Water temp readings

fatlazyless · 07-08-2007, 03:04 PM

Just happened to notice that the Black Cat web cam says the water is 67.5, while the Lakeport Dam- State of NH's reading from this website says it is 70. Methinks 67.5 is correct after measuring myself with a good qualty thermometer and based on feel. Heck, it feels too cold today to be 70. 70 is a relatively warm temp, and a warm temp, it is not.

Is this some type of revenue-generating tourist trap foisted on us by our Blue-New Hampshire, Democratically controlled state goverment who are willing to compromise their professional political dignity just so's more tourists will drive here from anywhere, or what?

So, how come the State's reading is too high? Is there a temperature detective in the house? How.....who.....how.... are we the residents and visiters of NH supposed to believe?

JTA · 07-08-2007, 06:28 PM

Black Cat is in the north and the Lakeport dam is in the south. Everyone knows that southern waters are warmer than northern. Give the State a break. Not everything is a conspiracy (unless the statistics are controlled by the Fed).

ITD · 07-08-2007, 06:48 PM

This one's easy, they rounded.

Pineedles · 07-08-2007, 07:05 PM

Right............ There's no such thing as a tourist forecast in the Lakes Region. Been hearing for years.. RED, Blue, it doesn't matter who is in charge.

Weirs guy · 07-09-2007, 11:31 AM

You're also assuming both thermometers are calibrated and accurate. You could probably put both of them in the same bucket of water and have a 2-1/2° difference between them.

CanisLupusArctos · 07-09-2007, 12:10 PM

Not sure what the DES is using for a temp probe, but mine is a Sensatronics E4 temp monitor which is brand new. If you're curious about its techie specs, you can visit www.sensatronics.com and look at the E4. The company is located in Bow, and has a reputation of making very accurate instruments.

When I saw the differences in the readings I always figured it's because the state's probe measures the temp of the water going thru the dam in Lakeport at the end of Paugus Bay. Paugus Bay heats up more easily in summer and freezes sooner in winter than out here on the open lake. The lake gets stirred up a lot more out here.

This'nThat · 07-09-2007, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

So, how come the State's reading is too high? Is there a temperature detective in the house? How.....who.....how.... are we the residents and visiters of NH supposed to believe?

Many possibilities, including the depth of the two gauges, instrument calibration, water turbulance, the exact time of the measurements, the amount of sunlight on the area just before the measurement, the surface conditions (temp, humidity), and so on.

I think better data is needed before anyone can draw any conclusions. Specifically, need to collect measurements at the same times over a long period of time, and we need to calibrate (not only the instrument, but the all the other conditions around the instrument). With a lot more data, you can perform a good analysis.

Grant · 07-10-2007, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTA

Black Cat is in the north and the Lakeport dam is in the south. Everyone knows that southern waters are warmer than northern. Give the State a break. Not everything is a conspiracy (unless the statistics are controlled by the Fed).

Rock bass are a conspiracy.

Weirs guy · 07-10-2007, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grant

Rock bass are a conspiracy.

Can they calibrate a temp probe?

Grant · 07-10-2007, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weirs guy

Can they calibrate a temp probe?

They would, if they were actually in the Lake.

Island-Ho · 07-10-2007, 11:32 AM

I thought the summer temperature readings on this site came from Jolly Island, or somewhere in that vicinity?

webmaster · 07-10-2007, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Island-Ho

I thought the summer temperature readings on this site came from Jolly Island, or somewhere in that vicinity?

Right at the top of the temp page it says:

Quote:

The water temperatures listed here are from the
Winnipesaukee Dataphone at the Lakeport Dam (603-527-0071).

Some of the archived temperatures were posted by Ron from his
thermometer on Jolly Island. Thanks to Ron for his contributions.

Ron was kind enough to post the water temperature from his thermometer off Jolly Island for several summers. He stopped doing it a few years ago and I have been posting the temperature from the dam ever since.

When Ron was posting the temperature it was usually the same or very close to the dam readings.

Weirs guy · 07-11-2007, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grant

They would, if they were actually in the Lake.

The probes or the bass?

I did read the specs CanisLupusArctos link lead to, the probe is ± 0.5° for this temp range, so assuming the states probe is equal that could be a full degree's difference right there!

fatlazyless · 07-11-2007, 12:06 PM

This time a year, with the outflow reduced to the minimum, the concrete dam structure becomes a heat exchanger transfering heat into the water. The concrete dam structure absorbs radiant heat from all the wonderfull sunshine and it gets transferred into the water as it flows though.

Not much water going through the dam this time a year, correctimondo?

ITD · 07-11-2007, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weirs guy

The probes or the bass?

I did read the specs CanisLupusArctos link lead to, the probe is ± 0.5° for this temp range, so assuming the states probe is equal that could be a full degree's difference right there!

Wait a minute, probe accuracy is +/- .5 degree. How is it Algore can predict climate change to absolute certainty if the measuring instruments have a 1 degree margin of error on them, I thought the science was settled?

Oops, thread hijack, Less would never do that to someone else's thread.

CanisLupusArctos · 07-12-2007, 10:44 AM

I would suspect that the difference is related to the size of the water. Paugus Bay, where the state's probe is, gets circulated a lot less than the water out here. Paugus Bay is almost its own little lake with only a small channel into the main lake. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the water temps there were warmer in the summer and if it froze earlier in winter.

Where my probe is, we see the lake getting continuously stirred from end to end - wind comes up from Wolfeborough (from the SE) and on days like today it blows from Center Harbor (NW.) The water here has always taken a good deal of hot humid weather before it warmed above 70 in summer, and in the fall it takes a good long time to cool down and eventually freeze. The trees within a couple hundred feet of the shoreline are usually a week behind the rest of the area during foliage season. We typically don't get our first frost until November, thanks to relatively warm water.

The last couple days the water temp reached 71, but now with lower humidity and a NW wind I'm wondering if it'll drop back into the 60s by evening.

steadyon · 07-12-2007, 01:58 PM

so, because the states reading is 2degrees higher, tourists will be coming
in droves and the Democrats get the points.
this is almost as silly as the Rusty McMeredith thread

Weirs guy · 07-13-2007, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steadyon

this is almost as silly as the Rusty McMeredith thread

So, why waste your time reading it and responding?

CanisLupusArctos · 08-01-2007, 12:19 PM

Just installed a second probe at 12 feet deep. The "surface" probe remains at 3 feet. Right now it's showing 80 degrees at 3 feet and 75 degrees at 12 feet. They update every 15 minutes at www.blackcatnh.com.

SS-194 · 08-01-2007, 02:16 PM

I like analyzing temps as much as the next guy but hey it is the middle of summer. It may not get any better than this. Forget the #'s let's all go swimming!!

Bear Islander · 08-01-2007, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanisLupusArctos

Just installed a second probe at 12 feet deep. The "surface" probe remains at 3 feet. Right now it's showing 80 degrees at 3 feet and 75 degrees at 12 feet. They update every 15 minutes at www.blackcatnh.com.

My water temps are very close to yours. I measure at 3 feet. My lake temp is online, it updates when you refresh the page.

The way you display the data makes me believe you are also using the Sensatronics E4

www.bearcam1.com

SIKSUKR · 08-07-2007, 10:07 AM

My water temp sensor is at the surface on my boat.I was on the lake 5 days last week and consistantly saw 80-82 degrees.At one spot in the broads of all places,I had 86 degrees!Wow,the water is wonderfull!!!

chipj29 · 08-07-2007, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

My water temp sensor is at the surface on my boat.I was on the lake 5 days last week and consistantly saw 80-82 degrees.At one spot in the broads of all places,I had 86 degrees!Wow,the water is wonderfull!!!

Been on the Merrimack lately? Last Thursday in Bow the water temp downstream of the powerplant was around 90. Talk about unrefreshing!

Merrymeeting · 08-07-2007, 02:48 PM

Has anyone figured out what the highest recorded temperature is of those that have been captured in the readings on the site?

I haven't had time to look yet...

Merrymeeting · 08-07-2007, 02:54 PM

Answering my own question,

Assuming it had to happen in July, Aug, or Sept (I didn't look at other months), 79 is the highest recorded temp.

Aug 9-10, 2001, July 19, 2006, and several times in July 2005

New record this week?

CanisLupusArctos · 08-09-2007, 03:24 PM

79 is the record on which body of water? I seem to remember that in 1988, Winnipesaukee hit a record high of 92 degrees. It was in the news, alongside articles about duck itch and unusual aquatic plants popping up everywhere. That was a really, really hot summer as I recall.

Last year my old probe got to 84 degrees at 3 feet, during the heat wave of early August. This summer (with new probe) 82 has been the highest.

Merrymeeting · 08-09-2007, 04:06 PM

I was referring to the records on this website. They only go back as far as 2000.

I too recorded 83 last week on Merrymeeting (which seems to track Winni fairly well). This is with a probe about 3' deep below my dock, about 20' from shore with water depth about 6'.

SIKSUKR · 08-10-2007, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chipj29

Been on the Merrimack lately? Last Thursday in Bow the water temp downstream of the powerplant was around 90. Talk about unrefreshing!

Actually yes I have.I live in Bedford and was on the river last week.Although I launched at Lambert Park and was below the Hooksett dam.I didn't look at my temp gauge though.

SIKSUKR · 08-13-2007, 10:04 AM

From last weeks surface reading on my boat of 82-84,this weekend I had 76 on Saturday and 77 yesterday in the Broads off Welch Island.

CanisLupusArctos · 08-13-2007, 08:38 PM

A little wind on the surface seems to have blown warm water elsewhere... meanwhile the humidity dropped off a ledge this afternoon. From a dewpoint of 65 this AM (very muggy) to 48 at sunset (Fall-like dryness.) When the air is very dry the lake water cools off quick. Today I had 76 water temp on Black Cat.

Channel 6 in Portland just mentioned "Fall-like" temps for this upcoming weekend so I'd say enjoy those water temps while they're still in the upper 70s.

Weirs guy · 08-14-2007, 11:22 AM

I drove by Winnisquam this a.m. on the way to work and saw the dreaded "heat loss fog" rising off the water.

Merrymeeting · 08-15-2007, 11:53 AM

... the downward slide begins...

CanisLupusArctos · 08-16-2007, 07:59 AM

Heat loss fog, already? I haven't seen that yet but it does make for some *great* sunrise pictures.

The last few days the surface temp has been running cooler than the 12-foot temp. Just another sign of autumn. The hornbeam trees also have their first red leaves - they always start turning a few weeks before all the others but they still peak about the same time as the others.

Ch. 6 Weather (Kevin Mannix) said mountain valleys would probably get down into the 30s on Saturday night.

Grant · 08-16-2007, 08:36 AM

Personally, I think 70 is the ideal lake temp. Just right. And once you get into 80 and above, the algae blooms go into overdrive.

Weirs guy · 08-16-2007, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanisLupusArctos

Heat loss fog, already?

Bad news update, saw it again on the big lake on Meredith bay yesterday morning about 5:30.

CanisLupusArctos · 08-18-2007, 07:56 AM

It felt like November suddenly roared in about midnight last night. Calm quiet summer night became hefty gusts out of the northwest in a matter of minutes and the wind is still increasing. Dewpoint now in the 40s, temp in the 50s, wind still increasing and tossing up the whitecaps.

Not surprisingly the water temp is now steadily dropping from 72. Based on weather forecast I think it'll get down to around 67 before this first-of-the-season cold wave is done with us.

07-08-2007, 03:04 PM	#1
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,752 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,010 Times in 736 Posts	Water temp readings Just happened to notice that the Black Cat web cam says the water is 67.5, while the Lakeport Dam- State of NH's reading from this website says it is 70. Methinks 67.5 is correct after measuring myself with a good qualty thermometer and based on feel. Heck, it feels too cold today to be 70. 70 is a relatively warm temp, and a warm temp, it is not. Is this some type of revenue-generating tourist trap foisted on us by our Blue-New Hampshire, Democratically controlled state goverment who are willing to compromise their professional political dignity just so's more tourists will drive here from anywhere, or what? So, how come the State's reading is too high? Is there a temperature detective in the house? How.....who.....how.... are we the residents and visiters of NH supposed to believe? Last edited by fatlazyless; 07-08-2007 at 04:34 PM.

07-08-2007, 06:28 PM	#2
JTA Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Fort Pierce, Florida Posts: 233 Thanks: 34 Thanked 25 Times in 21 Posts	Southern waters Black Cat is in the north and the Lakeport dam is in the south. Everyone knows that southern waters are warmer than northern. Give the State a break. Not everything is a conspiracy (unless the statistics are controlled by the Fed).

07-08-2007, 07:05 PM	#4
Pineedles Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Moultonborough & CT Posts: 2,545 Thanks: 1,072 Thanked 667 Times in 366 Posts	Tourist Forecast? Right............ There's no such thing as a tourist forecast in the Lakes Region. Been hearing for years.. RED, Blue, it doesn't matter who is in charge.

07-09-2007, 11:31 AM	#5
Weirs guy Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Weirs Beach, NH Posts: 1,067 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	You're also assuming both thermometers are calibrated and accurate. You could probably put both of them in the same bucket of water and have a 2-1/2° difference between them. __________________ Is it bikeweek yet? Now?

07-09-2007, 12:10 PM	#6
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	Thermometer Not sure what the DES is using for a temp probe, but mine is a Sensatronics E4 temp monitor which is brand new. If you're curious about its techie specs, you can visit www.sensatronics.com and look at the E4. The company is located in Bow, and has a reputation of making very accurate instruments. When I saw the differences in the readings I always figured it's because the state's probe measures the temp of the water going thru the dam in Lakeport at the end of Paugus Bay. Paugus Bay heats up more easily in summer and freezes sooner in winter than out here on the open lake. The lake gets stirred up a lot more out here.

07-08-2007, 06:48 PM	#3
ITD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Moultonboro, NH Posts: 2,928 Thanks: 476 Thanked 691 Times in 387 Posts	This one's easy, they rounded.

07-10-2007, 11:32 AM	#11
Island-Ho Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 176 Thanks: 19 Thanked 14 Times in 11 Posts	Location? I thought the summer temperature readings on this site came from Jolly Island, or somewhere in that vicinity?

07-11-2007, 12:06 PM	#14
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,752 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,010 Times in 736 Posts	This time a year, with the outflow reduced to the minimum, the concrete dam structure becomes a heat exchanger transfering heat into the water. The concrete dam structure absorbs radiant heat from all the wonderfull sunshine and it gets transferred into the water as it flows though. Not much water going through the dam this time a year, correctimondo?

07-12-2007, 10:44 AM	#16
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	My guess I would suspect that the difference is related to the size of the water. Paugus Bay, where the state's probe is, gets circulated a lot less than the water out here. Paugus Bay is almost its own little lake with only a small channel into the main lake. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the water temps there were warmer in the summer and if it froze earlier in winter. Where my probe is, we see the lake getting continuously stirred from end to end - wind comes up from Wolfeborough (from the SE) and on days like today it blows from Center Harbor (NW.) The water here has always taken a good deal of hot humid weather before it warmed above 70 in summer, and in the fall it takes a good long time to cool down and eventually freeze. The trees within a couple hundred feet of the shoreline are usually a week behind the rest of the area during foliage season. We typically don't get our first frost until November, thanks to relatively warm water. The last couple days the water temp reached 71, but now with lower humidity and a NW wind I'm wondering if it'll drop back into the 60s by evening.

07-12-2007, 01:58 PM	#17
steadyon Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Meredith Posts: 102 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts	its summer, smile so, because the states reading is 2degrees higher, tourists will be coming in droves and the Democrats get the points. this is almost as silly as the Rusty McMeredith thread

08-01-2007, 12:19 PM	#19
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	Depth readings now online Just installed a second probe at 12 feet deep. The "surface" probe remains at 3 feet. Right now it's showing 80 degrees at 3 feet and 75 degrees at 12 feet. They update every 15 minutes at www.blackcatnh.com.

08-01-2007, 02:16 PM	#20
SS-194 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Nottingham NH Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post	I like analyzing temps as much as the next guy but hey it is the middle of summer. It may not get any better than this. Forget the #'s let's all go swimming!!

08-07-2007, 10:07 AM	#22
SIKSUKR Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 5,075 Thanks: 215 Thanked 903 Times in 509 Posts	My water temp sensor is at the surface on my boat.I was on the lake 5 days last week and consistantly saw 80-82 degrees.At one spot in the broads of all places,I had 86 degrees!Wow,the water is wonderfull!!! __________________ SIKSUKR

08-07-2007, 02:48 PM	#24
Merrymeeting Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Merrymeeting Lake, New Durham Posts: 2,226 Thanks: 302 Thanked 800 Times in 368 Posts	Record? Has anyone figured out what the highest recorded temperature is of those that have been captured in the readings on the site? I haven't had time to look yet...

08-07-2007, 02:54 PM	#25
Merrymeeting Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Merrymeeting Lake, New Durham Posts: 2,226 Thanks: 302 Thanked 800 Times in 368 Posts	79 Answering my own question, Assuming it had to happen in July, Aug, or Sept (I didn't look at other months), 79 is the highest recorded temp. Aug 9-10, 2001, July 19, 2006, and several times in July 2005 New record this week?

08-09-2007, 03:24 PM	#26
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	79 is the record on which body of water? I seem to remember that in 1988, Winnipesaukee hit a record high of 92 degrees. It was in the news, alongside articles about duck itch and unusual aquatic plants popping up everywhere. That was a really, really hot summer as I recall. Last year my old probe got to 84 degrees at 3 feet, during the heat wave of early August. This summer (with new probe) 82 has been the highest.

08-09-2007, 04:06 PM	#27
Merrymeeting Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Merrymeeting Lake, New Durham Posts: 2,226 Thanks: 302 Thanked 800 Times in 368 Posts	I was referring to the records on this website. They only go back as far as 2000. I too recorded 83 last week on Merrymeeting (which seems to track Winni fairly well). This is with a probe about 3' deep below my dock, about 20' from shore with water depth about 6'.

08-13-2007, 10:04 AM	#29
SIKSUKR Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 5,075 Thanks: 215 Thanked 903 Times in 509 Posts	Big drop From last weeks surface reading on my boat of 82-84,this weekend I had 76 on Saturday and 77 yesterday in the Broads off Welch Island. __________________ SIKSUKR

08-13-2007, 08:38 PM	#30
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	Dry weather is here A little wind on the surface seems to have blown warm water elsewhere... meanwhile the humidity dropped off a ledge this afternoon. From a dewpoint of 65 this AM (very muggy) to 48 at sunset (Fall-like dryness.) When the air is very dry the lake water cools off quick. Today I had 76 water temp on Black Cat. Channel 6 in Portland just mentioned "Fall-like" temps for this upcoming weekend so I'd say enjoy those water temps while they're still in the upper 70s.

08-14-2007, 11:22 AM	#31
Weirs guy Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Weirs Beach, NH Posts: 1,067 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I drove by Winnisquam this a.m. on the way to work and saw the dreaded "heat loss fog" rising off the water. __________________ Is it bikeweek yet? Now?

08-15-2007, 11:53 AM	#32
Merrymeeting Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Merrymeeting Lake, New Durham Posts: 2,226 Thanks: 302 Thanked 800 Times in 368 Posts	Based on the Winnipesaukee.com temp readings... ... the downward slide begins...

08-16-2007, 07:59 AM	#33
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	Autumn nears... Heat loss fog, already? I haven't seen that yet but it does make for some great sunrise pictures. The last few days the surface temp has been running cooler than the 12-foot temp. Just another sign of autumn. The hornbeam trees also have their first red leaves - they always start turning a few weeks before all the others but they still peak about the same time as the others. Ch. 6 Weather (Kevin Mannix) said mountain valleys would probably get down into the 30s on Saturday night.

08-16-2007, 08:36 AM	#34
Grant Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Pennsyltuckey, Tuftonboro, Moultonborough Posts: 1,500 Thanks: 375 Thanked 230 Times in 124 Posts	Personally, I think 70 is the ideal lake temp. Just right. And once you get into 80 and above, the algae blooms go into overdrive. __________________ "When I die, please don't let my wife sell my dive gear for what I told her I paid for it."

08-18-2007, 07:56 AM	#36
CanisLupusArctos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Center Harbor Posts: 1,049 Thanks: 15 Thanked 472 Times in 107 Posts	The downward spiral begins... It felt like November suddenly roared in about midnight last night. Calm quiet summer night became hefty gusts out of the northwest in a matter of minutes and the wind is still increasing. Dewpoint now in the 40s, temp in the 50s, wind still increasing and tossing up the whitecaps. Not surprisingly the water temp is now steadily dropping from 72. Based on weather forecast I think it'll get down to around 67 before this first-of-the-season cold wave is done with us.