West Alton Marina manager arrest for alleged sex crimes

[John Mercier]

If you have been reading... we are speculating why the resignation?

It wasn't because he was homosexual. So what was it?

If he knew... or even suspected... do to interaction with any of the parties... his duty is to move it to the Alton Chief and the AG.

And no, a police chief can not state ''I was off duty when the crime happened''... ''I was off duty when suspicion of a crime was happening''... ''I heard the rumor when I was off duty''.

The law does not allow for that.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

If you have been reading... we are speculating why the resignation?

It wasn't because he was homosexual. So what was it?

If he knew... or even suspected... do to interaction with any of the parties... his duty is to move it to the Alton Chief and the AG.

And no, a police chief can not state ''I was off duty when the crime happened''... ''I was off duty when suspicion of a crime was happening''... ''I heard the rumor when I was off duty''.

The law does not allow for that.

"We" are not speculating. I am speaking of known facts and pointing out where your speculation does not agree with the facts.

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Possibly the off chance that a charge of Official Oppression could be registered.
If further investigation revealed that the Chief was doing as the accused stated and setting aside complaints rather than investigating them.

None of us will really know for some time as cases take a while to make it through the court system.

You are the only one speculating, and doing so with a lack of information and distortion of the actual facts. Among other errors, the accused (Murray) never stated that the Chief was setting aside complaints. Murray said that there was no point in going to the police because of his relationship with the Chief. You turned that into the accused stating the chief was setting aside complaints, and added the possibility of official oppression.

At this point, what is known is the Chief may have had a relationship with Murray. That is all. There has been no public accusation of anything illegal on the part of the Chief. Turning that into liability for the town is, at this time, a stretch. More information will certainly come out as the legal process continues.

[TiltonBB]

The financial aspects of this matter should be interesting.

The accusers families have asked for an attachment of over $6 million on the marina. Meredith Village Savings Bank has a mortgage of over $5 million on the property. That will total over $11 million in liens, if nothing else comes up.

Looking at recent sales and comparing what Channel Marine and Thurston's Marina sold for it is hard to see a property valuation that will be anywhere near that for West Alton Marina.

[winni83]

The existence of the mortgage and the attachment liens, if they are upheld, will certainly impact any voluntary sale. But a foreclosure of the mortgage will extinguish the attachments, with the proviso that any excess foreclosure sale proceeds above the amount owed to the mortgagee will go first to valid junior lienors and then to the owner. This assumes that taxes and other municipal liens are current. Candidate for a Chapter 11 filing?

[Descant]

Not part of this thread directly, but I am under the impression that WAM planned some major upgrades and/or expansion. If that is the case, and the work has not been done, the bank may still have some of the funds held back and the eventual debt could be much less. Is there work in progress? If I were a contractor, I'd want payment in advance. It would probably sell for more if it went condo.

[Patiently Watching]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

The financial aspects of this matter should be interesting.

The accusers families have asked for an attachment of over $6 million on the marina. Meredith Village Savings Bank has a mortgage of over $5 million on the property. That will total over $11 million in liens, if nothing else comes up.

Looking at recent sales and comparing what Channel Marine and Thurston's Marina sold for it is hard to see a property valuation that will be anywhere near that for West Alton Marina.

West Alton Marina is quite the property and definitely has more land value than the others.

[TiltonBB]

Fifth lawsuit filed, by a female

As with the four suits filed earlier, the plaintiff is alleging that she suffered physical harm and continues to suffer from emotional distress which has required therapy and counseling.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...0ffd42959.html

[lagoon]

All of this is following a not unknown pattern. As a former customer I wish I had been more tuned into the illegal behavior towards youth there. I will say that one of the fellows on trial actually tried to pick me up while there for boat service. His remarks were way off base and looking back I should have done something other than telling him I did not "go that direction".

If guilty, they will both be out of commission for long time. The marina will be sold and the rich heritage of the Colby family will be stained because of these two sick individuals.

[TiltonBB]

In the new filing, lawyers for West Alton Marina, Fortier and Murray are asking a judge to move at least two of the lawsuits from state to federal court.

https://www.wmur.com/article/west-al...court/40278166

[John Mercier]

From the newscast, I think they are arguing that the cases fall under federal law , but not State law.

I would think that NH RSA 354-A:7 Section V (5) should cover that.

''V. Harassment on the basis of sex constitutes unlawful sex discrimination. Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal, non-verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature constitutes sexual harassment when:
(a) Submission to such conduct is made either explicitly or implicitly a term or condition of an individual's employment;
(b) Submission to or rejection of such conduct by an individual is used as the basis for employment decisions affecting such individual; or
(c) Such conduct has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with an individual's work performance or creating an intimidating, hostile, or offensive working environment."

[wentworthwhitbreadIII]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

From the newscast, I think they are arguing that the cases fall under federal law , but not State law.

I would think that NH RSA 354-A:7 Section V (5) should cover that.

''V. Harassment on the basis of sex constitutes unlawful sex discrimination. Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal, non-verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature constitutes sexual harassment when:
(a) Submission to such conduct is made either explicitly or implicitly a term or condition of an individual's employment;
(b) Submission to or rejection of such conduct by an individual is used as the basis for employment decisions affecting such individual; or
(c) Such conduct has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with an individual's work performance or creating an intimidating, hostile, or offensive working environment."

I suggest checking with the former chief of police in Gilford if anyone wants more information on the situation at WAM. He appears to have intimate knowledge and some time on his hands.


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[John Mercier]

The Chief wouldn't know anymore about the NH statute than the statute itself.

It is really a matter of whether the plaintiff's lawyers can convince a judge that the case has standing in NH.

[TiltonBB]

The investigation concluded there was “insufficient evidence to meet the State’s burden to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Chief Burpee committed a crime."

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...748baf96d.html

[wentworthwhitbreadIII]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

The investigation concluded there was “insufficient evidence to meet the State’s burden to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Chief Burpee committed a crime."

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...748baf96d.html

Aka not easily found guilty but also not innocent. Not the kind of person I’d choose to enforce the law in my neighborhood.


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[knowit]

Drove through WAM for the first time the other day. I have to say it looks like a shanty town with all those gazebos. Quite disgusting and depressing if you ask me. Do people camp in those things? Skid Row is great description for it. Just my opinion.

[Lakeboater]

Originally Posted by knowit

Drove through WAM for the first time the other day. I have to say it looks like a shanty town with all those gazebos. Quite disgusting and depressing if you ask me. Do people camp in those things? Skid Row is great description for it. Just my opinion.

Do they, yes. But I believe they are not supposed to be for “sleeping” in.

[knowit]

Originally Posted by Lakeboater

Do they, yes. But I believe they are not supposed to be for “sleeping” in.

That is absolutely disgusting.

[Lakeboater]

Originally Posted by knowit

That is absolutely disgusting.

My comment about sleeping in the cabanas was that I believe they are not supposed to per the town of Alton. Much like some of the campgrounds can’t have anyone year round.

[Cobaltdeadhead]

I have one of the Cabana slips at WAM and I personally think it's the absolute best setup of any marina on the lake. I have a 16 x 12 deck right behind my slip with a 12 x 12 Cabana on it, place to grill and parking spot immediately behind it, nice furnishings, cable TV, WiFi, full sized fridge, all with views of the channel and My Major. We absolutely love it.

It's just a gorgeous spot to relax and watch the boats go by when my family isn't out on the water. It's also really nice to have when a quick shower comes through. Go hang out in the Cabana and wait for it to pass, then head back out. All of our Cabana neighbors are wonderful families, always people milling about, having drinks and sharing laughs.

[mowtorman]

I had reason to go there once.. Got a tour the whole shooting match. Teenagers were around. Talk about how much "fun' everyone was having. A forum member posted that he knew there was a problem from a summer camp 35 years ago. Hundreds of people around every day all summer and no one thought any the worse of anything? Sometimes we don't see what we don't want to.

In these touchy times I knew I wouldn't return when I drove out. To express thoughts on your perceptions without any specific tales puts you on the wrong side of being"correct". These days no matter what you say someone is offended, so I tend to say little or I'm always carefully choosing my words. I wonder how much goes unmentioned or unnoticed in these politically correct times. I didn't mention anything about it until now.

Much different than my childhood when we were still coming off WWII and getting into Vietnam. As kids we used all the incorrect words all the time and called our best friends the worst ones when we were mad...then we either fought it out or got over it.

Who would think a summer job at an established business in the lakes region could be so impactful?

[John Mercier]

As a child, if I used ''incorrect words'', regardless of the situation, I got the strap and sent to my room without dinner.

Seems my grandparents were not so willing to put up with me being ill-mannered.

[TiltonBB]

Another victim. Sixth suit filed.

“The types of things that were done to Jack, have been occurring at the marina for many years,” the suit says

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...5e0a63dc6.html

[lagoon]

If you look for statistics on the number of victims of each pedophiles at the CDC you will be stunned. I am sure there are more to come in this case and indeed I would not be surprised if there are other victims from other locations where these two alleged abusers spent time before.

People who abuse youth like this do not belong in society at all. Now we will hear about their rights as defendants, and how they misunderstood etc.

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by knowit

Drove through WAM for the first time the other day. I have to say it looks like a shanty town with all those gazebos. Quite disgusting and depressing if you ask me. Do people camp in those things? Skid Row is great description for it. Just my opinion.

I docked at WAM for several years. Most of the dock areas that had cabana space behind the docks were home to cruisers for the most part. The cabanas were used for some storage, but mainly for sitting off the boat to eat and entertain.

The one thing I can say is that the areas were not like a shanty town. The areas around them were always neat. On more than one occasion, i did visit with friends at the marina who had a cabana and found it nice to get away from the bugs or out of the rain.

Obviously, your opinion is far different from mine. I don't think you will find many people who would spend $200 per linear foot to dock their boat, ie, 35' boat = $7000.

Dave

[knowit]

Well, you know what they say, one man’s trash is another man’s treasure.
If I had a cruiser boat all my entertaining would be on the boat. Not in some shanty makeshift poor man’s vacation home! And as far as $200 a linear foot, that means nothing. There are plenty of folks with more money than brains on the lake. This whole fiasco is gonna make a great movie. I can only hope they film it in the shanty town. That would be amazing.

[LikeLakes]

Originally Posted by knowit

Well, you know what they say, one man’s trash is another man’s treasure.
If I had a cruiser boat all my entertaining would be on the boat. Not in some shanty makeshift poor man’s vacation home! And as far as $200 a linear foot, that means nothing. There are plenty of folks with more money than brains on the lake. This whole fiasco is gonna make a great movie. I can only hope they film it in the shanty town. That would be amazing.

So if people don't do their lake experience exactly like you, what they are doing is disgusting? Strange outlook, kind of narrow view of things IMO.

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by knowit

Drove through WAM for the first time the other day. I have to say it looks like a shanty town with all those gazebos. Quite disgusting and depressing if you ask me. Do people camp in those things? Skid Row is great description for it. Just my opinion.

I havent been in a couple of years, but in the past we were regulars there, used the launch ramp for day trips.

The gazebos you reference were very inconsistent, some were kept very neat and the people appeared very quiet and friendly, while others kinda fit your description and had loud and rowdy characters hanging out.

But then its the same at the sand bars and any town dock and any waterfront restaurant. Winnipesaukee attracts the whole spectrum.

In the last 20 years I would not keep a boat on wet slip, too many problems with the bottom getting nasty, and the boat always dirty from being out in the open so we trailered.

The last couple of years we have been at Paugas Bay Marina in the valet program and its so much better than a wet slip. Their location is great and they have been outstanding to work with.

I still miss having the boat at home to clean and do maintenance, but dont miss having to drive extra miles to find a ramp and deal with the ramp traffic and parking challenges.

And as far as WAM, I would find it hard to go back knowing what was going on there. Sorry but it would bother me to support such a place until EVERYONE associated with that happened is gone and its under new ownership and management.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by XCR-700

And as far as WAM, I would find it hard to go back knowing what was going on there. Sorry but it would bother me to support such a place until EVERYONE associated with that happened is gone and its under new ownership and management.

Couldn’t agree more with this statement!

Dan

[LikeLakes]

Agree completely.

[mcdude]

From WMUR today
https://www.wmur.com/article/west-al...arges/40644868

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

"We" are not speculating. I am speaking of known facts and pointing out where your speculation does not agree with the facts.


You are the only one speculating, and doing so with a lack of information and distortion of the actual facts. Among other errors, the accused (Murray) never stated that the Chief was setting aside complaints. Murray said that there was no point in going to the police because of his relationship with the Chief. You turned that into the accused stating the chief was setting aside complaints, and added the possibility of official oppression.

At this point, what is known is the Chief may have had a relationship with Murray. That is all. There has been no public accusation of anything illegal on the part of the Chief. Turning that into liability for the town is, at this time, a stretch. More information will certainly come out as the legal process continues.

No. If you read the posts... different people posted on what might be the reason for his resignation.

Since it isn't his sexuality... and no one can think of a good reason... I speculated that he may have had some insight into rumors, and failure to pass those to other authorities would be official oppression.

So far. No one has come up with any reason that he would resign. People knew he was homosexual. He isn't the first official, even a local police chief to have an adulterous affair... not even news around here... and the only time it has been news is when the official failed their duty.

Even a misdemeanor conviction against a police officer is not that unusual... so I am open minded as to what it may be.

Personally, I don't think it is any more of a stretch than the silent partner sisters. They didn't commit the claimed acts; we don't even know if they had heard any rumors or had any knowledge of it.

What we know is that well is only so deep, and we don't know what property was pledged in support of the bank note. Was it just the marina, or did it include homes and other property?

The chief's resignation seems odd with the history that we have around here.

[camp guy]

I think what mcdude had to say last evening was appropriate, but I fear that as this thread moves through time it (the thread) could easily deteriorate into something rather unseemly. Maybe it is time to let this topic rest and move on to topics more about boating, restaurants, and lake life.

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Before we let it rest, may I mention the best selling novel, Peyton Place, written by Grace Metalious (sic) about a small NH town. Does this ring a bell? At the time, it was s shocking tale. Hmmm…

[Mr. V]

Speculation: Perhaps the chief resigned because he suspected his relationship with one of the accused would become known and cast him in a bad light, personally and professionally.

Question: did he resign before the story of the sexual abuse broke in the media?

If so, perhaps he knew about it and figured "Uh oh, I'm in an impossible position."

If he resigned after it broke then he probably read the hand writing on the wall and left to avoid further scandal.

Sad, either way: it seems he was a competent policeman; hopefully he'll do OK elsewhere.

[John Mercier]

Shocking at the time.
Today it would be rather tepid.

Winni83... I think I am more questioning what the final sales value would be?
It obviously speculation... but rising interest rates and the shadow of a serious recession... simply make me wonder if there would be enough to even come close to covering the lawsuit; should it come to that.

I can't seem to find records on incorporation... but it may be that I am not looking under the correct name.

[winni83]

John, the name is West Alton Marina, LLC. It is a Delaware LLC registered to do business in NH.

https://quickstart.sos.nh.gov/online...usinessID=4731

[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

No. If you read the posts... different people posted on what might be the reason for his resignation. . . . The chief's resignation seems odd with the history that we have around here.

Sometimes people resign hastily to head off an investigation. That doesn't indicate guilt, though. It seems unlikely that the resignation is completely unrelated to the marina affair, given the timing. That would seem to indicate that the chief foresaw that the investigation into Murray would turn up something unfavorable to the chief that would result in his firing. Better to quit than be fired. I'm only speculating.

[John Mercier]

That was my thoughts.
But I just can't imagine what.

I just can't imagine that the lawyer working for the plaintiffs would not pursue that.
It may lead to nothing, but advocating for your client should lead you somewhat in that direction.

[SailinAway]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

That was my thoughts. But I just can't imagine what. I just can't imagine that the lawyer working for the plaintiffs would not pursue that. It may lead to nothing, but advocating for your client should lead you somewhat in that direction.

The chief must have resigned based on legal advice, indicating that what the public doesn't know about his case is not small. NHPR, May 3: "[The chief] had been on paid leave since Jan. 10. He has been the subject of a criminal investigation by the Public Integrity Unit of the state Attorney General‘s Criminal Justice Bureau." Four months later, the AG apparently had discovered enough to convince Bean Burpee to resign.

This statement by Brian Fortier is pretty strange and disingenuous given that he was or is married to John Murray, according to the lawsuit: "Our family is shocked and deeply saddened by the disturbing allegations against former employee John Murray."

[CaptT820]

I agree with others, that until we have more information, there isnt much else to say on this topic from an evidence standpoint. However, it does affect many boaters, slip renters, etc. in the fact that the Marina may change hands. It would be difficult renting a slip at West Alton right now, as you have a prime spot with a lot of amenities but a very questionable/unstable ownership situation.

By pure speculation, I imagine the asking price for the marina would be in the $40-$70M range. 162 Acres, with 440 slips at an average of $4500-$5000 annual rent, dockside market, fuel, commercial operations, location.. location... location. It is a high interest rate market, with a tenuous legal situation, crazy high demand with no supply, and how often does a marina actually go up for sale on the lake? When a one of one situation comes up (unique), the sky is the limit on price.

[TiltonBB]

Marina sales on the lake are not all that uncommon.

Channel Marine, Thurston's, Shep Brown's, and the Pier all sold within the last four years. None of the sale prices exceeded $3.5 million and some were much less. However, none had the number of slips that West Alton has.

If the buyer pays a price on the high end, arriving at that price based upon cash flow, that could be a problem if the economy continues to slow down. The economy is cyclical and when it slows down the income may not be enough to satisfy the debt. Empty slips don't generate any income.

[LikeLakes]

Originally Posted by CaptT820

By pure speculation, I imagine the asking price for the marina would be in the $40-$70M range.

I really don't think so. I realize you are just speculating, so who knows, but while it is a very valuable property I don't believe it is anywhere near that range.

[Descant]

Originally Posted by LikeLakes

I really don't think so. I realize you are just speculating, so who knows, but while it is a very valuable property I don't believe it is anywhere near that range.

Go condo young man. 440 slips at~$100 K is $44,000,000, plus valet and other assets. Slips at MVYC are going for $175K.

[LikeLakes]

I guess in this crazy market anything can happen! Will be curious to see the result.

[Poor Richard]

Originally Posted by Descant

Go condo young man. 440 slips at~$100 K is $44,000,000, plus valet and other assets. Slips at MVYC are going for $175K.

Small difference is, WAM has the stigma of employing pedos. I wouldn't exactly file that under "value add" but that's just me.

[LikeLakes]

Originally Posted by Poor Richard

Small difference is, WAM has the stigma of employing pedos. I wouldn't exactly file that under "value add" but that's just me.

Liens and perhaps complicated purchase parameters may affect value, but not so sure the legal situation will. New owner gets to clear the slate, enact proper, proactive, modern employment training and policies and get a fresh new start.

If I bought WAM I'd hire a well qualified HR/employment person right away to make sure practices were correct and send the message of zero tolerance from day 1.

[Descant]

Originally Posted by Poor Richard

Small difference is, WAM has the stigma of employing pedos. I wouldn't exactly file that under "value add" but that's just me.

Ten days, no, make that 5 days, after the sale, nobody will remember their names. Certainly not the proud new owners of 440 slips, and/or valet services. Ya gotta believe that all the boat owners posting looking for slips are sharpening their pencils and salivating at the thought that WAM will be a condo by next spring. Right behind them are all the investors who want passive income.