HUB status in Moultonborough

[TiltonBB]

Triple the number of people will fit now.

"This time, every possible measure is being taken to be able to handle what could be the largest turnout in town history."

This seems true: “There were so many people, and so many people I’ve never seen before. It’s been dividing this community since 2007. ... It’s going to be an interesting conversation, I’ll tell you that.”

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...e029601f7.html

[winni83]

This is the latest information on the Town Meeting on June 1, 2023, from the Town Website:

Posted on: May 23, 2023
2023 Annual Town Meeting
Town of Moultonborough

2023 Annual Town Meeting


To the inhabitants of the Town of Moultonborough in the County of Carroll in the State of New Hampshire qualified to vote in Town affairs, are hereby notified that the Annual Town Meeting, that was rescheduled from Thursday, the 11th day of May 2023 and will be held as follows:

Second Session of Annual Meeting (Transaction of All Other Business) will take place on Thursday, the 1st day of June 2023 at 6:00 P.M., at Moultonborough Academy, 25 Blake Road, Moultonborough, NH for voters to act upon Article 2 and the remaining articles of the Warrant.
Early check-in starts at 3:30 P.M. No reentry after check-in. Please bring a government ID.
If you have a copy of the 2022 Town Report, please bring a copy. Town warrant/budget copies will be provided.
Limited parking available at Moultonborough Academy, as availability will be for Handicap Parking. Carpooling is encouraged. Overflow parking available at Town Hall, Public Safety Building (Police/Fire Station), Function Hall (former Lions Club building), Moultonborough United Methodist Church, Bank of New Hampshire (after 5 p.m.) and Meredith Village Savings Bank (after 5 p.m.). Shuttle bus service will be provided starting at 3:30 P.M.
Childcare will be provided at Moultonborough Central School.
Any person with a disabling condition who would like to attend this public meeting and needs to be provided reasonable accommodations to participate please contact the Moultonborough Town Hall at 603-476-2347 so accommodations can be made."

Aside from the real potential to be as much of a disaster as the aborted May 11th non Town Meeting, just how is the Town Moderator going to enforce the "NO REENTRY AFTER CHECK IN"? Such policy was never in place before as I have gone outside to take a break from the endless comments at various town meetings. Does that mean you cannot leave the building itself or the room you are in. If the latter, good luck with stopping people from using the restroom. If the former or the latter, just when did Moultonborough enact this rule or is it just another power grab by the Town Moderator. Expect the no reentry rule to be challenged and if the rule has no validity, then perhaps the vote on the bond would be suspect or at least brought to the attention of bond counsel prior the issuance of the required bond opinion.

See issues in previous post about "Handicapped Parking" and what that means.

[longislander]

Early check-in starts at 3:30 P.M. No reentry after check-in.

The "reentry" had been mentioned at the last select board meeting and commented on how can that be enforced. No answer then, no answer now. The BoS even joked about maybe a movie should be provided!

It probably came up because of folks getting there early to claim a seat, and then taking off to return later.

Legalities could easiily kick-in. The moderator has no authority over the building, nor its property. He has authority of the meeting. That authority can easily be overturned by a vote of the voters to overrule thhe moderator. The supervisors of the checklist control the registering of voters and handing out of the ballot cards and "secrret ballots". Do they have any authority after folks have checked-in? Doubt it. Who has authority to refrain a voter from voting after legally registering to vote at town meeting? Anybody? What is the penalty for preventing a voter from exercising his/her right to vote?

Realistically, it is probably an attempt to instill some semblance of sanity with expected problems. However, you can rest assured that all parties involved with setting-up this town meeting will be in unison, including the police department.

Going off topic for a moment but cogent to town meeting secret ballots. Many times the wrong secret ballot is used 1, 2, or 3 and nothing is said about disqualifying those votes after the moderator insructions on which to use (self-evident). The excuse in the past is because old person used the wrong ballot. Really. I'm an old person and that insults me! What if it is ballot stuffing and using more than one ballot. Pass/fail decisions by a few votes have occurred in the past. Those votes should be negated.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by longislander

What if it is ballot stuffing and using more than one ballot.

That kind of thought belongs in a different forum.

Back to the Community Center and the Recreation Complex.

My main concern is how many bathrooms. And for how many genders.
Will there be a family rest room for baby changing diapers and such ?

[longislander]

My main concern is how many bathrooms. And for how many genders.
Will there be a family rest room for baby changing diapers and such ?

That kind of thought belongs in a different forum.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

That kind of thought belongs in a different forum.

Back to the Community Center and the Recreation Complex.

My main concern is how many bathrooms. And for how many genders.
Will there be a family rest room for baby changing diapers and such ?

The SB2 discussion belongs in a different thread, yet it's here.

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Originally Posted by ITD

The SB2 discussion belongs in a different thread, yet it's here.

SB2 discussion is here because if we had it, there wouldn’t have been the fiasco at the cancelled town meeting…..so it’s relevant in that respect.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

SB2 discussion is here because if we had it, there wouldn’t have been the fiasco at the cancelled town meeting…..so it’s relevant in that respect.

It's not at all relevant and your assessment is suspect, most likely dead wrong. I could bring up the current federal fiascos with inflation, debt and other maladies using your logic and I would be just as wrong as you.

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Originally Posted by ITD

It's not at all relevant and your assessment is suspect, most likely dead wrong. I could bring up the current federal fiascos with inflation, debt and other maladies using your logic and I would be just as wrong as you.

ITD, you misinterpreted my comment in my last post. Let me first say to you “Calm down….it’s not good for your health to get your toga in a knot!”
SB2 and the HUB are the most highly contested warrants on the docket at town meeting. Where SB2 comes into the discussion here is that it has been noted by many that if we had SB2 instead of town meeting, the recent fiasco would have been avoided. It’s not really that difficult to understand. EOM.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

ITD, you misinterpreted my comment in my last post. Let me first say to you “Calm down….it’s not good for your health to get your toga in a knot!”
SB2 and the HUB are the most highly contested warrants on the docket at town meeting. Where SB2 comes into the discussion here is that it has been noted by many that if we had SB2 instead of town meeting, the recent fiasco would have been avoided. It’s not really that difficult to understand. EOM.

Lol, I'm not uptight at all about this, but it seems the sb2 crowd feels it's perfectly logical to hijack a thread with their agenda, but it's knot (not, see what I did there?) Start your own thread rather than incorrectly stating that sb2 will solve all these problems. That is innately false, you can't know that, you are speculating. Regardless, it is a discussion for another thread. I'm not going to bother looking back, but I'm thinking that you are one of the individuals admonishing Less for his thread hijacking, this is worse.

Start another thread if you want to talk about SB 2, but leave this one to the merits or disadvantages of the HUB. Stop hijacking the thread, "it's not really that difficult to understand."

[longislander]

incorrectly stating that sb2 will solve all these problems. That is innately false, you can't know that, you are speculating.

SB2 comments and The Hub comments have a common course of a 60% vote requirement to pass at the same town meeting by the same legislative body!

What facts are false?
About a month to get "informed" before voting?
All warrant articles would be voted on the same ballot?
Articles can be amended?
No new warrant article subject matter can be eliminated, nor introduced?
Absentee ballots would include all warrant articles?
Voting would occurr on the second Tuesday of the month decided by the legislative body, not the select board?
Voting from 7:00 am to 7:00 pm?
Voting in a private setting (curtained voting booth) without anyone looking over your shoulder?
There would no longer be postponed town meetings because of available floor space?

leave this one to the merits or disadvantages of the HUB. Stop hijacking the thread,

How many "pages" are needed on this thread to determine The Hub has no merit? This last comment will probably give rise to another hijacked thread. Comprehend what ... mindless babbling ... or diapers ... how about restrooms!

[ITD]

Originally Posted by longislander

SB2 comments and The Hub comments have a common course of a 60% vote requirement to pass at the same town meeting by the same legislative body!

What facts are false?
About a month to get "informed" before voting?
All warrant articles would be voted on the same ballot?
Articles can be amended?
No new warrant article subject matter can be eliminated, nor introduced?
Absentee ballots would include all warrant articles?
Voting would occurr on the second Tuesday of the month decided by the legislative body, not the select board?
Voting from 7:00 am to 7:00 pm?
Voting in a private setting (curtained voting booth) without anyone looking over your shoulder?
There would no longer be postponed town meetings because of available floor space?



How many "pages" are needed on this thread to determine The Hub has no merit? This last comment will probably give rise to another hijacked thread. Comprehend what ... mindless babbling ... or diapers ... how about restrooms!

You posted why it's false in your quotation of me above, yet you continue. Stop it, start another thread about SB 2, leave this one alone. Unbelievable. You can certainly make up points like you did above, but they are your opinion, not facts. Stop misrepresenting them. Stop it.

[John Mercier]

SB2 meant that all the voters would not need to be in the location of the polling at the same time. So I think they are talking about the room not being large enough to hold the voters and the delayed vote due to that factor.

[tis]

Honestly I can't see anybody being against SB2 except the little town clicks that want everything that they approve of to pass having their own personal agenda. Most people don't want to take the time to go to town meeting so very few end up voting. SB2 takes very little time to run in during the day and vote.

[longislander]

ITD

You posted why it's false in your quotation of me above, yet you continue. Stop it, start another thread about SB 2, leave this one alone. Unbelievable. You can certainly make up points like you did above, but they are your opinion, not facts. Stop misrepresenting them. Stop it.

Thank you for continuing this thread.
You need to slow down and read. I did not state "why it's false" My post was an enumeration of facts, easily confirmed. Try researching the NH Municipal Association, the NH Dept. of Revenue Administration, SB2 town administrators, to name a few.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by tis

Honestly I can't see anybody being against SB2 except the little town clicks that want everything that they approve of to pass having their own personal agenda. Most people don't want to take the time to go to town meeting so very few end up voting. SB2 takes very little time to run in during the day and vote.

Exactly. The "perfect democracy" of Town Meeting is baloney. The largest effect of these meetings today is to impose a steep cost on voting, so that only those who have the most time and most at stake will vote. We erase a huge chunk of voters.

In this particular case, it's easy to see HUB supporters rallying every time--if they win, they get the huge reward of a subsidized pool. People who just think this is not the best thing for the town...maybe they show every time, maybe they just get tired of the hassle

[John Mercier]

We have been under SB2 for decades...
It doesn't stop what you are expecting.

The majority of town residents' attitude is what forms the basis of the town's future development.

Moultonborough is pushing a tourism/recreation town.

[Sue Doe-Nym]

In a communication with the Select Board Chair, we learned that there will be sufficient accommodations for seniors and especially those voters with mobility problems. There should not be a problem with drop offs, and spaces specifically designated for handicapped will require the necessary placard. No exceptions, we were told….so that the captain of the track team can’t come wheeling in and grab a prime parking spot! Lines should be shorter, and those needing special attention can be moved to the head of a line. Hopefully, this will answer some questions, and pass it along if so. We need lots of support, so show up and vote!

[tis]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

We have been under SB2 for decades...
It doesn't stop what you are expecting.

The majority of town residents' attitude is what forms the basis of the town's future development.

Moultonborough is pushing a tourism/recreation town.

Unfortunately most voters are not informed. They vote for something if it says recommended by the planning board or selectmen or whatever. I stood outside talking to voters years ago and was shocked at how little they knew about what they were voting for. Zoning amendments are particularly difficult unless you have studied before hand because for instance if they are recommending a change, it doesn't tell you what it is changing from. In this case, it has been publicly discusses enough so the voters know what they are voting for and therefore the big turnout.

[jbolty]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Exactly. The "perfect democracy" of Town Meeting is baloney. The largest effect of these meetings today is to impose a steep cost on voting, so that only those who have the most time and most at stake will vote. We erase a huge chunk of voters.

In this particular case, it's easy to see HUB supporters rallying every time--if they win, they get the huge reward of a subsidized pool. People who just think this is not the best thing for the town...maybe they show every time, maybe they just get tired of the hassle

This. People give up from exhaustion but the zealots have never ending energy and if it comes up enough times it will pass eventually.

[tis]

Please let us know how it goes today!

[winni83]

Just got to Town Meeting. Still room in the auditorium and was able to park on the school property. No chaos yet but it’s not supposed to start for an hour.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by tis

Honestly I can't see anybody being against SB2 except the little town clicks that want everything that they approve of to pass having their own personal agenda. Most people don't want to take the time to go to town meeting so very few end up voting. SB2 takes very little time to run in during the day and vote.

Yes, they are little, small, selfish, cliques. Although using the word click is understood.

Now back to the HUB status and the associated adjunct of SB2.

Who is paying for all of those mailings sent to homes in Moultonborough?

As learned in early 1970's: follow the money.

[longislander]

Who is paying for all of those mailings sent to homes in Moultonborough?

The Friends of the Moultonborough Community Center (FOTMCC)

https://quickstart.sos.nh.gov/online...inessID=714337

[Wishbone]

I did a quick search and found at least 8 companies in the business of running facilities like they are proposing for the Hub. If there is such a need for that type of facility, why aren't they working with the sponsors of this article, or fighting each other to build such a facility here?

[tummyman]

Moultonborough knows better than anyone else how to do things. Logic and rational thinking does not exist here. Only wants for the residents survive that get paid for by the majority of non-resident lakefront people that bankroll 70% of everything.