Liberty Hill

[CitizenReporter]

There has been a huge spread done on the Liberty Hill coal tar contamination. Below are some of the stories that have been done.

What does everyone thing about this issue?

Does anyone have any information that might be helpful?

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Main: http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...5/-1/CITNEWS01

PUC: http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...014/-1/CITIZEN

PICTURES:
http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...075/-1/CITIZEN

Lawsuit:
http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711240037

New Proposals:
http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711180061

National Grid:
http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711190008

EPA:
http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711150062

Politician Reaction:
http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711060036

[Argie's Wife]

I hope you don't think I'm "reporter bashing" - I'm not. I know who you are and know you try to do a good job... What I'm trying to say is that I have some doubts as to what you're trying to accomplish with this particular thread and don't mean to upset you with my comments... but...

... there was a thread about this not too long ago... I'll gladly bump it up for you, if that will help...

...and I sorta wonder how you gather "facts" from a forum where people post with handles, like myself, and expect to get accurate information. Additionally, your "survey" is hardly objective or scientific - it points a lot of fingers in a situation that's already pretty delicate and multi-faceted, don't you think? (There's no one answer... in other words...)

(Again - nothing personal - just wondering...)

Peace,

-AW

[LIforrelaxin]

This is a case of something that happened 50+ years ago, comming back to haunt a company years later, because it is not suitable by todays standards. While I understand the enviormental impacts and concerns, a company shouldn't be punished for something that happened 50 years ago. From what I can tell the in the brief reading I did the company that created this problem has now through multiple mergers become Keyspan. As a company they had now involvement in the situation 50 years ago. They have however purposed a reasonable clean up. From what I can tell it sounds as though the people and town think more should be done. I think that if more aggressive plans are felt to be warrented the towns people better be ready to kick in some money for the project. The town didn't push hard enough to clean this up 50 years ago, they are also to blame.

Way to often companies are getting punished for enviornmental disasters and being asked to clean them up, when the disasters happened many years ago knowingly to the public. I don't believe it is correct or proper to punish a company for something they did in the pass, that has only been deemed a disaster by todays standards. They are hard lessons to learn for sure, but life is about learning and mistakes happen.

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

This is a case of something that happened 50+ years ago, comming back to haunt a company years later, because it is not suitable by todays standards. While I understand the enviormental impacts and concerns, a company shouldn't be punished for something that happened 50 years ago. From what I can tell the in the brief reading I did the company that created this problem has now through multiple mergers become Keyspan. As a company they had now involvement in the situation 50 years ago. They have however purposed a reasonable clean up. From what I can tell it sounds as though the people and town think more should be done. I think that if more aggressive plans are felt to be warrented the towns people better be ready to kick in some money for the project. The town didn't push hard enough to clean this up 50 years ago, they are also to blame.

Way to often companies are getting punished for enviornmental disasters and being asked to clean them up, when the disasters happened many years ago knowingly to the public. I don't believe it is correct or proper to punish a company for something they did in the pass, that has only been deemed a disaster by todays standards. They are hard lessons to learn for sure, but life is about learning and mistakes happen.

You should take the time to read the articles in the links.

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711240037

The transport company paid.

and...

Keyspan is being cheap.

Originally Posted by online Citizen

While the main emphasis is on cost, with complete removal priced at nearly $16 million, during the winter of 2006-2007, KeySpan received authorization from the New Hampshire Public Utilities Commission to build fees into the cost of gas to recover cleanup expenditures incurred from any cleanup of sites like Liberty Hill throughout the state. That cost amounts to $19 extra per year for the average KeySpan customer.

This year KeySpan was able to recover more than $12 million from insurance companies that covered the companies originally responsible for the coal tar dumping back in the 1950s.

Gov. John Lynch has not yet weighed in on the issue, although the town is hoping for his support of full removal.

"We trust DES will work closely with the community on this important issue," said Lynch Press Secretary Colin Manning, saying the governor will remain in contact with DES officials.

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711180061

Where are the environmental groups?

Originally Posted by online citizen

More recently, engineers have found that there has been an exposure pathway detected into Jewett Brook. This means chemicals may have been leaching into the brook for the past 50 years.

The brook winds its way through several Laconia neighborhoods and eventually empties into the Winnipesaukee River. Earlier this month, a hiker walking along the brook behind the former house lots reported a strong, foul odor.

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...5/-1/CITNEWS01

Who does NHDES represent in this matter?

Originally Posted by online Citizen

"I can't believe what I am hearing," said Goodhue, drawing issue with the DES stance on not mandating complete removal and the EPA's indication that they might decide the same.

"At the last public hearing you people held it seemed like you were there representing KeySpan," said Goodhue to DES Supervisor John Regan, who had previously explained to Gilford officials and residents why KeySpan should not have to bear the cost burden of complete removal. "I don't think there are too many people in that room that are feeling sorry for an energy company paying $16 million."

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...WS02/711150062

[jeffk]

What should be sought here is the best result. Total cleanup is not always the best option because it disturbs and distributes the pollutant. There have been oil spills where it was insisted that total cleanup be done and the oil company argued that environmentally it would be better to do a partial cleanup. In one area complete cleanup was done, in another partial cleanup. Guess what, the oil company was correct. The partially cleaned area recovered faster and better.

Now I don't know what the right answer is in this case. All I am saying is that the emphasis should be on the best result. If all if the residue needs to be removed, it should be. However, the partial removal may actually yield a better result. People jumping up and down and yelling about something aren't always right, often they are just most noticed.

Environmentally, what is the best way to clean this site?

[fatlazyless]

Keyspan Energy was sold to National Grid of Scotland, ticker symbol NGG, a few months back, and National Grid is a way bigger company than Keyspan was.

National Grid has stock value of 45 billion dollars, and its' stock price has gone up a lot in the past five years which is an indication of a strong and very profitable company.

Most likely, when they bought Keyspan's assets, they also receive Keyspan's liabilities.....that's usually the way it works. Probably, they have more than one high deductible insurance policy to cover for big environmental problems. Also, they would have a powerfull legal defense.

[LIforrelaxin]

I just noticed a flaw in this Poll, How about being able to vote for the EPA to step in.... This certainly would seem to be a big enough eviornmental impact to warrent thier involvment.....

[SIKSUKR]

We had what sounds like the same situation here in Manchester a few years back.Right next to where Keyspan sits off Elm ST there was a big coal tar deposit that I believe has since been remediated.The tar was a byproduct of the production of propane from coal.I'm assuming this was how the Gilford deposit got there?

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

We had what sounds like the same situation here in Manchester a few years back.Right next to where Keyspan sits off Elm ST there was a big coal tar deposit that I believe has since been remediated.The tar was a byproduct of the production of propane from coal.I'm assuming this was how the Gilford deposit got there?

This is how it got there.

[GWC...]

Latest on the footdragging, regarding Liberty Hill, NHDES, and the Gov...

"I think they have already made up their minds on what they are going to do," said Wayne Gustafson, who lives with his family across the road from the site. "They aren't going to do anything. They are just going to cover it up and tell everyone everything is fine."

A few weeks ago Benavides and Juris went to Concord to meet with Gov. John Lynch. While Lynch acknowledged the town's concerns, he did not promise to act on the matter.

While pleased that the governor is aware of what is happening in Gilford, Lacroix said he has yet to see the Governor make good on his word and take action.

Trust nobody and you will never be disappointed...

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by online Citizen

Keyspan plan wins DES okay

State allows partial cleanup of coal tar

By CUTTER MITCHELL
jmitchell@citizen.com

Article Date: Saturday, March 1, 2008

Selectman Gus Benavides was at a loss for words, only saying he was disappointed by the whole thing.

"I question why DES would not just go for total removal," said Benavides, pointing out that KeySpan can recover its costs from ratepayers.

Originally Posted by online Citizen

The estimate for the complete removal of coal tar is $15.9 million, compared to the $8.7 million the limited removal option.

KeySpan had been authorized by the N.H. Public Utilities Commission to build in costs associated with the Liberty Hill site investigation and cleanup into the bills consumers pay. According to the commission, the average gas user consumes 1,250 terms of gas annually; therefore, the average KeySpan consumer paid $19 between 2006 and 2007 toward remediation costs in the state.

KeySpan also recovered $14 million, or $1.9 million shy of the total removal cost, from insurance companies that issued polices to the predecessor companies responsible for contamination sites.

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...318/-1/CITIZEN

One has to wonder if the members of the NHDES will share in the profits of not fully removing the contamination on Liberty Hill?!

[Mark]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

... What I'm trying to say is that I have some doubts as to what you're trying to accomplish with this particular thread and don't mean to upset you with my comments... but...

...and I sorta wonder how you gather "facts" from a forum where people post with handles, like myself, and expect to get accurate information.

I don't know this reporter but I think they want dig up as much information as they can. A reporter who does a "good job" (your words) would verify the source or the info. Remember that a Nixon whistle blower had the name "Deep Throat" and was believed.

I do not have the information needed to make an informed answer to the poll question. I can tell you that in the end, it is US who pay for it. No matter the method we will pay. Where does Keyspan get the money it spends? From us.

[Just Sold]

Citizen reports that KeySpan knew of contamination 5 years before it was reported.
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