First Cyanobacteria Warnings of 2024 Issued for Lake Winnipesaukee

[sky's]

its good to see some mature people have accepted the facts. The fact that man with the big egos have been ruining this lake for years. now bring on the beautiful condos like the new mess next to Cumberland farms towards Weirs Beach omg. we recently ran out of Moultonboro after 24 years and now reside in nice peacful Sandwhich. Sandwhich is what Moultonboro use to be like 24 years ago. real New England People that trust and do business on a hand shake. the lake is just the tip of the ice burg folks sorry for the reality check. best wishes to all.

[LoveLakeLife]

Originally Posted by sky's

its good to see some mature people have accepted the facts. The fact that man with the big egos have been ruining this lake for years. now bring on the beautiful condos like the new mess next to Cumberland farms towards Weirs Beach omg. we recently ran out of Moultonboro after 24 years and now reside in nice peacful Sandwhich. Sandwhich is what Moultonboro use to be like 24 years ago. real New England People that trust and do business on a hand shake. the lake is just the tip of the ice burg folks sorry for the reality check. best wishes to all.

It’s sad that the rules of capitalization elude even some of the self-proclaimed mature people.

Thankfully, divergent opinions about any number of things don’t correlate with maturity level. The truly mature understand and “accept”this “fact.”


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[tis]

It's nice to see so many experts who know exactly what is causing this.

[winterh]

I am no expert on this matter but it seems to me like there are many causes that contribute to the problem. Some would be easier to solve than others. Old leaking septics and lush green lawns seem to be well within our power to fix. I am not proposing we adopt these methods but I see the crazy environmentalist stop oil types who throw paint on famous works of art or more recently on Stonehenge to protest. Makes me think a similar approach to some of the bigger greener lawns on the lake might work. It should be a source of shame to have a lush green lawn on the lake not something to be proud of.

[tis]

Originally Posted by winterh

I am no expert on this matter but it seems to me like there are many causes that contribute to the problem. Some would be easier to solve than others. Old leaking septics and lush green lawns seem to be well within our power to fix. I am not proposing we adopt these methods but I see the crazy environmentalist stop oil types who throw paint on famous works of art or more recently on Stonehenge to protest. Makes me think a similar approach to some of the bigger greener lawns on the lake might work. It should be a source of shame to have a lush green lawn on the lake not something to be proud of.

My lawn is green and I am proud of it and don't use fertilizer or sprinkle it. Yes, it usually gets brown in August but the rest of the time it looks pretty nice. It was originally an old cow field. How many places were cow fields in the old days?

[winterh]

I think there is a difference between having a naturally growing lawn thats a mix of grass, clovers, weeds... but looks nice when cut (I have one myself) and having a perfectly manicured lush green obviously fertilized lawn that looks like a golf course. It's pretty easy to tell who is using fertilizer and who is not.

[Susie Cougar]

Originally Posted by winterh

I think there is a difference between having a naturally growing lawn thats a mix of grass, clovers, weeds... but looks nice when cut (I have one myself) and having a perfectly manicured lush green obviously fertilized lawn that looks like a golf course. It's pretty easy to tell who is using fertilizer and who is not.

This is so true! I don’t use any fertilizer on my lawn and try to pull as many weeds by hand as possible. By having a mix in your lawn, you do not need to add fertilizer.

[John Mercier]

Slightly...

There are a lot more non-phosphorous fertilizer options for lawns... as nitrogen is really what the turf grass wants - that is what makes it green.
The clover mix adds the nitrogen... so it reduces the need for additional.

Blooms are the effect of phosphorous...
The situation with the lakefront lawn is really more a matter of how well it slows a downpour reducing the amount of anything being carried into the lake.

That, and they can attract geese that love the salad with the sight line to shrubbery being far enough back to provide some protection from predation.

The geese will add manure with phosphorous that can be washed in.

[Grant]

Another problem with lawns is that grass has very shallow root structures, and is a very poor filter for runoff. More runoff = more nutrient for blooms. Natural, native vegetation is far more effective in reducing runoff into the lake. It's not just fertilized lawns that help promote cyanobacteria blooms. Cyanobacteria occurs naturally -- almost everywhere. There's lots in the average shovelful of topsoil. And it's always in the lake. Not all varieties are toxic, but many are. But the combination of excess nutrients and warmer water causes these big blooms. More nutrients + More warm water = blooms of greater frequency, magnitude and duration.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by winterh

I think there is a difference between having a naturally growing lawn thats a mix of grass, clovers, weeds... but looks nice when cut (I have one myself) and having a perfectly manicured lush green obviously fertilized lawn that looks like a golf course. It's pretty easy to tell who is using fertilizer and who is not.

Absolutely! I have the same type of "lawn" at my island camp. It's green, never gets fertilized and the dog certainly does not seem to mind pooping and peeing on it!

I planted it 16 years ago by basically throwing out the cheapest grass seed Sam's Club sold, just threw it on the island sand that was washing in the lake every rain storm. Well if that seed didn't sprout like wildfire and in no time by just watering it. It's been holding everything together and has completely stopped the erosion that was occurring previously...again without a speck of fertilizer!

Dan

[tis]

It must be a wonderful clover year because it has taken over most of my lawn this year. I have been wondering why.

[Descant]

Grant makes good points about runoff. Fertilizer or not, grass still has runoff resulting in silt flowing into the lake too. Lowbush blueberry has a better root structure, Geese don't like it and it doesn't need to be mowed. Here's one source: https://turfinstaller.net/sod-turf-p...ry-native-sod/
And, I understand grass muffins and pies require a lot of chewing unless you're a goose.

[Grant]

Originally Posted by Descant

Grant makes good points about runoff. Fertilizer or not, grass still has runoff resulting in silt flowing into the lake too. Lowbush blueberry has a better root structure, Geese don't like it and it doesn't need to be mowed. Here's one source: https://turfinstaller.net/sod-turf-p...ry-native-sod/
And, I understand grass muffins and pies require a lot of chewing unless you're a goose.

I was gonna say, "Don't get me started on the geese," but now that you mention it...

Geese LOVE grass. Need some validation of this claim? Drive through Meredith on any given day and note where the geese are. On the grass. Although the damn things never showed up in any real numbers before, say, 2011 or 2012, we NEVER had them on the property -- with 200+ feet of shoreline. Why? It was all rocks and native shrubs. Nothing to eat here...nowhere to graze or spawn/raise our young, so move on.

Now consider this: ONE adult Canada goose craps out TWO POUNDS (minimum) of those nasty green tootsie roll logs per day. And they do it about every 12 minutes...just to spread the love. This stuff is PURE nutrient for cyanobacteria. Multiply those 2+ pounds by the (growing) number of geese on the lake, and you get the picture. They destroy lakes for a living...I've seen it first-hand in Pennsylvania over the years. So, while many folks thinks they're "adorable" and "majestic," they are truly a menace. If you see them on your property, shoo them away. They multiply like rats and rabbits and poop like it's their job.

And, for the record, they do NOT taste good.

[Grant]

The Lake Winnipesaukee Association, which posts regularly on the forum now, is a fantastic resource for learning about the things that impact water quality. They also publish the water quality and cyanobacteria map updates: https://www.winnipesaukee.org/winni-...obacteria-map/

Also --

• Learn about nutrients and their role in lake health: https://www.winnipesaukee.org/the-issues/nutrients/
  
• See how stormwater runoff accounts for 85-90% of the pollution in the lake: https://www.winnipesaukee.org/the-is...mwater-runoff/
  
• Want to know the impact of aging septic systems? - https://www.winnipesaukee.org/the-is...eptic-systems/
  
• Want to speak up on behalf of the lake? - https://www.winnipesaukee.org/take-action/

And check out the Winni Blue and LakeSmart programs!

[dickiej]

……or, you could rip out your lawn and put in rock gardens….lawns are a terrible waste and contribute to the pollution in the lake. They should be outlawed anywhere near the lake.

[SAB1]

If the Cyanobacteria only killed the geese…..

[Grant]

Originally Posted by SAB1

If the Cyanobacteria only killed the geese…..

Would that be akin to a semi-circular firing squad?

[tis]

Originally Posted by winterh

I think there is a difference between having a naturally growing lawn thats a mix of grass, clovers, weeds... but looks nice when cut (I have one myself) and having a perfectly manicured lush green obviously fertilized lawn that looks like a golf course. It's pretty easy to tell who is using fertilizer and who is not.

True except there is a fertilizer that is safe.

[imyourhuckleberry]

I am in the lawn care industry and am very familiar with the problem of fertilizers.
You don't have to use chemicals to have a nice lawn. You can use low nitrogen, zero phosphorus, slow release inputs and have a great lawn. So i wouldn't immediately assume anyone with a great lawn next to the lake is part of the problem. Though they're suspect.
Readily available sources of Nitrogen in the towns surrounding the lake seems like a big problem. I was in a local hardware store today and found all of the usual brands with synthetic nitrogen and phosphorus-heavy starter fertilizers readily available.

As long as there no ordinances in place to ban N and P apps in these towns, people will continue to over-apply these elements to their lawn and they will run off into the lake. This is, at least in part, a failure of local town government.

[John Mercier]

It is actually State law.
And we can't sell anything in NH that violates State law...

We just can't stop homeowners and professionals from violating the law.

[YOLO]

….. nevermind

[imyourhuckleberry]

Then we can't have nice things.

If people can't act responsibly then they cant have access to the stuff thats causing the issue.

I read the law and its pretty soft. Eg, there's exceptions for people "growing new lawns" which allows stores to stock high phosphorus fertilizers. Leaving it up to the discretion of homeowners never actually works.

Time to update that law huh?

[John Mercier]

10-10-10 is pretty common for a farm... but not really made for turf grass. Starter for Turf Grass is usually x-x-4, so a lot less phosphorous than what we would use for farming.

So not sure how they could update the law to make it more effective.

Slow release can help... in that the turf grass has more time to absorb it... but a soil sample before application would go a long way. Which should be what the professionals are doing; just guessing that they start most lawns.

[rodgcsa]

Do people really think Geese are a major cause of this?? Really think about it.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by rodgcsa

Do people really think Geese are a major cause of this?? Really think about it.

They are one of many!

[sunfishman]

The geese contribute to the problem. The question is why do people tolerate the mess from the geese. If the mess was from the dogs, would it be tolerated.
For some reason, people don't mind stepping in goose poo.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by sunfishman

The geese contribute to the problem. The question is why do people tolerate the mess from the geese. If the mess was from the dogs, would it be tolerated.
For some reason, people don't mind stepping in goose poo.

Dogs are pets, and their owner is responsible to pick up their mess. Geese are not pets so who is responsible to pick up their mess?
We tolerate it because we don't want to pick it up. Maybe you should volunteer.

[sunfishman]

The solution is not volunteers picking up after a never ending overpopulation of geese. They need to be 'thinned out'. Once they became a federally protected species their population exploded. Why do we have hunting seasons on everything else, but not the geese?

[SAB1]

Geese are migratory waterfowl birds and under control of the federal government. They are hunted.

[tis]

Originally Posted by sunfishman

The solution is not volunteers picking up after a never ending overpopulation of geese. They need to be 'thinned out'. Once they became a federally protected species their population exploded. Why do we have hunting seasons on everything else, but not the geese?

I agree. In Paugus Bay one group had 17 babies a week ago or so with another group across the bay. I can't imagine the s--- that was coming out of them.

[fatlazyless]

This June 21, 2024 New Hampshire news report from In Depth NH ..... Lake Winnipesaukee's Under Siege By Cyanobacteria ..... includes a link to the NH-DES to report any new cyanobacteria blooms in N.H. water bodies.

https://indepthnh.org/2024/06/21/lak...cyanobacteria/

It also has a link to this here thread.

Yesterday was the very first calendar day of the summer and hopefully all the cyanobacteria blooms reported in Tuftonboro, Wolfeboro, The Broads, Governor's Island, Meredith, and Center Harbor will dry up and disappear, quickly.

Time will tell what's happening with the green/blue cyanobacteria blooms? I was swimming in Meredith and the water seemed less clear than usual, and more difficult to see the rocky lake bottom. The water was obscured with less visibility but there was no green/blue growth on the water surface? With water temp at 68 and air temp a sunny humid 92-degrees, it was a happening swim in the lake.

Swimming the lake is different from swimming a pool, and wearing a swim flotation belt is a good suggestion for swimming the deep water with the waves, wind, and wakes.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by sunfishman

The solution is not volunteers picking up after a never ending overpopulation of geese. They need to be 'thinned out'. Once they became a federally protected species their population exploded. Why do we have hunting seasons on everything else, but not the geese?

I agree, but they are protected. Maybe we should deport them back to Canada.

[Lake Fan]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I agree, but they are protected. Maybe we should deport them back to Canada.

10 years ago or so, you didn't see geese on the lake. Now they are a scourge.

Maybe they've been protected enough?

[John Mercier]

They aren't protected from hunting.
You simply purchase a Duck Stamp.

We can't hunt with a shotgun in the areas that they congregate.
That is a landowner problem... not a policy problem.

[Lake Fan]

I never said they couldn't be hunted. Daily bag limit of 2 could be tripled and we'd still have too many of that invasive species. That, and we need more hunters.

[John Mercier]

You mean for Canadian Geese in the second session?
First session is five, and Snow is 25

Most of the watershed in our area is closed... and other restrictions exist.

The federal law is from 1918... so the law is not the problem.
It is the changes we make to the land that causes the problem.

No geese at Middleton Meredith until the town required the large greenspace in the back... now it is a hangout... but can't be hunted.

[Susie Cougar]

Originally Posted by rodgcsa

Do people really think Geese are a major cause of this?? Really think about it.

Four adult Canada geese produce as much phosphorus as a septic system!

[Rosemarie Rung]

The June onset of cyanobacteria blooms in NH lakes has been a wake-up call for many about the fragile health of lakes. The main culprit is warming water temperature that has been trending up for many years (see ice-out history). This will continue as climate change worsens, but there are things in our control that can be done. First, reduce phosphorus to lessen the role of warmer water temperature in triggering blooms. It's not just from fertilizer but septic systems that run off into the water (must be inspected to know for sure), stormwater runoff from impervious surfaces (go out when it's raining and see where water goes, it needs to soak in where it falls or close to it), animal waste (don't feed the ducks or let animal defecate near water), and erosion (don't create boat wakes in shallow water which pulls out aquatic plants needed to take up phosphorus and add oxygen to water. Deep wakes can disrupt phosphorus-rich sediment which add phosphorus to water). In addition to reducing phosphorus, add vegetation near the shoreline to prevent run-off and take up phosphorus, maintain trees and bushes at shoreline to shade and cool the water, don't disrupt aquatic plants, have septic systems evaluated. A study done in 2014 for areas of LW identifies needed action: https://winnipesaukeegateway.org/lak.../introduction/
Finally, become educated and educate others on what a bloom looks like. You cannot rely on DES to stay up to date as not all blooms are reported and tested and they drift. Don't go into water during or just after a bloom as toxins take time to degrade. The cyanotoxin, BMAA is linked to ALS, even breathing droplets from a distance away, so the threat is not just water contact. See this presentation for more on that research: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfDtMqnBjvk&t=1452s The folks at DES are great, but they are short-staffed and underfunded. NH LAKES is a great resource, too, on proactive measures.

[barefootbay]

Originally Posted by rodgcsa

Do people really think Geese are a major cause of this?? Really think about it.

Contributing cause. Their numbers have dramatically increased !

[tis]

At least all warnings have been removed.

[chasedawg]

I find it interesting all the causes of the bloom that have been reported. I agree with them all. Even the NH State fish Harvesting that has been going on for decades. But for us from what we have experienced over the last several years is the change in water temperature with all the other causes.

For example, this recent bloom. When the bloom was first reported in 19 mile bay the water temp was 80. Out beyond in inside our break wall the temp was 74 degrees. During the Dome Heat Wave our temp increased by 4 degrees. Then the rains came and the temp dropped back to 74 degrees off our beach on Chases Island. Today I cruised 19 mile bay area and the water temp is 78 degrees and now the bloom alert has been lifted.

We have not seen any evidence of the Cyanobacteria yet this year. Last year when the water temp reached 82 we could look down in the water column and could see yellow specks in the water. Then after a few days of rain and it was all gone not to be seen again.

Then this year and many several years before hand the broads use to freeze over and i remember even a few years ago fishing derby's were called off due to poor ice conditions. It really didn't freeze over like in past years. Forty year and even twenty years ago we use to drive out to Chases Island in our truck with windows down and wearing PFD's and seat belts undone. It was my wife's truck and she was driving. At that time the ice would easily be 36" to 40". Those days are long gone.

What could make that much difference? Someone said the weather is changing.... Really.... ?

[Lake Fan]

Okay, everybody can get back into the pool.

[chasedawg]

I find it interesting all the causes of the bloom that have been reported. I agree with them all. Even the NH State fish Harvesting that has been going on for decades. But for us from what we have experienced over the last several years is the change in water temperature with all the other causes.

For example, this recent bloom. When the bloom was first reported in 19 mile bay the water temp was 80. Out beyond in inside our break wall the temp was 74 degrees. During the Dome Heat Wave our temp increased by 4 degrees. Then the rains came and the temp dropped back to 74 degrees off our beach on Chases Island. Today I cruised 19 mile bay area and the water temp is 78 degrees and now the bloom alert has been lifted.

We have not seen any evidence of the Cyanobacteria yet this year. Last year when the water temp reached 82 we could look down in the water column and could see yellow specks in the water. Then after a few days of rain and it was all gone not to be seen again.

Then this year and many several years before hand the broads use to freeze over and i remember even a few years ago fishing derby's were called off due to poor ice conditions. It really didn't freeze over like in past years. Forty year and even twenty years ago we use to drive out to Chases Island in our truck with windows down and wearing PFD's and seat belts undone. It was my wife's truck and she was driving. At that time the ice would easily be 36" to 40". Those days are long gone.

What could make that much difference in 40 years? Prety strong evidence that our weather has changed significantly causing issues we have never seen before.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by chasedawg

I find it interesting all the causes of the bloom that have been reported. I agree with them all. Even the NH State fish Harvesting that has been going on for decades. But for us from what we have experienced over the last several years is the change in water temperature with all the other causes.

For example, this recent bloom. When the bloom was first reported in 19 mile bay the water temp was 80. Out beyond in inside our break wall the temp was 74 degrees. During the Dome Heat Wave our temp increased by 4 degrees. Then the rains came and the temp dropped back to 74 degrees off our beach on Chases Island. Today I cruised 19 mile bay area and the water temp is 78 degrees and now the bloom alert has been lifted.

We have not seen any evidence of the Cyanobacteria yet this year. Last year when the water temp reached 82 we could look down in the water column and could see yellow specks in the water. Then after a few days of rain and it was all gone not to be seen again.

Then this year and many several years before hand the broads use to freeze over and i remember even a few years ago fishing derby's were called off due to poor ice conditions. It really didn't freeze over like in past years. Forty year and even twenty years ago we use to drive out to Chases Island in our truck with windows down and wearing PFD's and seat belts undone. It was my wife's truck and she was driving. At that time the ice would easily be 36" to 40". Those days are long gone.

What could make that much difference in 40 years? Prety strong evidence that our weather has changed significantly causing issues we have never seen before.

I've been coming to the lakes region for over 50 years. I've seen, first-hand, the temperature warming, not just here but all of New England. When I first started coming up snowmobiling, the lakes were always frozen and the snowstorms were light and fluffy powder. Now the storms are heavy wet snow and the lakes freeze later and thaw earlier. That is a fact, we can argue the causes forever, but it has happened!

[SAB1]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I've been coming to the lakes region for over 50 years. I've seen, first-hand, the temperature warming, not just here but all of New England. When I first started coming up snowmobiling, the lakes were always frozen and the snowstorms were light and fluffy powder. Now the storms are heavy wet snow and the lakes freeze later and thaw earlier. That is a fact, we can argue the causes forever, but it has happened!

Snowmobiling - what’s that lol!

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by imyourhuckleberry

Then we can't have nice things.

If people can't act responsibly then they cant have access to the stuff thats causing the issue.

I read the law and its pretty soft. Eg, there's exceptions for people "growing new lawns" which allows stores to stock high phosphorus fertilizers. Leaving it up to the discretion of homeowners never actually works.

Time to update that law huh?

Since your in the business, you can probably confirm this but I heard that "guano" (Bat / seabird poop) is an excellent phosphorous free (or much lower in phosphorous) fertilizer that is completely safe to use around waterways and also works excellent. If so why isn't more of this being used??...is it a cost related issue??

Thanks!

Dan

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by tis

It's nice to see so many experts who know exactly what is causing this.

We spend more money on studies than we do on remediation. Then, when we finally decide to do something, the price has gone up so much that we can't get the funding.

[Lakegeezer]

Originally Posted by Biggd

We spend more money on studies than we do on remediation. Then, when we finally decide to do something, the price has gone up so much that we can't get the funding.

This might be true in some cases but there are recent examples where the process worked. For example, in the M'boro Bay sub-watershed, about $40K was spent on the study - which identified the problem spots and over 40 projects that would reduce phosphorus level. Over the past eight years, the town DPW has used that plan to get grants and work through the project list. In another case, about $70K was spent studying the cyano problem in Kanasatka which resulted in over $500,000K spent on remediation. The common thread here is the Lake Winnipesaukee Association. They are good at making plans and even better at using the plans to obtain grants for projects. No plan, no grant - so money needs to be spent on studies. The trick is rapid follow-up.