Viessmann vs IBC vs NTI Boilers

[MeredithMan]

Unfortunately, my existing wall-mounted boiler is on its last legs after only 10 years. Based on what I've read on the web, it seems that this particular brand, (Triangle Tube), is notorious for dying in the 8-12 year old range.

My HVAC guy has given me a few replacement options, which range from IBC and NTI on the lower end of the price spectrum, to Viessmann, on the higher end of the price spectrum. I'm familiar with the Viessman brand and know it's one of the best out there, but the price is commensurate with that. I've never heard of IBC or NTI, but those options would be about 40% less expensive. The HVAC guy states that they are good "middle of the road" options. I don't want to cheap out, but I don't want to overpay, (like any major purchase).

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with these 3 brands, especially the IBC or NTI?

Thanks!

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

Unfortunately, my existing wall-mounted boiler is on its last legs after only 10 years. Based on what I've read on the web, it seems that this particular brand, (Triangle Tube), is notorious for dying in the 8-12 year old range.

My HVAC guy has given me a few replacement options, which range from IBC and NTI on the lower end of the price spectrum, to Viessmann, on the higher end of the price spectrum. I'm familiar with the Viessman brand and know it's one of the best out there, but the price is commensurate with that. I've never heard of IBC or NTI, but those options would be about 40% less expensive. The HVAC guy states that they are good "middle of the road" options. I don't want to cheap out, but I don't want to overpay, (like any major purchase).

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with these 3 brands, especially the IBC or NTI?

Thanks!

Go with Viessmann unless you want to do it again in another ten years.

[Formula260SS]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

Unfortunately, my existing wall-mounted boiler is on its last legs after only 10 years. Based on what I've read on the web, it seems that this particular brand, (Triangle Tube), is notorious for dying in the 8-12 year old range.

My HVAC guy has given me a few replacement options, which range from IBC and NTI on the lower end of the price spectrum, to Viessmann, on the higher end of the price spectrum. I'm familiar with the Viessman brand and know it's one of the best out there, but the price is commensurate with that. I've never heard of IBC or NTI, but those options would be about 40% less expensive. The HVAC guy states that they are good "middle of the road" options. I don't want to cheap out, but I don't want to overpay, (like any major purchase).

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with these 3 brands, especially the IBC or NTI?

Thanks!

I have a Viessman at home and love it - thumbs up for Viessman

[MotorHead]

Get a Burnham cast iron boiler.
It will last you 30+ years.

[VitaBene]

I will 4th Viesmann. Love our quiet little wall hung unit!!

[BroadHopper]

There is a federal website on what boilers are available for a rebate. For example the Riannai E-Series boiler has a $1600+ rebate. It also qualifies for an additional NHSaves rebate. A high end boiler at mid range price. Plus the fact the energy saves on the long wrong.
Find out if your boiler qualifies.

[MotorHead]

Are you a fast runner?
If you are, run, run as fast as you can from Rinnai.

I had ECP75 installed to ~1450 s/f property in NH back in 2017.
Provides both heat and hot water.
It was installed by a Rinnai authorized/ certified installer/crook, listed on Rinnai website.

There were no rebates at the time, or I did not qualify since I am not a NH resident, or possible I missed it. Oh well.

Only one person at a time can shower.
You can not run the dishwasher or the washing machine if someone is taking a shower.
The unit is very efficient, my propane bill is comical.
The unit has 0 reliability factor. Every year, something breaks.
This valve, that gasket, some aluminum heat plate, mechanical switch.
Every F..n year.
It is now under Eastern Contract, so far they are doing a great job.
RUN, RUN from Rinnai as fast as you can.

In mass I have a 30+ year Burnham boiler for ~3000 s/f property.
Efficiency s..ks.
I call the plumber once every 5 to 6 years to clean the unit. That is it.
No other service is needed.

Best of luck.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by MotorHead

Are you a fast runner?
If you are, run, run as fast as you can from Rinnai.

I had ECP75 installed to ~1450 s/f property in NH back in 2017.
Provides both heat and hot water.
It was installed by a Rinnai authorized/ certified installer/crook, listed on Rinnai website.

There were no rebates at the time, or I did not qualify since I am not a NH resident, or possible I missed it. Oh well.

Only one person at a time can shower.
You can not run the dishwasher or the washing machine if someone is taking a shower.
The unit is very efficient, my propane bill is comical.
The unit has 0 reliability factor. Every year, something breaks.
This valve, that gasket, some aluminum heat plate, mechanical switch.
Every F..n year.
It is now under Eastern Contract, so far they are doing a great job.
RUN, RUN from Rinnai as fast as you can.

In mass I have a 30+ year Burnham boiler for ~3000 s/f property.
Efficiency s..ks.
I call the plumber once every 5 to 6 years to clean the unit. That is it.
No other service is needed.

Best of luck.

Since your Rinnai ECP75 specs state it can only produce 2.1 gallons per minute and since the average shower utilizes 2.1 gallons per minute, I'm not sure why you would expect anything more?? You should have bought a larger unit plain and simple...

Dan

[MotorHead]

I purchased the one recommended by the Rinnai authorized seller/installer.

Hot water is the least of our issues.
The unit is not reliable at all.

Again, best of luck to you.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by MotorHead

I purchased the one recommended by the Rinnai authorized seller/installer.

Hot water is the least of our issues.
The unit is not reliable at all.

Again, best of luck to you.

I have a couple of on demand water systems but strictly use for hot water not heat. One is made by State and has been trouble free for 12 years with zero maintenance. The other I just installed a year ago made by Rinnai RL75iP good for 7.5 gallons per minute. It's installed in a new efficiency apartment above a garage I had built. So far so good...

Dan

[swnoel]

All wall hung boilers are 10-12 year boilers... don't be fooled again!

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by ishoot308

Since your Rinnai ECP75 specs state it can only produce 2.1 gallons per minute and since the average shower utilizes 2.1 gallons per minute, I'm not sure why you would expect anything more?? You should have bought a larger unit plain and simple...

Dan

My E110CN is 5 years old and never had a problem. 3.2 GPM flow rate is perfect for a 2 bathroom home. 110,000 BTU is sufficient to heat a high energy efficient 2500 sq foot unit.

Don Morin, who is now retired after 60 years in the business recommends this unit. He says if I have problems it's usually in the water and electrical handling units, i.e. the water circulator, zone switches, zone valve control, etc. They have one year warrantees and often fails. In this install, he uses brands that he can trust.

This model has a 12-year warranty.

The only problem I had was Don Morin's retirement left me without a qualified maintenance person in the area. I made the mistake of allowing Rowell's to maintain the unit only because they claim to maintain Rinnai systems. The system was only two years old, the technician claims the unit is failing and had to flush out the unit and all the lines! Padded the bill big time! After he left no heat in the baseboards and there was a gurgling noise. This time I called Rinnai. They told me to unplug the unit, wait a couple of minutes before plugging in and perform a system diagnostic, purge the pipes of air, and if necessary add water. Problem solved. Called a qualified company since.

I agree with you, you need to get a bigger unit.

[MotorHead]

Thank you for all the advice.

When the unit goes, I am going to have a sledgehammer party in the driveway.
Will post it here and let you know when and where.

[dpg]

Originally Posted by MotorHead

Thank you for all the advice.

When the unit goes, I am going to have a sledgehammer party in the driveway.
Will post it here and let you know when and where.

"When it goes?" I hope your changing it before it "dies?" Surer than !@#$ it'll "go" in the middle of a snow storm in January.

[MotorHead]

It is now 3 years old and under "Eastern" Red Ribbon contract.
Repair or replace.

If the pipes freeze, well that is what the insurance is for.

Thank you for your suggestion.

[MeredithMan]

...ended up going with the Viessmann Vitodens 200 Boiler. When it took a full 4 days to install, with a lot of new piping and wiring, I felt better about the high price...Ha! I ultimately chose to go with this unit as the heat exchanger and other internals are stainless steel, (as opposed to aluminum), so theoretically it should be less susceptible to corrosion and leaking. And it is amazingly quiet...you cannot hear this thing go on!

[Tomregal]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

Unfortunately, my existing wall-mounted boiler is on its last legs after only 10 years. Based on what I've read on the web, it seems that this particular brand, (Triangle Tube), is notorious for dying in the 8-12 year old range.

My HVAC guy has given me a few replacement options, which range from IBC and NTI on the lower end of the price spectrum, to Viessmann, on the higher end of the price spectrum. I'm familiar with the Viessman brand and know it's one of the best out there, but the price is commensurate with that. I've never heard of IBC or NTI, but those options would be about 40% less expensive. The HVAC guy states that they are good "middle of the road" options. I don't want to cheap out, but I don't want to overpay, (like any major purchase).

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with these 3 brands, especially the IBC or NTI?

Thanks!

I would go with Viessmann. Mine is 14 years old and rock solid. My HVAC guy swears by them.

I should have read the last post! Looks like you made a good choice!!!

[Wentworth06]

This is pretty interesting , what would you think your annual heating costs will be with the new system if you don’t mind me asking.

[MeredithMan]

Originally Posted by Wentworth06

This is pretty interesting , what would you think your annual heating costs will be with the new system if you don’t mind me asking.

Good question. I don't know, is the honest answer, at this point. The new Viessmann is allegedly a lot more efficient than the previous unit, so I'm hoping that translates into less propane being used. The other piece to the puzzle is that our primary source of heating and cooling is geothermal, so the boiler replacement may be a moot point from an energy consumption & cost point of view.

[DickR]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

....The other piece to the puzzle is that our primary source of heating and cooling is geothermal, so the boiler replacement may be a moot point from an energy consumption & cost point of view.

Ummm, with the geothermal heating system, why do you need/want a costly propane-fired system?

[MeredithMan]

Originally Posted by DickR

Ummm, with the geothermal heating system, why do you need/want a costly propane-fired system?

The previous owner, who built the house, was/is an HVAC/Plumbing contractor. It was built with the geothermal as the primary heat source, but with propane system as a back-up and/or supplemental system. In the winter, we set the thermostat for the back-up heat system pretty low...in the 50's. This saved our bacon several years ago when the geothermal pump failed while we weren't at the house for a few weeks.

[frank m.]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

Unfortunately, my existing wall-mounted boiler is on its last legs after only 10 years. Based on what I've read on the web, it seems that this particular brand, (Triangle Tube), is notorious for dying in the 8-12 year old range.

My HVAC guy has given me a few replacement options, which range from IBC and NTI on the lower end of the price spectrum, to Viessmann, on the higher end of the price spectrum. I'm familiar with the Viessman brand and know it's one of the best out there, but the price is commensurate with that. I've never heard of IBC or NTI, but those options would be about 40% less expensive. The HVAC guy states that they are good "middle of the road" options. I don't want to cheap out, but I don't want to overpay, (like any major purchase).

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with these 3 brands, especially the IBC or NTI?

Thanks!

I had a lot of trouble after installing a Buderus a few years ago, and replaced it with a Viessmann last year. It was installed by Rowell and was actually cheaper than the Buderus. It has a titanium boiler with a much better warranty. Very happy with it.