Housing Market Slowdown

[thinkxingu]

Lots of articles this last week about a slowdown in the housing market. Many identify "500k more sellers than buyers" and that "the real estate market is finally starting to listen."

I've gotta think that second home locations would show trends like this before primary home areas—anyone seeing a slowdown in the Lakes Region?

I know that here at Arcadia, properties are still selling without hitting the market, but that might be a reflection of the cost-of-entry becoming a better value with high interest rates and prices.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

but that might be a reflection of the cost-of-entry becoming a better value with high interest rates and prices.

Can you explain? Not sure i understand that statement.

In any case, i agree some properties are spending more time on the market. Seems like only the most “perfect”properties are still moving quickly.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by BillTex

Can you explain? Not sure i understand that statement.

In any case, i agree some properties are spending more time on the market. Seems like only the most “perfect”properties are still moving quickly.

The cost-of-entry at Arcadia is ~$200k these days. That includes a private beach, private boat ramp, rentable boat poles, docks (separate ownership), tennis/pickleball courts, laundry and shower facilities, a rec. hall with patio overlooking the lake and performer stage, playground, sports field and boat storage, etc. etc.

As the prices for lake properties have skyrocketed, Arcadia has become a better and better value. That I know, the lowest selling price for a home on Hanson Cove this last couple years is just under $1M, almost five times higher.

Though it's certainly not for everyone—seasonal, an association, etc.—it's a bargain for lake access in a gated community.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Lots of articles this last week about a slowdown in the housing market. Many identify "500k more sellers than buyers" and that "the real estate market is finally starting to listen."

I've gotta think that second home locations would show trends like this before primary home areas—anyone seeing a slowdown in the Lakes Region?

I know that here at Arcadia, properties are still selling without hitting the market, but that might be a reflection of the cost-of-entry becoming a better value with high interest rates and prices.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

It was bound to happen sooner or later. I know a guy who put his home on the market a few weeks ago, an entry level lake access home. A year ago, that home would have had multiple offers, now it sits on the market for who knows how long.
The second home market is usually the first to slow down.
Other parts of the country are already in a decline, New England overall has held up better than most.
In my hometown of Waltham Ma. a 1000 sq ft entry level home on a slab in need of remodeling listed for 650K, had multiple offers over list at an open house last week.

[FlyingScot]

Arcadia sounds great!

On lake properties in general, I do not think values will fall significantly, for two reasons. First--waterfront, like other super premium land, has skyrocketed away from the rest of the market, and everybody knows the supply is finite, it has become a distinct market without connection to normal buying and selling. Second, almost all of the recent waterfront transactions have gone to people who are rich, not stretching to afford it (no one stretches to afford a $2MM second home). So financially, it's just one piece of their overall portfolio.

But of course, I do not have a crystal ball...

[TomC]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Arcadia sounds great!

On lake properties in general, I do not think values will fall significantly, for two reasons. First--waterfront, like other super premium land, has skyrocketed away from the rest of the market, and everybody knows the supply is finite, it has become a distinct market without connection to normal buying and selling. Second, almost all of the recent waterfront transactions have gone to people who are rich, not stretching to afford it (no one stretches to afford a $2MM second home). So financially, it's just one piece of their overall portfolio.

But of course, I do not have a crystal ball...

An outsider coming here and reading 50+ post threads on the low lake level, water quality/cyanobacteria, loud music from wake boats, ever increasing ad volarem-based property taxes, etc., may very well think twice about dropping multimillions on lakefront property...

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by TomC

An outsider coming here and reading 50+ post threads on the low lake level, water quality/cyanobacteria, loud music from wake boats, ever increasing ad volarem-based property taxes, etc., may very well think twice about dropping multimillions on lakefront property...

I think that's part of it, sure, but I also think a lot of today's younger generation no longer wants the "baggage" of extras in their life, nor can they afford them.

So, even though there's "only so much waterfront to go around," as Flying mentions above, if there's less demand from younger generations, it's a simple formula.
Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

[TomC]

I think you are on to something: my children are in their late 20's... before I sold my lakefront house in Raoul Cove I offered it to them... they declined!

[TheTimeTraveler]

Originally Posted by TomC

I think you are on to something: my children are in their late 20's... before I sold my lakefront house in Raoul Cove I offered it to them... they declined!

They're waiting for the cash instead!

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

The cost-of-entry at Arcadia is ~$200k these days. That includes a private beach, private boat ramp, rentable boat poles, docks (separate ownership), tennis/pickleball courts, laundry and shower facilities, a rec. hall with patio overlooking the lake and performer stage, playground, sports field and boat storage, etc. etc.

As the prices for lake properties have skyrocketed, Arcadia has become a better and better value. That I know, the lowest selling price for a home on Hanson Cove this last couple years is just under $1M, almost five times higher.

Though it's certainly not for everyone—seasonal, an association, etc.—it's a bargain for lake access in a gated community.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

I am sorry…what is Arcadia?
Trailers?
Condos?
HOA?

Thank you,
Bill

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

I think that's part of it, sure, but I also think a lot of today's younger generation no longer wants the "baggage" of extras in their life, nor can they afford them.

So, even though there's "only so much waterfront to go around," as Flying mentions above, if there's less demand from younger generations, it's a simply formula.
Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

This.
Many of the younger generations have ruled out ever owning a primary home, never mind second home. So they just move on to other things in life, like travel. They are more about “experience” than they are “baggage”.

That is ok-i understand. But I wonder how that will shake out as they age.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by BillTex

I am sorry…what is Arcadia?
Trailers?
Condos?
HOA?

Thank you,
Bill

Arcadia Campground Association is a former campground-turned-condo Campground where the residents own the sites with, mostly, park model trailers and stick-built porches and decks, patios, etc.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

[kjbathe]

Originally Posted by TomC

An outsider coming here and reading 50+ post threads on the low lake level, water quality/cyanobacteria, loud music from wake boats, ever increasing ad volarem-based property taxes, etc., may very well think twice about dropping multimillions on lakefront property...

The internet version of the lake always seems to be more negative than the in person. No one posts about clean water, beautiful sunsets or the 50 people that shared a friendly wave. Captain Bonehead, however, gets lots of traction. 🙂

[winterh]

Inventory is up in my seacoast town. Past few years there were never more than 3 or 4 listings available at any given time. 16 today. Lots of homes selling though so it's just more supply but still good demand. Waterfront here in lakes region still seems to have very limited inventory. Articles about home sales can be misleading as nationwide stats don't always apply to our local areas. (at least right now they don't)

[BillTex]

Since this is a broad real estate thread, i will throw this out for comments. If not appropriate to the OP please let me know.

I’ll note that DW and I were both licensed real estate agents years back, so we know a little bit about real estate.

Friend of ours looking to relocate to northeast from Chicago. Has a “private showing” yesterday.
Customer offers $50k > listing. (You think she’d be dancing…)
Our friend’s agent suggests she counters by asking for $10k more!?

I say that is crazy! Take the offer and be happy. I think she risks losing the sale for a lousy $10k. She was already offered $50k over list.

I dont know the Chicago market, i dont know if there are any contingencies.

I think her agent is:
* trying to cover up a poor original listing price
* greedy

In any case, I have never heard of a seller counter offering an over list price offer by asking for more!?

What say you?

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by BillTex

Since this is a broad real estate thread, i will throw this out for comments. If not appropriate to the OP please let me know.

I’ll note that DW and I were both licensed real estate agents years back, so we know a little bit about real estate.

Friend of ours looking to relocate to northeast from Chicago. Has a “private showing” yesterday.
Customer offers $50k > listing. (You think she’d be dancing…)
Our friend’s agent suggests she counters by asking for $10k more!?

I say that is crazy! Take the offer and be happy. I think she risks losing the sale for a lousy $10k. She was already offered $50k over list.

I dont know the Chicago market, i dont know if there are any contingencies.

I think her agent is:
* trying to cover up a poor original listing price
* greedy

In any case, I have never heard of a seller counter offering an over list price offer by asking for more!?

What say you?

It seems like we are missing some of the story here. Unless there is a competitive process going on, on unless the house is not yet on the market and they are expecting a competitive process, this does not make sense from either direction:

Why list for less than you'd accept?

Why offer more than asking price?

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by TomC

An outsider coming here and reading 50+ post threads on the low lake level, water quality/cyanobacteria, loud music from wake boats, ever increasing ad volarem-based property taxes, etc., may very well think twice about dropping multimillions on lakefront property...

Except the Forum this year is no more negative than in the past, so these things should not drive prices down.

Of course, the other way to look at this is to turn the question on its head. I cannot remember of you own waterfront property. If yes, would you sell it today for what's listed on Zillow, or your own estimate of market value, or even 20% above that?

[TomC]

I sold my Winnipesaukee properties and built on acreage with waterfront on a smaller lake. when you are selling/buying at the same time, equivalent market forces operate on both ends of the transaction, so the anxiety/timing on the best time to pull the trigger is lessened.

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

It seems like we are missing some of the story here. Unless there is a competitive process going on, on unless the house is not yet on the market and they are expecting a competitive process, this does not make sense from either direction:

Why list for less than you'd accept?

Why offer more than asking price?

No idea why the agent is pushing them to list at less than they accepted. That is the crazy part and i would think puts the agent’s license at risk (as well as this sale). Countering an over asking price by asking for more is bewildering. I would not be surprised if the offer blows up because of this response.

Offers over asking has been the norm since rona and during the last real estate bubble (early 2000’s) in many, many markets. Nothing unusual about that.

[SAB1]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

I think that's part of it, sure, but I also think a lot of today's younger generation no longer wants the "baggage" of extras in their life, nor can they afford them.

So, even though there's "only so much waterfront to go around," as Flying mentions above, if there's less demand from younger generations, it's a simply formula.
Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

This is very true. Can be seen in more than housing purchases as well.

[Mr. V]

Continued high interest rates have a chilling effect, as I suspect does the "aging out" of the boomers who now own most of the lake front properties.

There simply are not as many younger folk with the resources to buy as there are boomer sellers, and this will likely worsen over time.

It's a numbers game.

[Descant]

Whether it be $10K or $50K, we would have a better persdpective if we kew the asking price ranfe. I doubt the RE Agent was being greedy--his/her share of the $10K would only be a few hundred in most cases. Special conditions would justify the $10K ask, such as-- furnshed? Occupancy wutrhin 20 days, etc.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by SAB1

This is very true. Can be seen in more than housing purchases as well.

Very hard to get quiet on the lake(s) now, and much less of a focus on hunting and fishing for those that are.

Smaller lakes and ponds are offering a better outlet.

[Juiced06GTO]

It seems like listings on Winni are lasting longer and price cuts are happening. They are still almost double what they were 5 years ago, but at least some are moving down. Most of the island places I have been watching have had some fairly significant reductions (25-50K) over the last month, but 650-750K for an island property while still needing to purchase a slip is still not that appealing unfortunately.

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by Descant

Whether it be $10K or $50K, we would have a better persdpective if we kew the asking price ranfe. I doubt the RE Agent was being greedy--his/her share of the $10K would only be a few hundred in most cases. Special conditions would justify the $10K ask, such as-- furnshed? Occupancy wutrhin 20 days, etc.

List price = $450k (small house, suburb of Chicago).
Ever.
It is the only offer they have to date.

At $50k over asking, you either accept the offer or not. But to counter by asking more? Crazy.

Anyone else ever counter offer an over asking bid by looking for more $?
I thinks its the best way to lose the sale.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Juiced06GTO

It seems like listings on Winni are lasting longer and price cuts are happening. They are still almost double what they were 5 years ago, but at least some are moving down. Most of the island places I have been watching have had some fairly significant reductions (25-50K) over the last month, but 650-750K for an island property while still needing to purchase a slip is still not that appealing unfortunately.

I watch the island market very closely and often hear of things coming before they are listed (I cast a wide net!). The inventory in general has been low this season. Rattlesnake listings haven’t been moving at all. It seems many of the listings are still priced for the Covid market and will sit.

[jbolty]

Originally Posted by BillTex

This.
Many of the younger generations have ruled out ever owning a primary home, never mind second home. So they just move on to other things in life, like travel. They are more about “experience” than they are “baggage”.

That is ok-i understand. But I wonder how that will shake out as they age.

My friends kids are doing this now. Two of them sold a house and are spending every available minute traveling. Good for them but mid 30s is time to be planning for the future, even if it's not the main focus. Time will tell.

Meantime, I think buyers are sitting on their hands waiting to see if there is a rate cut eventually.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by jbolty

My friends kids are doing this now. Two of them sold a house and are spending every available minute traveling. Good for them but mid 30s is time to be planning for the future, even if it's not the main focus. Time will tell.

Meantime, I think buyers are sitting on their hands waiting to see if there is a rate cut eventually.

That's the time to do it, before babies come along, still plenty of time to settle down and save. Although it gets tougher to save when you have a family.
I was always thinking about retirement from the time I started working full time at 19, now 71, I'm glad I did.

[Descant]

I agree that prices are inflated. I expect more of a leveling off rather than significant drops. I do see a lot of price drops in areas where folks bought rental/investment properties and now want to sell. In the long term a 7% mortgage isn't so bad, and there are a bunch of low down payment programs. I recall the edarly 80's when mortgages were 18% and word was that you'd never see single digits again. Whether you live-in or are a landlord, deducting expenses and leverage in real estate are a strong favorable argument to have RE as part of a diversified portfolio.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Descant

I agree that prices are inflated. I expect more of a leveling off rather than significant drops. I do see a lot of price drops in areas where folks bought rental/investment properties and now want to sell. In the long term a 7% mortgage isn't so bad, and there are a bunch of low down payment programs. I recall the edarly 80's when mortgages were 18% and word was that you'd never see single digits again. Whether you live-in or are a landlord, deducting expenses and leverage in real estate are a strong favorable argument to have RE as part of a diversified portfolio.

I see a lot of properties listed as contingent, curious to what those contingencies could be.
I'm wondering if some are waiting for mortgage appraisals that might not qualify for a mortgage unless the buyers come up with more of a down payment?
I've seen a few marked contingent, only to go back on the market weeks later.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I see a lot of properties listed as contingent, curious to what those contingencies could be.
I'm wondering if some are waiting for mortgage appraisals that might not qualify for a mortgage unless the buyers come up with more of a down payment?
I've seen a few marked contingent, only to go back on the market weeks later.

Most are probably in the mortgage process, but it can also be done on a cash deal if it is subject to inspections (or any other hurdle built into the deal to overcome). Home sale contingencies (waiting to close on the new purchase until your present property sells) used to be a common thing, but when covid hit, they seemed to fall out of grace. Things were selling so fast that there was no need to wait. You will probably see those making a comeback as the market slows.

[LIforrelaxin]

Covid really messed up the housing Market, especially for second home properties, in remote areas..... Because there was an exodus of people trying to get out of the cities, and into more desirable full time locations where they could have fun, prices on lake properties sky rocketed. People where getting top dollar, now some of the "new" owners, want back out of what they bought into... The problem is they can't get out, unless they get top dollar. Hence properties are sitting on the Market longer, until someone comes along that has the money to waste..... Its a vicious cycle.....

Add on that the problems that are being seen on Winnipesaukee, indicating that the lake health is declining.....Honestly if I was going to invest knowing what I know about the lake, I would be looking else where.... if someone asked me about buying on the Lake, I would also advise them to be cautious...... I have a friend who's parents just decided to sell, and I am waiting to see how it goes for them.... As many have they built a home that would house all the kids and Grandkids..... of course they where never all up there... and now that the Grandkids are in college and no longer have time for Grandma and Grandpas lake house it isn't getting used.....

[MeredithMan]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

Covid really messed up the housing Market, especially for second home properties, in remote areas..... Because there was an exodus of people trying to get out of the cities, and into more desirable full time locations where they could have fun, prices on lake properties sky rocketed. People where getting top dollar, now some of the "new" owners, want back out of what they bought into... The problem is they can't get out, unless they get top dollar. Hence properties are sitting on the Market longer, until someone comes along that has the money to waste..... Its a vicious cycle.....

Add on that the problems that are being seen on Winnipesaukee, indicating that the lake health is declining.....Honestly if I was going to invest knowing what I know about the lake, I would be looking else where.... if someone asked me about buying on the Lake, I would also advise them to be cautious...... I have a friend who's parents just decided to sell, and I am waiting to see how it goes for them.... As many have they built a home that would house all the kids and Grandkids..... of course they where never all up there... and now that the Grandkids are in college and no longer have time for Grandma and Grandpas lake house it isn't getting used.....

I think your first paragraph about RE prices spiking due to the 'Vid is spot on. It was a feeding frenzy 5 yrs ago, with many stories of folks selling everything to move to the lake and pay cash for waterfront properties because, "now we can work from anywhere". And waterfront properties are definitely sitting longer and people are loathe to lower the price for the reasons you pointed out. There's a waterfront rental near me that has been a rental forever...big groups every week for years. The place is old and tired, yet it was listed for over $3M and has been on the market for months.

On the other end of the spectrum, however, is another waterfront near me...very large high-end house...never a rental. That sold for $6M relatively quickly at the end of last year and then the buyers had workers in there for 6 months or so. I assume they gutted it head to toe, as there was a huge roll-off dumpster in the driveway all that time that was regularly filled and emptied.

A friend who is a RE agent who only sells waterfront described the current market as "unpredictable".

[John Mercier]

Certain locations on the lake are better than others.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

Continued high interest rates have a chilling effect, as I suspect does the "aging out" of the boomers who now own most of the lake front properties.

There simply are not as many younger folk with the resources to buy as there are boomer sellers, and this will likely worsen over time.

It's a numbers game.

Definitely a numbers game.

Washington is pressuring "The Fed" to lower interest rates; when that happens, the dam will break.

BTW: I have an opportunity to buy into a Florida house with an assumable 3.5% interest rate. I'm considering it.

[jeffk]

It's a complex game.

Interest rates are still a bit high. The best rates require a high credit score.

Since prices are still up, down payments are higher, requiring more cash on hand.

The interested buyers already grabbed theirs during the last few years and the pool of buyers may be reduced. This is a normal cycle.

Since many people put their houses on the market as prices rose, there may be less people willing to sell for a while. This reduces choice; again a normal cycle.

The change in federal government has put many people in doom & gloom mode and there is certainly enough change going on to make people cautious about a large purchase.

Plus a lot of the issues already mentioned.

Each potential seller and buyer has their own reasons for acting or not acting.

Fun to talk about and speculate, almost impossible to conclude anything.

[Biggd]

Real estate is always a tug of war between supply and demand. It's beginning to balance out, supply slowly increasing and demand slowly decreasing.
I think the stock market rising has made wealthy people wealthier, so the high-end properties are still moving. It's much easier to take some profits when the market is sky high.
Being 71 gives me a different perspective, rates don't look that high to me.

[TheTimeTraveler]

Originally Posted by ApS

Definitely a numbers game.

Washington is pressuring "The Fed" to lower interest rates; when that happens, the dam will break.

BTW: I have an opportunity to buy into a Florida house with an assumable 3.5% interest rate. I'm considering it.

Interesting that you found a very rare assumable loan. Is that a VA loan?

For the younger Forum readers, most every home loan written was assumable up until the late 1960's or early 1970's. It was then that the lenders woke up and realized that they could make a lot more money by writing a higher priced fresh loan (charging "points" and closing costs). Assumable loans all but disappeared.

Profits always seem to rule the day.......

[tis]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Real estate is always a tug of war between supply and demand. It's beginning to balance out, supply slowly increasing and demand slowly decreasing.
I think the stock market rising has made wealthy people wealthier, so the high-end properties are still moving. It's much easier to take some profits when the market is sky high.
Being 71 gives me a different perspective, rates don't look that high to me.

I agree with you. Rates used to be much higher. In the late 80s we had a business loan at 21% I have no idea how we managed it, looking back.

[Garcia]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Real estate is always a tug of war between supply and demand. It's beginning to balance out, supply slowly increasing and demand slowly decreasing.
I think the stock market rising has made wealthy people wealthier, so the high-end properties are still moving. It's much easier to take some profits when the market is sky high.
Being 71 gives me a different perspective, rates don't look that high to me.

This is key - the wealth gap continues to grow which has a huge impact on waterfront/second home purchases. Prices are never going to be affordable for "regular" (create your own definition!) people like was the case 30 years ago. The divide will grow. Those who own waterfront property may get priced out due to taxes/upkeep but there will continue to be buyers that will cause prices to steadily rise over time.

[winterh]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Certain locations on the lake are better than others.

This has a lot to do with homes you see sitting on the market. Especially at the higher price points buyers can have it all and there is more to it than a nice house

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by tis

I agree with you. Rates used to be much higher. In the late 80s we had a business loan at 21% I have no idea how we managed it, looking back.

I got burnt one time back in the 80's and it taught me a very valuable lesson, never follow the crowd, you don't want to be late to the party.
Experience tells me this party is, to use an old man expression, "long in the tooth".

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by ApS

Definitely a numbers game.

Washington is pressuring "The Fed" to lower interest rates; when that happens, the dam will break.

BTW: I have an opportunity to buy into a Florida house with an assumable 3.5% interest rate. I'm considering it.

Florida real estate is a mess right now with condo re-assessments and homeowners insurance availability,
Just sayin’…

[BillTex]

Originally Posted by ApS

Definitely a numbers game.

Washington is pressuring "The Fed" to lower interest rates; when that happens, the dam will break.

BTW: I have an opportunity to buy into a Florida house with an assumable 3.5% interest rate. I'm considering it.

Sorry-double post…I am on a plane right now to…Florida!
WiFi is kind of wonky.

[Couple of Lakers]

We would like to chime in here as a couple that has had their Winnipesaukee lakefront condo on the market now for a little over 2 months. Yes we think the market is definitely soft and yes prices are coming down. We have now lowered the price of our place 110K. 50K, then another 50K, and now just another 10K. Granted our original listing price could be considered high but you have to start somewhere. Obviously we want as much as we can get and of course buyers want to pay as little as possible. We think everyone gets that. Based on what our place has to offer, 2 years ago we probably would have gotten our original asking price. Today that's not the case.

Although we have had interest, we have yet to have anyone make an offer. We suspect buyers are sitting on the sidelines taking a wait and see approach. Especially for 2nd vacation homes. We thought we were priced aggressively especially compared to anything else in our price range with similar amenities. Even more so after the first 50K price reduction. We thought someone wouldn't be able to pass this up. Wrong. Next 50K reduction more interest but still nothing. Now we're another 10K down and waiting to see what happens. We know someone will eventually come along and be able to see the value in what we're offering. But who knows how long it will take.

There's something to our disadvantage as an HOA waterfront property that most wouldn't realize when exploring valuations. The boat slip is not figured into the value of the property, neither is the jet ski lift. This, in our opinion, is huge. It makes us seem overpriced. To buy an equivalent slip would be around 200K today not to mention the added bonus of a jet ski lift. Although you have these dedicated spots they are not figured into your tax bill which is a huge bonus. They are part of the associations property and actually not individually "owned".

The lake level at this time is also a problem. Our place has a deck that sits right over the water and we can usually dock our kayaks there. But not now. With the water being down about 2ft it is now a sandbar. No rain we believe has had an impact at least with waterfront sales.

So there you have it from our personal experience thus far. Yes, there is a slowdown. And also according to our realtors, few places have been gone under contract over the last few months.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by winterh

This has a lot to do with homes you see sitting on the market. Especially at the higher price points buyers can have it all and there is more to it than a nice house

They rebuild the houses.

Building and renovation hasn't slowed a bit.

But they can't change the location. And unlike a few years ago where they bought anything and if a better location opened they would trade up; they now know that even if that location opens up... selling the current one that you bought in a rush for fear of losing out may sit on the market for a long time.

[WinnisquamZ]

Originally Posted by BillTex

Florida real estate is a mess right now with condo re-assessments and homeowners insurance availability,

Just sayin’…

Yes, most costal properties and housing are feeling the pressure of intelligent buyers who no longer will pay for garbage just to be near the water.


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[WinnisquamZ]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

We would like to chime in here as a couple that has had their Winnipesaukee lakefront condo on the market now for a little over 2 months. Yes we think the market is definitely soft and yes prices are coming down. We have now lowered the price of our place 110K. 50K, then another 50K, and now just another 10K. Granted our original listing price could be considered high but you have to start somewhere. Obviously we want as much as we can get and of course buyers want to pay as little as possible. We think everyone gets that. Based on what our place has to offer, 2 years ago we probably would have gotten our original asking price. Today that's not the case.

Although we have had interest, we have yet to have anyone make an offer. We suspect buyers are sitting on the sidelines taking a wait and see approach. Especially for 2nd vacation homes. We thought we were priced aggressively especially compared to anything else in our price range with similar amenities. Even more so after the first 50K price reduction. We thought someone wouldn't be able to pass this up. Wrong. Next 50K reduction more interest but still nothing. Now we're another 10K down and waiting to see what happens. We know someone will eventually come along and be able to see the value in what we're offering. But who knows how long it will take.

There's something to our disadvantage as an HOA waterfront property that most wouldn't realize when exploring valuations. The boat slip is not figured into the value of the property, neither is the jet ski lift. This, in our opinion, is huge. It makes us seem overpriced. To buy an equivalent slip would be around 200K today not to mention the added bonus of a jet ski lift. Although you have these dedicated spots they are not figured into your tax bill which is a huge bonus. They are part of the associations property and actually not individually "owned".

The lake level at this time is also a problem. Our place has a deck that sits right over the water and we can usually dock our kayaks there. But not now. With the water being down about 2ft it is now a sandbar. No rain we believe has had an impact at least with waterfront sales.

So there you have it from our personal experience thus far. Yes, there is a slowdown. And also according to our realtors, few places have been gone under contract over the last few months.

You’re doing what many say “chasing your tail”. Determine your bottom line price to sell and lower it. Markets not getting any better soon and with winter approaching you will be holding it.


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

You’re doing what many say “chasing your tail”. Determine your bottom line price to sell and lower it. Markets not getting any better soon and with winter approaching you will be holding it.

Thank you for your reply. Yes you are probably correct. We're pretty much at the bottom and have resigned to the fact we may have to be here for another year or more. No big deal.

Winnipesaukee is still very enjoyable. We do love our place just looking for new adventures in the latter part of life after having been here for 26 years.

Everything that we're looking at is folks chasing their tails too. We're certainly not desperate and definitely have the best deal on the lake for what it is by far.

If buyers don't exist unless you're giving something away then that's the way it is.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

Thank you for your reply. Yes you are probably correct. We're pretty much at the bottom and have resigned to the fact we may have to be here for another year or more. No big deal.

Winnipesaukee is still very enjoyable. We do love our place just looking for new adventures in the latter part of life after having been here for 26 years.

Everything that we're looking at is folks chasing their tails too. We're certainly not desperate and definitely have the best deal on the lake for what it is by far.

If buyers don't exist unless you're giving something away then that's the way it is.

It's good that you're not desperate!
If we can stay out of a recession sales may get back to normal in another year or so, but that's a big if.
There are different forces at work today, investors have banded together to buy prime properties for cash and rent them out on internet rental sites. But even though they have no mortgages, if we have a recession each investor faces their own financial struggles. if one investor gets in financial trouble the others inherit the carrying costs which can cause a distress sale.
Instead of banks folding you will have personal investors folding.

[Descant]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

Thank you for your reply. Yes you are probably correct. We're pretty much at the bottom and have resigned to the fact we may have to be here for another year or more. No big deal.

Winnipesaukee is still very enjoyable. We do love our place just looking for new adventures in the latter part of life after having been here for 26 years.

Everything that we're looking at is folks chasing their tails too. We're certainly not desperate and definitely have the best deal on the lake for what it is by far.

If buyers don't exist unless you're giving something away then that's the way it is.

We don't know where this is, or if it is a primary residence. I'd look into leasing it for a year or two. When I look at condos online, I review the history. Price drops like you describe tell me others have looked and walked away, so I shouldn't even bother to look. Price drops in short time frames emphasize this appearance. It wasn't long ago that 90-180 days on market was common. This also has the markings of an agent who gave you a high listing price to get the listing. Condos that are in demand often sell through the HOA newletter, nothing ever shows up on the public marketplace. How did you choose the agent you ended up with? What other sales have there been in your complex? Which agen? Just thinking--no need for answers here..

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

Thank you for your reply. Yes you are probably correct. We're pretty much at the bottom and have resigned to the fact we may have to be here for another year or more. No big deal.

Winnipesaukee is still very enjoyable. We do love our place just looking for new adventures in the latter part of life after having been here for 26 years.

Everything that we're looking at is folks chasing their tails too. We're certainly not desperate and definitely have the best deal on the lake for what it is by far.

If buyers don't exist unless you're giving something away then that's the way it is.

If you've been here 26 years, aren't you making an absolute killing on your place? Maybe in that context, what you perceive as a low price is not giving something away?

[pondguy]

Could this be the property? https://www.realtor.com/realestatean...=srp-list-card

[ApS]

Originally Posted by TheTimeTraveler

Interesting that you found a very rare assumable loan.

Is that a VA loan?

For the younger Forum readers, most every home loan written was assumable up until the late 1960's or early 1970's. It was then that the lenders woke up and realized that they could make a lot more money by writing a higher priced fresh loan (charging "points" and closing costs). Assumable loans all but disappeared.

Profits always seem to rule the day.......

It's a "brick and mortar" bank loan, written in 2016.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

If you've been here 26 years, aren't you making an absolute killing on your place? Maybe in that context, what you perceive as a low price is not giving something away?

We live here full time. Sold a larger house and downsized 6 years ago. Unfortunately we would not be making a killing as a replacement residence will cost as much if not more for us to be able to live the same lifestyle elsewhere. Yes of course prices have gone up since 1998. But a "killing" we wish.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by pondguy

Could this be the property? https://www.realtor.com/realestatean...=srp-list-card

Yes that's it. It's only a 6 unit association on the water. All of us here consider it the best HOA on the lake. We live here year round.

Others here like us are older and are planning their retirement elsewhere. We feel we've been pretty aggressive and can't find any other property that comes close for what we have to offer. We consider our unit the best here with the most privacy too.

We would love to know if there is a better waterfront deal than ours (across the street on Weirs Blvd doesn't count). Hence our conclusion that yes there is a slowdown.

Although there may be a slowdown. We don't think it's a shutdown. Winnipesaukee is a gem. We do love it here. Otherwise we wouldn't have stayed for 26 years. We've done the lake and New England all our life. We simply want to explore elsewhere and experience some new adventures while we can with whatever time we have left. Winter is tiring when you're older.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

We live here full time. Sold a larger house and downsized 6 years ago. Unfortunately we would not be making a killing as a replacement residence will cost as much if not more for us to be able to live the same lifestyle elsewhere. Yes of course prices have gone up since 1998. But a "killing" we wish.

I agree that since you have to replace the condo you are in a tough spot, bummer. I hope you did well with the sale a few years ago. Good luck with the sale/relo

[Major]

Originally Posted by pondguy

Could this be the property? https://www.realtor.com/realestatean...=srp-list-card

My parents owned that property from 1979 to 1986. Capri Cottages. My parents purchased it from Yvonne and Yvette Duhamel. (I loved their first names!) When my parents converted them to condominiums, they sold the four units along the north side of the property for $64,500 per unit! How things have changed!

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Major

My parents owned that property from 1979 to 1986. Capri Cottages. My parents purchased it from Yvonne and Yvette Duhamel. (I loved their first names!) When my parents converted them to condominiums, they sold the four units along the north side of the property for $64,500 per unit! How things have changed!

That's funny. I have a vintage postcard when the places were pink! It's certainly not the 80's and we do miss those days.

[Major]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

That's funny. I have a vintage postcard when the places were pink! It's certainly not the 80's and we do miss those days.

When my family purchased the property in 1979, my dad, who is a painting contractor, painted the main house and five units mint green. Not sure whether that was a better choice than hot pink, but I know as a 14 year old boy I was grateful that I did not live in a pink house!

[pondguy]

Back in the days when Prescott's Store was across the street.

[Major]

Originally Posted by pondguy

Back in the days when Prescott's Store was across the street.

Absolutely. And when you went there for ice cream, you hoped one of the young kids would serve you, not Mr. Tilton! He was a nice man but stingy doling out ice cream!

[TheTimeTraveler]

Originally Posted by Major

When my family purchased the property in 1979, my dad, who is a painting contractor, painted the main house and five units mint green. Not sure whether that was a better choice than hot pink, but I know as a 14 year old boy I was grateful that I did not live in a pink house!

Was that seasonal property when purchased in 1979...? Is it seasonal property now or has it been made into year 'round property.

Seems to me like any property would be of far more value if it were able to be utilized year 'round.

[Mr. V]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

We simply want to explore elsewhere and experience some new adventures while we can with whatever time we have left. Winter is tiring when you're older.

Amen.

I chose not to live in NH due to cold winters and opted to live in the Pacific NW, in Portland: no regrets.

Alas, real estate prices are high but seem to be falling a bit, but there are lots of choices.

As for waterfront, think...rivers, not lakes, for the most part, or ocean front.

A lovely part of the USA to visit and live, if it floats your boat.

Bon Voyage.

[Juiced06GTO]

Is it me or does it seem like double the tax assessed value or something around there has been the norm for listing prices? I wonder if appraisals aren't coming back high enough to fund the loans people are looking to take?

[John Mercier]

I don't know if people are serious about second homes at this time.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

I don't know if people are serious about second homes at this time.

When people are struggling, they are going to save their primary home first, even if it means selling off the vacation home at a loss.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Juiced06GTO

Is it me or does it seem like double the tax assessed value or something around there has been the norm for listing prices? I wonder if appraisals aren't coming back high enough to fund the loans people are looking to take?

I think we are seeing investors pulling back from the market. They have been jumping into market over the past few years because of high rental rates and quick price appreciation.
Now that it's slowing down, it should get back to a more normal market. Unfortunately, that means future prices will reflect this correction.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I think we are seeing investors pulling back from the market. They have been jumping into market over the past few years because of high rental rates and quick price appreciation.

Now that it's slowing down, it should get back to a more normal market. Unfortunately, that means future prices will reflect this correction.

There's also a lot to be said about the decline in the Airbnb and VRBO industry, which will impact that whole investor/available inventory piece.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

There's also a lot to be said about the decline in the Airbnb and VRBO industry, which will impact that whole investor/available inventory piece.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk

Plus the actions cities and towns are taking to reign in daily rentals.

[Major]

Originally Posted by TheTimeTraveler

Was that seasonal property when purchased in 1979...? Is it seasonal property now or has it been made into year 'round property.

Seems to me like any property would be of far more value if it were able to be utilized year 'round.

Yes, it was a seasonal property. At that time (1986) there wasn't the demand like there is now to convert seasonal properties to year 'round properties. It would have taken quite a bit of investment since each cottage was relatively rudimentary. Also, water and sewer would have required updating. Very expensive upgrades. Others that sold at that time, such as Whispering Pines and eventually the Christmas Island cottages, were sold as seasonal properties.

[Descant]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I think we are seeing investors pulling back from the market. They have been jumping into market over the past few years because of high rental rates and quick price appreciation.
Now that it's slowing down, it should get back to a more normal market. Unfortunately, that means future prices will reflect this correction.

I agree about investors. I was ready to buy vacation/investments a couple of years ago and backed off. Now I see those places for sale witrh price drops. Many buyers thought they were buying a second home and they would pay for it with short term rental income. They didn't think of themselves as investors and probably many were too eager to buy. Now, or soon, real investores will be buyhing the dip. Making a down payment with a HELOC adds to the problem whem it means the second home/investment may be close to a 90% loan instead of the 70%+ that is common for invewstment real estate.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Descant

I agree about investors. I was ready to buy vacation/investments a couple of years ago and backed off. Now I see those places for sale witrh price drops. Many buyers thought they were buying a second home and they would pay for it with short term rental income. They didn't think of themselves as investors and probably many were too eager to buy. Now, or soon, real investores will be buyhing the dip. Making a down payment with a HELOC adds to the problem whem it means the second home/investment may be close to a 90% loan instead of the 70%+ that is common for invewstment real estate.

Many of the prime properties were bought by groups of investors with cash hoping to get the rental income and price appreciation. I know many of my son's friends bought into these real estate investment groups. We'll see how this all shakes out if prices drop and rentals slow down.
My son almost bought into one of these and I steered him away from them.
I took advice given to me by a smart uncle long ago and passed it on to him, "partners are for dancing"!

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Major

When my family purchased the property in 1979, my dad, who is a painting contractor, painted the main house and five units mint green. Not sure whether that was a better choice than hot pink, but I know as a 14 year old boy I was grateful that I did not live in a pink house!

When we purchased in 1998 three of the six units were still mint green including ours. We did the windows, door, insulation, siding, etc. when we got it. They were all still seasonal back then too. You can still see the green when you open the shed to our outside electrical meter.

This place has gone through a radical transformation since the old days. They're all year round and 3 out of the 6 units live here full time including us.

Another thing about our HOA is that we don't allow rentals. That could be a turn off for some. Being a small family association we're not interested in renters taking over and destroying our peaceful place. It's happened in the past and that's definitely an ongoing problem elsewhere. Especially during bike week.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by TheTimeTraveler

Was that seasonal property when purchased in 1979...? Is it seasonal property now or has it been made into year 'round property.

Seems to me like any property would be of far more value if it were able to be utilized year 'round.

All units here are year round and 3 of the 6 owners live here full time.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Juiced06GTO

Is it me or does it seem like double the tax assessed value or something around there has been the norm for listing prices? I wonder if appraisals aren't coming back high enough to fund the loans people are looking to take?

The assessed value of our particular property does not include the value of the private boat slip or jet ski location. That makes a huge difference! The benefit is that your taxes do not reflect that extra 200K+ in value.

An assessment would most likely be on the unit itself as the dock is owned by the association. Most of these places are cash deals.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Many of the prime properties were bought by groups of investors with cash hoping to get the rental income and price appreciation. I know many of my son's friends bought into these real estate investment groups. We'll see how this all shakes out if prices drop and rentals slow down.
My son almost bought into one of these and I steered him away from them.
I took advice given to me by a smart uncle long ago and passed it on to him, "partners are for dancing"!

There's a definite spectrum across the amount of time people will be renting a recently purchased place from 100% to 0%. The closer a buyer is to 100%, the more sensitive they are to market conditions.

My earlier posts were all around people with 0% rental time, and I think this group is growing as the lake becomes more expensive in general. Of course, I don't really know. We can see that fewer places are for sale than there were 10 years ago. But I wonder how the number of rental opportunities had changed?

[Major]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

When we purchased in 1998 three of the six units were still mint green including ours. We did the windows, door, insulation, siding, etc. when we got it. They were all still seasonal back then too. You can still see the green when you open the shed to our outside electrical meter.

This place has gone through a radical transformation since the old days. They're all year round and 3 out of the 6 units live here full time including us.

Another thing about our HOA is that we don't allow rentals. That could be a turn off for some. Being a small family association we're not interested in renters taking over and destroying our peaceful place. It's happened in the past and that's definitely an ongoing problem elsewhere. Especially during bike week.

I just realized that you purchased the property from our family's very good friends. I will let Jim know that it's for sale. He'd get a kick out of what it looks like now!

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Major

I just realized that you purchased the property from our family's very good friends. I will let Jim know that it's for sale. He'd get a kick out of what it looks like now!

It's a small world. Jim is a great guy! We remember him well. We still have the original for sale by owner sign he had in the window. We were just driving by and stopped in to take a look. The rest is history. We couldn't pass up such a beautiful place. If we remember he moved down the street to the four seasons after he sold to us. We're guessing if the place was year round like it is today he never would have left.

[MeredithMan]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

We would like to chime in here as a couple that has had their Winnipesaukee lakefront condo on the market now for a little over 2 months. Yes we think the market is definitely soft and yes prices are coming down. We have now lowered the price of our place 110K. 50K, then another 50K, and now just another 10K. Granted our original listing price could be considered high but you have to start somewhere. Obviously we want as much as we can get and of course buyers want to pay as little as possible. We think everyone gets that. Based on what our place has to offer, 2 years ago we probably would have gotten our original asking price. Today that's not the case.

Although we have had interest, we have yet to have anyone make an offer. We suspect buyers are sitting on the sidelines taking a wait and see approach. Especially for 2nd vacation homes. We thought we were priced aggressively especially compared to anything else in our price range with similar amenities. Even more so after the first 50K price reduction. We thought someone wouldn't be able to pass this up. Wrong. Next 50K reduction more interest but still nothing. Now we're another 10K down and waiting to see what happens. We know someone will eventually come along and be able to see the value in what we're offering. But who knows how long it will take.

There's something to our disadvantage as an HOA waterfront property that most wouldn't realize when exploring valuations. The boat slip is not figured into the value of the property, neither is the jet ski lift. This, in our opinion, is huge. It makes us seem overpriced. To buy an equivalent slip would be around 200K today not to mention the added bonus of a jet ski lift. Although you have these dedicated spots they are not figured into your tax bill which is a huge bonus. They are part of the associations property and actually not individually "owned".

The lake level at this time is also a problem. Our place has a deck that sits right over the water and we can usually dock our kayaks there. But not now. With the water being down about 2ft it is now a sandbar. No rain we believe has had an impact at least with waterfront sales.

So there you have it from our personal experience thus far. Yes, there is a slowdown. And also according to our realtors, few places have been gone under contract over the last few months.

I think one of the major problems you are facing--market conditions aside--is that the physical constraints of your home, (i.e., size), proximity to a busy road, and shallowness of that cove even in a non-drought year, severely limits your pool of potential buyers. You obviously can't change these physical factors, but have you had a conversation with your RE agent about strategies/ideas to market around these, other than price?

A wise person told me many years ago that before buying a property, think about who would buy it when you go to sell it in the future. Will it appeal to a broad spectrum of buyers? If not, you may be stuck.

Unfortunately, "the market" can be an unforgiving beast. We've been in this boat before as well, when we sold our house in CT to move back to MA in 2014. House was on the market for 9 months, and we eventually took a $400K haircut from our purchase price to be able to move on with our lives. The only saving grace was that RE prices in MA had declined too, so we were able to find a similar house and have a similar mortgage payment as we did in CT.

[sky's]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Many of the prime properties were bought by groups of investors with cash hoping to get the rental income and price appreciation. I know many of my son's friends bought into these real estate investment groups. We'll see how this all shakes out if prices drop and rentals slow down.
My son almost bought into one of these and I steered him away from them.
I took advice given to me by a smart uncle long ago and passed it on to him, "partners are for dancing"!

very well said.

[Major]

As Dave Ramsey says "The only ship that won't sail is a partnership." Having been in a partnership for nearly 20 years, I can attest to this.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by MeredithMan

I think one of the major problems you are facing--market conditions aside--is that the physical constraints of your home, (i.e., size), proximity to a busy road, and shallowness of that cove even in a non-drought year, severely limits your pool of potential buyers. You obviously can't change these physical factors, but have you had a conversation with your RE agent about strategies/ideas to market around these, other than price?

A wise person told me many years ago that before buying a property, think about who would buy it when you go to sell it in the future. Will it appeal to a broad spectrum of buyers? If not, you may be stuck.

Unfortunately, "the market" can be an unforgiving beast. We've been in this boat before as well, when we sold our house in CT to move back to MA in 2014. House was on the market for 9 months, and we eventually took a $400K haircut from our purchase price to be able to move on with our lives. The only saving grace was that RE prices in MA had declined too, so we were able to find a similar house and have a similar mortgage payment as we did in CT.

Thanks for your input. We understand what you're saying but without actually seeing the property in person we can say this.

Yes our place is small which we believe is reflected in the price. Someone could also add a second story which is approved and end up with a property worth much more for a minimal investment.

Pretty much all properties on Weirs Blvd are close to the street too. That's never been an issue with us. We can't even hear traffic inside. We're lucky to be one of the few places on the water side too. Not having to cross the street is huge.

Langley cove doesn't have a problem with shallowness itself. Just in front of the decks in units 1, 2, and 3. Our dock has always had deep enough water so we never removed our boat until late in the season. There's not even an issue now with our spot with the lake this low. The association beach is beautiful year round and the diving dock always has plenty of depth right until we take it out.

So unless we're missing something the only physical factors we're seeing would be size and the water level off of our deck. Everything else in our opinion and the realtors as well seems to check all of the boxes for not being a million dollar property.

The real estate market has always been unforgiving in our opinion. Buying or selling. Luckily we don't have to sell and would never feel stuck. It's been our dream home for many years. The more we talk about it the more we question if we're making the right decision. We're spontaneous like that. We're not even sure exactly where we will end up but will figure it out.

Our real estate agents, and other agents too, thought our place was a good deal and would sell fairly quick even before we slashed our price. Again, our reason for chiming in and thinking that yes, there is a slowdown. Also most people would probably not be buying to live here full time like us. Vacation homes we don't think are an option right now for many like they were in the past and that limits our buyer pool.

At this point we've been thinking about taking it off the market and waiting until early spring to try again if we don't change our minds all together. Who knows what the market will look like 6 months from now.

Thank you everyone for this thread. Lots of good insight.

[Susie Cougar]

It seems like there are at least two other properties in your HOA that are for sale. I think the buyer last year got a price that was unsustainable.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

Thanks for your input. We understand what you're saying but without actually seeing the property in person we can say this.

Yes our place is small which we believe is reflected in the price. Someone could also add a second story which is approved and end up with a property worth much more for a minimal investment.

Pretty much all properties on Weirs Blvd are close to the street too. That's never been an issue with us. We can't even hear traffic inside. We're lucky to be one of the few places on the water side too. Not having to cross the street is huge.

Langley cove doesn't have a problem with shallowness itself. Just in front of the decks in units 1, 2, and 3. Our dock has always had deep enough water so we never removed our boat until late in the season. There's not even an issue now with our spot with the lake this low. The association beach is beautiful year round and the diving dock always has plenty of depth right until we take it out.

So unless we're missing something the only physical factors we're seeing would be size and the water level off of our deck. Everything else in our opinion and the realtors as well seems to check all of the boxes for not being a million dollar property.

The real estate market has always been unforgiving in our opinion. Buying or selling. Luckily we don't have to sell and would never feel stuck. It's been our dream home for many years. The more we talk about it the more we question if we're making the right decision. We're spontaneous like that. We're not even sure exactly where we will end up but will figure it out.

Our real estate agents, and other agents too, thought our place was a good deal and would sell fairly quick even before we slashed our price. Again, our reason for chiming in and thinking that yes, there is a slowdown. Also most people would probably not be buying to live here full time like us. Vacation homes we don't think are an option right now for many like they were in the past and that limits our buyer pool.

At this point we've been thinking about taking it off the market and waiting until early spring to try again if we don't change our minds all together. Who knows what the market will look like 6 months from now.

Thank you everyone for this thread. Lots of good insight.

I think the size is the issue, 400 sqft is quite small, JMO! That's over $1500 per sq ft.

[fatlazyless]

It probably has both Laconia city water and city sewer which helps by a lot for adding a bedroom and a bathroom.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Susie Cougar

It seems like there are at least two other properties in your HOA that are for sale. I think the buyer last year got a price that was unsustainable.

Only one. The other sold.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I think the size is the issue, 400 sqft is quite small, JMO! That's over $1500 per sq ft.

You are not factoring in the value of the boat slip which is worth about 200K if you were to purchase one separately. There is also the value of a jet ski lift (technically another boat). What is that worth? Also when the water is not this low you can dock another boat right off of your deck.

Folks cannot seem to understand those items are not included in the value of the home itself.

[Susie Cougar]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

Only one. The other sold.

What did the other one sell for? Was it this year?

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

It probably has both Laconia city water and city sewer which helps by a lot for adding a bedroom and a bathroom.

Yes city water and sewer. Yes you can add a second story and it could be a 3 bedroom quite easily. We opted not to do that as it's just the two of us.

There was a larger home for sale on Christmas Island that everyone thought would sell quick. They have since taken it off the market. Although the price seemed good, the monthly expenses with taxes, condo fees, etc would have been over $1400/month not including any mortgage or other expenses. That's huge especially if you're just using it as a seasonal property.

We've also come to the conclusion that folks just don't understand the differences between many properties around the lake. Boat slips aren't free, jet ski slips aren't free, private beaches aren't free, being right on the water is not free, etc.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Susie Cougar

What did the other one sell for? Was it this year?

Unit 3 was listed for 659K and sold for 619K. Although nice, it is the least desirable unit in the HOA with a small deck and little privacy. It is the unit that has changed hands the most since we've been here. Many times actually compared to pretty much nothing for the other places. It sold 2 years ago.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

You are not factoring in the value of the boat slip which is worth about 200K if you were to purchase one separately. There is also the value of a jet ski lift (technically another boat). What is that worth? Also when the water is not this low you can dock another boat right off of your deck.

Folks cannot seem to understand those items are not included in the value of the home itself.

Ultimately, it's only worth what someone else is willing to pay for it.

[NH.Solar]

I wonder if the news of the world will cause an even larger decline of home sales in the 4th quarter.
First, Russia sending warheads into Poland is shades of 1939 again where we have a large country in tough financial shape lead by an imperialistic dictator and Poland backed by the EU and NATO ...and that is on top of Putin determined to seize the Donbas region rich in oil fields and a bread basket as well.
Second, we have a president that seems to like to provoke the rest of the world more than exercising the proper diplomacy that might actually accomplish something lasting. Don't get me wrong, I believe in a strong stance and USA first, but think that the way things are presently being done are far too harsh and thus dangerous. Maybe Trump is just pushing so forcefully because he knows that he needs to get as much of his agenda done before the mid-term elections?
And lastly add in the huge negative economic effects that the tariffs are creating and the news becomes a recipe for a sharp downturn in our economy. Anyone else nervous? I suspect so. I know I sure am

[GusMan]

The big red flag to me is that the dock and jet ski slip are "owned by the association" not the homeowner.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Biggd

Ultimately, it's only worth what someone else is willing to pay for it.

That of course it true when buying and selling anything.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by GusMan

The big red flag to me is that the dock and jet ski slip are "owned by the association" not the homeowner.

Why is that a "red flag"? It's been this way since they were turned into condos. Every unit has their own assigned boat slip and a spot for a jet ski. The dock is maintained by the HOA. It's never changed and never been a problem. Why would it be? The huge benefit is that you are not paying taxes on another potential 300K in value added to your home for these amenities. Maybe some people like paying more taxes. We don't. Hopefully no one from the city is following this and they change their mind

[Susie Cougar]

I am assuming that potential buyers have been looking at your place. What does your realtor say she is getting for feedback? This should give you a good idea of why there haven’t been any offers.

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by NH.Solar

I wonder if the news of the world will cause an even larger decline of home sales in the 4th quarter.
First, Russia sending warheads into Poland is shades of 1939 again where we have a large country in tough financial shape lead by an imperialistic dictator and Poland backed by the EU and NATO ...and that is on top of Putin determined to seize the Donbas region rich in oil fields and a bread basket as well.
Second, we have a president that seems to like to provoke the rest of the world more than exercising the proper diplomacy that might actually accomplish something lasting. Don't get me wrong, I believe in a strong stance and USA first, but think that the way things are presently being done are far too harsh and thus dangerous. Maybe Trump is just pushing so forcefully because he knows that he needs to get as much of his agenda done before the mid-term elections?
And lastly add in the huge negative economic effects that the tariffs are creating and the news becomes a recipe for a sharp downturn in our economy. Anyone else nervous? I suspect so. I know I sure am

Bingo! Everything that's happening in the world is contributing to a housing market slowdown pretty much nationwide from what we can see. Not everywhere but it is certainly widespread.

We believe there are a number of contributing factors that we won't get into in order to avoid thread drift. There is a lot in play and it's not just politics which we avoid like the plague. Unfortunately for those who only arrive at their conclusions from watching the MSM you are missing out. All you need to do to understand how unstable things are is to look at the precious metals market.

Again, our conclusion that yes there is a slowdown in the real estate market. But no matter how bad things get, we consider ourselves lucky to be at least "stuck" here!

Below is an interesting interview from 7/16/25 where he talks about the decline in the housing market.
https://usawatchdog.com/chaos-in-hou...r-john-rubino/

[Couple of Lakers]

Originally Posted by Susie Cougar

I am assuming that potential buyers have been looking at your place. What does your realtor say she is getting for feedback? This should give you a good idea of why there haven’t been any offers.

Nice place. No money.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by Couple of Lakers

Bingo! Everything that's happening in the world is contributing to a housing market slowdown pretty much nationwide from what we can see. Not everywhere but it is certainly widespread.

We believe there are a number of contributing factors that we won't get into in order to avoid thread drift. There is a lot in play and it's not just politics which we avoid like the plague. Unfortunately for those who only arrive at their conclusions from watching the MSM you are missing out. All you need to do to understand how unstable things are is to look at the precious metals market.

Again, our conclusion that yes there is a slowdown in the real estate market. But no matter how bad things get, we consider ourselves lucky to be at least "stuck" here!

Below is an interesting interview from 7/16/25 where he talks about the decline in the housing market.
https://usawatchdog.com/chaos-in-hou...r-john-rubino/

I believe the HOA pays the taxes on the docks, and that would be part of your HOA fee.

Things are not slow in the area.
Changes have occurred over the last several years as to taste and value, but everything seems to just keep going from both the building materials and labor.

A smaller cottage on the lake me be currently "out of style" or it may be the location, but other properties are moving upward still.