Lake Markers

[Phantom]

Jonnfinn ----

BEWARE !!

I too use the rule of thumbs (color associations) mentioned above -- but remember it is a "rule of thumb" -- it will work 95% of the time. There are however a couple of "confusing" situations out there and the Map is your best ally. A perfect example of this (at least for me) is the black top's near FL# 30 (near Mink & Little Camp ilses). After time, I fully understand it's logic today, but at first it was an inigma as to where to safely boat.

[jrc]

Originally Posted by Phantom

... A perfect example of this (at least for me) is the black top's near FL# 30 (near Mink & Little Camp ilses). After time, I fully understand it's logic today, but at first it was an inigma as to where to safely boat.

OK, please explain FL#30 to me. Why is it there, it seems safe on all fours sides. Is it just a single rock?

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by jrc

OK, please explain FL#30 to me. Why is it there, it seems safe on all fours sides. Is it just a single rock?

It's shallowish and there's a rock south of it between it and Mink. Pass that one on the north side. The confusing one (for me) is the black topped spar just northeast of FL30 and it's companion balck topped spar. You need to pass between the two black topped spars to be safe.

[Gilligan]

Originally Posted by Dave R

It's shallowish and there's a rock south of it between it and Mink. Pass that one on the north side. The confusing one (for me) is the black topped spar just northeast of FL30 and it's companion balck topped spar. You need to pass between the two black topped spars to be safe.

The larger boats go north of FL 30 and I see many others go on either side. Dave R is right about the preferred route.

Dave, I thought that North of FL 30 on the side of Mark is one red top closer to the island and a black top "companion" to the right of it. If those are the two markers you are thinking about, I thought you needed to pass outside the black top marker, or between the red top and the island. I thought the shallowest area is between the two markers.

You wrote that it is 2 black tops and I don't see them on my chart therefore I'm not sure we are talking about the same place.

It is true that passage past markers is not always by the intuitive route. Check the chart.

[kchace]

Originally Posted by Gilligan

The larger boats go north of FL 30 and I see many others go on either side. Dave R is right about the preferred route.

Dave, I thought that North of FL 30 on the side of Mark is one red top closer to the island and a black top "companion" to the right of it. If those are the two markers you are thinking about, I thought you needed to pass outside the black top marker, or between the red top and the island. I thought the shallowest area is between the two markers.

You wrote that it is 2 black tops and I don't see them on my chart therefore I'm not sure we are talking about the same place.

It is true that passage past markers is not always by the intuitive route. Check the chart.

Its the companion buoy to FL#30 that is also black. So when navigating the preferred route, you pass between that black buoy and the black buoy off the tip of Bear. That, I believe, is the confusing aspect of it.
(That spot is a lot more clear on my old Duncan chart)

Ken

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Gilligan

Dave, I thought that North of FL 30 on the side of Mark is one red top closer to the island and a black top "companion" to the right of it. If those are the two markers you are thinking about, I thought you needed to pass outside the black top marker, or between the red top and the island. I thought the shallowest area is between the two markers.

You wrote that it is 2 black tops and I don't see them on my chart therefore I'm not sure we are talking about the same place.

You are correct, the other black top I meant does indead have a companion red top. It's just that the 3 markers are in relative close proximity and the correct course is not at all intuitive. I have been fully comfortable with the proper route through there for years, but the first time I approached that spot was from Birch Island and I must confess that I found the concept of making a hard right turn and going between the two black spars a little disturbing. I had to stop and triple check my chart.

That route is my prefered way from Center Harbor to Weirs Beach/Meredith, just to avoid the no wake at the north end of Bear. I also route around the north side of Eagle to avoid the no wake at FL2.

[kchace]

Originally Posted by Dave R

It's shallowish and there's a rock south of it between it and Mink. Pass that one on the north side. The confusing one (for me) is the black topped spar just northeast of FL30 and it's companion balck topped spar. You need to pass between the two black topped spars to be safe.

I go that way all the time and it had the same effect on me until I memorized it.

For the longest time I had a mental block on remembering which sides to pass on which color buoy until I was able to remember "BEN" Black - East/North.

One thing finally dawned on me that made it a lot easier to understand how buoys are placed. That is, just because a bouy has a certain color top, doesn't mean you can safely pass on BOTH of two sides of it. For example, a black topped buoy means pass to the east or north, but it doesn't mean you can safely pass on BOTH the east and north sides - that all depends on what its marking and where that hazard is. Once I figured that out, it made it a lot easier to figure out what was right and wrong. A perfect example are the 3 black buoys lined up on the north side of Eagle Island. You'd better NOT pass to the north side of the first two!

One thing for sure is the lake will either keep you on your toes or it'll take your prop.

Ken

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by kchace

A perfect example are the 3 black buoys lined up on the north side of Eagle Island. You'd better NOT pass to the north side of the first two!

One thing for sure is the lake will either keep you on your toes or it'll take your prop.

Ken

You know, I see boats blast through that area on the north side of Eagle all the time. Makes me wonder just how bad it is in there; not enough to gamble though.

[kjbathe]

Originally Posted by Dave R

You know, I see boats blast through that area on the north side of Eagle all the time. Makes me wonder just how bad it is in there; not enough to gamble though.

I did it once by accident on plane going into the sun (missed the marker). As soon as I realized where I was I had the conflicting thoughts of "Do I slow down in case I'm in trouble?", "Do I maintain speed to keep as much boat out of the water as possible?" and "How fast do I really want to be going if I hit something?" I recommend against people following my example

A good reminder for jonfinn and other folks not to assume that other boats are taking an acceptable course.

[kchace]

Originally Posted by Dave R

You know, I see boats blast through that area on the north side of Eagle all the time. Makes me wonder just how bad it is in there; not enough to gamble though.

I've seen that too. There may be 'gaps' big enough for those who know exactly where to go, but there's a bunch of rocks in there. I stopped myself from accidentally going through there one fall. As I turned the boat around I found myself going right around a good sized rock maybe 18-24" below the surface.

Ken

[tis]

I think some of the problem is that the markers move with the ice. We have markers near us that have been moved so far around over the years, that it is hard to tell what they are marking. MP can only guess as to exactly where they go. I think only the people living in the area know the bottom well. A couple of years ago the black one disappeared never to be seen again.

[Phantom]

Okay -- sorry for the delayed response......but we just got back from the Lake and our "season opening" five days boating.

Glad to know I wasn't the only one seriously confused by the FL30 area when I first started out (yearrrrrrs ago)


(kchace) there are no "companions" to black or red "Tops" ..... what you (I think) are referring to as FL30's "companion" is actually the aspect that makes that area confusing. Notably a black & red top pair just to the north-ish of the lite. This is one of the rare areas that "depending on your approach" you actualy split a pair of black tops --- which scares the hell outta ya the first few time you do it -- MAP or not!!

DaveR -- we have our place just east of FL#1 and watch the traffic off Eagle all the time. Your reffering to the FL#44 side of Eagle and there are many a boater who get my "God is on their side" award. That side of the island has numerous eractic rock configurations ... we've putted over there with the Jet Ski (best time is Fall low water)..... the closer you are to Eagle the more hazard but as Kchace said --there is no real logical "single hazard".

[KTO]

My best advice...

KNOW THE LAKE...Become familiar with the lake.

You can't always see markers in the distance, so be prepared where you need to go. There are several markers that make you scratch your head when you first see them ("Why is this marker HERE of all places?"). They are there for a reason, so plan ahead and KNOW THE LAKE...

and have fun!

[WeirsBeachBoater]

FL30 is very confusing to most. The even more confusing marker is just off the tip of Bear in that same area. Where it is actually safe between the island and the marker when your minds eye says that can't be!

[fatlazyless]

I know someone who has the 14', 300lb, wood spar complete with shackle hardware that served for years as the black & white, flasher #3 companion spar. A few years back it washed up on shore in December and the next year the Marine Patrol replaced it with a new and improved pvc spar. And, the MP did not want it back.....they said 'thanks, but no thanks.'

If the old spar could talk, it would say ' Ahoy, I ain't no garden timber, put me back into the lake!" Hey, there's no spar like an old, square, double tapered, lake Winni orig wooden spar...

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

I know someone who has the 14', 300lb, wood spar complete with shackle hardware that served for years as the black & white, flasher #3 companion spar. A few years back it washed up on shore in December and the next year the Marine Patrol replaced it with a new and improved pvc spar. And, the MP did not want it back.....they said 'thanks, but no thanks.'

If the old spar could talk, it would say ' Ahoy, I ain't no garden timber, put me back into the lake!" Hey, there's no spar like an old, square, double tapered, lake Winni orig wooden spar...

14' long? Wow I had no idea those things were that long. Still, kind of a neat thing to have. Some day it may be worth a few bucks....

[Mink Islander]

It's not uncommon to see the occasional "panic stop" when an unfamiliar boater comes upon the less than intuitive 3 buoy triangle there. There are some boulders south of FL 30 but they're down at least 6 feet. I've stood on one on my tip-toes with fins on and I'm over 6 ft tall. Familiar boaters often cut the corner coming around Mink and ignore FL 30 altogether. Actually a safe route for recreational boats. Remember, some of these marked channels are there primarily for the tour boats given their deeper draft.

The single most common error is when boats go between the red and the black markers heading north/south, apparently confused in thinking they are a paired set marking a channel.... Nope. They're not solid red/black. See this mistake all the time. The correct path is to go either to the inside between the red marker and shore (RSW) (very counter-intuitive) or around the outside of the black marker (BEN) There is a shoal in between there (closer to the red marker) that late in the season could spell trouble for a big cruiser.

[kchace]

Originally Posted by Phantom

Okay -- sorry for the delayed response......but we just got back from the Lake and our "season opening" five days boating.

Glad to know I wasn't the only one seriously confused by the FL30 area when I first started out (yearrrrrrs ago)


(kchace) there are no "companions" to black or red "Tops" ..... what you (I think) are referring to as FL30's "companion" is actually the aspect that makes that area confusing. Notably a black & red top pair just to the north-ish of the lite. This is one of the rare areas that "depending on your approach" you actualy split a pair of black tops --- which scares the hell outta ya the first few time you do it -- MAP or not!!

Actually, since flashers usually have companion buoys, I was referring to the companion buoy of FL30 which is black-topped. Its close enough to the black-topped buoy just off the southern tip of Bear that it's scary the first time or two through there. I think those two black-topped buoys are barely further apart than 2 of the 3 that are off the north side of Eagle that you best not be passing through.

Just another endearing Lake Winnipesaukee idiosyncrasy.

Ken

[Dave M]

A suggestion, I travel that route alot. If your going easterly from the channel next to Mark island and want to go on the inside of the red bouy on the tip of Bear island, make a wide sweep first keeping in mind FL30. Years ago I didn't make such a wide sweep and met another boat coming through on a southerly direction. Luckily I was able to turn and continue easterly and he stopped. Its as close as I want to meet another moving boat.

Dave M

[MeEscape]

Some time ago someone posted an attached file which was a simple circle, half black, half red, with N,E,S,W printed on it indicating the passing direction. I've searched but was unable to locate this post, if that someone or someone else remembers what I'm referring to, could they repost it or redirect me to the file? It was a good simple aid for folks that don't drive often on the Lake.

Thanks in advance.

[Rattlesnake Guy]

I never saw it but was inspired to draw this.

[Mat]

Look under new Bizer chart of the this section. Thread # 16 I think for the pie chart.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

I never saw it but was inspired to draw this.

Where does this image keep disappearing to?

[dog paw]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Gal

Where does this image keep disappearing to?

I need to print, laminate and hang this on the handlebar of my ski. The lake is becoming a bit more familiar over the years but for some reason those markers will not stick in my thick head... Killer rocks are not much of a issue in the man made mudhole lakes we have down south.

The wife found a tear in her vest this weekend, I told her we would just have to go back to De Silvas and get another Missing summer already

[bkgoodman]

I don't want to be "the heavy", but since you're asking the question, I'm assuming you haven't taken the NH boating course, and don't have the certification.

It is the law that you do. (Unless you have USGC Aux, Power Squadron or something equiv.)

If you have one of the equivalent certifications, I'd highly recommend brushing up on N.H. laws, as boating in N.H. is very quirky, and you will get pulled over and fined on Winnipesaukee for breaking laws that you would never otherwise know about.

If you don't have these certs, you must get the N.H. Certification.

http://www.boat-ed.com/newhampshire/

Just trying to be helpful...

[robmac]

I guess I was taught using the "KISS"method. Every boat I've owned I would go to Thurstons and buy the decal for my dash or an easy place to see so I could never question which side to pass the markers.

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by jrc

OK, please explain FL#30 to me. Why is it there, it seems safe on all fours sides. Is it just a single rock?

I believe it is ok on all sides.Based on the Bizer chart,the depth does go down below 6 ft on the south side of FL 30,which I think is why the charts show the main route around the north side.Bizer does not show any rocks in that area.