Comparing cost of oil and electricity for heat

[SailinAway]

Gentlemen, gentlemen, a simple answer if possible: at current rates, is my 1500-watt heater saving me money or costing more than it would cost to turn the oil heat up a few degrees? Without going into too much detail, which is cheaper per million BTU, oil or electricity?

[John Mercier]

Oil is. But the oil would be heating a larger space, so the M/BTU would have a lesser effect on ambient temperature than a space heater putting out the same amount of heat in a lesser space.

[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Oil is. But the oil would be heating a larger space, so the M/BTU would have a lesser effect on ambient temperature than a space heater putting out the same amount of heat in a lesser space.

Thank you. Sounds like what I'm doing now makes sense.

P.S. I ordered oil yesterday. CN Brown was quite a bit cheaper than AD&G/Dead River, but delivery was two weeks out! Dead River always delivers in a day or two. CN Brown just doesn't have enough drivers and/or trucks for efficient delivery, and they require prepayment but not at today's price, rather the (higher) price two weeks from now. They also don't provide any type of service. I guess I have to stop trying to get oil from them. Nice folks though---their driver once backed into my car, putting a very small dent in it. The company paid me the $3000 repair estimate with no quibbles. (No, I did not get the dent repaired.) I love those kinds of accidents.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Thank you. Sounds like what I'm doing now makes sense.

P.S. I ordered oil yesterday. CN Brown was quite a bit cheaper than AD&G/Dead River, but delivery was two weeks out! Dead River always delivers in a day or two. CN Brown just doesn't have enough drivers and/or trucks for efficient delivery, and they require prepayment but not at today's price, rather the (higher) price two weeks from now. They also don't provide any type of service. I guess I have to stop trying to get oil from them. Nice folks though---their driver once backed into my car, putting a very small dent in it. The company paid me the $3000 repair estimate with no quibbles. (No, I did not get the dent repaired.) I love those kinds of accidents.

Just be careful that you are not heating the room with the thermostat that runs the oil burner. If you do, the temperature in the other rooms could drop low enough to cause plumbing issues.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Gentlemen, gentlemen, a simple answer if possible: at current rates, is my 1500-watt heater saving me money or costing more than it would cost to turn the oil heat up a few degrees? Without going into too much detail, which is cheaper per million BTU, oil or electricity?

If the space you're heating with the 1,500 watt heater is much smaller than what you would have to heat with oil AND it's a well-insulated space AND it's for a finite period of time, then I would say yes, it would save money.

If, however, you have a leaky space or door open and will run it for a while, no, it would not be a savings.

I would add that what you're probably saving, unless you have an incredibly drafty or large area beyond the one room, is negligible given a difference of a degree or two, especially if you open the door to go to the bathroom or have the slightest gap under the door, etc.

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

If the space you're heating with the 1,500 watt heater is much smaller than what you would have to heat with oil AND it's a well-insulated space AND it's for a finite period of time, then I would say yes, it would save the money. If, however, you have a leaky space or door open and will run it for a while, no, it would not be a savings. I would add that what you're probably saving, unless you have an incredibly drafty or large area beyond the one room, is negligible given a difference of a degree or two, especially if you open the door to go to the bathroom or have the slightest gap under the door, etc.

That makes total sense, thank you. I think what I'm saving could work out to a full tank of gas for my car each month, so it's worth it.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

That makes total sense, thank you. I think what I'm saving could work out to a full tank of gas for my car each month, so it's worth it.

That's where the subjective part comes in, for sure. If I recall, you've got a small car, so ~$40/tank right now? For that, I'd rather not worry about opening doors or having it chilly when I go to the bathroom, etc. Especially where you can probably make up the difference by programming the thermostat well.

But that's moi!

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

That's where the subjective part comes in, for sure. If I recall, you've got a small car, so ~$40/tank right now? For that, I'd rather not worry about opening doors or having it chilly when I go to the bathroom, etc. Especially where you can probably make up the difference by programming the thermostat well. But that's moi! Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Yes, small car $38 a tank. I was raised in a cold house. My dad worked for the electric company and he policed the lights and heat in the house. When Jimmy Carter asked Americans to lower their thermostat to 65 during the gas crisis, my parents lowered it to 60 because it already was at 65. You acclimate to that. I don't heat the upstairs of my house at all. If the outside temperature is above 25, I open the bedroom window at night (last night, for example). I also like to camp in the winter. Photo below: January, 5 degrees the previous night. Toasty! Tip: Don't leave bird feeder over your tent at night.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Yes, small car $38 a tank. I was raised in a cold house. My dad worked for the electric company and he policed the lights and heat in the house. When Jimmy Carter asked Americans to lower their thermostat to 65 during the gas crisis, my parents lowered it to 60 because it already was at 65. You acclimate to that. I don't heat the upstairs of my house at all. If the outside temperature is above 25, I open the bedroom window at night (last night, for example). I also like to camp in the winter. Photo below: January, 5 degrees the previous night. Toasty! Tip: Don't leave bird feeder over your tent at night.

Soooo it's not about saving money? Color me confused.

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[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Soooo it's not about saving money? Color me confused.

Yes, it's certainly about saving money.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Yes, small car $38 a tank. I was raised in a cold house. My dad worked for the electric company and he policed the lights and heat in the house. When Jimmy Carter asked Americans to lower their thermostat to 65 during the gas crisis, my parents lowered it to 60 because it already was at 65. You acclimate to that. I don't heat the upstairs of my house at all. If the outside temperature is above 25, I open the bedroom window at night (last night, for example). I also like to camp in the winter. Photo below: January, 5 degrees the previous night. Toasty! Tip: Don't leave bird feeder over your tent at night.

Awesome! Pretty much the same here. I used to love Deep Freeze and Polar Bear weekends as a Boy Scout. When my Dad offered me the choice of my own unheated bedroom on the third floor, or sharing a room with my kid brother, it took just moments for me to move upstairs

[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Awesome! Pretty much the same here. I used to love Deep Freeze and Polar Bear weekends as a Boy Scout. When my Dad offered me the choice of my own unheated bedroom on the third floor, or sharing a room with my kid brother, it took just moments for me to move upstairs

Course, there's no need to suffer in a cold tent these days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouMZE1KI15g Scroll to 8:40.

[upthesaukee]

Two years ago we did not burn any wood and just heated with oil (outside tank = kero). Last year we waited till the last minute to decide to burn some wood and got two cords of "seasoned" wood. Around $800 for the two cords.

This year, we cut and split close to 3 cords with the help of a few friends. Started off hand splitting until one of my neighbors stopped by and let me know I could borrow his gas log splitter. (Who knew he had one??? I didn't )

Wood sat on the driveway from the end of June until mid-September. We did not start to burn wood until mid-December because we were not around Nov to mid-Dec.

We burn from when we get up in the morning around 530 or so and last load goes into the stove between 630-700 usually.

I have a Nest learning thermostat and looking at the history while we were away, with the temp set at 50, the furnace ran around 3.5 - 4.5 hrs daily.

Burning the wood during the day, the furnace is only running around 1.5 to 2.5 hrs daily. Given the fact the wood cost me nothing but my time and effort plus about a gallon of gas for the splitter, I'm feeling pretty good about our savings on the fuel oil cost.

Now if I could just find a way to use swim noodles to make wood splitting easier.

Dave

[John Mercier]

We did that experiment.
One home wood and oil boiler with tankless; other just the oil boiler with tankless. Wood savings over a three year period averaged about 100 gallons.
Home using the wood has since switched to a mini-split... but still uses about 100 gallons annually less than me. Hot water, and the standby, eats up a lot of the usage.

[mswlogo]

Originally Posted by SailinAway

Gentlemen, gentlemen, a simple answer if possible: at current rates, is my 1500-watt heater saving me money or costing more than it would cost to turn the oil heat up a few degrees? Without going into too much detail, which is cheaper per million BTU, oil or electricity?

No











Sorry I couldn’t keep it to just No because this site requires filler. So here it is.

[Glendale Deli Boy]

I’ve always used oil furnace to heat our home but this year installed Mitsubishi Splits with heat pumps for main floor and upstairs master bedroom. Basement is unfinished.

I keep the home at 50 degrees in the winter and sadly am rarely there.

What is the best solution (most efficient manner) to keep my home heated at 50 through the winter? Use the Splits exclusively? If super cold, somehow have it set up so that oil furnace kicks in?

I just can’t quite get my head around the optimal thermostat setup and how to balance use of both the Splits and oil heat to most efficiently heat the house. Got the Splits primarily for AC but included heat pumps to give me options for the winter.

Thanks for any wisdom you all can share.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by Glendale Deli Boy

I just can’t quite get my head around the optimal thermostat setup and how to balance use of both the Splits and oil heat to most efficiently heat the house. Got the Splits primarily for AC but included heat pumps to give me options for the winter.

Now that requires a little 'rocket science'. You would have to take in the factor of efficiency of the appliances in cold weather, cost per btu etc. It can be done to determine the 'crossover'.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by Glendale Deli Boy

I’ve always used oil furnace to heat our home but this year installed Mitsubishi Splits with heat pumps for main floor and upstairs master bedroom. Basement is unfinished.

I keep the home at 50 degrees in the winter and sadly am rarely there.

What is the best solution (most efficient manner) to keep my home heated at 50 through the winter? Use the Splits exclusively? If super cold, somehow have it set up so that oil furnace kicks in?

I just can’t quite get my head around the optimal thermostat setup and how to balance use of both the Splits and oil heat to most efficiently heat the house. Got the Splits primarily for AC but included heat pumps to give me options for the winter.

Thanks for any wisdom you all can share.

For me that question would be a strict decision of cost. Unfortunately, figuring it out accurately is a bit of a chore. Electricity costs more than oil. The heat output of heat pumps varies with outside temperature so the efficiency varies also.

Honestly, without having done this calculation recently and assuming your oil heat is in the 80 to 85% range, I wouldn't worry too much about it and just do what made me feel best.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Glendale Deli Boy

I’ve always used oil furnace to heat our home but this year installed Mitsubishi Splits with heat pumps for main floor and upstairs master bedroom. Basement is unfinished.

I keep the home at 50 degrees in the winter and sadly am rarely there.

What is the best solution (most efficient manner) to keep my home heated at 50 through the winter? Use the Splits exclusively? If super cold, somehow have it set up so that oil furnace kicks in?

I just can’t quite get my head around the optimal thermostat setup and how to balance use of both the Splits and oil heat to most efficiently heat the house. Got the Splits primarily for AC but included heat pumps to give me options for the winter.

Thanks for any wisdom you all can share.

I don't think you will need any oil (but it would be foolish to bank on that, haha).

My guess is that you have these on two separate controllers. If that is correct, you could set the mini splits at 50 and the oil at 45. Also, if you put the oil on a Nest, it's easy to control remotely.

[mswlogo]

Our previous house was a modern 2x6 construction with oil heat.
So I used to keep it at 40F.

It was a HUGE difference, heat didn’t even come on until around January.

I had multiple alarms that would call me if temp dropped below 40F.
It didn’t give much buffer in the event of a power failure but I never had a problem.

We used about 200 Gallon oil a year.

[root1]

..... I have an oil-fired boiler at my vacation home. I employ several methods to monitor the heating system & temperature of the house.
I recommend (for those with a modern Honeywell R7284 controller on their burner) a little-known Honeywell Alarm Module (#W8735S3000). It closes a contact if it detects any system faults on the data bus. It's pretty cheap (around $45) and gives you a few hours advance notice before the house temperature drops. I have mine integrated into the house alarm system which notifies me of any number of adverse situations. Solid and reliable.
The Carlin controller (#70200) has the contacts already built in; making life a little bit simpler.
J

[mswlogo]

Originally Posted by root1

..... I have an oil-fired boiler at my vacation home. I employ several methods to monitor the heating system & temperature of the house.
I recommend (for those with a modern Honeywell R7284 controller on their burner) a little-known Honeywell Alarm Module (#W8735S3000). It closes a contact if it detects any system faults on the data bus. It's pretty cheap (around $45) and gives you a few hours advance notice before the house temperature drops. I have mine integrated into the house alarm system which notifies me of any number of adverse situations. Solid and reliable.
The Carlin controller (#70200) has the contacts already built in; making life a little bit simpler.
J

I had an Industrial type Electric Heater with a blower in the cellar. Set at a few degrees lower in case Furnace failed. Furnace never failed in 20 years.

If house is calling for heat and doesn’t get it, it doesn’t take long to know something is wrong.
Some smart Thermostats have that built in.