Comparing cost of oil and electricity for heat

tummyman · 12-27-2021, 08:18 PM

The .05177 is just the distribution charge embedded in the overall rate. You are missing the energy charge, transmission cost, stranded cost recovery charge, and system benefits charge. See rate R in the Eversource document you attached. Costs should come out in the .18 - 19 per KWH.

https://www.eversource.com/content/d...sn=2947c862_14

ITD · 12-27-2021, 08:29 PM

The other thing you are missing is the power from electricity can be used to generate heat via a heat pump which multiplies the heat output by a pretty good factor, making it more competitive or when oil gets more expensive cheaper. The issue is that fossil fuels are used to make electricity and sometimes the increases in electricity, which somewhat follow oil, lag oil. I've done these calculations many times, for me oil generally comes out ahead of electricity, and natural gas always wins. The energy market is in turmoil right now due to the current administration shutting down leases and generally enacting the "green" agenda, which in the end makes energy more expensive.

The comparison you showed, shows resistive electric heat against oil. Resistive electric heat always loses.

John Mercier · 12-27-2021, 10:04 PM

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/17/us-h...ter-cop26.html

Our markets are not in turmoil.

The ANWAR leases are shutdown... the ten tracts were purchased by two speculators, neither of which has a history of producing one drop of crude from the ground. They were never even bid on by the only two major US oil companies that have the capitalization and technical expertise to drill and transport oil.

The price of West Texas Intermediate is set by market action based on the price of Brent. The price of Brent is set by the only two oil/distillate exporters in the European market - Saudi Arabia and Russia - that have significant production reserves that can be brought to market rather quickly.

We do not price short term futures contracts based on supply that could not reach the market for years or decades.

Our demand rose back to pre-pandemic levels, our production has not returned that quickly. It takes a while to shutdown and a while to reopen.

Natural gas production, though down is not significant, the largest change in that market is the enhanced opportunity to ship to Europe that has a higher market price through the LNG channels. That was initially started by President Obama and further enhanced by President Trump on June 20th, 2020. President Biden was petitioned to end the exports, or at least curtail them, and stated that he would not on October 14th, 2021.

The answer to your question SailnAway is bit more than you suspect. Depending on the temperature between the room your in and the rest of your house, it may be the means that you are using is the most cost effective. You would need to determine what it would cost to heat the entire house to the temperature you desire (provided you have only a single zone), and then determine if the increased electricity cost is less using the portable heater.

12-27-2021, 08:18 PM	#1
tummyman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 846 Thanks: 261 Thanked 698 Times in 246 Posts	The .05177 is just the distribution charge embedded in the overall rate. You are missing the energy charge, transmission cost, stranded cost recovery charge, and system benefits charge. See rate R in the Eversource document you attached. Costs should come out in the .18 - 19 per KWH. https://www.eversource.com/content/d...sn=2947c862_14

12-27-2021, 08:29 PM	#2
ITD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Moultonboro, NH Posts: 2,941 Thanks: 481 Thanked 699 Times in 390 Posts	The other thing you are missing is the power from electricity can be used to generate heat via a heat pump which multiplies the heat output by a pretty good factor, making it more competitive or when oil gets more expensive cheaper. The issue is that fossil fuels are used to make electricity and sometimes the increases in electricity, which somewhat follow oil, lag oil. I've done these calculations many times, for me oil generally comes out ahead of electricity, and natural gas always wins. The energy market is in turmoil right now due to the current administration shutting down leases and generally enacting the "green" agenda, which in the end makes energy more expensive. The comparison you showed, shows resistive electric heat against oil. Resistive electric heat always loses.

12-27-2021, 10:04 PM	#3
John Mercier Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2021 Posts: 3,565 Thanks: 3 Thanked 635 Times in 522 Posts	https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/17/us-h...ter-cop26.html Our markets are not in turmoil. The ANWAR leases are shutdown... the ten tracts were purchased by two speculators, neither of which has a history of producing one drop of crude from the ground. They were never even bid on by the only two major US oil companies that have the capitalization and technical expertise to drill and transport oil. The price of West Texas Intermediate is set by market action based on the price of Brent. The price of Brent is set by the only two oil/distillate exporters in the European market - Saudi Arabia and Russia - that have significant production reserves that can be brought to market rather quickly. We do not price short term futures contracts based on supply that could not reach the market for years or decades. Our demand rose back to pre-pandemic levels, our production has not returned that quickly. It takes a while to shutdown and a while to reopen. Natural gas production, though down is not significant, the largest change in that market is the enhanced opportunity to ship to Europe that has a higher market price through the LNG channels. That was initially started by President Obama and further enhanced by President Trump on June 20th, 2020. President Biden was petitioned to end the exports, or at least curtail them, and stated that he would not on October 14th, 2021. The answer to your question SailnAway is bit more than you suspect. Depending on the temperature between the room your in and the rest of your house, it may be the means that you are using is the most cost effective. You would need to determine what it would cost to heat the entire house to the temperature you desire (provided you have only a single zone), and then determine if the increased electricity cost is less using the portable heater.

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