Who's mansion on Clay Point

[pjard]

Who is building that HUGE Mansion on Clay Point? Does anyone know if that's the biggest home on the lake?

[Outlaw]

Bob Baher (owner of Loundon Race Track - Nextel and Bush Racing). The one next to the BIG house is his son's house. Don't know if its the biggest for sure, but it certainly looks like it.

[JohnNH]

Isn't Clay Point in Wolfeboro just east of Parker Island?

There is a very large house under construction at that site. I spoke with the contractor last year when the foundation was in process and I recall him telling me that the footprint is roughly 150 feet by 300 feet. It looked like they might have been building a WalMart.

Some estimates when the house is complete are over 30,000 square feet and it's a summer home.

John/NH

[Outlaw]

http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/...ght=clay+point


Here's a link to a previous thread about Bahre's estate. Clay Point is actually in Alton on the Barndoor Island side. Bahre's property was formerly a (boy scout?) camp.

[jrc]

There is a big estate on Clay point in Alton. Clay point is between Barndoor Island and Roberts Cove. It is a large house slightly towards the Barndoor side of the point with a three stall boat house. A smaller house further back is said to be a family member. The houses seem to have traditional mansion styling. Both house have been near completion for at least a year. My only "proof" that this is the Bahre estate, comes from this forum.

There is also a huge house with a rectangular shape and an unusual modern roof line on Wolfeboro Neck near Parker Island. I think that's the house JohnNH refers to. It's under construction but not nearly as complete as the Clay point house. Roof trusses are still visible from the lake. Because of it's size, unusual styling, and closeness to the water you can't miss it.

[new boater]

Does anyone know what's up with the huge tent on the Bahre estate? Just noticed it yesterday.

[fatlazyless]

Anyone know how Bob Bahre is recovering from his ice skid rollover last winter in Maine while driving a large suv by himself. A newpaper article said the 78 year old Bahre came close to dying about one week after the rollover. Be well, Mr Bahre!

[Skip]

....according to this in depth article about the family from the July 24th Sunday Union Leader.

http://www.theunionleader.com/Articl...1295&archive=1

[fpartri497]

wife and I had dinner at sandy point about a month ago. bob and his wife where dining In front coner booth. walked and talked just fine. couldnt see any lasting affects from his accident.

[Outlaw]

Originally Posted by Skip

....according to this in depth article about the family from the July 24th Sunday Union Leader.

http://www.theunionleader.com/Articl...1295&archive=1

What a great article. If only more people would take the time to say something as simple and easy as I love you to someone they care about, just once a day. So touching.... Thanks Skip.

[HotDog]

i also heard that he has the racers there. So he writes the whole thing off as "business."

[Aquadeziac]

The semi-finished house in Wolfboro with the steel superstructure,was the subject of a Concord Monitor article about a week or so ago that I can't seem to find in their archives. Basically a Mass couple started building without all the proper permits and now have to tear down part of their mansion. Supposedly was going to be over $6 Million. Now to conform to codes they overlooked to begin with its going to cost them an added Million to tear down what they shouldn't have built in the first place. Well, boo-freakin-hoo, my heart cries for them....NOT!

Originally Posted by jrc

There is a big estate on Clay point in Alton. Clay point is between Barndoor Island and Roberts Cove. It is a large house slightly towards the Barndoor side of the point with a three stall boat house. A smaller house further back is said to be a family member. The houses seem to have traditional mansion styling. Both house have been near completion for at least a year. My only "proof" that this is the Bahre estate, comes from this forum.

There is also a huge house with a rectangular shape and an unusual modern roof line on Wolfeboro Neck near Parker Island. I think that's the house JohnNH refers to. It's under construction but not nearly as complete as the Clay point house. Roof trusses are still visible from the lake. Because of it's size, unusual styling, and closeness to the water you can't miss it.

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Aquadeziac

The semi-finished house in Wolfboro with the steel superstructure,was the subject of a Concord Monitor article about a week or so ago that I can't seem to find in their archives. Basically a Mass couple started building without all the proper permits and now have to tear down part of their mansion. Supposedly was going to be over $6 Million. Now to conform to codes they overlooked to begin with its going to cost them an added Million to tear down what they shouldn't have built in the first place. Well, boo-freakin-hoo, my heart cries for them....NOT!

Sorry for the title, just watched the Blazing Saddles DVD "Mee" got me. I wish the article was findable, I seem to recall that they did have the permits, approved by the town but that the state or fed gov't stepped in and said there was a problem. I didn't get the impression that the home owners were trying to pull a "fast one" but rather that a little known portion of the code was overlooked.

[Rinkerfam]

I saw the story on WMUR just after it broke. From what I understood, the house was supposed to be single story based on the permits. When it was discovered that they were building a multi-story home, they were forced to stop construction. I haven't seen or heard anything else since.

[Skip]

This is the link to the August 7th Union Leader/Sunday News story (also covered by WMUR) referencing the new home under construction on the Lake in Wolfeboro, and the dispute the builders are having with the NH DES:

http://www.theunionleader.com/Articl...1901&archive=1

[rrr]

My question is: Why are they allowed to build so close to shore?

[jrc]

The old house on the lot probably violated the 50' setback but was grandfathered, because it predated the law. Typically you can repair or rebuild a grandfathered building, provided you build in the same footprint. The arguements seem to be, does footprint includes height, does a town law supercede the state law, and/or did they get permits before some parts of the law changed. Should be fun to watch.

[mousecatcher]

Originally Posted by jrc

The old house on the lot probably violated the 50' setback but was grandfathered, because it predated the law. Typically you can repair or rebuild a grandfathered building, provided you build in the same footprint. The arguements seem to be, does footprint includes height, does a town law supercede the state law, and/or did they get permits before some parts of the law changed. Should be fun to watch.

Usually the Town law is more stricter than the State law. The State of NH says you can have a deck up to 12 feet within the 50 foot set back, the Town of Moultonborough says NO, nothing withing the 50 foot set back period. A friend of mine ran into that problem in Moultonborough when trying to build a 10 foot deep deck into two feet of the 50 foot set back from the water on a small canal. This place is not even considered Lake front. This canel just leads out into the lake. The Town said absolutely NOT. Nothing can be in the 50 foot set back.

I am still wondering how people can still build and blast granite on property that did not have a previous home on it (no grandfather law here) to build so close to the water. The home I am referring to is the new home going up within feet of the water on the back side of Long Island in Moultonborough? This is just before you get to the bridge on the left. It must have something to do with greasy palms, and who has the money.

Another fairly new home, built a few years ago, way up into Greens Basin had no deck put on until rescently. That deck must be at least 20 feet from the waters edge. It makes one wonder how can some people do it and some people can not?

If you have the money you can buy your way into anything just about. I remember a few years ago where someone built a home on top of a boat house and also knocked a bunch of trees down next to the water for a better view (Moultonborough or the town next to it). The owner was ordered to take down the home and restore the land where they took down the bunch of trees. Guess what the boat house with the home on top of it right next to the water's edge is still there, and for the trees, well what can I say, they haven't been planted yet.

This home in Wolfboro we are all talking about, will go up as planned, you watch, they have the money and someone else will get rich. No doubt about it.

[GScharoff]

Originally Posted by Outlaw

http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/...ght=clay+point


Here's a link to a previous thread about Bahre's estate. Clay Point is actually in Alton on the Barndoor Island side. Bahre's property was formerly a (boy scout?) camp.

Just to set the record straight the property that this McMansion is being built on (still )...think it is close to 3 years now, was the former site of Camp Alton a boys camp that closed after the summer of '92 . I went there as a camper back in the '70s and maintain the site www.campalton.com If you want to see additional pictures of this house during the earlier stages of construction and from my visit to the area back in April of 2002 you can check http://www.campalton.com/april_2002_photos.html There are some great photos from the landside of the home as opposed to the lakeside shots now.

That is one of a number of large homes on the former camp grounds (none close in size to these 2 however)

Gary

[KTO]

It looks more like a 5 star hotel with all of the imported stuff, the size of the house, the son's house, and the what...8 car garage?
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strain index

[gravy boat]

...and let's not forget the Marine Patrol cruising along the shoreline in front of these houses every now and then to keep people from getting too close.

My husband and I have been by there three times this summer to check the progress and MP was there twice, cruising the shoreline, ONLY in front the the properties. We watched and concluded (hopefully incorrectly) that MP was there to specifically prevent boat traffic from coming too close. Not protecting the lake, not protecting boat traffic -- but protecting the properties.

I truly hope MP is being paid by the owners of those houses -- would really tee me off if my tax dollars went to protect the privacy of those who build houses crying out for attention.

[KTO]

Ok, so I don't pay taxes (yet!) But why should the MP be there, when there are dozens of boats not only making a wake, but SPEEDING out of Meredith Bay!
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sc2 replays

[Bubba]

If you will notice, he also brings in helicopters and lands them on the property. This weekend, watch the helicopter traffic over Clay Point, Chestnut Cove, and Alton Bay. It is a direct line to the track.

Also, have heard that Mario Andretti has purchased land on the other side of the Clay Point, next to them.

[KTO]

That place has taken years to complete! (Of course, construction service around the lake is slow) When is it expected to be done? What's already amazing is how far away you can can be and still see it!

[GScharoff]

The really sad part is that 6 or 7 years ago you would have noticed nothing...just tall pine trees lining the shoreline now you can see that location from - as you say - far away because all the green is gone

[Frdxplorer]

Originally Posted by GScharoff

The really sad part is that 6 or 7 years ago you would have noticed nothing...just tall pine trees lining the shoreline now you can see that location from - as you say - far away because all the green is gone

I agree that is the really sad part. What I consider even sadder, is that all those trees have been ripped out of a piece of land that was once used as a summer camp. Now it is certainly not the owner's fault that the camp went under, but it just really seems like a shame. I spent 6 years @ Camp Belknap in Tuftonboro and believe strongly in the value of these summer camps for kids. What a huge asset it is to have a place where kids who have never seen a lake or a mountain come for a few weeks and learn more about the world they live in. And the values I took away from Camp Belknap have helped guide me in alot of experiences in life. I would certainly like to be in the position to purchase a place like that, but I would hope that if I was, I wouldn't actually do it. I just wonder how much "the great spirit" smiles as the choppers and private jets criss cross the lake.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Flyguy sure has talent. Looks like a palace.

[KTO]

Wow! That picture just makes it look that much...annoying! Is a house that large truly neccesary?

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Maybe no one in that family likes each other. It seems so big that a few families could move in and never be detected!

[Merrymeeting]

...and I'm sure all that lush, dark green grass is naturally grown, with no need for herbicides and fertilizers...

[gtxrider]

Its 2 houses and 2 boat houses. I guess Senator Kerry is correct the economy is bad.

[PROPELLER]

I don't like it. In my opinion for what its worth, its disgusting. If I had the financial ability to buy that piece of property I would have only cut the necessary trees to build a modest summer cottage & road to access it. I would not have cut trees down to the shoreline & I would not have a lawn that requires chemicals & fertilizers. The cottage would also be set back far enough from the shore & would have as much tree cover as possible so as to make the cottage as unobtrusive from the shore as possible (it would be hard to see) But thats just me.

[Bubba]

and they (Bahre and son) aren't done yet!!

[Frdxplorer]

Originally Posted by Bubba

and they (Bahre and son) aren't done yet!!

Bubba,
what do you mean by that? are more structures planned. Someone should refer them to ELF (Environmental Liberation Front)... Just kidding. that's kinda an extremist organization. I gotta have an old Ranger Rick magazine around here somewhere. Maybe I'll drop it in the mail to them.

[Grant]

Originally Posted by KTO

Wow! That picture just makes it look that much...annoying! Is a house that large truly neccesary?

House, schmouse...I'm more concerned with that green lawn that *reportedly* (yeah, right) is cultivated/maintained without the use of fertilizers.

God, from that vantage point, you can see that there is really nothing left of the old Camp Alton. What a shame. That was a cool place.

[Just Sold]

I can tell you from a first hand observation, I took the wrong road last week and ended up at the back of the house, the lawn is an instant one of cut sod.

They have left an area between the large lawn and the lake planted with perennials that will need some sort of fertilizer with the exception of a small area with grass in front of the main house based on the photo from Flyguy.

I hope that nothing ends up leaching into the lake from any of the lawns or plantings. The place is still not completed so more lawn and ground cover will be comming I am sure.

[webmaster]

I cruised by the Bahre property this summer with a neighbor of his that was having boat trouble. According to him the main house is 37,000 square feet, has a 16 car garage and a foyer so large that Mr. Bahre has part of his car collection on display there. His son's house next door is a mere 17,000 sf.

He also said that one of its main purposes was to entertain and accommodate some of the multimillionaire drivers and business people he deals with at the speedway. In this way it is like an exclusive, private hotel.

[fpartri497]

wife and I cruised on over in the boat yesterday 09/16/04 to take a look at the progress on the house. at the entrance to the cove, there was a M.P. boat right In the middle of the cove. It appeared to us as If it was guarding the bahre estate. I could be wrong but it sure appeared that way. they didnt shoe me away but watched us intently.

[webmaster]

Originally Posted by JohnNH

Isn't Clay Point in Wolfeboro just east of Parker Island?

Here's a map I prepared last year showing the location of Clay Point:

[upthesaukee]

In articles in the Citizen last spring, the top tax payers in each community were listed, and Mr. Bahre was the highest taxpayer in Alton. As a resident in alton, I must say "thanks to Mr. Bahre". I believe the second highest in town was West Alton Marina, and my thanks to them for what they do with for our town and the boating public here on the lake.

All the "glitter" does not come cheaply, and as much as we "locals" complain about the "flatlanders", they are directly providing financial aid to some very small towns that thrive and depend on tourism.

[Bubba]

Yes, Frdxplorer, there is more to come. The rumor is that Papa and Jr are not always on the best of terms. A wall (hill) is being built between the two houses so they do not have to look at each other. Take it down, then put it back up.

[tricia1218]

It is sad this house screams "Look at me, look at me!!!" Amazing what a little insecurity and some money can accomplish.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Delayed reaction to GScharoffs post with the link to Camp Alton. What a great site! If you haven't been there, take a look. There are lots of great old photos and information. Alumni keep in touch and have reunions too. The glossary of Alton Terms is a riot!





Camp Alton

[DoftheMattysort]

I'm not educated on the enviromental laws of Alton or the State of NH for that matter, but that grass looks like sod and thus must be treated year round to maintain the plush carpet and rich color. What are the laws on using chemicals that close to a body of water? Especially one used for drinking water? (Being the big of a taxpayer must make the town officals look the other way.)

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Could a lawn look like that just from frequent watering, but not fertilizing?

[Just Sold]

The lawn pictured in Fly Guy's photo is sod as I previously posted here. Water alone cannot maintain sod or any lawn that good without fertilizer being applied at regular intervals.

[mcdude]

unbelievable.....
Citizen Article

[Frdxplorer]

Interesting how he claims to like Alton becuase it's a nice small little town. Yet he hopes to develop a "major supermarket" near the 28 circle. Maybe a nice little stripmall with a Wal-Mart will be next. I'll try to keep this related to the lake but if anyone would like to privately discuss with me how Wal-Mart is destroying the moral fabric of America, feel free to email me.

[DoftheMattysort]

In the article about Bahre being the highest taxpayer in the town I noticed something that doesn't seem right. Here is the breakdown.

1. Bahre
$18,902,700 in property value
$318,154 in taxes
($16.831/$1000.00)

2. Newton Porter Foundation
$4,717,000 in property value
$79,434 in taxes
($16.839/$1000.00)

3. William Higgins
$4,496,200 in propterty value
$75,716 in taxes
($16.830/$1000.00)

4. Barbara Fortier
$4,422,487 in property value
$74,474 in taxes
($16.839/$1000.00)

5. NH Electric Cooperative
$4,438,300 in property value
$54,014 in taxes
($12.169/$1000.00)

Now I know that the top 4 having about .01 descrepency is just from rounding but how come NH electric is only paying $12.169 per $1000.00 when the others are paying $4.67 per one thousand more than NH electric?
Citizen Article

[SPANKY]

i would guess it's got something to do whether or not the land is in "current use".