Aug 1 Capt. Bonehead's

Just Sold · 08-02-2009, 06:47 AM

I was on the lake yestreday and between the southern end of Cow south of the Barber Pole and up to the Graveyard on no less than 5 occasions we were passed (overtaken) within 50' by other boats at high speeds.

This happened with 2 different boats at different times during the day not on just one pass through the area. First we were on a 22' Sea Ray and later a 17' Chris Craft. The most dangerous and this happend 2 times (a few hours apart - same boat and driver) was with an all black Ranger w/a Merc. - a young man and woman on board - that passed within 30' at high speed when we were near the Graveyard. Each time we were not above 20 MPH. We were just cruising slowly enjoying the day. In all my years out on the lake this was by far the worst for Capt. Boneheads I have ever encountered. Was it because we finally got a nice day at the lake or what and did everyone lose their sense of driving courtesy as well? Operator age nor boat size was not a factor as all categories made the Capt's table!

I also noticed that people did not wave as has been a custom. If I waved some did wave back but I only saw a few initiate the boaters wave. Guess we are all too wraped up in ourselves to care. That is a shame.

BTW We also saw that the MP has a jet boat w/no MP markings.

They had a boat pulled over by the LI bridge and were doing a safety inspection when we saw them. Wish they had been where we were.

OK I got my rant out.

VitaBene · 08-02-2009, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just Sold

The most dangerous and this happend 2 times (a few hours apart - same boat and driver) was with an all black Ranger w/a Merc. - a young man and woman on board - that passed within 30' at high speed when we were near the Graveyard. Each time we were not above 20 MPH. We were just cruising slowly enjoying the day.

Your post illuminates what many have said on the forum. The MP could easily be able to tell a knowledgable boater from a bonehead by putting an unmarked boat at the graveyard or channel outside Ambrose Cove. In my estimation, half or more would fail that "test" and a marked boat could chat with them when they reached open water. There are too many boats on the lake for people to boat stupidly and inconsiderately.

ApS · 08-02-2009, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just Sold

"...OK I got my rant out..."

Works for me!

While the MPs are pretty well spread out on this lake, a cellphone call to NHMP headquarters (877-642-9700) could have a nearby MP alerted to these characters. Even without the bow numbers, all the MPs would need to do is "crowd them" and have their probable cause for a stop.

BTW: Did I see a (possibly unmarked MP) Donzi out there yesterday?

(Grey uniform the only clue).

VtSteve · 08-02-2009, 03:25 PM

Same over here. I was anchored on our main beach area due to the conditions. After being rocked around by people going plow speed into and out of the area, I wondered what could the LEOs be doing today that precluded them from being here, again? Not much apparently. People tubing into and out of the anchorage area, leaving on plane well before they had even cleared the second stage of boats.

We have very much the same idiots over here that make the rules, and then never enforce them. I'm never convinced anymore by the argument that they actually care.

The best way to handle these people I'm afraid, is to follow them and wait for them to be in your position, whether it be the dock, or at anchor. A huge wave is always fun

no-engine · 08-02-2009, 03:27 PM

Could do same as a friend did when healthy people park in fire zone or handicapped areas in front of store: he took picture of offending car and went to police station to make report.

fatlazyless · 08-02-2009, 04:57 PM

Yesterday seemed like the busiest boating day so far, this summer. Finally, the weather said 'real summer is here."

VtSteve · 08-02-2009, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Yesterday seemed like the busiest boating day so far, this summer. Finally, the weather said 'real summer is here."

I was out doing my Dragonboat charity paddle today. When it brains hard enough to peel paint, and three boats go over, it's not a good day.

trfour · 08-02-2009, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VtSteve

I was out doing my Dragonboat charity paddle today. When it brains hard enough to peel paint, and three boats go over, it's not a good day.

Weather can turn at any moment on this Great Lake. Over the past 25 years I have learned to watch the skys.... Mind you, I am not an expert in any way, just have been lucky enough to hit par, and we are still here, enjoying to this very day!

Rinkerfam · 08-02-2009, 10:03 PM

Saturday was out of control in my opinion. I had to come off plane a half dozen times (while having the right of way in every situation) to allow other boaters to maintain course. The Governors/Eagle nwz was so rough on the pm ride home that we actually took a wave over the bow (pretty remarkable in a 25 foot bowrider). The only silver lining was when I slowed to allow a boat with the right of way to cross my bow and the driver waved to thank me. I give the day overall a solid

VitaBene · 08-02-2009, 10:11 PM

Unfortunately, I have to assume my boat is the give way and have taught my kids the same. Defensive boating, really not much different than defensive driving.

LakeSnake · 08-03-2009, 07:50 AM

I was also out on Saturday and was very disappointed at the antics of the majority of boat drivers. Like Rinkerfan I also had to alter speed and course numerous times to avoid other boaters oblivious to their surroundings and the general boating navigation rules.

It appears to me the requirement for a safe boating cert. has accomplished nothing to make the lake a safer place to boat. I have never seen it this bad in 30+ years.

BroadHopper · 08-03-2009, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Unfortunately, I have to assume my boat is the give way and have taught my kids the same. Defensive boating, really not much different than defensive driving.

I have always consider the rule above as good defensive tactic. Unfortunately.

You should have seen the PWCs on Paugus Bay Saturday! It was like Demolition Derby! Worst I have seen!

Lake Fan · 08-03-2009, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just Sold

I was on the lake yestreday and between the southern end of Cow south of the Barber Pole and up to the Graveyard

That part of the lake (Barber Pole/Chase Point/Graveyard) has become a freeway in recent years. Our camp is in that area and despite it being in the "quiet corner" of the lake, crossing that route on the way to 19 Mile Bay has gotten hazardous to say the least. Totally agree that the "Capt. Bonehead" quotient is higher than it's ever been. Be careful out there!

Martha Marlee · 08-03-2009, 09:56 AM

Here is my rant. If your going slower then 20 MPH please do the other boaters on plane cruising somewhere the courteously to stay out of the middle of the area. We have to slow down so often bc the other boats won’t move over ( at the lawful 150 foot rule btw land and other boat) to allow another boat to pass safe. I think some people just don't (or can’t) visualize the 150 feet.
I also think so many boaters are hung up on I HAVE THE RIGHT AWAY instead of common sense /courtesy allowing EVERY one to enjoy the lake. Make room when ya can and you just may get more waves saying thanks for letting me pass safely as your just cruising.

Here’s a bone head story- pulling you children tubing with your pontoon boat at the very end of Alton Bay cutting across the whole bay as other boats try and avoid you….DuH?!

jrc · 08-03-2009, 11:51 AM

My observations this year seem to indicate no middle ground. Either the weather is crappy and the lake is deserted or the weather is nice and it's a mob seen. It seems like every nice day, everyone is making up for lost time.

To comment on Martha's comments, it does seem that any voluntary traffic alignment to improve flow has ceased. In the old days, when I was taught to drive a boat, we tried to follow general road rules.

Stay to the right side of the bay, channel or any narrow spot. If the marker was on your starboard then stay close to the marker, if the marker is on your port then stay away so oncoming boats can have room.

If a boat is coming head on, then bear right, this one is actually a rule. If you want to go fast, then go keep away from shore. If you want to go slow then go near shore.

I also like to "round" a corner rather than "cut" it. This is hard to describe, but imagine that boats coming out of the corner in the opposite direction also need room. So when you enter, make sure you enter away from where you expect then to exit.

WeirsBeachBoater · 08-03-2009, 12:30 PM

I thought the new law we can't talk about was going to be the great savior of the lake..... Not according to what I am reading above. Anyone catch the antics on the front of the Daily Sun. Unreal

kjbathe · 08-03-2009, 12:34 PM

Same experience, but in the Broads, twice while headed from Alton to Center Harbor. No other boats around, but two clowns found it necessary to come up from behind and pass within 50 feet with me going 30+ MPH. I drop off plane to comply with the law, slosh through their wake, and shrug at how -- even the open water -- the boneheads still manage to make their presence known.

Perhaps Marlee et al. got tired of waiting for us to move over...

VtSteve · 08-03-2009, 12:47 PM

It's an incredible situation, but it's happening in abundance everywhere. I don't bother with the right of way rules anymore either, makes no difference. STAY AWAY is my motto, as far away from other boaters as possible.

If you look back on the older thread, many of us pointed out what the real problems were. In a rotten summer like this one, it's understandable that there will be an overload of boaters on nice days, the few that there are. But I have to wonder about some previous reports of the calm, quiet and peaceful lake. Are there boaters that can actually block the boneheads from their mind completely?

Is there an organization setup to rid the waterways of Boneheads?

chipj29 · 08-03-2009, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VtSteve

It's an incredible situation, but it's happening in abundance everywhere. I don't bother with the right of way rules anymore either, makes no difference. STAY AWAY is my motto, as far away from other boaters as possible.
If you look back on the older thread, many of us pointed out what the real problems were. In a rotten summer like this one, it's understandable that there will be an overload of boaters on nice days, the few that there are. But I have to wonder about some previous reports of the calm, quiet and peaceful lake. Are there boaters that can actually block the boneheads from their mind completely?

Is there an organization setup to rid the waterways of Boneheads?

I always take the same approach. I would rather go a little bit out of my way, than be dead right! If you are coming in the opposite direction, I am bearing right, no matter how straight you may be coming at me.

LakeSnake · 08-03-2009, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VtSteve

It's an incredible situation, but it's happening in abundance everywhere. I don't bother with the right of way rules anymore either, makes no difference. STAY AWAY is my motto, as far away from other boaters as possible.

If you look back on the older thread, many of us pointed out what the real problems were. In a rotten summer like this one, it's understandable that there will be an overload of boaters on nice days, the few that there are. But I have to wonder about some previous reports of the calm, quiet and peaceful lake. Are there boaters that can actually block the boneheads from their mind completely?

Is there an organization setup to rid the waterways of Boneheads?

Isn't that what the safety cert was aimed at doing?
I hate to say this (it won't happen in today’s economy either) but I think any one who took the test on the internet should have to re-certify. I know when the internet option was available there where many cases of people taking the test for others as well the obvious easy task of keeping 2 windows open - one with the test and the other with the training material. Basically rendering the process a farce for anyone looking to take advantage (and we know who they are).
The proctored test should have been the rule from day one.

Mee-n-Mac · 08-03-2009, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrc

My observations this year seem to indicate no middle ground. Either the weather is crappy and the lake is deserted or the weather is nice and it's a mob seen. It seems like every nice day, everyone is making up for lost time.

To comment on Martha's comments, it does seem that any voluntary traffic alignment to improve flow has ceased. In the old days, when I was taught to drive a boat, we tried to follow general road rules.

Stay to the right side of the bay, channel or any narrow spot. If the marker was on your starboard then stay close to the marker, if the marker is on your port then stay away so oncoming boats can have room.

If a boat is coming head on, then bear right, this one is actually a rule. If you want to go fast, then go keep away from shore. If you want to go slow then go near shore.

I also like to "round" a corner rather than "cut" it. This is hard to describe, but imagine that boats coming out of the corner in the opposite direction also need room. So when you enter, make sure you enter away from where you expect then to exit.

My observations agree with yours. It's either empty due to weather or full of people with the usual mix of Capt B. I'd rate the prior weekend more chock full 'o' nuts than last weekend but I don't doubt that varies from location to location. Just a for instance ... I had 2 kids on the SeaDoo and was hugging the east shore heading up Alton Bay. I was confronted by a number of boats all coming done the bay, all wanting to be on the east side as if the west side was full of hungry mosquistos carrying the West Nile virus. Included was one bonehead towing a skier coming directly at me. So I turned to starboard, edged the shoreline even closer and let him pass port to port. As I was about to come back on plane, having let another boat (a bass boat IIRC) go by, I found the ski boat passing between me and shore going the opposite direction, about 25' away (from me, maybe 75' from shore). Apparently I was the turn buoy. This is how he won his Capt B designation. Given the reputation PWCs have for unpredictable behavior I thought his trust that I wouldn't jump up in front of him most {Spock_voice} intriguing {/Spock_voice}.

Then there was the tuber who decided that all the traffic was producing a good chop and the best chop to dislodge his rider was right by FL28 off Sandy point. That this is where all the traffic goes and that his dislodged rider just might be in danger didn't seem to jog either of his 2 working neurons.

Now is this any different then it has been for the last decade ... probably not. There's just been less sunny days this summer (and last) for Capt B to make his presence known. The contrast between "off" days and "on" days is more marked as a result.

Mee-n-Mac · 08-03-2009, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSnake

Isn't that what the safety cert was aimed at doing?
I hate to say this (it won't happen in today’s economy either) but I think any one who took the test on the internet should have to re-certify. I know when the internet option was available there where many cases of people taking the test for others as well the obvious easy task of keeping 2 windows open - one with the test and the other with the training material. Basically rendering the process a farce for anyone looking to take advantage (and we know who they are).
The proctored test should have been the rule from day one.

While any test that forces the "skipper" to become more cognizant of the rules is a good thing, the bigger problem I see is that most people seem to "bone up" for the exam the day before and then flush the knowledge out the day after. That or ignore what they've learned when they're out on the water. To be fair I think most of the boaters out there do OK, it's just that the minority of Capt B's is large enough to be a problem. Even more to the point it isn't the outright violation of the few written rules of the water that make things ugly, it's the lack of consideration and common courtesy that seemingly predominate today that make things ugly. To illustrate with just 1 example ... if you don't want to come off plane to avoid a 150' conflict then you have to leave enough room for the other guy to travel. All too often what I see (and jrc remarked on above) is a wall of boats all coming down the bay leaving no one going up the bay any room to continue travel short of coming within 150' of shore or crossing over to the "left" side of the bay. Were people to "stay right" then there would be no conflict nor angst. Alas, short of being in a defined channel, there's no written rule to require them to do so. It's just commonsense with a little consideration tossed in. Both appear to be in short supply these days, on the water or elsewhere.

VtSteve · 08-03-2009, 02:56 PM

Good points on the common sense. The unfortunate part of things like driver's licenses and the boating safety certs, is that the tests themselves do not reveal common sense. To actually think that a high percentage of boaters actually know how far 150' is is ridiculous. As many point out, too many boaters lack the common sense (or courtesy), to leave room for others. I've seen bike riders do this many times in roadways, so why should boaters be any different?

Most of our discussions are wasted I'm afraid. The voters, and even (some) groups that pretend to advocate boating safety, do absolutely nothing to lobby for more enforcement funds. Assuming the MP can do little or nothing in the way of a major Bonehead targeting campaign, I see little evidence that proctored exams would provide.

How about this? If a real bonehead is spotted by the MP, and they actually cite them for some significant behavior, A Mandatory, ON-Water test on a Weekend will be scheduled. The Boater assumes the full responsibility of whatever the MP deems a fee for this. This would actually change the culture on many lakes, and actually do something.

MJM · 08-03-2009, 03:15 PM

I think the real problem is ATTITUDE, not knowledge.
Think about it:
- Good, safe, concientious, boaters will take the course and test seriously, even welcoming an opportunity to tune up their knowledge.
- Reckless, hot-rod, self-centered types consider the course and test an inconvenience, and something to get by with the minimum.

And there are always those people that know the rules, and just ignore them. THOSE people, in my opnion, are the vast majority of the Capt B's out there.

Just Sold · 08-03-2009, 03:50 PM

I agree that a slower vessel should not hog the water like the Barber Pole so as to restrict other craft from passing but it is not always safe, possible or practicle to do so. Too many this past weekend failed to follow the rules. It was not only my experience as stated here but in other locations as well.

From the NH Boating Booklet: Then add in the 150' rule!

Boating Basics: On the Water
Navigation Rules

There are two terms that help explain these rules.

Stand-on vessel: The vessel that should maintain its course and speed
Give-way vessel: The vessel that must take early and substantial action to avoid collision by stopping, slowing down, or changing course

Types of Boating Situations	Rules: Powerboat vs. Powerboat	Rules: Powerboat vs. Sailboat
Meeting Head-On	Power vs. Power: Neither vessel is the stand-on vessel. Both vessels should keep to the starboard (right)	Power vs. Sail: The powerboat is the give-way vessel. The sailboat is the stand-on vessel.
Crossing Situations	Power vs. Power: The vessel on the operator's port (left) side is the give-way vessel. The vessel on the operator's starboard (right) side is the stand-on vessel.	Power vs. Sail: The powerboat is the give-way vessel. The sailboat is the stand-on vessel.
Overtaking	Power vs. Power: The vessel that is overtaking another vessel is the give-way vessel. The vessel being overtaken is the stand-on vessel.	Power vs. Sail: The vessel that is overtaking another vessel is the give-way vessel. The vessel being overtaken is the stand-on vessel.

Mee-n-Mac · 08-03-2009, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VtSteve

How about this? If a real bonehead is spotted by the MP, and they actually cite them for some significant behavior, A Mandatory, ON-Water test on a Weekend will be scheduled. The Boater assumes the full responsibility of whatever the MP deems a fee for this. This would actually change the culture on many lakes, and actually do something.

That might help though it's already difficult enough for the MP to patrol the lake. Adding all the manpower needed to do added on-water tests would no doubt reduce their patrol presence. Would that be a good tradeoff ... I dunno ?

But I think the real change wouldn't come from enforcing the written rules but rather in educating the masses to be a little more cognizant of the larger situation when boating and to be a bit less competitive when out there on the lake. I have no idea as to how to do this successfully. A proven method has historically been "the club" (and I don't mean the caveman kind). A newbie is inducted into the club and learns proper etiquette from it's members. Alas getting all the people to join the Fraternal Order of Friendly Boaters (FOFB, hmmmm ... gotta work on that one) is a tall order indeed.

I thought a sneaky method (to start on the kids) would be to use some of the first person shooter video game software and create a "3D" simulation of Winni on your PC (or Mac). You'd "travel" about the lake on your PC, admiring all the sights, learning all the hazards all while the software monitors your performance and gives you a rating for how well (or badly) you handled certain scenarios that required knowledge of the rules (written and unwritten) and commonsence. Extra points awarded for courteous boating. Capt B's find out that Winnie the lake monster is not just a legend. Alas I lack the skilz to accomplish such a task.

rrr · 08-03-2009, 04:17 PM

You guys would have loved to be at my house yesterday! All summer I've been ranting about how close the boats are coming especially towing skiers or tubes. Saturday, a boat went by with the skier inside my neighbor's raft! Well yesterday the marine patrol idled in - he was probably about 100' off my dock when - you guessed it - Cap'n B blew through splitting the distance between the MP boat and the dock. On go the lights, on goes the siren - they were close enough that we could hear their conversation. MP was telling Cap'n B that he was too close to the MP boat and too close to the dock. Cap'n B seemed surprised - news to him. He passed the safety inspection and received something in writing from the MP - at that point they had drifted to far for me to hear. Now he wasn't the worst I've seen - but I'm hoping that some of the others may have seen him get stopped.

VtSteve · 08-03-2009, 08:29 PM

I don't know how many people have picked up on something, something's missing here.

I rarely, if ever, hear anything about the you know whos. I know it's all about changing the culture and all, but the you know whos are rarely the big problem. Sometimes, yes, but not usually. These threads listing the boneheads are not the targeted group. Their culture is not changing at all (assuming they have any).

People are scared, worried, and generally ticked off by these idiots on the water. Yet a concentrated focus was put into place by a group of people that are rarely heard from anymore, targeting a group that, wasn't the problem. If the weather was great, and the economy great, we'd still be talking about the captain boneheads.

gtagrip · 08-04-2009, 11:27 AM

VtSteve, I was actually wondering the same thing. One of the biggest advocates of you know what has not been heard from since the you know what passed, Evenstar! I was hoping she would chime in this summer to let us know how much safer she feels on the lae this year, as we all know, she has spent a lot of time kayaking on the lake.

At 46mph Capt. B was to distracted to notice the 150' rule or see her in her kayak, however, at 45, there was all kinds of time to see her and obey the 150' rule!

caloway · 08-04-2009, 12:06 PM

45 is no magic number any more than 65 is on the highway. Reasonable people, however, wouldn't argue that we shouldn't have highway speed limits because 66 is almost always as safe as 65.

Captn B's are a separate, adjoining circle on the same Venn diagram.

Mee-n-Mac · 08-04-2009, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caloway

45 is no magic number any more than 65 is on the highway. Reasonable people, however, wouldn't argue that we shouldn't have highway speed limits because 66 is almost always as safe as 65.

I'd think you'd find a number of German drivers who would argue otherwise ... and have the data to back it up. That said, nobody would argue that a road running next to an unfenced schoolyard should be posted at 65 ... or even 45 (assuming school is in). And therein lies the rub. There is no 1 magic number/limit for all places on the lake and for all times. And the limits we do have presently don't have any firm backing from analysis or statistics. I think there is a limit to how fast a boat can go, even under favorable conditions, above which it becomes a danger to somene lying in it's path. But 45 isn't anywhere near close to it. Alas it doesn't seem that either side wanted to think to hard about the other guys viewpoint.

Kracken · 08-04-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtagrip

VtSteve, I was actually wondering the same thing. One of the biggest advocates of you know what has not been heard from since the you know what passed, Evenstar! I was hoping she would chime in this summer to let us know how much safer she feels on the lae this year, as we all know, she has spent a lot of time kayaking on the lake.

At 46mph Capt. B was to distracted to notice the 150' rule or see her in her kayak, however, at 45, there was all kinds of time to see her and obey the 150' rule!

There ya go...
you had to say it...

Its kinda like Lavern and Shirley...do you remember that show?

When ever they said something disgusting or foul... in came Lenny and Squiggy.

You just jinxed us all !!!

caloway · 08-04-2009, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mee-n-Mac

I'd think you'd find a number of German drivers who would argue otherwise ... and have the data to back it up. That said, nobody would argue that a road running next to an unfenced schoolyard should be posted at 65 ... or even 45 (assuming school is in). And therein lies the rub. There is no 1 magic number/limit for all places on the lake and for all times. And the limits we do have presently don't have any firm backing from analysis or statistics. I think there is a limit to how fast a boat can go, even under favorable conditions, above which it becomes a danger to somene lying in it's path. But 45 isn't anywhere near close to it. Alas it doesn't seem that either side wanted to think to hard about the other guys viewpoint.

Less than half of Germany's autobahn is unlimited and for the rest that is, congestion prevents people from truly speeding except during off hours. That's the reason for the decent safety numbers.

And having driven 120+ on the autobahn (in a Ford Fiesta if you can believe it), I can tell you it doesn't feel all that safe passing somebody doing 70 and certainly doesn't feel safe when passed by somebody doing 150.
As for the limit to how safe a boat can go, clearly there are some that can operate well above 45 ignoring all other factors. Going quicker decreases time to collision, increases turning radiuses and increases the amount of attention required to pilot while simultaneously increasing fatigue. These are just facts.

After stepping out of the sweet beige Fiesta at the end of my trip, I can tell you that I was mentally spent from the concentration required. Asking that of a boater bouncing around in the sun all day is a pretty tall order.

Mee-n-Mac · 08-04-2009, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caloway

Less than half of Germany's autobahn is unlimited and for the rest that is, congestion prevents people from truly speeding except during off hours. That's the reason for the decent safety numbers.

And having driven 120+ on the autobahn (in a Ford Fiesta if you can believe it), I can tell you it doesn't feel all that safe passing somebody doing 70 and certainly doesn't feel safe when passed by somebody doing 150.
As for the limit to how safe a boat can go, clearly there are some that can operate well above 45 ignoring all other factors. Going quicker decreases time to collision, increases turning radiuses and increases the amount of attention required to pilot while simultaneously increasing fatigue. These are just facts.

After stepping out of the sweet beige Fiesta at the end of my trip, I can tell you that I was mentally spent from the concentration required. Asking that of a boater bouncing around in the sun all day is a pretty tall order.

And yet despite your feelings people do run the autobahn day in, day out safely (or at least as safely as we do on our highways). You may not be used to it but obviously the Germans are. I've not asked for people in boats to be doing 150 MPH nor have I even suggested that doing 60 MPH faster than boat traffic, as close to as you are on a highway, is fine and proper. These aren't good arguments that say 45 MPH is the "magic number". Let's not be erecting strawman arguments.

And while "going faster decreases time to collision, increases turning radiuses and increases the amount of attention required" both in a car and in a boat, the real question is at what speed does the aforementioned increase to such a degree that it becomes unreasonable to expect a person to handle the situation. How would "we" determine that limit ? Should we poll peoples feelings ?

Kamper · 08-05-2009, 06:38 AM

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I respectfully request that my fellow forum members stop the speed-limit discussion. If we start going back and forth on that topic, this thread will get frozen and moved to the (frozen) speed limit forum.

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SIKSUKR · 08-05-2009, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamper

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I respectfully request that my fellow forum members stop the speed-limit discussion. If we start going back and forth on that topic, this thread will get frozen and moved to the (frozen) speed limit forum.

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So don't read the thread.Geesh,kind of reminds me of the speed limit argument.We don't like it so you can't have it.

OCDACTIVE · 08-05-2009, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

So don't read the thread.Geesh,kind of reminds me of the speed limit argument.We don't like it so you can't have it.

totally agree..

now that it is back in the legislature I am surprised it is getting frozen at all. If it up for debate at the state house is should be here as well. Especially now that it has been in force and there are results or lack there of.

webmaster · 08-05-2009, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

totally agree..

now that it is back in the legislature I am surprised it is getting frozen at all. If it up for debate at the state house is should be here as well. Especially now that it has been in force and there are results or lack there of.

What are you guys talking about? The topic was reopened as soon as I became aware of the new legislation. I would just like speed limit debates and comments to be in the Speed Limit forum. Why is that unreasonable?

OCDACTIVE · 08-05-2009, 10:10 AM

VERY SORRY Don... My bad.. I was reading earlier posts and there was one thread started by skip on the second page of the boating forum that was still locked. I didn't realize it was able to be discussed. Sorry for the confusion.

Mee-n-Mac · 08-05-2009, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

So don't read the thread.Geesh,kind of reminds me of the speed limit argument.We don't like it so you can't have it.

Actually I agree with Kamper. The topic of this thread was Capt B, not speed limits. My apologies for participating in the derailing. As Webmaster D points out we can have that discussion, just in another thread(s). It's not unreasonable to try to keep a thread somewhat on topic. I've resumed my discussion of this particular point in another post in the appropriate forum.

OCDACTIVE · 08-05-2009, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travaler18

IMO- cptn b-heads do in fact have common sense ,they DO knw the laws and they are perceptive of 150 ft .what they lack is the ability to use all that knowledge .they are blaytent in their DISREGUARD of the laws. I believe they choose to IGNORE whichever rules they break . try stopping a so called cptn -b and ask him if he realized he was braeking the law . If he WAS ignorent to the rules he would say thanks ,I didnt know ,but more then likely you would recieve a F***OFF - I DONT CARE,your not the law .I fail to believe there are that many unknowledgable boaters ,just a lot of assoles, therefore it should be (CPTN -ASSOLE)

I think you are correct...... The majority of boaters know of the 150 ft rule, however I don't think they comprehend how far that actually is. I have stopped people and said something if we come into a mutual port and they say "I was 150 ft".. Most people have trouble determining by sight 150ft is approx 1/2 a football field. A pretty big distance. Not to mention the 300ft law for PWC to land (1 full football field)

But on the most part I would agree with you. If they do not see a white boat with a radar arch they just don't care.

SIKSUKR · 08-05-2009, 09:23 PM

Fair enough and point taken.I will post in the appropriate threads.

onlywinni · 08-06-2009, 02:18 PM

I have noticed over the last few years the captains on the lake have become increasingly more inconsiderate of other boaters.

I have surmised that they are either purposely ignoring the 150 rule, the no wake areas and common courtesy or are just ignorant to the laws....

Then I realized there are just more Massachusetts Drivers up there now

ps..I am from MA and Hate MA Drivers...

NoBozo · 08-06-2009, 03:25 PM

Every year we have more New Laws enacted for everything.....but boating is on everyones mind on this forum. I'm just wondering if people just "Tune It Out" when they climb in the boat.

There are Never LESS laws to worry about this year than the last.

It's just way too complicated to keep track of every New Law AND ....ALL the Interpretations you can come up with on this forum. INFORMATION OVERLOAD.

I'm not suggesting that the lawbook be thrown overboad.... I'm suggesting maybe some people just get fed up trying to interpret every little nuance and just say..To Hell With It, I'm not out here to be constantly looking over my shoulder wondering if I broke a law 3 minutes ago.

Common courtesy is another subject.

VitaBene · 08-06-2009, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoBozo

Every year we have more New Laws enacted for everything.....but boating is on everyones mind on this forum. I'm just wondering if people just "Tune It Out" when they climb in the boat.

There are Never LESS laws to worry about this year than the last.

It's just way too complicated to keep track of every New Law AND ....ALL the Interpretations you can come up with on this forum. INFORMATION OVERLOAD.

I'm not suggesting that the lawbook be thrown overboad.... I'm suggesting maybe some people just get fed up trying to interpret every little nuance and just say..To Hell With It, I'm not out here to be constantly looking over my shoulder wondering if I broke a law 3 minutes ago.

Common courtesy is another subject.

Good point. I guess I would be happy if some folks just followed a few! When you really think of it, give way and 150" are really just common courtesy.

VtSteve · 08-06-2009, 04:08 PM

I'm sure like anything else, there are people with better ability than others. Certainly boating has it's novices and experienced boaters. Think of the people that are completely new to boating. I wrote on another thread what I though of the Boater Ed characterizations of docking maneuvers. Well, just this summer, at my very own marina, I've witnessed a few boaters doing just as their little video suggested. Funny how it worked in the cartoon

I did assist and help them out before they totaled every boat within two boat lengths. They did exactly as instructed though.

But picture this group. Never been on a boat, or certainly never have driven one. Their only assistance is a well-run marina, a helpful friend that can show them the ropes, or just wing it. This brings up an interesting point regarding the 150' rule. As I've suggested before, most people couldn't show you 150' if their lives depended on it. I prefer to use the term "safe distance". just get acclimated to a range of the infamous 150' and try to get a mental picture of it. Farther is always better. For newbies, this is especially true.

As much as I may not want to, I try to wave to all boaters. I say try, because there's no way I'll wave to that SOB that practically dumped me in the water as his little cruiser plowed by my anchored boat.

There are no TV public service ads that I know of showing proper behavior, except the wall to wall BUI ones they run occasionally. Perhaps since no accidents are being reported, it's really more of an annoyance than a real problem. Of course, some people have more common sense than others, and some are less arrogant than others. Coming into my own marina, a 30' sailboat coming directly at me, was piloted by an interesting man. I was up against the headway only markers on starboard side, he was in the middle of the channel, under power, doing about 10-12 mph, on my port side but heading towards me

I put my boat into neutral and watched. He swung by my port side, and yelled out "SAILBOATS HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY DUMBA$$". When back at port, I nicely explained tom this seasoned expert that he was wrong. He was not only going too fast in the channel, but he was not operating in a safe manner, intending fully to cut me off in a channel, I had to stop thinking a collision was imminent. He didn't agree and uttered some profainty. I didn't happen to look in the sailboat to see if there were any shiny CD's in there

Point is, attitude is a big part of the stress levels out there nowadays, has been for awhile now. There are people that get the shakes when reading about someone on plane at night, and those that simply don't appear to care what they do, just so long as you get out of their way. I personally don't want to be in either group.

The laws are/were pretty easy to understand. Basically, use some common sense, be cautious in traffic, know where you are, keep a lookout, don't get drunk. And be Nice. This isn't enough for some of the more paranoid I know. But mostly, it's the truth.

travaler18 · 08-06-2009, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VtSteve

The laws are/were pretty easy to understand. Basically, use some common sense, be cautious in traffic, know where you are, keep a lookout, don't get drunk. And be Nice. This isn't enough for some of the more paranoid I know. But mostly, it's the truth.

VTSteve -you pretty much nailed it on the head here . treat people like you would want them to treat you.do unto others and all that.

SIKSUKR · 08-07-2009, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travaler18

VTSteve -you pretty much nailed it on the head here . treat people like you would want them to treat you.do unto others and all that.

Thanks you thank you thank you!Those are words that I live by.So if some bozo cuts me off in traffic,I feel obligated to cut him off in return because he must want to be treated that way.

BroadHopper · 08-07-2009, 12:25 PM

In the Lake Winnipesaukee group, there are lots of comments on Boneheads on the lake. So this forum is not the only web site that have problems with boneheads.

Dave R · 08-07-2009, 02:17 PM

I have been taking mental note of incidents of good behavior on the lake and they FAR outnumber incidents of boneheadedness. I have also been teaching two 14 year olds and a 12 year old how to operate a boat properly all Summer and it's been fun pointing out all the situations that come up and giving direction (or quizzing) on how to handle them. I hope the kids I'm training operate with skill someday.

So far, the biggest issue I've had to deal with is trying to get the kids to maintain a heading. They are all over the place on the compass...

Wolfeboro_Baja · 08-07-2009, 03:46 PM

We went through the graveyard on Aug. 1 and had our own incident. Heading north just as we were exiting the channel, another boater was just entering the channel heading south. He wasn't doing 40-45mph but he certainly wasn't at no wake speed given the fact we were both in the channel (so in close proximity).

Judging from the descriptions of other boaters causing problems in the graveyard that day (as described in this thread), I don't think any complaints were about me so that's a relief! Lots of times I find I'm second guessing myself, wondering if I did the right thing, was I wrong or right in this, that or another situation. With so many boneheads out there, it's hard to know if I'm doing the right thing.

I also had an incident in the NWZ between Eagle and Governor's islands. As we were exiting that NWZ heading back to Wolfeboro, another boater was entering the zone, seemingly headed towards the Weirs. He waved but didn't slow down much, probably doing 25-30mph (enough to stay on plane). I'm sad to say the other boater was driving a Baja; I didn't wave back. I'm sure he thought I was being snooty but I can't witness this kind of driving and pretend not to see it and wave back, especially in an area as obvious as a posted NWZ.

MJM · 08-10-2009, 07:19 AM

I had one yesterday (8/9) that was so incredible, it's still hard to believe it happened.

Cruising across the broads, going from entrance to Winter Harbor towards Rattlesnake. 6 kids in the bow, enjoying the beautiful morning, going probably 15mph on a straight course.

I notice a bass boat behind me off the port side, coming somewhat at an angle towards us, but 100 yards or more away so no issue. A few minutes later I look again, and he's now maybe 200ft off my stern, still on my port side, with a slight (maybe 15 degrees) angle towards us. I found that odd, so I keep my eyes on him. (There are NO other boats anywhere in the area.)

The boat comes alongside me, MAYBE 20ft off!!!! Two guys, both of whom looked like responsible types (wearing PFDs, all gear was stored well, boat was in great shape, they were both sitting, didn't look like 20-something partiers).

I was stunned. So shocked I wasn't even angry. It seemed like a joke. I turn and raise my hands/shrug my shoulders and say (they were so close they could hear me) "WHAT ARE YOU DOING?!?!" They look at me, kinda shrug back as if to say "Hey, how are you, what're you trying to say?".

They went by, crossed in front of us (I had throttled down) at maybe 50ft, having stayed on their original course, and went on their way.

It was one I will never forget. It was so strange/stupid, it almost doesn't seem real!

08-02-2009, 06:47 AM	#1
Just Sold Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Suncook, NH, but at The Lake at Heart Posts: 2,615 Thanks: 1,083 Thanked 434 Times in 210 Posts	Aug 1 Capt. Bonehead's I was on the lake yestreday and between the southern end of Cow south of the Barber Pole and up to the Graveyard on no less than 5 occasions we were passed (overtaken) within 50' by other boats at high speeds. This happened with 2 different boats at different times during the day not on just one pass through the area. First we were on a 22' Sea Ray and later a 17' Chris Craft. The most dangerous and this happend 2 times (a few hours apart - same boat and driver) was with an all black Ranger w/a Merc. - a young man and woman on board - that passed within 30' at high speed when we were near the Graveyard. Each time we were not above 20 MPH. We were just cruising slowly enjoying the day. In all my years out on the lake this was by far the worst for Capt. Boneheads I have ever encountered. Was it because we finally got a nice day at the lake or what and did everyone lose their sense of driving courtesy as well? Operator age nor boat size was not a factor as all categories made the Capt's table! I also noticed that people did not wave as has been a custom. If I waved some did wave back but I only saw a few initiate the boaters wave. Guess we are all too wraped up in ourselves to care. That is a shame. BTW We also saw that the MP has a jet boat w/no MP markings. They had a boat pulled over by the LI bridge and were doing a safety inspection when we saw them. Wish they had been where we were. OK I got my rant out. __________________ Just Sold At the lake the stress of daily life just melts away. Pro Re Nata

08-02-2009, 04:57 PM	#6
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,738 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,007 Times in 735 Posts	Yesterday seemed like the busiest boating day so far, this summer. Finally, the weather said 'real summer is here." __________________ ... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake!

08-02-2009, 10:03 PM	#9
Rinkerfam Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 268 Thanks: 0 Thanked 14 Times in 8 Posts	Saturday was out of control in my opinion. I had to come off plane a half dozen times (while having the right of way in every situation) to allow other boaters to maintain course. The Governors/Eagle nwz was so rough on the pm ride home that we actually took a wave over the bow (pretty remarkable in a 25 foot bowrider). The only silver lining was when I slowed to allow a boat with the right of way to cross my bow and the driver waved to thank me. I give the day overall a solid __________________ Education is hanging around 'til you've caught on - Frost

08-02-2009, 10:11 PM	#10
VitaBene Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 3,576 Thanks: 1,611 Thanked 1,632 Times in 839 Posts	Give way Unfortunately, I have to assume my boat is the give way and have taught my kids the same. Defensive boating, really not much different than defensive driving.

08-03-2009, 09:56 AM	#14
Martha Marlee Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 14 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	My Rant Here is my rant. If your going slower then 20 MPH please do the other boaters on plane cruising somewhere the courteously to stay out of the middle of the area. We have to slow down so often bc the other boats won’t move over ( at the lawful 150 foot rule btw land and other boat) to allow another boat to pass safe. I think some people just don't (or can’t) visualize the 150 feet. I also think so many boaters are hung up on I HAVE THE RIGHT AWAY instead of common sense /courtesy allowing EVERY one to enjoy the lake. Make room when ya can and you just may get more waves saying thanks for letting me pass safely as your just cruising. Here’s a bone head story- pulling you children tubing with your pontoon boat at the very end of Alton Bay cutting across the whole bay as other boats try and avoid you….DuH?!

08-02-2009, 03:25 PM	#4
VtSteve Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,320 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 230 Thanked 361 Times in 169 Posts	Same over here. I was anchored on our main beach area due to the conditions. After being rocked around by people going plow speed into and out of the area, I wondered what could the LEOs be doing today that precluded them from being here, again? Not much apparently. People tubing into and out of the anchorage area, leaving on plane well before they had even cleared the second stage of boats. We have very much the same idiots over here that make the rules, and then never enforce them. I'm never convinced anymore by the argument that they actually care. The best way to handle these people I'm afraid, is to follow them and wait for them to be in your position, whether it be the dock, or at anchor. A huge wave is always fun

08-02-2009, 03:27 PM	#5
no-engine Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: West side Winnipesaukee, Lakes Region Posts: 516 Thanks: 20 Thanked 52 Times in 40 Posts	Could do same as a friend did when healthy people park in fire zone or handicapped areas in front of store: he took picture of offending car and went to police station to make report.

08-03-2009, 07:50 AM	#11
LakeSnake Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Pine (Alton) Mountain Posts: 138 Thanks: 39 Thanked 33 Times in 20 Posts	I was also out on Saturday and was very disappointed at the antics of the majority of boat drivers. Like Rinkerfan I also had to alter speed and course numerous times to avoid other boaters oblivious to their surroundings and the general boating navigation rules. It appears to me the requirement for a safe boating cert. has accomplished nothing to make the lake a safer place to boat. I have never seen it this bad in 30+ years.

08-03-2009, 11:51 AM	#15
jrc Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NH Posts: 2,689 Thanks: 33 Thanked 439 Times in 249 Posts	My observations this year seem to indicate no middle ground. Either the weather is crappy and the lake is deserted or the weather is nice and it's a mob seen. It seems like every nice day, everyone is making up for lost time. To comment on Martha's comments, it does seem that any voluntary traffic alignment to improve flow has ceased. In the old days, when I was taught to drive a boat, we tried to follow general road rules. Stay to the right side of the bay, channel or any narrow spot. If the marker was on your starboard then stay close to the marker, if the marker is on your port then stay away so oncoming boats can have room. If a boat is coming head on, then bear right, this one is actually a rule. If you want to go fast, then go keep away from shore. If you want to go slow then go near shore. I also like to "round" a corner rather than "cut" it. This is hard to describe, but imagine that boats coming out of the corner in the opposite direction also need room. So when you enter, make sure you enter away from where you expect then to exit.

08-03-2009, 12:30 PM	#16
WeirsBeachBoater Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 709 Blog Entries: 9 Thanks: 39 Thanked 148 Times in 65 Posts	I thought the new law we can't talk about was going to be the great savior of the lake..... Not according to what I am reading above. Anyone catch the antics on the front of the Daily Sun. Unreal

08-03-2009, 12:34 PM	#17
kjbathe Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 281 Thanks: 3 Thanked 21 Times in 11 Posts	Ayuh! Same experience, but in the Broads, twice while headed from Alton to Center Harbor. No other boats around, but two clowns found it necessary to come up from behind and pass within 50 feet with me going 30+ MPH. I drop off plane to comply with the law, slosh through their wake, and shrug at how -- even the open water -- the boneheads still manage to make their presence known. Perhaps Marlee et al. got tired of waiting for us to move over...

08-03-2009, 12:47 PM	#18
VtSteve Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,320 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 230 Thanked 361 Times in 169 Posts	It's an incredible situation, but it's happening in abundance everywhere. I don't bother with the right of way rules anymore either, makes no difference. STAY AWAY is my motto, as far away from other boaters as possible. If you look back on the older thread, many of us pointed out what the real problems were. In a rotten summer like this one, it's understandable that there will be an overload of boaters on nice days, the few that there are. But I have to wonder about some previous reports of the calm, quiet and peaceful lake. Are there boaters that can actually block the boneheads from their mind completely? Is there an organization setup to rid the waterways of Boneheads?

08-03-2009, 02:56 PM	#23
VtSteve Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,320 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 230 Thanked 361 Times in 169 Posts	Good points on the common sense. The unfortunate part of things like driver's licenses and the boating safety certs, is that the tests themselves do not reveal common sense. To actually think that a high percentage of boaters actually know how far 150' is is ridiculous. As many point out, too many boaters lack the common sense (or courtesy), to leave room for others. I've seen bike riders do this many times in roadways, so why should boaters be any different? Most of our discussions are wasted I'm afraid. The voters, and even (some) groups that pretend to advocate boating safety, do absolutely nothing to lobby for more enforcement funds. Assuming the MP can do little or nothing in the way of a major Bonehead targeting campaign, I see little evidence that proctored exams would provide. How about this? If a real bonehead is spotted by the MP, and they actually cite them for some significant behavior, A Mandatory, ON-Water test on a Weekend will be scheduled. The Boater assumes the full responsibility of whatever the MP deems a fee for this. This would actually change the culture on many lakes, and actually do something.

08-03-2009, 03:15 PM	#24
MJM Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 262 Thanks: 0 Thanked 23 Times in 11 Posts	I think the real problem is ATTITUDE, not knowledge. Think about it: - Good, safe, concientious, boaters will take the course and test seriously, even welcoming an opportunity to tune up their knowledge. - Reckless, hot-rod, self-centered types consider the course and test an inconvenience, and something to get by with the minimum. And there are always those people that know the rules, and just ignore them. THOSE people, in my opnion, are the vast majority of the Capt B's out there.

08-03-2009, 04:17 PM	#27
rrr Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Winter Harbor Posts: 214 Thanks: 75 Thanked 37 Times in 14 Posts	finally You guys would have loved to be at my house yesterday! All summer I've been ranting about how close the boats are coming especially towing skiers or tubes. Saturday, a boat went by with the skier inside my neighbor's raft! Well yesterday the marine patrol idled in - he was probably about 100' off my dock when - you guessed it - Cap'n B blew through splitting the distance between the MP boat and the dock. On go the lights, on goes the siren - they were close enough that we could hear their conversation. MP was telling Cap'n B that he was too close to the MP boat and too close to the dock. Cap'n B seemed surprised - news to him. He passed the safety inspection and received something in writing from the MP - at that point they had drifted to far for me to hear. Now he wasn't the worst I've seen - but I'm hoping that some of the others may have seen him get stopped.

08-03-2009, 08:29 PM	#28
VtSteve Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,320 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 230 Thanked 361 Times in 169 Posts	I don't know how many people have picked up on something, something's missing here. I rarely, if ever, hear anything about the you know whos. I know it's all about changing the culture and all, but the you know whos are rarely the big problem. Sometimes, yes, but not usually. These threads listing the boneheads are not the targeted group. Their culture is not changing at all (assuming they have any). People are scared, worried, and generally ticked off by these idiots on the water. Yet a concentrated focus was put into place by a group of people that are rarely heard from anymore, targeting a group that, wasn't the problem. If the weather was great, and the economy great, we'd still be talking about the captain boneheads.

08-04-2009, 11:27 AM	#29
gtagrip Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 301 Thanks: 115 Thanked 75 Times in 52 Posts	VtSteve, I was actually wondering the same thing. One of the biggest advocates of you know what has not been heard from since the you know what passed, Evenstar! I was hoping she would chime in this summer to let us know how much safer she feels on the lae this year, as we all know, she has spent a lot of time kayaking on the lake. At 46mph Capt. B was to distracted to notice the 150' rule or see her in her kayak, however, at 45, there was all kinds of time to see her and obey the 150' rule!

08-04-2009, 12:06 PM	#30
caloway Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: exeter, nh Posts: 73 Thanks: 4 Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts	No magic number 45 is no magic number any more than 65 is on the highway. Reasonable people, however, wouldn't argue that we shouldn't have highway speed limits because 66 is almost always as safe as 65. Captn B's are a separate, adjoining circle on the same Venn diagram.

08-05-2009, 06:38 AM	#35
Kamper Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Thornton's Ferry Posts: 1,302 Thanks: 67 Thanked 171 Times in 127 Posts	* * I respectfully request that my fellow forum members stop the speed-limit discussion. If we start going back and forth on that topic, this thread will get frozen and moved to the (frozen) speed limit forum. * *

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08-05-2009, 10:10 AM	#39
OCDACTIVE Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Fort Myers FL / Moultonboro Posts: 1,045 Thanks: 444 Thanked 574 Times in 178 Posts	VERY SORRY Don... My bad.. I was reading earlier posts and there was one thread started by skip on the second page of the boating forum that was still locked. I didn't realize it was able to be discussed. Sorry for the confusion. __________________ Have you had your Vessel Inspected Yet?

08-05-2009, 09:23 PM	#42
SIKSUKR Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 5,075 Thanks: 215 Thanked 903 Times in 509 Posts	My tail is between my legs Fair enough and point taken.I will post in the appropriate threads. __________________ SIKSUKR

08-06-2009, 02:18 PM	#43
onlywinni Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Laconia Posts: 108 Thanks: 6 Thanked 39 Times in 16 Posts	I have noticed over the last few years the captains on the lake have become increasingly more inconsiderate of other boaters. I have surmised that they are either purposely ignoring the 150 rule, the no wake areas and common courtesy or are just ignorant to the laws.... Then I realized there are just more Massachusetts Drivers up there now ps..I am from MA and Hate MA Drivers... __________________ *Special Thanks to the Marine Patrol for keeping us all safe on Winni*

08-06-2009, 03:25 PM	#44
NoBozo Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Portsmouth. RI Posts: 2,231 Thanks: 400 Thanked 460 Times in 308 Posts	Just Wondering Every year we have more New Laws enacted for everything.....but boating is on everyones mind on this forum. I'm just wondering if people just "Tune It Out" when they climb in the boat. There are Never LESS laws to worry about this year than the last. It's just way too complicated to keep track of every New Law AND ....ALL the Interpretations you can come up with on this forum. INFORMATION OVERLOAD. I'm not suggesting that the lawbook be thrown overboad.... I'm suggesting maybe some people just get fed up trying to interpret every little nuance and just say..To Hell With It, I'm not out here to be constantly looking over my shoulder wondering if I broke a law 3 minutes ago. Common courtesy is another subject.

08-06-2009, 04:08 PM	#46
VtSteve Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,320 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 230 Thanked 361 Times in 169 Posts	I'm sure like anything else, there are people with better ability than others. Certainly boating has it's novices and experienced boaters. Think of the people that are completely new to boating. I wrote on another thread what I though of the Boater Ed characterizations of docking maneuvers. Well, just this summer, at my very own marina, I've witnessed a few boaters doing just as their little video suggested. Funny how it worked in the cartoon I did assist and help them out before they totaled every boat within two boat lengths. They did exactly as instructed though. But picture this group. Never been on a boat, or certainly never have driven one. Their only assistance is a well-run marina, a helpful friend that can show them the ropes, or just wing it. This brings up an interesting point regarding the 150' rule. As I've suggested before, most people couldn't show you 150' if their lives depended on it. I prefer to use the term "safe distance". just get acclimated to a range of the infamous 150' and try to get a mental picture of it. Farther is always better. For newbies, this is especially true. As much as I may not want to, I try to wave to all boaters. I say try, because there's no way I'll wave to that SOB that practically dumped me in the water as his little cruiser plowed by my anchored boat. There are no TV public service ads that I know of showing proper behavior, except the wall to wall BUI ones they run occasionally. Perhaps since no accidents are being reported, it's really more of an annoyance than a real problem. Of course, some people have more common sense than others, and some are less arrogant than others. Coming into my own marina, a 30' sailboat coming directly at me, was piloted by an interesting man. I was up against the headway only markers on starboard side, he was in the middle of the channel, under power, doing about 10-12 mph, on my port side but heading towards me I put my boat into neutral and watched. He swung by my port side, and yelled out "SAILBOATS HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY DUMBA$$". When back at port, I nicely explained tom this seasoned expert that he was wrong. He was not only going too fast in the channel, but he was not operating in a safe manner, intending fully to cut me off in a channel, I had to stop thinking a collision was imminent. He didn't agree and uttered some profainty. I didn't happen to look in the sailboat to see if there were any shiny CD's in there Point is, attitude is a big part of the stress levels out there nowadays, has been for awhile now. There are people that get the shakes when reading about someone on plane at night, and those that simply don't appear to care what they do, just so long as you get out of their way. I personally don't want to be in either group. The laws are/were pretty easy to understand. Basically, use some common sense, be cautious in traffic, know where you are, keep a lookout, don't get drunk. And be Nice. This isn't enough for some of the more paranoid I know. But mostly, it's the truth.

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08-07-2009, 12:25 PM	#49
BroadHopper Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Laconia NH Posts: 5,570 Thanks: 3,206 Thanked 1,101 Times in 793 Posts	Facebook In the Lake Winnipesaukee group, there are lots of comments on Boneheads on the lake. So this forum is not the only web site that have problems with boneheads. __________________ Someday may never be an actual day.

08-07-2009, 02:17 PM	#50
Dave R Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 2,984 Thanks: 246 Thanked 743 Times in 443 Posts	I have been taking mental note of incidents of good behavior on the lake and they FAR outnumber incidents of boneheadedness. I have also been teaching two 14 year olds and a 12 year old how to operate a boat properly all Summer and it's been fun pointing out all the situations that come up and giving direction (or quizzing) on how to handle them. I hope the kids I'm training operate with skill someday. So far, the biggest issue I've had to deal with is trying to get the kids to maintain a heading. They are all over the place on the compass...

08-07-2009, 03:46 PM	#51
Wolfeboro_Baja Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Hopkinton NH Posts: 395 Thanks: 88 Thanked 80 Times in 46 Posts	We went through the graveyard on Aug. 1 and had our own incident. Heading north just as we were exiting the channel, another boater was just entering the channel heading south. He wasn't doing 40-45mph but he certainly wasn't at no wake speed given the fact we were both in the channel (so in close proximity). Judging from the descriptions of other boaters causing problems in the graveyard that day (as described in this thread), I don't think any complaints were about me so that's a relief! Lots of times I find I'm second guessing myself, wondering if I did the right thing, was I wrong or right in this, that or another situation. With so many boneheads out there, it's hard to know if I'm doing the right thing. I also had an incident in the NWZ between Eagle and Governor's islands. As we were exiting that NWZ heading back to Wolfeboro, another boater was entering the zone, seemingly headed towards the Weirs. He waved but didn't slow down much, probably doing 25-30mph (enough to stay on plane). I'm sad to say the other boater was driving a Baja; I didn't wave back. I'm sure he thought I was being snooty but I can't witness this kind of driving and pretend not to see it and wave back, especially in an area as obvious as a *posted* NWZ.

08-10-2009, 07:19 AM	#52
MJM Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 262 Thanks: 0 Thanked 23 Times in 11 Posts	Surreal I had one yesterday (8/9) that was so incredible, it's still hard to believe it happened. Cruising across the broads, going from entrance to Winter Harbor towards Rattlesnake. 6 kids in the bow, enjoying the beautiful morning, going probably 15mph on a straight course. I notice a bass boat behind me off the port side, coming somewhat at an angle towards us, but 100 yards or more away so no issue. A few minutes later I look again, and he's now maybe 200ft off my stern, still on my port side, with a slight (maybe 15 degrees) angle towards us. I found that odd, so I keep my eyes on him. (There are NO other boats anywhere in the area.) The boat comes alongside me, MAYBE 20ft off!!!! Two guys, both of whom looked like responsible types (wearing PFDs, all gear was stored well, boat was in great shape, they were both sitting, didn't look like 20-something partiers). I was stunned. So shocked I wasn't even angry. It seemed like a joke. I turn and raise my hands/shrug my shoulders and say (they were so close they could hear me) "WHAT ARE YOU DOING?!?!" They look at me, kinda shrug back as if to say "Hey, how are you, what're you trying to say?". They went by, crossed in front of us (I had throttled down) at maybe 50ft, having stayed on their original course, and went on their way. It was one I will never forget. It was so strange/stupid, it almost doesn't seem real!