Speed Limit test zones dead in the water!

[Islander]

Originally Posted by brk-lnt

Trying to sort through all the noise of your posts, I see two recurring themes:

1) Speed limits are inevitable. Both because the vast majority of people want them, and you live in close proximity (at least part of the year) to a NH senator

2) The efforts of various LE groups to test speed limits are being done in such a way as to skew the data collected, such that it is useless and likely to show that there are no speed issues on the lake.

These points sort of seem to be at opposite ends of the spectrum. What leads you to believe there will ever be a speed limit on the lake if the efforts to test the need for it are being purposefully mishandled?

Note: if I have misinterpreted your posts, I'm happy to have you clarify these specific points, if it can be done without dragging the issue in 300 non-relevant directions.

Speed limits are inevitable, but my proximity to a Senator has nothing to do with it. The Senate voted down the previous speed limit bill by two votes. The current Senate has more liberals, more women and more democrats. The numbers are there now to pass this bill.

Plus the death toll is rising. Four in the area just this summer. And Coast Guard statistics show boating accidents on the rise.

Even the organized anti speed limit crowd have given up. Where is NHRBA? Gone from this argument.

The MP have been against speed limits from the beginning. This test area baloney is just their last shot in a losing battle. The Legislative Committee voted unanimously to reject the MP's 8 year delay tactic. Even Barrett now says a speed limit will pass.

Public opinion has also changed with 78% of registered NH voters favoring speed limits.

[EricP]

Originally Posted by Islander

Speed limits are inevitable, but my proximity to a Senator has nothing to do with it. The Senate voted down the previous speed limit bill by two votes. The current Senate has more liberals, more women and more democrats. The numbers are there now to pass this bill.

Plus the death toll is rising. Four in the area just this summer. And Coast Guard statistics show boating accidents on the rise.

Even the organized anti speed limit crowd have given up. Where is NHRBA? Gone from this argument.

The MP have been against speed limits from the beginning. This test area baloney is just their last shot in a losing battle. The Legislative Committee voted unanimously to reject the MP's 8 year delay tactic. Even Barrett now says a speed limit will pass.

Public opinion has also changed with 78% of registered NH voters favoring speed limits.

I have never seen anyone make up statistics to the degree you have. I have yet to see you post any valid source of these ficticious stats you quote. Meanwhile all research that other people post here is real.

I was involved in voting out a Senator who supported the speed limit, and he doesn't even own a boat! And will continue to not vote for politicians who support laws that remove freedoms.

To everyone else: If we don't post anymore the ONE person who believes there will be a speed limit and defends it here will have no one to argue with.

[KonaChick]

I know the Bear Island contingent and their feelings on PWC's. The funniest thing is that when we go to visit relatives on BI the kids are literally drooling to take a ride on our PWC. It's such a dichotomy to see the NO PWC'S THEY ARE EVIL crowd and the PLEASE PLEASE TAKE US OUT FOR A RIDE ones. I always chuckle each time we see this!

[Irrigation Guy]

Originally Posted by Islander

Speed limits are inevitable, but my proximity to a Senator has nothing to do with it. The Senate voted down the previous speed limit bill by two votes. The current Senate has more liberals, more women and more democrats. The numbers are there now to pass this bill.

All according to your ever present agenda driven opinion.

Originally Posted by Islander

Plus the death toll is rising. Four in the area just this summer. And Coast Guard statistics show boating accidents on the rise.

Statistic have been repeatedly presented that less than 10% these accidents have had anything to do with speed. Speed is not the issue here nor nationwide.

Originally Posted by Islander

Even the organized anti speed limit crowd have given up. Where is NHRBA? Gone from this argument.

Seems to me the speed limit side consists of you and your alter ego's previously revealed by the moderator of this forum to all come from the same IP.

Originally Posted by Islander

The MP have been against speed limits from the beginning. This test area baloney is just their last shot in a losing battle. The Legislative Committee voted unanimously to reject the MP's 8 year delay tactic. Even Barrett now says a speed limit will pass.

Barrett is saying a speed limit will not do anything to change things on this lake.

Originally Posted by Islander

Public opinion has also changed with 78% of registered NH voters favoring speed limits.

Registered voters in Salem, NH on a Monday evening in July?

Fill us in on the parameters of this so-called poll.

[Cal]

Originally Posted by Islander

Plus the death toll is rising. Four in the area just this summer. And Coast Guard statistics show boating accidents on the rise.

And of course all are a direct result of speed , correct??? Or are you purposely omittiing the WHOLE truth to lead us to believe it was speed related

[Cal]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Islander

Plus the death toll is rising. Four in the area just this summer. And Coast Guard statistics show boating accidents on the rise.

Originally Posted by Cal

And of course all are a direct result of speed , correct??? Or are you purposely omittiing the WHOLE truth to lead us to believe it was speed related

Like I said , are they ALL related to speed??? Huh , huh...inquiring minds want to know
Or would you say that just to make it SOUND like speed was the cause?

[Islander]

Originally Posted by Cal

Quote:
Originally Posted by Islander

Plus the death toll is rising. Four in the area just this summer. And Coast Guard statistics show boating accidents on the rise.


Like I said , are they ALL related to speed??? Huh , huh...inquiring minds want to know
Or would you say that just to make it SOUND like speed was the cause?

I do not know the speed of the boats involved. I don't think it matters all that much. The two fatalities in Maine obviously involved high speed, the exact numbers are not important.

Two separate PWC accidents killed two teenagers and badly injured two more. Again I don't know the speeds, but teenagers going fast on a PWC is not unusual. And a crash at low speeds is not as likely to kill.

However the real benefit of a speed limit will be that less people will be putting high speed craft on the lakes of New Hampshire. When the speed limit passes families will purchase fewer PWC's. Some teenagers might even be forced to move from a PWC to a kayak.

A popular movie once quoted "if you build it, they will come". I would paraphrase that to "if you don't buy it, they can't ride it" or even "if you don't buy it, they can't be killed on it".

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by Islander

I do not know the speed of the boats involved. I don't think it matters all that much.

A popular movie once quoted "if you build it, they will come". I would paraphrase that to "if you don't buy it, they can't ride it" or even "if you don't buy it, they can't be killed on it".

This should make the Lake safer for all...

Drain the Lake...

If there's no water; nobody can drown...

P.S.- No need for a boat speed limit, either
and the GFBL crowd will be elsewhere,
as will the large cruisers and their big wakes.

[Cal]

Originally Posted by Islander

I do not know the speed of the boats involved. I don't think it matters all that much. The two fatalities in Maine obviously involved high speed, the exact numbers are not important.



A popular movie once quoted "if you build it, they will come". I would paraphrase that to "if you don't buy it, they can't ride it" or even "if you don't buy it, they can't be killed on it".

Ooooooooooooohhh , I understand now. That's not lying , the original statement was just a little miss leading .
As for your quote please let me appologize , I forgot we are no long responsible for our actions and require laws to protect us from ourselves.
MY gawd woman , what's next , rubber rooms for all of us

FYI , kayaks by themselves (with out any other boats around) aren't 100% safe either.

[tis]

Bear Islander. Yes, I know the people of NH own the lake. Just as we own the roads. But I don't really care what the speed limit is in Andover NH because I never go there. It doesn't really bother me if it is 20 or 70. Why should I care. It is just not relevent to me personally. So again, why should people who don't use the lake care???

[Bear Islander]

Originally Posted by tis

Bear Islander. Yes, I know the people of NH own the lake. Just as we own the roads. But I don't really care what the speed limit is in Andover NH because I never go there. It doesn't really bother me if it is 20 or 70. Why should I care. It is just not relevent to me personally. So again, why should people who don't use the lake care???

The citizens of NH have the responsibility to set certain limits for public safety. This is done through elected representatives, but the final responsibility is with the people.

Ultimately it's the responsibility of the citizens to determine if a speed limit is needed on NH lakes.

Also consider the speed limit will be state wide, including any lakes in Andover. Most citizens live near a lake, have been on a lake or will be on a lake.

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Islander

I do not know the speed of the boats involved. I don't think it matters all that much. The two fatalities in Maine obviously involved high speed, the exact numbers are not important.

Two separate PWC accidents killed two teenagers and badly injured two more. Again I don't know the speeds, but teenagers going fast on a PWC is not unusual. And a crash at low speeds is not as likely to kill.

However the real benefit of a speed limit will be that less people will be putting high speed craft on the lakes of New Hampshire. When the speed limit passes families will purchase fewer PWC's. Some teenagers might even be forced to move from a PWC to a kayak.

A popular movie once quoted "if you build it, they will come". I would paraphrase that to "if you don't buy it, they can't ride it" or even "if you don't buy it, they can't be killed on it".

Actually I tend to think that any speed limit will have a zero to positive effect on the numbers of PWCs on Winni. Let's say people forgoe the big fast boats for "lesser" craft, what do you expect they'll be ? Frankly I'd expect them to be PWCs as they're relatively cheap bang for the buck. Gas prices will drive their sales more than any SL. Anybody know what the RCS of a typical PWC is ?

Again if the purpose of the speed limit is to reduce the "high speed" boat collisions, I don't see why you're mentioning accidents where such collisions didn't occur and you don't even know the speeds involved. For you I guess it is all about ridding the lake of those people you deem undesirable.

[Resident 2B]

Originally Posted by Islander

Public opinion has also changed with 78% of registered NH voters favoring speed limits.

Islander,

Where and when was this poll taken?

You could add significant creditability to your statements by providing references.

Making statements without providing references makes you look foolish.

R2B

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by Resident 2B

Islander,

Where and when was this poll taken?

You could add significant creditability to your statements by providing references.

Making statements without providing references makes you look foolish.

R2B

The 2005 Speed Limit Poll:

http://americanresearchgroup.com/nhpoll/boat/

The pen is mightier than the sword…

[Skip]

Originally Posted by islander

...the study was done by the American Research Group in February of 2007...

Originally Posted by Resident 2B

...Islander...Where and when was this poll taken...

In late June of 2005 a poll of six hundred randomly telephoned New Hampshire residences resulted in 64% of the respondents in favor of the question, 22% opposed and 14% undecided.

The exact wording of the question was:

Do you favor or oppose a law that would impose speed limits for boats on large lakes in New Hampshire?

The American Research Group conducted a poll, not a study. The poll was conducted in 2005, not 2007 and those supporting the question posed totaled 64%, not 78%.

Perhaps these mistakes are why Islander did not supply the following LINK to verify her claims?

Ah, maybe we should poll our readers to study this issue further!


There are three kinds of lies; lies, damn lies and then there are statistics - Mark Twain

[Rattlesnake Guy]

Originally Posted by Islander

{cut}
Public opinion has also changed with 78% of registered NH voters favoring speed limits.

2 Calmly asked questions.

Do you happen to know the exact question that was asked which yielded a 78% affirmative response?

Do you "think" that if the question had been:
Would you favor a state wide lakes and ponds speed limit system in NH that is similar to the roads where the speed limit is proportional to the ability of the road to handle vehicles of a certain speed?

This is not a trick question, just wondering if 79% would agree to this question?

Now I have to drive home on 93 at 65 mph+ with inattentive drivers who try to break the 1 foot rule. Now that's scary.

[Lakegeezer]

Originally Posted by Islander

The current Senate has more liberals, more women and more democrats. The numbers are there now to pass this bill.

Is this attitude any hint of the nanny laws we should expect from a Hillary presidency?

[winnilaker]

Originally Posted by Islander

Even the organized anti speed limit crowd have given up. Where is NHRBA? Gone from this argument.

http://www.opposehb847.com/opposehb847/testimonials.htm

... more and more as each day passes!