greater than the 100K reported thus far. We DO know number of deaths caused directly by Covid; 1704 as of latest data collection. Please not a wrote DIRECTLY as that will come into play shortly.

The simple math is 1704/104000 or about 1.6% BUT that is indeed overstating the death rate as the PRESUMED number of cases is AT LEAST 250,000 and probably higher so 1704/250000 equals about .7%. My son says that the whisper number is right around .5%.

Still pretty damn deadly. The GOOD news is children under the age of 15 or so are practically impervious to Covid. We do not know why. That said, there are healthy younger people dying from Covid but MOST deaths are older or more vulnerable people.

Short of a vaccine-which we won't see for at least a year, the ONLY way to slow down Covid is isolation. There is simply no other option. It is possible that warmer weather may reduce he spread but we don't know that either.

So America has a choice; as several on this forum and our illustrious POTUS have suggested, GO BACK TO WORK! Understand that if we go down that path that 20-50% of Americans will become infected, we will completely overwhelm our healthcare system which means that INDIRECTLY (no room at the hospital) hundreds of thousands will die and DIRECTLY (let's use a 25% infection rate and be optimistic) about 500,000 Americans will die and I would guess that's on the low side.

OR

Hunker down except for absolute essential workers for 4-6 weeks and the economy does whatever it will do but it won't be pretty either. Note that this will NOT eradicate the virus but rather slow it down.

Those are the choices.

So we pull the band aid off now or we wait and pull it off later. Either way, it will be painful


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[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

So, anyway you can to get those homeless “eyesores” out of your pure conservative lily white world! How about helping them find a job, or a place to live?

Sometimes people just suck!


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People like you ALWAYS get around to the race-card. It never fails.

[Mr. V]

There wasn't a homeless problem when I was growing up (baby boomer): seems to me the first time I noticed / heard of it was in the 1990's, and it mushroomed since then.

What happened to us as a country, that family no longer take care of their own?

That question was rhetorical.

[The Real BigGuy]

What “race card”? Since when did conservatives become a race? Some people will pull anything out of their butt to create controversy! I guess you’re one of the “people” I’m talking about.


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[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

What “race card”? Since when did conservatives become a race? Some people will pull anything out of their butt to create controversy! I guess you’re one of the “people” I’m talking about.


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You left out "lily-white". Nice try.

[Mr. V]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

What “race card”?

"...lily white world..."

[Mr. V]

A county jail out here on the left coast just released a couple hundred inmates well in advance of their scheduled release date due to covid-19 concerns.

[TiltonBB]

What is worse? The Corona Virus or being robbed and mugged by an ex-con on early release?

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

What is worse? The Corona Virus or being robbed and mugged by an ex-con on early release?

They are releasing non violent criminals, but it's nice to see you are trying to calm peoples fears.

[The Real BigGuy]

Originally Posted by Irish mist

You left out "lily-white". Nice try.

When did “lily-white” as in pure become “the race card”? I would guess that you are the ones with race issues if you are interpreting anything I said in a racial light. As Steve DiOssie said, “You’re not smart enough to put words in my mouth.”


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[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

When did “lily-white” as in pure become “the race card”? I would guess that you are the ones with race issues if you are interpreting anything I said in a racial light. As Steve DiOssie said, “You’re not smart enough to put words in my mouth.”


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You are not fooling anyone. Your attempt to separate conservative from lily-white in post 255 when you were called out was pathetic, and a tell.

The lily-white designation added to the conservative labeling was a purposeful and common stunt to shade people on the right as racists.

As for intelligence...watching you stumble around this forum insulting and antagonizing posters these past several weeks is all I need to know about you.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

What is worse? The Corona Virus or being robbed and mugged by an ex-con on early release?

Burglaries will be rare.

[JEEPONLY]

I would suggest that phrases such as- lily white / black magic- are adjectival, not racist.

Have you ever been caught red faced?

[The Real BigGuy]

Thanks Jeeponly. I appreciate your input. Let add white wash, black as night, and yellow as the sun. Apparently political correctness has taken some people so far as parsing individual words in everyone’s sentences looking for fault. Again, I would say that negative connotations are generally generated in the reader’s minds, not necessarily in the writer’s intent. I suggest that individuals look inward before they accuse someone else. It has been said, and I believe it is a good example: people who claim they are not a racist, probably are.


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[gravy boat]

Originally Posted by ApS

Burglaries will be rare.

Burglaries will be rare.

There is a meme circulating about that - everyone is sitting at home with a firearm and enough bleach and paper towels to clean up the mess.

[Biggd]

Our children have been "social distancing" for years now.
We are now seeing the effects it is having on adults.
Our moral compass is being tested and many are failing.
We use to say "we are turning into our parents" but I think now we are turning into our children.

[Garcia]

No wonder Gen X is so unfazed by social distancing

https://www.papercitymag.com/culture...mic-stay-home/

[gwhite13]

Not all republicans are racist, but all racists are republican. plus or minus 2%. Be safe don't catch the trump virus, first sign is stupidity. enjoy today

[garysanfran]

Originally Posted by gwhite13

Not all republicans are racist, but all racists are republican. plus or minus 2%. Be safe don't catch the trump virus, first sign is stupidity. enjoy today

I'm worried you got "the first sign"...

Probably not contagious...

[Major]

Originally Posted by gwhite13

Not all republicans are racist, but all racists are republican. plus or minus 2%. Be safe don't catch the trump virus, first sign is stupidity. enjoy today

I think you need a history lesson. Starting with the Civil War, Reconstruction, Segregation, Re-segregation (by Woodrow Wilson), Jim Crow, etc., the party of racism was the Democrats. HRC's idol, Robert Byrd, was the exulted cyclops of the KKK. He was in the Senate until 2010. Research what Lyndon Johnson said while returning to his ranch after signing the Civil Rights Act (which was initiated by Republicans). What you are saying is patently false. Who is the party of identity politics?

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

I think you need a history lesson. Starting with the Civil War, Reconstruction, Segregation, Re-segregation (by Woodrow Wilson), Jim Crow, etc., the party of racism was the Democrats. HRC's idol, Robert Byrd, was the exulted cyclops of the KKK. He was in the Senate until 2010. Research what Lyndon Johnson said while returning to his ranch after signing the Civil Rights Act (which was initiated by Republicans). What you are saying is patently false. Who is the party of identity politics?

Agreed that there are plenty of racist Democrats, such as Byrd. But let's not throw LBJ under the same label. I don't know what he said when he got back to his ranch, but far more importantly than anything he might have said, he did champion the Civil Rights Act--at significant political cost. Richard Nixon capitalized on the backlash with his Southern Strategy, and of course, that was pretty much the end of the South for the Dems.

Given your interest in this though, doesn't it at least bug you that Trump has said a number of things that have inflamed racial tensions? Just for example--don't you wish he had not said there were good people on both sides when referring to the Charlottesville white nationalist march?

[Garcia]

Originally Posted by gwhite13

Not all republicans are racist, but all racists are republican. plus or minus 2%. Be safe don't catch the trump virus, first sign is stupidity. enjoy today

One of the interesting thing about racism is that almost no one identifies as a racist. Instead, all across the political spectrum, from one side to the other, people say they are not racist - but can point to those who are.

[garysanfran]

Just for example--don't you wish he had not said there were good people on both sides when referring to the Charlottesville white nationalist march?
FlyingScot is online now Report Post Reply With Quote

Obama as being "clean"?

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Agreed that there are plenty of racist Democrats, such as Byrd. But let's not throw LBJ under the same label. I don't know what he said when he got back to his ranch, but far more importantly than anything he might have said, he did champion the Civil Rights Act--at significant political cost. Richard Nixon capitalized on the backlash with his Southern Strategy, and of course, that was pretty much the end of the South for the Dems.

Given your interest in this though, doesn't it at least bug you that Trump has said a number of things that have inflamed racial tensions? Just for example--don't you wish he had not said there were good people on both sides when referring to the Charlottesville white nationalist march?

LBJ was a reluctant champion. He did it to secure votes, plain and simple. The CRA started as a republican initiative in the late 1950s.

Nothing Trump has said has bugged me. He calls thing as he sees them. Regarding Charlottesville, the other side he was referencing wasn't the white nationalists, but the first amendment supporters. There were many groups there. He has NEVER said that he supports the KKK or white nationalists.

He was on national TV for 15 years, worked with hundreds if not thousands of people. If he had any hint of racism, or is a racists, we could call on dozens of examples from this period of time. NOTHING. (As an anecdote, I know a producer of the Apprentice, who is far from conservative, who states that Trump was good to everyone, and that there was never any instances of misogynist or racist behavior.) He has been in the public light for nearly 40 years. NOTHING. These accusations are about as real as Russian collusion.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by gwhite13

Not all republicans are racist, but all racists are republican. plus or minus 2%. Be safe don't catch the trump virus, first sign is stupidity. enjoy today

Your lack of intelligence is showing. The facts do not support your claim. Perhaps you may wish to think a little more before you post.

Hillary tried the same approach, making false claims about Republicans: How did that work out for you?

Some notable Republican progress to help minorities:

Civil Rights Act of 1960: "Eisenhower signed the GOP’s 1960 Civil Rights Act after it survived a five-day, five-hour filibuster by 18 Senate Democrats."

Desegregating schools (1957): Dwight Eisenhower "deployed the 82nd Airborne Division to desegregate Little Rock’s government schools over the strenuous resistance of Governor Orval Faubus (D., Ark.)."

Emancipation Proclamation (1863): The first Republican President, Abraham Lincoln, issued an order freeing all slaves in the confederacy.

The First Asian-American U.S. Senator (1959): The first Asian-American senator, Republican Hiram Fong, was elected in Hawaii.

[garysanfran]

With a lack of intelligence.

Ignorance I associate with a lack of knowledge.

gwhite13 could increase HIS knowledge by reading some of the posts in this Forum.

From my experience, stupidity keeps more than a 6' distance from the members on this Forum, because the numbers are few.

Lot of knowledge is past through this Forum, and thanks to all those who share knowledge AND intelligence with others.

Name calling is for the intellectually vapid with no intellectual knowledge to share.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

there was never any instances of misogynist ...behavior

You know, you lose all credibility for your fair points (like Byrd was a racist) when you follow them with stuff that we all know is not true. You might Google Trump misogynistic statements, then ask a partner at your law firm what would happen to an employee who said this stuff on the job or even broadcast while not on the job.

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

You know, you lose all credibility for your fair points (like Byrd was a racist) when you follow them with stuff that we all know is not true. You might Google Trump misogynistic statements, then ask a partner at your law firm what would happen to an employee who said this stuff on the job or even broadcast while not on the job.

I hate to break it to you, worst things are said in locker rooms all the time. He had a private moment with a reporter over 10 years ago. If that's all you have then you don't have much.

What he said to Billy Bush cannot be compared to saying something to an employee in a business or workplace setting. I taught and conducted presentations on workplace harassment and discrimination for years in the military. I have a lot of experience in this area of the law.

[The Real BigGuy]

But for crimes sake Major he is/was running for President. Shouldn’t the American people expect and be entitled to better from their leader? This is why, while I respect the office, I can’t respect the man!


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[4 for Boating]

Look I'm not crazy about what Trumps says and would not want to work for him (Trying to judge him on his actions and not words)

BUT - I gave up a long time ago on expecting/looking for a role model in a President.

Obama - seemed like a nice/good guy > not a big fan of his policy

George W > did not seem like the brightest bulb (No WMD's)

I mean Clinton raped a couple of woman didn't he?
I guess when he was not flying around on Epstein's private plane to the Bahamas and have a relationship with an employee in the white house.

It seems like the country has lost the ability to call balls and strikes.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by 4 for Boating

Look I'm not crazy about what Trumps says and would not want to work for him (Trying to judge him on his actions and not words)

BUT - I gave up a long time ago on expecting/looking for a role model in a President.

Obama - seemed like a nice/good guy > not a big fan of his policy

George W > did not seem like the brightest bulb (No WMD's)

I mean Clinton raped a couple of woman didn't he?
I guess when he was not flying around on Epstein's private plane to the Bahamas and have a relationship with an employee in the white house.

It seems like the country has lost the ability to call balls and strikes.

Oops--did not mean to thank you, but did mean to reply:

Obama and George W are both gentlemen, both role models on a personal basis--honest people trying to make America a better place.

Clinton is a cad, as you note.

Trump is an over-the-top misogynist. To your point about judge a person based on actions, rather than words, and to Major's question wondering if I'm only worried about locker room talk--we might all remember that Trump is being sued by over 20 different women from multiple walks of life and political perspectives. Here's a list (for those who demand more than Wikipedia, all these names are in the public record, google-able and available on other websites too):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald...ct_allegations

[4 for Boating]

I almost had my 2nd THANKS! - joke

To be clear I don't necessary disagree/dispute with the link you provided.
BUT > To also say/recognize he has not done some good things for the country would be back to my point about the inability to call balls and strikes.

Is "cad" some sort of codeword for rapist?

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by 4 for Boating

I almost had my 2nd THANKS! - joke

To be clear I don't necessary disagree/dispute with the link you provided.
BUT > To also say/recognize he has not done some good things for the country would be back to my point about the inability to call balls and strikes.

Is "cad" some sort of codeword for rapist?

Old school!

"If you say that a man is a cad, you mean that he treats other people, especially women, badly or unfairly. [old-fashioned] He's a scoundrel! A cad! "

[Wifi-1]

If one doesn't like their child payment, they need to go back to court to prove their position, not thumb their nose at their kids to get "free" money.

[JEEPONLY]

Originally Posted by gravy boat

Burglaries will be rare.

There is a meme circulating about that - everyone is sitting at home with a firearm and enough bleach and paper towels to clean up the mess.

This is supported by the news- gun inventories are depleted in many shops!
SAD.

[JEEPONLY]

Originally Posted by Wifi-1

If one doesn't like their child payment, they need to go back to court to prove their position, not thumb their nose at their kids to get "free" money.

What are you talking about? Who's getting free money?

Please clarify.

[Top-Water]

Intersting social distancing story on WMUR this morning.

https://ktla.com/news/coronavirus/pa...d-of-covid-19/

Panama announces separate quarantine days for men and women to help combat spread of COVID-19.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by Top-Water

Intersting social distancing story on WMUR this morning.

https://ktla.com/news/coronavirus/pa...d-of-covid-19/

Panama announces separate quarantine days for men and women to help combat spread of COVID-19.

Hey Top-Water ...... this is from Panama City, Florida ..... and this report is an April fool's day joke, type of a made up story ...... it's meant to be an April fool's joke and not a real believable news report.

It is truly FAKE NEWS ..... done for a joke, or something.

[Top-Water]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Hey Top-Water ...... this is from Panama City, Florida ..... and this report is an April fool's day joke, type of a made up story ...... it's meant to be an April fool's joke and not a real believable news report.

It is truly FAKE NEWS ..... done for a joke, or something.

You should take it to the CNN Wire and click the link Suggest a Correction

[fatlazyless]

Both the Conway Daily Sun and the Laconia Daily Sun have joke stories running for April 1.

The best joke story is in the www.conwaydailysun.com with a photo of Gov Chris Sununu and Sec Frank Edelblut surrounded by a big number of back-packs ..... starting a back-pack company .... April fools'.

Chris Sununu has hiked the entire 2100-mile Appalachian trail something like 25-years ago, so he knows his back-packs ...... dat's a lot of back-pack'n ..... walk'n from Georgia to Mt Katahdin!
.....................

Ok, so here's a March 4, 2020 CNN video report on Congressman Matt Gaetz from Florida wearing a gas mask as a way to mock legislation to provide funding to protect against the 2020 coronavirus pandemic, the Coronavirus Preparedness and Response Supplemental Appropriations Act.

http://www.cnn.com/2020/03/04/politi...ask/index.html

How 37-year old, Republican Congressman Matt Gaetz from Florida's 1st district in the north-west Florida pan handle area that includes Panama City, thought about the coronavirus on March 4, less than one month ago.

.....and, this is not a joke.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Both the Conway Daily Sun and the Laconia Daily Sun have joke stories running for April 1.

The best joke story is in the www.conwaydailysun.com with a photo of Gov Chris Sununu and Sec Frank Edelblut surrounded by a big number of back-packs ..... starting a back-pack company .... April fools'.

Chris Sununu has hiked the entire 2100-mile Appalachian trail something like 25-years ago, so he knows his back-packs ...... dat's a lot of back-pack'n ..... walk'n from Georgia to Mt Katahdin!
.....................

Ok, so here's a March 4 2020 CNN video report on Cong Matt Gaetz from Florida wearing a gas mask as a way to mock legislation to protect against the coronavirus.

http://www.cnn.com/2020/03/04/politi...ask/index.html

How 37-year old, Republican Congressman Matt Gaetz from Florida thought about the coronavirus on March 4.

.....and, that's no joke!

This Floridian voted for Matt Gaetz [R-FL].

I'd actually never seen his face until last evening!

Of course, the accompanying article was a negative one...

[WinnisquamZ]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/27/b...nequality.html
Good read. Different view


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[gravy boat]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

What is worse? The Corona Virus or being robbed and mugged by an ex-con on early release?

At least you can defend yourself with your firearm if mugged...

[gravy boat]

Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy

But for crimes sake Major he is/was running for President. Shouldn’t the American people expect and be entitled to better from their leader? This is why, while I respect the office, I can’t respect the man!


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

Now, I COULD see not respecting the man if he took sexual advantage of an intern while holding the office of President...and then lied about it.

I COULD also see not respecting his wife, who not only belittled and tried to tarnish the reputation of the intern her husband just sexually harassed but also tried to tarnish the reputation of the other women with whom her husband is alleged to have had "sexual relations".

But then again I can see how one instance of locker room talk long before holding public office would be considered equally as horrible...

To each his or her own.

[Top-Water]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Hey Top-Water ...... this is from Panama City, Florida ..... and this report is an April fool's day joke, type of a made up story ...... it's meant to be an April fool's joke and not a real believable news report.

It is truly FAKE NEWS ..... done for a joke, or something.

KTLA 5 News in Los Angeles ............... did you forget your medication again.

I guess its like you a little bit............. done for a joke, or something. Try the country of Panama.

[fatlazyless]

Yes, oh well, my bad .....that's Panama City, Panama, and not Panama City, Florida?

I had just read two April fools joke stories in the LaDaSun and Conway Sun, and this story seemed like another April fool joke coming from WMUR.

So, what do I know ..... it is the real deal ....... oh well!

Still say the best April fool, make believe story is on Gov Sununu opening a back-pack store...... which sells ..... budda-bing ...... back-packs! ...... April 1, Conway Daily Sun.

Does he have a Chuck Roast model in like new condition?

[coolyourjets]

Originally Posted by Major

LBJ was a reluctant champion. He did it to secure votes, plain and simple. The CRA started as a republican initiative in the late 1950s.

Nothing Trump has said has bugged me. He calls thing as he sees them. Regarding Charlottesville, the other side he was referencing wasn't the white nationalists, but the first amendment supporters. There were many groups there. He has NEVER said that he supports the KKK or white nationalists.

He was on national TV for 15 years, worked with hundreds if not thousands of people. If he had any hint of racism, or is a racists, we could call on dozens of examples from this period of time. NOTHING. (As an anecdote, I know a producer of the Apprentice, who is far from conservative, who states that Trump was good to everyone, and that there was never any instances of misogynist or racist behavior.) He has been in the public light for nearly 40 years. NOTHING. These accusations are about as real as Russian collusion.

Google it. There are several reports of racist behavior while he was on the Apprentice. So, it’s not really NOTHING.


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[ApS]

Originally Posted by coolyourjets

Google it. There are several reports of racist behavior while he was on the Apprentice. So, it’s not really NOTHING.

Checked.

The BBC version is widely criticized.