$3,995,000 - Wow...

[mswlogo]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

Are you fricken kidding me? You would let those things get in your way of considering a property?

The entire process of "staging" a property is over rated. Because if it is staged in a different way then a potential buyer would want to see it, it can actually work against you....

What if the owner prefers not to use a bed frame some people don't.... Just because you think they are necessary doesn't mean they are....

So a couple of Adirondack chairs are blown over.... what if the person looking at the photos doesn't even like Adirondack chairs....

Perception is important don't get me wrong. But the things mentioned here are frivolous... If I was able to afford to look at property for 4M$.... I am likely also planning to come in and spend an additional 500K - 1M$ to make updates to the property to make it mine...

Last if I was buying a 4M$ piece of property, I would also be investing some money, in a thorough inspection of the home including heating and hot water systems as well as the structure itself to insure I knew what I was buying.

In the end the pictures are fine... only nit picky people would be offended by them.

Likewise folks spending $4million could care less if it needs a new furnace.

I waived inspections to make my offers look stronger on several properties.

Inspections are mostly an escape clause or a plan to re-negotiate price and generally weaken your offer. You either really want the property or you don’t. You really gonna reject a $4m home over a leaky water heater? Or renegotiate for a $1000 off, when they have 2 cash backup offers waiting in wings? I don’t think so.

One place I made an offer on with no contingencies and site unseen.

That’s what you need to do in today’s market.

If you hesitate or put down any more contingencies than someone else, you’re out.

[codeman671]

It looks to me like someone just went with a "make me move" price on this. Shoot for the stars and if someone is dumb enough to pay it, pack up and go. There are far better properties on the lake for less money, even in todays market. The inside is clean but in need of updating. Outside the deck and roof looks ratty, it could certainly use maintenance and landscaping, and the driveway isn't even paved.

Maybe my freshly renovated island property should be $2mil now!

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by mswlogo

Likewise folks spending $4million could care less if it needs a new furnace.

I waived inspections to make my offers look stronger on several properties.

Inspections are mostly an escape clause or a plan to re-negotiate price and generally weaken your offer. You either really want the property or you don’t. You really gonna reject a $4m home over a leaky water heater? Or renegotiate for a $1000 off, when they have 2 cash backup offers waiting in wings? I don’t think so.

One place I made an offer on with no contingencies and site unseen.

That’s what you need to do in today’s market.

If you hesitate or put down any more contingencies than someone else, you’re out.

You are definitely underestimating inspections. You have only highlighted small issues and left out major expensive issues such as structural integrity of framing, HVAC, roof replacement, foundation issues, mold, termites, dry rot etc. many buyers use inspections to justify they are paying for what they think they are getting and not as a negotiation tool.

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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by joey2665

You are definitely underestimating inspections. You have only highlighted small issues and left out major expensive issues such as structural integrity of framing, HVAC, roof replacement, foundation issues, mold, termites, dry rot etc. many buyers use inspections to justify they are paying for what they think they are getting and not as a negotiation tool.


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Agreed, esp in this market where you are possibly paying over listing to get the property.
If it was a buyers market and you are making an offer well below listing then sometimes waving the inspection is a great tool knowing that you are going to go in and rehab the property anyway.

[Formula260SS]

Originally Posted by mswlogo

Likewise folks spending $4million could care less if it needs a new furnace.

I waived inspections to make my offers look stronger on several properties.

Inspections are mostly an escape clause or a plan to re-negotiate price and generally weaken your offer. You either really want the property or you don’t. You really gonna reject a $4m home over a leaky water heater? Or renegotiate for a $1000 off, when they have 2 cash backup offers waiting in wings? I don’t think so.

One place I made an offer on with no contingencies and site unseen.

That’s what you need to do in today’s market.

If you hesitate or put down any more contingencies than someone else, you’re out.

I agree people use inspections for re-negotiations, it's unbelievable what's happening to a friend. They are picking apart every little nit picky thing on what is clearly a perfect condition house. It's causing him a lot of unnecessary pain as he finally said sorry no deal and moved onto the next offer he had. I have a good friend who owns a real estate business in Mass with 6 offices - she HATES what it's all turned into.

I also agree on a 4M property that the owners are dumping another $$$ into it and most likely only care about the big ticket stuff which is not the furnace.

[Descant]

I think by now, we're all agreed that this is not a $4MM property.
I'm not generally enthusiastic about home inspections, but last house, I took my HVAC guy with me for the walk through. (No charge) He said the furnace was no good and the seller knocked $5K off without hesitation. He apparently had more credibility than a home inspector. Ironic to me however, is that wouldn't buy a boat without a survey. My experience is that boat surveys, at least on larger boats are more detailed than home inspections--multi: engines, heads, AC systems, electric systems, generator etc, etc. I had one home inspector turn on a furnace, it fired and he turned it off, gave a good report. In reality, the furnace would only run about 5 minutes and then shut itself off because the system was perforated and it would pump CO into the house. His fee was a waste. Yes, I know banks require it, if that's how you're buying.

[DesertDweller]

I think there are some broad generalizations being made. A lot of people that have accumulated the wealth needed to afford a $4mm house got that way because they invested wisely and didn't squander money. I agree that people that drop that kind of coin on a house will likely want to make improvements to make the house fit their tastes. I don't consider replacing a furnace, a roof, etc. an improvement. It's deferred maintenance the prior owner should have done and reduces the budget for putting in flooring, kitchens, etc. If someone is looking at that house and seeing plastic adirondack chairs all over the back yard, a roof covered in pine needles, etc. I think a pretty fair question to ask is what kind of care of the house did the owner take.

Regarding the price tag, that neighborhood is around the corner from me and is really nice but that house isn't a $4mm house.

[mswlogo]

As far as inspections go. If it’s a 30 year old house and the original HVAC. It doesn’t matter if it works or not. It’s essentially worthless. Similar on a roof, if it’s 20 years old it needs replacing “soon” if it leaks or not. If it’s a 10 year older house and the HVAC is broken, just fix it.

If the house is $250K these things matter. At $4M they are a minor nuisance.

Structural issues that are not obvious, in expensive homes are not that common.

Fir the most part, my experience with building inspectors on both sides has been a joke. But they can be handy for other reasons (for the buyer).

Septic inspection and site assessment are way more important.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Formula260SS

I agree people use inspections for re-negotiations, it's unbelievable what's happening to a friend. They are picking apart every little nit picky thing on what is clearly a perfect condition house. It's causing him a lot of unnecessary pain as he finally said sorry no deal and moved onto the next offer he had. I have a good friend who owns a real estate business in Mass with 6 offices - she HATES what it's all turned into.

I also agree on a 4M property that the owners are dumping another $$$ into it and most likely only care about the big ticket stuff which is not the furnace.

Sellers need to tell buyers during the offer and accept phase not to bother trying to nickel and dime after the inspection process. That they will fix fundamental problems but not normal wear and tear.

[marinewife]

After reading all of the comments and looking at the listing, I just had to look up the owner.

He is a recent widower, and his wife of 63 years was a big contributor and volunteer to the M. Library for many years, as well as a Minister in Meredith. She passed 3 years ago.

At his age, I'm thinking he is less concerned with the chairs being down outside and just wants to downsize into a smaller home that doesn't hold so many memories.

I hope he gets though the winter in an easier place to manage.

[winterh]

As a fellow waterfront property owner I truly hope the owner of this place gets over the asking price. I think any negative comments are directed at the realtor rather than the owner. They either mislead the man into what could be expected in order to get the listing (very common) or all involved understand they are just taking a wild shot at the moon with nothing to lose. Either way given what the realtor would make on this deal a few of the pics could have been done a bit better.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by winterh

As a fellow waterfront property owner I truly hope the owner of this place gets over the asking price. I think any negative comments are directed at the realtor rather than the owner. They either mislead the man into what could be expected in order to get the listing (very common) or all involved understand they are just taking a wild shot at the moon with nothing to lose. Either way given what the realtor would make on this deal a few of the pics could have been done a bit better.

A 4 million dollar property would pay a hefty commission. The reality should have taken it upon herself/himself to higher someone to clean the place up and take professional pictures.

[TFP]

I obviously meant the current owner no ill will and I wish him nothing but the best as he moves on from his home. And if someone pays him 4 million dollars for his home more power to him. At the end of the day he owns the place and I'm commenting on a message board in the middle of the work day to avoid the stacks of work on my desk.

However, I do agree with others that I think this reflects poorly on the realtor. If we assume a split of the 5% commission between the buying and selling realtors, and then also assume that the realtor splits half of the commission with their broker as I know many do: 5% of 4 million is 200,000, half of that is 100,000 and half of that is 50,000. So we're looking a possible 50k dollar payday for the realtor and they didn't put the effort in to tidying up the place a little. Sweeping, raking, and stacking chairs doesn't cost any money.

And LIforrelaxing, while you might argue that staging is pointless because rich people will spend money anyhow, I don't think you turn anyone off by having the place look well kempt. In other words, no one looks at a clean porch on the listing and says "Nope, not for me, I don't see pine needles all over the place and how dare they neatly arrange their chairs around the fire pit." Yet, posting it the way they did turned me and at least a few others off.

Also, how far does the "rich people are gonna spend money anyways" theory go? If you bought a new Bentley Continental GT should you expect the car to be clean when you pick it up at the dealer? Or is it assumed since you have the money to buy the Bentley you have the money to take it through the car wash too?

[tis]

I think that house had to be at least partially staged. I can't imagine a single 83 year old man keeping his house like that.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by TFP

I obviously meant the current owner no ill will and I wish him nothing but the best as he moves on from his home. And if someone pays him 4 million dollars for his home more power to him. At the end of the day he owns the place and I'm commenting on a message board in the middle of the work day to avoid the stacks of work on my desk.

However, I do agree with others that I think this reflects poorly on the realtor. If we assume a split of the 5% commission between the buying and selling realtors, and then also assume that the realtor splits half of the commission with their broker as I know many do: 5% of 4 million is 200,000, half of that is 100,000 and half of that is 50,000. So we're looking a possible 50k dollar payday for the realtor and they didn't put the effort in to tidying up the place a little. Sweeping, raking, and stacking chairs doesn't cost any money.

And LIforrelaxing, while you might argue that staging is pointless because rich people will spend money anyhow, I don't think you turn anyone off by having the place look well kempt. In other words, no one looks at a clean porch on the listing and says "Nope, not for me, I don't see pine needles all over the place and how dare they neatly arrange their chairs around the fire pit." Yet, posting it the way they did turned me and at least a few others off.

Also, how far does the "rich people are gonna spend money anyways" theory go? If you bought a new Bentley Continental GT should you expect the car to be clean when you pick it up at the dealer? Or is it assumed since you have the money to buy the Bentley you have the money to take it through the car wash too?

Agents typically don't split 50/50 with their broker unless they cut a really bad deal when they signed on. Sometimes listing agents will favor the split towards themselves, like a 3% to listing agent/ 2% to buyers agent. This usually pisses off buyers agents, but money is money.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by codeman671

Agents typically don't split 50/50 with their broker unless they cut a really bad deal when they signed on. Sometimes listing agents will favor the split towards themselves, like a 3% to listing agent/ 2% to buyers agent. This usually pisses off buyers agents, but money is money.

The listing office gets a cut also so that's usually why the listing agent gets more.

[TFP]

Originally Posted by codeman671

Agents typically don't split 50/50 with their broker unless they cut a really bad deal when they signed on. Sometimes listing agents will favor the split towards themselves, like a 3% to listing agent/ 2% to buyers agent. This usually pisses off buyers agents, but money is money.

I absolutely stand corrected then. If anything I was trying to put together the most conservative estimate of what the listing agent stood to gain. And again, no insult intended to anyone involved, just some constructive criticism from the cheap seats.

[WillyK]

Well, they've dropped the listing price almost 20% down to $3.25M. Still too high IMO, I think if they sell at all, it'll be in the $2.0 - $2.5 range.

[marinewife]

I recently spoke to a local realtor to ask who are the people selling their homes here to the newcomers (mostly MA 80%, then CT, NY, NJ buyers), and was surprised by the answer.

Many of the sales are from elderly people who don't want to keep up with a 2nd home and would rather cash out in a good market, feeling they can always rent for a few summer weeks if they miss the area.

Another group- the adult children of the recently deceased (or their parents have moved to a long term facility) and are unwilling or cannot come to an agreement on covering the costs of keeping the family vacation home, vacation black out days, whether to rent it out, etc.

This group is typically where the selling price seems too high or unreasonable- there's in-fighting, one sibling may want to keep it, and the others want the money instead- many price it higher, against a realtor's instincts, hoping some out of towner will jump at it.

Lastly, those that are divorcing are selling their vacation homes as well.

I just hope the new residents are friendly, adapt to NH, and don't try to change what we have here.

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Marinewife, your seller/buyer summary is very interesting. We fall into the senior category, and we were just discussing the headaches involved in owning 2 properties, 1500 miles apart. We both dislike extreme temperatures....Florida is beastly hot from May through September, and we all know how frigid it is here during the winter months, but it’s nice having the option of going to either one when you want to....plus you have your own belongings, etc, and don’t have to worry about what creature occupied the place the week before. 🤨 It’s a tough one, and the older you get, the less patience and ability you have to cope with problems that come up. A dilemma, for sure.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

Marinewife, your seller/buyer summary is very interesting. We fall into the senior category, and we were just discussing the headaches involved in owning 2 properties, 1500 miles apart. We both dislike extreme temperatures....Florida is beastly hot from May through September, and we all know how frigid it is here during the winter months, but it’s nice having the option of going to either one when you want to....plus you have your own belongings, etc, and don’t have to worry about what creature occupied the place the week before. It’s a tough one, and the older you get, the less patience and ability you have to cope with problems that come up. A dilemma, for sure.

Is there not a place that's temperature all year? The Carolinas? Arizona? I don't really know, but my wife and I have often talked about our future in retirement and am interested in knowing options other than what you've identified.

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[Sue Doe-Nym]

I guess there’s no perfect place.....some have claimed that the panhandle of Florida is more temperate....also some love Hilton Head, SC. For you, I would think that anywhere South, and hanging on to Arcadia, would be perfect.

[marinewife]

I spent over 3 years doing research on where to move before moving here.

Being an East Coast person for most of my life, I couldn't picture moving out west
and dealing with a completely different set of issues and unknowns.

The south, well, I don't think real southerners seem to accept or appreciate northerners, I could be wrong. There's a recent study on where people move from and to for all 50 states, and the south has maybe 5-10% of northerners in SC, NC and FL, mostly due to weather. I have relatives who moved to FL and NC, and while they're in gated communities or regular neighborhood homes, they say the people are different.

That left the mid-Atlantic and NE states. Tax-wise and in terms of natural beauty, NH seemed to have the best circumstances for me.

While I would love a shorter winter than what is up here, I guess my answer will be to rent somewhere for a few weeks to get a break from the cold. I think if I had two houses, I'd always be worried about the one I WASN'T in during any weather issue, and I'm getting too old for constant worry.

~just my two cents

[MeredithMan]

Originally Posted by marinewife

I recently spoke to a local realtor to ask who are the people selling their homes here to the newcomers (mostly MA 80%, then CT, NY, NJ buyers), and was surprised by the answer.

Many of the sales are from elderly people who don't want to keep up with a 2nd home and would rather cash out in a good market, feeling they can always rent for a few summer weeks if they miss the area.

Another group- the adult children of the recently deceased (or their parents have moved to a long term facility) and are unwilling or cannot come to an agreement on covering the costs of keeping the family vacation home, vacation black out days, whether to rent it out, etc.

This group is typically where the selling price seems too high or unreasonable- there's in-fighting, one sibling may want to keep it, and the others want the money instead- many price it higher, against a realtor's instincts, hoping some out of towner will jump at it.

Lastly, those that are divorcing are selling their vacation homes as well.

I just hope the new residents are friendly, adapt to NH, and don't try to change what we have here.

Way back in the 70's, when my parents bought their vaca home at the lake, their realtor, who was also a family friend, told them that 2nd homes are mainly put up for sale because either the owners are old and can't afford it or keep it up anymore, or the kids don't want it, (or they can't afford it), or there's a life-changing event, like a divorce, major illness, spouse death, etc. So it's really no different right now, with the exception of the sudden huge spike in prices that is maybe motivating some folks to sell to take the money and run. I also believe that the majority of 2nd home owners have always been out-of-staters, so again, I don't think there is anything new going on.

Mr Think:

To your point of where to go in retirement, we are having that same discussion in our house. We envision being at the lake 1/2 the year and "somewhere more south" the other part of the year, but we don't know where. Neither of us like FL...we have some friends in SC who absolutely love it, but we've never been there. I guess the thing to do is pick a few places and do some long weekends or a week or two there to get a feel for the areas. Then we'll be the out-of-staters that the locals will hate...HA

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

Way back in the 70's, when my parents bought their vaca home at the lake, their realtor, who was also a family friend, told them that 2nd homes are mainly put up for sale because either the owners are old and can't afford it or keep it up anymore, or the kids don't want it, (or they can't afford it), or there's a life-changing event, like a divorce, major illness, spouse death, etc. So it's really no different right now, with the exception of the sudden huge spike in prices that is maybe motivating some folks to sell to take the money and run. I also believe that the majority of 2nd home owners have always been out-of-staters, so again, I don't think there is anything new going on.

Mr Think:

To your point of where to go in retirement, we are having that same discussion in our house. We envision being at the lake 1/2 the year and "somewhere more south" the other part of the year, but we don't know where. Neither of us like FL...we have some friends in SC who absolutely love it, but we've never been there. I guess the thing to do is pick a few places and do some long weekends or a week or two there to get a feel for the areas. Then we'll be the out-of-staters that the locals will hate...HA

This appears to be something many here are familiar, or are dealing, with, so I'll start a new thread!

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