City of Laconia home rentals - Page 2

joey2665 · 01-23-2019, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Major

We received Long Bay's official position on short term rentals --

"Since the City Zoning Laws ban short term rentals in Long Bay, our Board has concluded that there are no additional considerations for Rules & Regulations needed at this time to address this subject. Simply stated, short term rentals are against the law in Long Bay, and anyone that continues to rent their home for less than 185 days are subject to City Laws that involve stiff fines."

I am pleased that our Board decided to follow the law. This is good news for our community.

I disagree with the law and LB. As I have stated my neighbor in LB rented weekly for years and never had an issue and I think short term rentals are good for the community and the economy. Big note as long as they follow the the rules at LBHOA and any other city ordinances.

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Major · 01-23-2019, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

I disagree with the law and LB. As I have stated my neighbor in LB rented weekly for years and never had an issue and I think short term rentals are good for the community and the economy. Big note as long as they follow the the rules at LBHOA and any other city ordinances.

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As the great Sy Robertson said, "we can disagree to disagree!" I'm not sure how often you used the beach, but you can definitely identify the renters from the owners. Most times it's not an issue, but sometimes it is. I'd rather not deal with it at all.

joey2665 · 01-23-2019, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Major

As the great Sy Robertson said, "we can disagree to disagree!" I'm not sure how often you used the beach, but you can definitely identify the renters from the owners. Most times it's not an issue, but sometimes it is. I'd rather not deal with it at all.

I used both the beach and the pool every visit in season and yes you can tell the renters and relatives staying for "free" but I never experienced any issues and I was in Long Bay for 10 years.

I understand and respect your position.

jetskier · 01-23-2019, 01:11 PM

The issue is that city ordinance over arches any association rules. As such, the city ordinances take priority. Both SD and LB are essentially deferring to the city for any enforcement (of city ordinance). LB is restating the city ordinance and it is probably a stronger position than in the past. However, the city has indicated that enforcement is based upon complaints only.

The issue for associations such as SD and LB is that when a property is rented, the owner is not around to deal with issues. All problems become the responsibility of the board and property manager. Essentially, the community bears the cost of the rental and the individual reaps the benefit.

Some renters are terrific, but others feel that they can do whatever they want as they have paid for their vacation. It is a difficult situation as some homeowners do rely on rental income.

Jetskier

TiltonBB · 01-24-2019, 06:16 AM

From the Laconia Sun:

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...5975c80d6.html

joey2665 · 01-24-2019, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jetskier

The issue is that city ordinance over arches any association rules. As such, the city ordinances take priority. Both SD and LB are essentially deferring to the city for any enforcement (of city ordinance). LB is restating the city ordinance and it is probably a stronger position than in the past. However, the city has indicated that enforcement is based upon complaints only.

The issue for associations such as SD and LB is that when a property is rented, the owner is not around to deal with issues. All problems become the responsibility of the board and property manager. Essentially, the community bears the cost of the rental and the individual reaps the benefit.

Some renters are terrific, but others feel that they can do whatever they want as they have paid for their vacation. It is a difficult situation as some homeowners do rely on rental income.

Jetskier

I absolutely agree that all city ordnance’s and law supersede rules and regulations-of any HOA and that is the way it should be. I do not agree that the HOA bares any of the cost of renters and the problems do ultimately fall on the owner not the HOA. There are plenty of rules in place in LB and the sub HOAs in LB so if a tenant had a situation where there was any cost and been paid by the HOA the owner would have to reimburse the said costs. But as I have said in 10 years as a board members of an LB sub HOA we had renters and never had this situation.

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Woodsy · 01-24-2019, 08:36 AM

Ultimately.... the signal from Laconia (and probably most other towns) is pretty clear. You can fly under the radar and we don't care. If you pop up on our radar due to a complaint, the party is over.

What I would like to see is what the ZBA does in an area like the Weirs, as it is zoned CR not residential.

Woodsy

fatlazyless · 01-24-2019, 08:55 AM

https://www.laconianh.gov/255/Zoning-Maps : Click on the zoning map link at the top, and it shows bright yellow for the Weirs Beach residential waterfront area just to the north of The Pier, as well as to the south of the weirs channel.

Isn't the yellow for shore front residential, and the red is for commercial, so's most of the Weirs single family homes could have their Air-bnb shut down with a nosy neighbor's single phone call complaint about short term renters making too much whoopie or something?

Hellooooooo Laconia-911 ....... this is nosy neighbors John & Jane Doe over at 123 Serenity Ave ..... and the short term renters next door are way out of control ...... they are simply having tooooo much fun .....and we cannot stand it ...... any more ........ puh-lease ...... what can we do here?

.............. ......

jetskier · 01-24-2019, 09:54 AM

Hi Joey2665,

Some years back I was in the Gables and renters completely trashed the pool area (broken glass on the deck, smashed the chairs etc...). The home owner did not deal with the issue. Just an example.

There are great renters and poor renters. Some homeowners are great about vetting their renters and others are not. The other problem is many renters just don't know the rules or (in some cases, care). We have had renters show up to the beach with floatation devices that you can land an air craft carrier on...small beach, not cool.

When there are issues or complaints, it ends up in a call to security, the management company or the board. I know that there are a lot of homeowners in LB very much against rentals because of issues and this has been a discussion at the board level. The other complexity is that it is extremely hard to know who should be in the community and who should not. This makes it difficult for security etc...

As I previously said, at some level the motivation of people renting and those owning in communities like LB and SD become at odds. There are only so many nice summer days to enjoy.

So, the way it stands now if someone is going to rent it is their responsibility to make sure that their renters don't cause an issue that is going to cause someone to complain to the city. The city is the only enforcement entity in this regard. So, this becomes a self correcting situation.

Just my 2 cents.
Bruce

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Major · 01-25-2019, 09:00 AM

Instead of short term rentals, maybe the owners should open boarding houses. Interesting articles in the Daily Sun.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...b33670d60.html

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...c0cb8e394.html

In all seriousness, as taxpayers, why are we investing in downtown Laconia when these types of "investments" are being encouraged by our City leaders and our media? The City is desperate for growth, and has encouraged Section 8 housing, drug rehab centers, and now boarding houses. This is okay, but why are we even considering investing in downtown, like the Colonial Theater or the WOW Trail?

Kamper · 01-27-2019, 02:33 PM

I have to pay my taxes. They can pay theirs. In this case though, it's the renters who are supposed to pay and the home-owner is simply a collecting agent.

8gv · 01-27-2019, 04:34 PM

Maybe take down the weed flag for 5 minutes while you get your picture taken for the newspaper?

That picture does not advance their cause.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...c0cb8e394.html

jetskier · 01-30-2019, 08:01 PM

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...72f509f7c.html

TiltonBB · 01-31-2019, 07:40 AM

All of this attention because of an insignificant number of complaints.

The officials are once again talking about more regulation and expense to both the homeowner and the city. They suggest fire inspections and a local party to call if there is a parking or noise violation. Don't those parking and noise laws already exist? Isn't the police department capable of handling a noise or parking complaint?

We don't need more regulation in the "Live Free or Die" state.

joey2665 · 01-31-2019, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

All of this attention because of an insignificant number of complaints.

The officials are once again talking about more regulation and expense to both the homeowner and the city. They suggest fire inspections and a local party to call if there is a parking or noise violation. Don't those parking and noise laws already exist? Isn't the police department capable of handling a noise or parking complaint?

We don't need more regulation in the "Live Free or Die" state.

Tilton is correct. We do not need more regulations the system is in place. In my experience I find long term renters in the area have caused more damage and more issues than the short term renters who tend to be more family oriented and there to enjoy the region.

Also isn’t this an opportunity for the state to charge short term renters the occupancy tax that hotel/motel patrons pay, which means more revenue? I also do not think this will have a great effect on the local hotels and motels as short term renters like to have the efficiencies of a home with full kitchen amenities and privacy which in turn means more visitors and more revenue for businesses and the government

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greeleyhill · 01-31-2019, 07:06 PM

Spot on. A very high percentage of the short term rentals in the area are managed and run the right way. For folks who are responsible and vet their renters thoroughly, they should be allowed to continue renting their property. Good for them - they've invested in Laconia real estate and are bringing business into the area...and Laconia definitely needs it! Most guests are families, in many cases, multi-generational, who are looking to rent a home and have all the amenities of home on their family vacation - not a stay at an old/dated and crowded hotel in the summer. Hotel options are very limited. If however, there are repeat offenders who rent their homes out as 'party homes', or allow 20 people to stay in a 2 bedroom home causing parking, noise and trash issues for the neighborhood then there should be a way for the town to step in and impose a heavy fine. I'm really just not a fan of the current stance which seems to be one complaint equals a ban from renting. Seems a bit heavy handed and "un-New Hampshire -like". Final point - what does the mandatory inspection process accomplish? Not sure that solves for noise, trash and parking issues.

TiltonBB · 02-18-2019, 07:24 AM

The Laconia Daily Sun:

Marc Burrell complained to the City Council last week about any efforts to regulate short-term Airbnb-type rentals:

“If you start regulating people and start wanting to charge to come in and inspect my house, I’m just going to stop doing it. If I feel that way, how many other people feel that way? This is a tourist town. It’s always had rentals. Now with the age of the Internet, people from all over the world come here. To start regulating it because of one or two people, you are just going to lose it. It brings a lot of revenue into this town.”

Woodsy · 02-19-2019, 09:45 AM

AirBnb & VRBO are great business ideas... they just need to abide by the same rules as everyone else.

Operate in the proper zone... pay the room & meals tax... pay the income tax...

Woodsy

exlakesregioner · 02-19-2019, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

AirBnb & VRBO are great business ideas... they just need to abide by the same rules as everyone else.

Operate in the proper zone... pay the room & meals tax... pay the income tax...

Woodsy

Best quote ever!! Love it that just because we have the internet everyone should be able to do what they want. Kinda like the same deal with Uber and Lyft, for years taxi companies have had to pay $$$ for the right to do business (esp at airports) and now anyone can do it without the regs? Was always don't meet strangers from the internet, it's not safe, never get into a strangers car, it's not safe...now just call from an APP and get into a car with a stranger!!

Biggd · 02-19-2019, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exlakesregioner

Best quote ever!! Love it that just because we have the internet everyone should be able to do what they want. Kinda like the same deal with Uber and Lyft, for years taxi companies have had to pay $$$ for the right to do business (esp at airports) and now anyone can do it without the regs? Was always don't meet strangers from the internet, it's not safe, never get into a strangers car, it's not safe...now just call from an APP and get into a car with a stranger!!

I'm not sure a taxi is any safer. Bottom line, always be aware of your surroundings.

Woodsy · 02-19-2019, 07:19 PM

Interesting take. NYC is def hostile to AirBnb....... Kind of takes the "tourist area" out of the argument.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/19/tech/...ity/index.html

Woodsy

TiltonBB · 03-13-2019, 06:51 AM

The Laconia Sun has an article with the Mayor's idea of someone needing the approval of neighbors before they can rent out their house.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...3484b125f.html

The City's thought process fails to take into account the financial contribution of short term visitors. From shopping and dining to boat rentals there is a lot of money spent in the area. And, many of those visitors enjoy the area enough that they come back year after year and some even move here and buy a house.

I have a rental house on the lake and about 50% of the summer is taken every year by repeat visitors. I live next door and I notice how often they go shopping and come back with bags of groceries, clothing, or water toys for their kids. Many times they tell me about local restaurants they have found. Their shopping and spending helps keep local businesses going and local people working.

I have one neighbor who complains about everything, and it has nothing to do with renting or tenants. The people I bought that house from many years ago also had years of problems with the same neighbor and they never rented the house. I would hate to think that one person with a bad attitude could determine whether the renting could continue.

The city is making a big deal about isolated problems. We have noise regulations, parking regulations, and many other laws that help to enable people to live peacefully. If there are violations of current laws then address those violations. We don't need more rules and regulations and we don't need government increasing their reach into our lives.

WinnisquamZ · 03-13-2019, 07:24 AM

So will the neighbor that rejects a rental have to be identified? Appears to open up a case of harassment

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Biggd · 03-13-2019, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

The Laconia Sun has an article with the Mayor's idea of someone needing the approval of neighbors before they can rent out their house.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...3484b125f.html

The City's thought process fails to take into account the financial contribution of short term visitors. From shopping and dining to boat rentals there is a lot of money spent in the area. And, many of those visitors enjoy the area enough that they come back year after year and some even move here and buy a house.

I have a rental house on the lake and about 50% of the summer is taken every year by repeat visitors. I live next door and I notice how often they go shopping and come back with bags of groceries, clothing, or water toys for their kids. Many times they tell me about local restaurants they have found. Their shopping and spending helps keep local businesses going and local people working.

I have one neighbor who complains about everything, and it has nothing to do with renting or tenants. The people I bought that house from many years ago also had years of problems with the same neighbor and they never rented the house. I would hate to think that one person with a bad attitude could determine whether the renting could continue.

The city is making a big deal about isolated problems. We have noise regulations, parking regulations, and many other laws that help to enable people to live peacefully. If there are violations of current laws then address those violations. We don't need more rules and regulations and we don't need government increasing their reach into our lives.

There always one grumpy old man that hates everyone and everything in a neighborhood. We also have one in ours. I was warned ahead of time. I'm new to my neighborhood, 5 years now, and I've already caught his attention. Some people are just born to be miserable.

WinnisquamZ · 03-13-2019, 08:52 AM

Agree, however, they also have the right to enjoy their space without being harassed by others. In my opinion If the city decides to identify these individuals they are making a mistake by putting neighbors vs neighbors

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iw8surf · 03-13-2019, 03:43 PM

I’ve totally forgotten what it’s like to “live free” in NH in this last decade..

Biggd · 03-14-2019, 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iw8surf

I’ve totally forgotten what it’s like to “live free” in NH in this last decade..

There is no such thing as "live free", never has been.

tis · 03-14-2019, 07:00 AM

Unfortunately, Biggd, you are right!!

Biggd · 03-14-2019, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tis

Unfortunately, Biggd, you are right!!

If you are getting something for free it may be free to you but it's being paid for by someone else.

tis · 03-14-2019, 08:58 AM

LOL, Bigg, you are right! But I think in this case, he is talking about FREEDOM not free things. As in the freedom to do what you want with your own property...

WE don't own our property anymore. If we ever did.

Biggd · 03-14-2019, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tis

LOL, Bigg, you are right! But I think in this case, he is talking about FREEDOM not free things. As in the freedom to do what you want with your own property...

WE don't own our property anymore. If we ever did.

We are all free to live in the USA as long as we pay all our bills. Even when you die someone has to pay the tab that you left behind!
Of course, if you don't pay your bills you go to jail and get free room and board. Then the rest of us have to pay the tab.

Someone always pays, that's FREEDOM!

tis · 03-14-2019, 09:53 AM

Yep and in this case if you want to rent your property out you might or might not be able to!!!

Red apple · 03-14-2019, 11:56 AM

Oh you can rent it out....Until one person complains and yes they can do this anonymously and then you get a letter from Laconia saying to to cease and desist all rentals or you will be charged $250.00 per day. Actually not bad if your getting $10k a week! Then you can apply to go in front of the zoning board but good luck with them as they have shown there is no way to show a hardship for them to allow a rezoning. Its only a matter of time before someone with deep pockets hires the right attorney and finds a loophole to make this work. As far as state and local room taxes yes these should and need to be in forced. But now who is cheeking the home for safety items, bed bugs and everything else that hotel and motels get checked for?

Woodsy · 03-14-2019, 12:27 PM

I have no problem with short term rentals in places like the Weirs, where families have rented out their properties 2-3 weeks a year to help pay the taxes. it is 1-2 weeks a year and has been going on forever...

But....

The AirBNB/VRBO model is a business model. People (sorry TiltonBB) should not be buying houses in residential areas and running them like unlicensed no tell motels. This has a very adverse effect on the neighborhood... higher rents as commercial landlords take long-term housing off the market to cash in on more lucrative short-term rental opportunities, loss of revenue for legitimate, regulated hotels/motels. Loss of tax income (both room & meals & business) for the state & city etc etc....

The the AirBnb/VRBO landlords cite existing laws regarding noise, parking etc as adequate protection for neighborhood. But we also have existing laws regulating short term rentals on the books... that is the law that the AirBNB/VRBO folks want to forget exists. This law is just as important as the noise & parking ordinances and also exists to protect the neighborhood.

Woodsy

TiltonBB · 03-14-2019, 12:59 PM

Woodsy: No apology necessary, we can still be friends!

The problem with leaving most of it to the hotels and motels is that may not be the type of place families are looking for. Many families want the home experience from the kids sleeping in their "own" bedrooms to grilling and family dinners at the kitchen table.

In some situations, the atmosphere from a shared beach at a motel may not be what a family is looking for and by afternoon, with a lot of alcohol involved, it may present an unhealthy situation for children.

Many families get together and rent a home that will fit all of them and it would be cost prohibitive, and not provide the family experience they are looking for, at a motel. They can rent a house that sleeps the whole family for less than the cost of several motel rooms.

The contention that it has a very adverse effect on the neighborhood has not been my experience. On my street alone I am aware of several summer weekly rentals. Both from the street, and from the water, you would have no idea the property was not occupied by the owners.

I know of three local agencies that together rent over 300 waterfront homes as weekly rentals. I have used them. They take a commission and collect and pay the rooms and meals tax to the state.

One physician that rented my home called me after his vacation. It was his family's first time on the lake and they liked it so much they asked for a realtor recommendation to help them find a house. They bought a waterfront in Meredith.

We have all probably had difficult and noisy neighbors at one time or another. You have a good chance of having a neighbor whose conduct and noise you don't approve of. You have to live with it or make complaints to whatever local authority has jurisdiction and that neighbor may be there 52 weeks a year. In the event someone in your neighborhood rents to a problem tenant, they are gone in a week.

My situation may be different but I do not use AirBnB or similar sites, and I will not rent to anyone that I have not talked to first.

pault842 · 03-14-2019, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Woodsy: No apology necessary, we can still be friends!

The problem with leaving most of it to the hotels and motels is that may not be the type of place families are looking for. Many families want the home experience from the kids sleeping in their "own" bedrooms to grilling and family dinners at the kitchen table.

In some situations, the atmosphere from a shared beach at a motel may not be what a family is looking for and by afternoon, with a lot of alcohol involved, it may present an unhealthy situation for children.

Many families get together and rent a home that will fit all of them and it would be cost prohibitive, and not provide the family experience they are looking for, at a motel. They can rent a house that sleeps the whole family for less than the cost of several motel rooms.

The contention that it has a very adverse effect on the neighborhood has not been my experience. On my street alone I am aware of several summer weekly rentals. Both from the street, and from the water, you would have no idea the property was not occupied by the owners.

I know of three local agencies that together rent over 300 waterfront homes as weekly rentals. I have used them. They take a commission and collect and pay the rooms and meals tax to the state.

One physician that rented my home called me after his vacation. It was his family's first time on the lake and they liked it so much they asked for a realtor recommendation to help them find a house. They bought a waterfront in Meredith.

We have all probably had difficult and noisy neighbors at one time or another. You have a good chance of having a neighbor whose conduct and noise you don't approve of. You have to live with it or make complaints to whatever local authority has jurisdiction and that neighbor may be there 52 weeks a year. In the event someone in your neighborhood rents to a problem tenant, they are gone in a week.

My situation may be different but I do not use AirBnB or similar sites, and I will not rent to anyone that I have not talked to first.

I have both rented my vacation home, in the past, and rented vacation homes in several different parts of the country over the years, that said if I was asked to vote on it at a town meeting, I'd vote it down for residential neighborhoods. Just my $.02.

Riviera · 03-14-2019, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red apple

Looks like they are cracking down on rental homes in Laconia.

There are many arguments to this debate. You have to look at some of the old/new assumptions:

1. Zoning. Zoning was established to assure that reasonably compatible land uses were/are located in contiguous geographic locations. As an extreme example, the goal was to avoid having a commercial junk yard located next to a permanent single family residence. As zoning evolved, the land uses were further segregated, such that uses akin to apartment buildings, or resort buildings, were/are not allowed next to single family residences.

2. Single Family Zoning. Many years ago, most communities developed a zone (or zones) that allow for "single family residential" zoning. Historically, the properties in these zones were utilized as "single family - owner occupied", or less commonly, "single family - monthly/yearly lease". Prior to such technology as AirBNB, it was rare that a property in a single family zoning district would be rented on a short term weekly or daily basis.

3. Zoning Purpose. The purpose of zoning was to allow property owners to purchase property in a location where they could have a reasonable expectation as to the neighboring uses. Very few people would want to establish permanent residency next to a junkyard. Zoning is a mechanism that allows a property buyer a reasonable expectation as to what sort of neighboring use they might expect. (Remember, nobody can pick their neighbor!)

4. Zoning Argument. At one extreme, there is, and always will be, a % of the population that will argue that their individual property rights should not be encumbered by zoning. That said, most people have a fundamental belief in zoning, even if they don't believe in the specific zoning ordinances that might encumber their own property.

5. Current Technology. The advent of websites such as AirBnB allows for the relatively simple marketing/purchasing of short term (weekly/daily) rentals in areas that previously saw few, if any, short term rentals. In some instances, these short term rentals are occurring in "single family" zoning districts that have not seen any short term rental (and little long term rental) use in years past.

6. A "Neighborhood" Perspective. People that live in most residentially zoned neighborhoods look at it from the perspective of their own personal home. Most of us (not all of us) live in an area that has, historically, been occupied by long term owners, or long term rentals. Most people are not accustomed to having their neighbors change on a weekly basis. For many people, the stability of neighboring properties allows for a certain degree of presumptive quiet enjoyment.

7. A "Property/Investment" Perspective. In the last couple of years, people are purchasing what has has historically been owner occupied property with a full/partial financial objective. The goal is to recognize a certain return on investment, through short term rental.

8. The Conundrum. A small, but rising, percentage of historically permanent residences in single family zones are being rented/occupied on a shorter term basis. If you buy your dream home in a "single family" zone, should you expect that your neighboring property might be rented to ever changing owners on a weekly/weekend basis? Conversely, if you buy a property in a single family zoned district, that does not have an zoning established minimum rental period, should you be limited in your financial right to rent the property on a short term basis?

There is no perfect answer to the conundrum, but I believe the City of Laconia is going to have a contend with a difficult task. The "it's only a problem if we hear a problem" approach is not going to work. There are too many personalities at stake to fairly implement this interpretation to the current zoning ordinance.

I am of the opinion that Laconia (and every other City with resort type appeal) is going to have to take a harder look at their ordinances, and set definitive allowable rental periods in the various zones. They may even need to expand their zones, allowing for the fact that certain "single family" neighborhoods (ie, Paugus Park .... with tight density single family waterfront) have been more prone to short term rentals in the past, and therefore may be more appropriate for short term rentals in the future. Conversely, I think that there should be other single family residential areas with tight restrictions on short term rentals, such that those buyers seeking a more stable occupied neighborhood, can buy in such a neighborhood, without the expectation that an adjacent home might be operated on a more commercial, short term basis.

Note that I know there are exceptions to every rule. I am certain that there are well intentioned/proactive owners of AirBnB type residences that can/will assure that their renters will be good neighbors. That said, there are those owners that will not be so proactive, and will create the occasional nuisance to the adjacent permanent residences.

The bottom line is that zoning can't regulate the people/personalities, they can only regulate the use. Communities are going to have to come to grips with the fact that they need to further define their use regulations, allowing for all of the economic and quiet enjoyment variables that go along with zoning ordinances.

My hope is that the officials will see fit to find a way to amend the ordinances, such that they allow some degree of economic benefit from the AirBnB type phenomenon, coupled with a strong commitment to creating stable quiet neighborhoods for long term residents.

No matter what they do, they are going to irritate a lot of people. They just need to look at it with a practical eye, and make the best possible business/political decision for the community.

Biggd · 03-15-2019, 06:58 AM

I understand both sides of this debate. I know many young people in the investment business that buy homes all around the country just to rent out. To these people it's just an investment. All they care about is ROI at the end of the year. These are the kind of neighbors you don't want.

I have an acquaintance that rents a large waterfront home on Winni every year with 2 other families with teen age children. They have to rent something big because there is usually about 12 to 15 people staying there and at times they could have as many as 25. They pay big bucks, around 10K a week, and they are usually asked not to come back because of neighbor complaints. But they still seem to find a new place to rent every year. He told me there are quite a few places on the water that have been bought by groups of investers just looking to rent out.
This is the sad part of property value appreciation. You have a lot of people that are buying just as an investment. There is no pride of ownership with these purchases.

TiltonBB · 03-15-2019, 07:18 AM

There are also companies like Inspirato that own luxury homes all over the world and rent them out. It requires a membership in Inspirato. I know someone who rented a house on Nantucket last summer and a week was $56,000. Not in my world!

https://www.inspirato.com/

I know every situation is different. I live next door to my rental house so if there are unruly or problem tenants I know right away. Since 2003 I have only had two groups that I would not rent to again because of their conduct. And, as soon as I knew it was a problem I was there addressing it. I know not every rental house situation is like that.

One thing that does filter out the problem tenants is the price of admission. It is not cheap to rent a house on the lake. I have had rental property (mostly not on the lake) since 1978 and my experience is that the higher the rent, the better caliber of the tenant.

TiltonBB · 03-18-2019, 07:10 AM

If the current Laconia laws prohibit short term rentals in areas zoned residential then one would assume that only "residential" uses are permitted in those areas.

1. If you store your boat on a trailer on your property I would assume that it is permissible in a residential zone. What about when a couple of people leave their boats on trailers at your house for the off season and pay you a few dollars. I would assume that makes it a commercial use of the property. Is that a violation and will the city enforce it?

2. If you have extra dock space at your house and you rent a slip or two to people you found on Craigslist will DES call that a marina? Does DES have any zoning laws? My understanding is the Laconia regulations, and all of the town regulations around the lake, only apply to the shoreline and anything on the water is up to the state.

3. If it is not permissible for private parties to rent out boat slips at the homes that they own in residential areas how does that impact the weekly renters who bring boats to the property that they rented and use the docks at that property?

So many questions. I wish I was smarter!

birchhaven · 03-18-2019, 10:07 AM

This is an issue all over the country and the rest of the lakes/mountains in NH. With all of Laconia's issues and they have a lot. Also the fact Laconia never seems to get anything right. Why are they trying to lead? No city has really come up with a good solution for this, Laconia should try and keep there head down so to speak. There is no way they are going to come up with the perfect solution that every city in the world is looking for, they are just going to either piss off a lot of people and/or devalue a bunch of properties. They are making the issue bigger than it is IMHO and should have just stayed out of the debate.

gokart-mozart · 03-18-2019, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pault842

I have both rented my vacation home, in the past, and rented vacation homes in several different parts of the country over the years, that said if I was asked to vote on it at a town meeting, I'd vote it down for residential neighborhoods. Just my $.02.

There's another angle to this excellent discussion I would like to bring up.

I live all year round in a lakeside development. I have small children and I am as sensitive as anyone to neighbor quality.

I have never experienced an issue with short-term summer renters of my neighbors' properties. Maybe I've been lucky, maybe the $$ barrier helps with tenant quality.

On the other hand, rental of these properties for September-May (off season) tenancies has caused problems, some of them big problems, at least half the time. Maybe you get a teacher who is trying out the job and the area, but maybe you get small-time or not-so-small time drug operations or other noxious and potentially dangerous activities.

Descant · 03-18-2019, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

If the current Laconia laws prohibit short term rentals in areas zoned residential then one would assume that only "residential" uses are permitted in those areas.

1. If you store your boat on a trailer on your property I would assume that it is permissible in a residential zone. What about when a couple of people leave their boats on trailers at your house for the off season and pay you a few dollars. I would assume that makes it a commercial use of the property. Is that a violation and will the city enforce it?

2. If you have extra dock space at your house and you rent a slip or two to people you found on Craigslist will DES call that a marina? Does DES have any zoning laws? My understanding is the Laconia regulations, and all of the town regulations around the lake, only apply to the shoreline and anything on the water is up to the state.

3. If it is not permissible for private parties to rent out boat slips at the homes that they own in residential areas how does that impact the weekly renters who bring boats to the property that they rented and use the docks at that property?

So many questions. I wish I was smarter!

I think the key word here is "season". Whether you put a boat in your yard or at your dock for the season, that can easily be translated to 6 months or more, not short term, not subject to Room and Meals tax.

If you rent your house and dock by the week in the summer, or for winter skiers, you have to live in a zone where that is permitted. Residential rental is still residential, not commercial. Laconia, and most towns, has a variety of zones. For example, you can have a one person hairdresser shop, CPA office, etc. in some places, not i n others. Sometimes subject to a public hearing and permission of the Planning Board or ZBA. As I understand this thread, most of Laconia shorefront is resort/residential and you can do short term rentals. The fly in the ointment came with some short term rentals in non-permitted zones that had been ignored for some years were discovered and complaints were brought to the city.
Due diligence when buying a house used to be "Is it a good school?" and Where's the bus stop?" Now, you have to learn what your neighbors are up to, what rules the HOA has, can I have a garage sale, can I cut my grass before 9:00 am? Best one is, can a Bike Week vendor rent my front yard?

iw8surf · 03-19-2019, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Descant

I think the key word here is "season". Whether you put a boat in your yard or at your dock for the season, that can easily be translated to 6 months or more, not short term, not subject to Room and Meals tax.

If you rent your house and dock by the week in the summer, or for winter skiers, you have to live in a zone where that is permitted. Residential rental is still residential, not commercial. Laconia, and most towns, has a variety of zones. For example, you can have a one person hairdresser shop, CPA office, etc. in some places, not i n others. Sometimes subject to a public hearing and permission of the Planning Board or ZBA. As I understand this thread, most of Laconia shorefront is resort/residential and you can do short term rentals. The fly in the ointment came with some short term rentals in non-permitted zones that had been ignored for some years were discovered and complaints were brought to the city.
Due diligence when buying a house used to be "Is it a good school?" and Where's the bus stop?" Now, you have to learn what your neighbors are up to, what rules the HOA has, can I have a garage sale, can I cut my grass before 9:00 am? Best one is, can a Bike Week vendor rent my front yard?

Off topic but a year back I went electric leaf blower, weed whacker and lawnmower for my smallish yard. I mow at 6 am now if I want, its almost silent! No more waking up the neighbors aha

greeleyhill · 03-21-2019, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

If the current Laconia laws prohibit short term rentals in areas zoned residential then one would assume that only "residential" uses are permitted in those areas.

1. If you store your boat on a trailer on your property I would assume that it is permissible in a residential zone. What about when a couple of people leave their boats on trailers at your house for the off season and pay you a few dollars. I would assume that makes it a commercial use of the property. Is that a violation and will the city enforce it?

2. If you have extra dock space at your house and you rent a slip or two to people you found on Craigslist will DES call that a marina? Does DES have any zoning laws? My understanding is the Laconia regulations, and all of the town regulations around the lake, only apply to the shoreline and anything on the water is up to the state.

3. If it is not permissible for private parties to rent out boat slips at the homes that they own in residential areas how does that impact the weekly renters who bring boats to the property that they rented and use the docks at that property?

So many questions. I wish I was smarter!

What if someone, say a landscape contractor, runs their business out of their home? Is that allowed in single family residential area? What if they keep their commercial truck in their driveway or on the street with their logo displayed on the side? What if someone operates a small machine repair shop out of their garage, would that be allowed. How about a person teaching piano or guitar lessons out of their house? What if it were an electric guitar and they played with their windows open? All of these seem like legitimate business enterprises that folks would run out of their house - would these activities also be banned because of zoning laws?

joey2665 · 03-21-2019, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

If the current Laconia laws prohibit short term rentals in areas zoned residential then one would assume that only "residential" uses are permitted in those areas.

So many questions. I wish I was smarter!

With the City of Laconia I would definitely not make that assumption. Especially since this is relatively new. I do know that many HOA's in the area do not allow business of any type to be run out of homes but the city itself does allow certain types of business to be run from the home. I inquired several years ago and I know I am allowing to run my CPA practice out of my home in Laconia but later found out my HOA does not allow it.

Rusty · 03-21-2019, 09:16 AM

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...9503ee281.html

The fourth time was the charm for people seeking city approval to operate a short-term rental in a residential neighborhood.

joey2665 · 03-21-2019, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...9503ee281.html

The fourth time was the charm for people seeking city approval to operate a short-term rental in a residential neighborhood.

Not a fan of the new proposal that would allow rentals in certain areas but would "require approval on neighbors". It should be its allowed or not. You cannot leave it up to neighbors to decide if someone can or can't rent. It's like opening Pandora's box. If someone is disgruntled for unrelated issues they can just vote no

Red apple · 03-27-2019, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...9503ee281.html

The fourth time was the charm for people seeking city approval to operate a short-term rental in a residential neighborhood.

OK so how did the City see this as a "Hardship"? The others told the city basically the same thing..They were very clear in the first three hearings that needing the extra money to keep your house was not a hardship. City has issues and still waiting for someone with deep pockets to sue them on this.

joey2665 · 03-27-2019, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red apple

OK so how did the City see this as a "Hardship"? The others told the city basically the same thing..They were very clear in the first three hearings that needing the extra money to keep your house was not a hardship. City has issues and still waiting for someone with deep pockets to sue them on this.

And the end result we will all lose. I believe you are correct, someone with deep pockets will sue and the Laconia's legal fees to defend will be astronomical.

TiltonBB · 06-19-2019, 05:24 AM

A committee has forwarded their proposal for rules that would allow rentals anywhere in Laconia.

The proposed rules apply to a dwelling offered for rent for up to 184 consecutive nights. Owners would be required to apply to the city to operate a short-term rental and pay a fee, still to be determined, that would cover the costs of reviewing the property and notifying neighbors.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...b9547f675.html

joey2665 · 06-19-2019, 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

A committee has forwarded their proposal for rules that would allow rentals anywhere in Laconia.

The proposed rules apply to a dwelling offered for rent for up to 184 consecutive nights. Owners would be required to apply to the city to operate a short-term rental and pay a fee, still to be determined, that would cover the costs of reviewing the property and notifying neighbors.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...b9547f675.html

Seems to be a fair resolution. This is very similar to short term rentals is Florida. The landlord is charged a short term rental tax that is passed along to the tenant.

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Redbarn · 06-19-2019, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

Seems to be a fair resolution. This is very similar to short term rentals is Florida. The landlord is charged a short term rental tax that is passed along to the tenant.

Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

NH already has the Meals and Rentals Tax of 9%. So this would be more similar to Key West where you pay the state tax and the local tax.

The huge difference is a renter just needs to go to another town the lake to avoid the Laconia Tax. Remember this is a town that already has property taxes out of control so owners are already passing on what the market will bare of those property Taxes.

Just so we all understand what a renter pays now in fees (I can tell you first hand the market is having a hard time bearing it).

A HomeAway/VRBO fee to the home owner, is $500 per year, plus fees on every rental that vary.

The renter pays, up to $499 in home away fees plus 9% NH rentals tax, plus most places have a cleaning fee, possible other fees.

The total fees being charged to an owner and renter on a property that is ~$4500+ rental (pretty typical for a week on the lake) is an extra $1000 being shared between the owner and renter.

The result is many homeowners have has to reduce pricing slightly. Now, let us add another local tax, why would anyone rent in Laconia when they can go one town over and avoid that fee.

The result will be a potential property buyer will weight this in their decision-making process even if they don't plan to rent but like the option. They will either pay less for the property in Laconia or just elsewhere.

This applies to the entire city.

Sorry for my terrible grammer.

nitrovandam · 06-19-2019, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greeleyhill

What if someone, say a landscape contractor, runs their business out of their home? Is that allowed in single family residential area? What if they keep their commercial truck in their driveway or on the street with their logo displayed on the side? What if someone operates a small machine repair shop out of their garage, would that be allowed. How about a person teaching piano or guitar lessons out of their house? What if it were an electric guitar and they played with their windows open? All of these seem like legitimate business enterprises that folks would run out of their house - would these activities also be banned because of zoning laws?

FOUR ( 4 ) What if's....... Typical Liberal ****. Try speaking the truths not the WHAT IF'S. You voted these liberals in, You know how they work. Tax Tax tax, and now you are complaining about it. LOL. Don't like it, Move back to the state you came from. Oops, sorry , forgot, it's even worse in your home state.
Love Love Love to see this happening. You vote these Democrats in, you get to deal with their Rath. Within a few years, NH will be as bad or worse as Mass, RI, Conn and NY. Guess you guys will fit right in then huh.

Please carry on now to RUIN NEW HAMPSHIRE even more.

Woodsy · 06-19-2019, 07:47 AM

I think this is a fair resolution to a difficult problem....

YES, it cuts into the Landlords profit margin, but it also levels the playing field between the short term rentals & existing hotels/motels in the area.

AIRBNB/VRBO/HOMEAWAY etc.. should also be collecting the 9% Meals & Rentals tax.

Woodsy

Redbarn · 06-19-2019, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

I think this is a fair resolution to a difficult problem....

YES, it cuts into the Landlords profit margin, but it also levels the playing field between the short term rentals & existing hotels/motels in the area.

AIRBNB/VRBO/HOMEAWAY etc.. should also be collecting the 9% Meals & Rentals tax.

Woodsy

I get what they are trying to do but how does this solve any rental issues this just adds fees and government over cite. How does it stop noise complaints, trash etc. Checking smoke detectors etc is great but doesn't solve the neighborhood complaints.

Red apple · 06-19-2019, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redbarn

I get what they are trying to do but how does this solve any rental issues this just adds fees and government over cite. How does it stop noise complaints, trash etc. Checking smoke detectors etc is great but doesn't solve the neighborhood complaints.

Well if I read it correctly if you as the "landlord" have three complaints against you or any of your renters you loose the right to rent. This is GREAT like I said from the start of this thread the city is leaving it up to your neighbors to decide if you can rent of not.. Look at Lake Opechee as there have been two cases if not more that have gone to the city for VRBO and have loss due to neighbors complaining and both of them have sold there homes. Have also heard of of more cases or Air B&B in the area going down the same road as neighbors are fed up with them also. So at the end of the day the City of Laconia will make some extra money in fees and the neighbors will have the final say if you rent of not. Start paying off your neighbors if you want to rent!!!

Redbarn · 06-19-2019, 08:37 AM

I don't see the 3 strikes in the article, where did you read that? Or do you have inside info?

Red apple · 06-19-2019, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redbarn

I don't see the 3 strikes in the article, where did you read that? Or do you have inside info?

I will look back but read that last week in two different places. Also when was at the city meeting they told they person that got approved to rent this.

joey2665 · 06-19-2019, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red apple

I will look back but read that last week in two different places. Also when was at the city meeting they told they person that got approved to rent this.

Improbably erroneously assumed since it was not in the article that they were taking that portion out. As I stated in posts above you cannot let neighbors decide if a homeowner can or cannot short term rent their home or the obvious reasons like disgruntled neighbors ect.... Also I believe the short term renters are much more behaved than long term renters which would not be subject to this proposal at all.

Woodsy · 06-19-2019, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redbarn

I get what they are trying to do but how does this solve any rental issues this just adds fees and government over cite. How does it stop noise complaints, trash etc. Checking smoke detectors etc is great but doesn't solve the neighborhood complaints.

There are 2 options here.... ban it completely (likely to end up in court) or regulate it.

This is a start.... They are addressing the parking issue. They are requiring a Fire Dept inspection. The KEY quote from the article...

"Approved applications must be renewed yearly and can be revoked for failure to follow the regulations. Fines can also be levied if someone operates a short-term rental in violation of the rules.

There will also be procedures for neighbors to complain about noise, trash, or parking problems associated with these rentals."

So there will be procedures in place for the neighbors if they have complaints.

Woodsy

Redbarn · 06-19-2019, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

There are 2 options here.... ban it completely (likely to end up in court) or regulate it.

This is a start.... They are addressing the parking issue. They are requiring a Fire Dept inspection. The KEY quote from the article...

"Approved applications must be renewed yearly and can be revoked for failure to follow the regulations. Fines can also be levied if someone operates a short-term rental in violation of the rules.

There will also be procedures for neighbors to complain about noise, trash, or parking problems associated with these rentals."

So there will be procedures in place for the neighbors if they have complaints.

Woodsy

Understood. But why is doing nothing and enforce current trash, noise and building code laws, not an option?

HomeAway, Airbnb have been around a long time at this point and before that, you always had rental services. The short term rental problem is not nearly as big an issue in Laconia as it is said in NY or San Fran. Neither of those places has been able to solve the issue, why Laconia is trying to crack the Airbnb problem before the rest of the world is kinda crazy to me. When Laconia historically gets things wrong. Remember the article cited one complaint last year. So one complaint leads to every rental in Laconia getting new laws. Rental Places that have been rented for decades may no longer be allowed to due to a disgruntled neighbor. Seems they are solving a small problem that does not need solving, and they could just use existing laws and codes to get a fair outcome for all.

nitrovandam · 06-19-2019, 11:11 AM

The short term rental problem is not nearly as big an issue in Laconia as it is said in NY or San Fran. Neither of those places has been able to solve the issue, why Laconia is trying to crack the Airbnb problem before the rest of the world is kinda crazy to me. When Laconia historically gets things wrong.

LOL And what party runs NY and San Fran and Laconia? Are ya seeing a pattern here? Hence the DOWNFALL of The once great state of New Hampshire.
Carry on now, see what else you can ruin.

Woodsy · 06-19-2019, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redbarn

Understood. But why is doing nothing and enforce current trash, noise and building code laws, not an option?

HomeAway, Airbnb have been around a long time at this point and before that, you always had rental services. The short term rental problem is not nearly as big an issue in Laconia as it is said in NY or San Fran. Neither of those places has been able to solve the issue, why Laconia is trying to crack the Airbnb problem before the rest of the world is kinda crazy to me. When Laconia historically gets things wrong. Remember the article cited one complaint last year. So one complaint leads to every rental in Laconia getting new laws. Rental Places that have been rented for decades may no longer be allowed to due to a disgruntled neighbor. Seems they are solving a small problem that does not need solving, and they could just use existing laws and codes to get a fair outcome for all.

If you enforce the current codes... Short term rentals are not allowed at all! So if a neighbor complains, the city has no choice but to shut it down. The city cannot just turn a blind eye to people who blatantly disregard the zoning laws.

With these new rules & regulations, it seems to me they take the "neighbor shutting you down option off the table". In order to do that, they are requiring people who do the short term rentals to follow some rules to make it a safe/better experience for both the renters and the neighborhood.

Woodsy

Redbarn · 06-19-2019, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

If you enforce the current codes... Short term rentals are not allowed at all! So if a neighbor complains, the city has no choice but to shut it down. The city cannot just turn a blind eye to people who blatantly disregard the zoning laws.

With these new rules & regulations, it seems to me they take the "neighbor shutting you down option off the table". In order to do that, they are requiring people who do the short term rentals to follow some rules to make it a safe/better experience for both the renters and the neighborhood.

Woodsy

As I have said before, I don't see in the current zoning where it says it is not allowed, I have even asked the town. This is why it is commonly believed the new rule they are currently enforcing would losing in court. Like I said they should just stick to the rules on the books.

Woodsy · 06-19-2019, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redbarn

As I have said before, I don't see in the current zoning where it says it is not allowed, I have even asked the town. This is why it is commonly believed the new rule they are currently enforcing would losing in court. Like I said they should just stick to the rules on the books.

Redbarn....

It took me all of 5 minutes to find it on the Laconia City website. Currently in the RS districts (Residential Single family) of Laconia...

Hotel/Motel/Inn = Not Permitted
Boarding/Rooming/Lodging = Not Permitted
Bed & Breakfast = Conditional Use Permitted

The City has and should enforce the existing rules! Under the existing rules the short term rentals are not allowed. The City is trying to reach a compromise that is fair to all....

I have attached the Zoning doc so you can see for yourself!

Woodsy

Redbarn · 06-19-2019, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

Redbarn....

It took me all of 5 minutes to find it on the Laconia City website. Currently in the RS districts (Residential Single family) of Laconia...

Hotel/Motel/Inn = Not Permitted
Boarding/Rooming/Lodging = Not Permitted
Bed & Breakfast = Conditional Use Permitted

The City has and should enforce the existing rules! Under the existing rules the short term rentals are not allowed. The City is trying to reach a compromise that is fair to all....

I have attached the Zoning doc so you can see for yourself!

Woodsy

Short term rentals do not meet the definition of everything you just cited. We have gone through this before in this thread. I am out we are just rehashing the same things.

You keep pulling me back in haha. I don't care to comment anymore but you below post references boarding/rooming/lodging and then cites the hotel definition. All well and good but again you are mixing the current argument about the need for a variance in downtown and the need for this new thing in the current article. Hotels etc are permitted in for example the weirs. I also disagree with your view on the definition and There are work arounds. There is going be a lot of issues created from this in the weirs that did not existed before due to this. They should have left it alone.

Woodsy · 06-19-2019, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redbarn

Short term rentals do not meet the definition of everything you just cited. We have gone through this before in this thread. I am out we are just rehashing the same things.

Sorry RedBarn.....

I get that you don't like it... However, Short Term Rentals is ABSOLUTELY the same as Boarding/Rooming/Lodging category used by the City.

NH RSA on the matter....

78-A:3 Definitions
III. "Hotel" means an establishment which holds itself out to the public by offering sleeping accommodations for rent, whether or not the major portion of its operating receipts is derived from sleeping accommodations. The term includes, but is not limited to, inns, motels, tourist homes and cabins, ski dormitories, ski lodges, lodging homes, rooming houses, furnished room houses, boarding houses, private clubs, hostels, cottages, camps, chalets, barracks, dormitories, and apartments.VII. "Permanent resident" means any occupant who has occupied any room in a hotel for at least 185 consecutive days. (i.e. short term = 184 or less) (motor vehicles are 180 days or less)

Here the proposal going to the full City Council & Planning board...

Woodsy

nitrovandam · 06-19-2019, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggd

I'm not sure a taxi is any safer. Bottom line, always be aware of your surroundings.

I am and do. LOL, that's why I'm leaving. KA-BOOM !!! Carry on, Please complete you task of Ruining NH.

laketrout · 07-09-2019, 06:01 AM

I have had properties In Both Southdown and Long Bay and for a time both. July 4th week I saw many renters in Long Bay and SDS from what a friend told me South Down still has many renters. One was my neighbors house, I Said hello and it took me a few minutes and the man told me they were renting for the week. Nice folks no issues they are quieter then some of my full time neighbors. I am guessing they were relatives of the owners. Wink wink..How do you enforce or investigate that? So we now pit neighbor against neighbor in The Im Going to rat you out for renting saga.
With high taxes I’m sure the owner is trying to cover part of his taxes or Hoa’s fees. I do not rent my property out, = this is another unenforceable law and don’t we have bigger fish to fry with all the issues plaguing our cities and towns? The city of Laconia should spend a more time coming up with a Master plan for the Weirs Beach area which has languished for decades without any clear vision or direction of what it could be.

garysanfran · 07-09-2019, 06:23 AM

My neighbor (full-time resident) had 24 guests in a two bedroom house for four days. Well behaved and quieter than I was expecting. But, I would not want it all summer (or for another four days). You may be able to enforce control on short-term renters if they violate their agreement. However, I have no control, nor agreement, with my full-time neighbors, unless it gets really out-of-control... Then my relationship with them would be ruined forever.

I would imagine there are no rules regarding over night guests in one's home.

TiltonBB · 11-22-2019, 07:04 AM

It looks like Laconia officials may be softening their position on short term rentals. However, the Mayor continues to drive the discussion against them.

I disagree with his opinion that short term rentals are almost always a negative. This whole discussion is because of a few isolated incidents with problem properties

He also states that he wants to return to families in neighborhoods with more kids playing in the streets. If that is his goal here is what will help: Take away the Iphones, disconnect the cable TV, and shut off the computers. I am not advocating that but the Mayor seems to wish to go back to the 50's and 60's and that is not going to happen.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...b3bcaeb3b.html

joey2665 · 11-22-2019, 07:38 AM

Correct Tilton: it’s always a couple of rotten apples that spoil it for everyone and then the government takes overreaching drastic measures.

I’d love to see kids with less tech time and more outside time but that is a tough one. Best thing to do is keep your kids active in sports and creative activities playing in the street is just a fond memory

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TiltonBB · 12-11-2019, 07:26 AM

On Monday the City of Laconia made the mistake of passing short term rental regulations. It can only hurt the local economy. It may be the last mistake of the outgoing Mayor. But no worries, the new Mayor will make a lot of mistakes too!

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...4df3b5940.html

joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 07:48 AM

I agree TiltonBB. THIS IS A HUGE MISTAKE!! extremely overbearing regulations. This will hurt the economy and could lower property values for investment property’s not in the Weir’s.

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WinnisquamZ · 12-11-2019, 08:28 AM

I agree with the vote to regulate short term rentals. Enforcement of the regulations maybe difficult but it gives neighbors of these units something to fall back on when issues arise. If more was done by the property owners when those “bad apples” were identified it would not of had to come to this. Your anger should be directed at the absence owners not the city council who are protecting the majority of property owners in the city

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Woodsy · 12-11-2019, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

I agree TiltonBB. THIS IS A HUGE MISTAKE!! extremely overbearing regulations. This will hurt the economy and could lower property values for investment property’s not in the Weir’s.

Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

I don't agree that this will hurt the economy or cause a loss of property value. This regulation will do exactly what is intended... right or wrong, it will slow down investment owners who are just looking to make a quick unregulated buck buying up housing property for the sole purpose of airbnb/vrbo.

I do think that waterfront property should have been exempted...

Woodsy

joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

I agree with the vote to regulate short term rentals. Enforcement of the regulations maybe difficult but it gives neighbors of these units something to fall back on when issues arise. If more was done by the property owners when those “bad apples” were identified it would not of had to come to this. Your anger should be directed at the absence owners not the city council who are protecting the majority of property owners in the city

Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

I believe the whole situation was overblown by a very few bad apples and a couple of annoyed neighbors. A complete overreaction by the government as usual.

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joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

I don't agree that this will hurt the economy or cause a loss of property value. This regulation will do exactly what is intended... right or wrong, it will slow down investment owners who are just looking to make a quick unregulated buck buying up housing property for the sole purpose of airbnb/vrbo.

I do think that waterfront property should have been exempted...

Woodsy

But you said it in your post. “ slow down investment owners” which in turn reduces demand and lowers values. Investors are willing to pay a little more if they can get a good ROI.

Short term renters are not renting in downtown Laconia or anywhere that is a good distance from the lake.

Also what’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

You cannot limit you just water front, what if you have a view or are walking distance from the lake etc that opens Pandora’s box.

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FlyingScot · 12-11-2019, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

But you said it in your post. “ slow down investment owners” which in turn reduces demand and lowers values. Investors are willing to pay a little more if they can get a good ROI.

Short term renters are not renting in downtown Laconia or anywhere that is a good distance from the lake.

Also what’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

You cannot limit you just water front, what if you have a view or are walking distance from the lake etc that opens Pandora’s box.

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Paradoxically, a huge number of lakefront owners do not benefit from increased property values. Increased values are great when a person sells, but if your property is going to be in the family for decades or generations, the higher price tag does nothing until that day arrives far into the future, or your kids' or grandkids' future. In the meantime, as many have pointed out on other threads, higher lakefront property values (relative to non lakefront) increase property taxes every year.

joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Paradoxically, a huge number of lakefront owners do not benefit from increased property values. Increased values are great when a person sells, but if your property is going to be in the family for decades or generations, the higher price tag does nothing until that day arrives far into the future, or your kids' or grandkids' future. In the meantime, as many have pointed out on other threads, higher lakefront property values (relative to non lakefront) increase property taxes every year.

I think you are correct for Island Owners and maybe if it was 20+ years ago but I do not think newer owners (non Island) in the area are apt to pass along property as in previous generations.

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WinnisquamZ · 12-11-2019, 09:32 AM

For those wishing to rent or invest in the lakes region there many other towns that don’t have the regulations Laconia just passed. Also, your ROI will be greater due to lower overhead costs in those towns

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Biggd · 12-11-2019, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

For those wishing to rent or invest in the lakes region there many other towns that don’t have the regulations Laconia just passed. Also, your ROI will be greater due to lower overhead costs in those towns

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That's been one of the driving forces that is benefiting surrounding towns. Keep up the good work Laconia.

Woodsy · 12-11-2019, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

But you said it in your post. Â“ slow down investment ownersÂ” which in turn reduces demand and lowers values. Investors are willing to pay a little more if they can get a good ROI.

Short term renters are not renting in downtown Laconia or anywhere that is a good distance from the lake.

Also whatÂ’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

You cannot limit you just water front, what if you have a view or are walking distance from the lake etc that opens PandoraÂ’s box.

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You are mistaken on several issues...

The City of Laconia suffers from a lack of affordable housing and this stifles the economic growth of the city. If investors continue to buy up the existing affordable housing stock with airbnb/vrbo business plans, this problem will never be resolved.

There are airbnb/vrbo rentals all over the city. They are the reason for these strict rules. A lot of these rentals are in family neighborhoods. I would argue that an airbnb/vrbo next door would lower my property value. Nobody wants to live next to an unregulated no tell motel party house in a residential neighborhood.

You most certainly can exempt waterfront property from the airbnb ordinance. You can make exceptions for DEEDED water access as well. No exemption for water views should be allowed.

Woodsy

iw8surf · 12-11-2019, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

You are mistaken on several issues...

The City of Laconia suffers from a lack of affordable housing and this stifles the economic growth of the city. If investors continue to buy up the existing affordable housing stock with airbnb/vrbo business plans, this problem will never be resolved.

There are airbnb/vrbo rentals all over the city. They are the reason for these strict rules. A lot of these rentals are in family neighborhoods. I would argue that an airbnb/vrbo next door would lower my property value. Nobody wants to live next to an unregulated no tell motel party house in a residential neighborhood.

You most certainly can exempt waterfront property from the airbnb ordinance. You can make exceptions for DEEDED water access as well. No exemption for water views should be allowed.

Woodsy

I would much rather live next to an Air-BnB (my current neighbor on the lake rents his house every week of the summer) then some of the characters I lived next to when I previously lived in Laconia.

5 years running never had a single issue with the neighbors renters.
2 years spent in Laconia my place was broken into twice, my car window were broken once and the last straw was things were stolen from my boat which sealed the deal on Laconia for me..

Woodsy · 12-11-2019, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iw8surf

I would much rather live next to an Air-BnB (my current neighbor on the lake rents his house every week of the summer) then some of the characters I lived next to when I previously lived in Laconia.

5 years running never had a single issue with the neighbors renters.
2 years spent in Laconia my place was broken into twice, my car window were broken once and the last straw was things were stolen from my boat which sealed the deal on Laconia for me..

There is good/bad everywhere! Laconia has many issues besides airbnb/vrbo.

What happens when the airbnb/vrbo market saturates and prices drop?

Woodsy

joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodsy

You are mistaken on several issues...

The City of Laconia suffers from a lack of affordable housing and this stifles the economic growth of the city. If investors continue to buy up the existing affordable housing stock with airbnb/vrbo business plans, this problem will never be resolved.

There are airbnb/vrbo rentals all over the city. They are the reason for these strict rules. A lot of these rentals are in family neighborhoods. I would argue that an airbnb/vrbo next door would lower my property value. Nobody wants to live next to an unregulated no tell motel party house in a residential neighborhood.

You most certainly can exempt waterfront property from the airbnb ordinance. You can make exceptions for DEEDED water access as well. No exemption for water views should be allowed.

Woodsy

Sorry as an investor in the area and some to be full time resident in July we will have to agree to disagree.

Short term vacationers do not want to rent downtown or anywhere that is not a decent neighborhood and too far from the lake.

In most vacation areas such as Florida, Vermont ect where short term rentals are more prevalent it actually helps the property value not reduce it as as stated brings in investors and helps the economy.

I do not think it would be far to limit to certain areas people should be allowed to maximize their investment if they so choose.

Again this is an overextension of government regulations that were an overreaction to a very few isolated incident.

Red apple · 12-11-2019, 11:01 AM

So they passed this now what...Anyone that lives in there home more than 150 days a year (good luck to the city proving you do not) and wants to rent under 14 days at a time needs to register with the city. Lets see how that goes and how many actually do this and if they do will they pass? I know that some that I know of are in lower levels of homes and people made a "bedroom" but the the room does not have a large enough window to meet today building codes for egress so will that pass??. Next if you have this type of a rental home next to you and do not want it as you live in a residential area the way it is written (or was) just need to have three legitimate complaints whether it is noise, people on your property, parking etc, etc....and then the town will issue a cease and desist and they can no longer rent and that home and that will stay with the property even when it is sold. So why even pass this law as before this it was the same way and the city only got involved when there was issues and then issued a cease and desist.. Seams like a lot ow work was done in the city on this but the outcome was not worth the time.

TheVoiceOfReason · 12-11-2019, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

Short term vacationers do not want to rent downtown or anywhere that is not a decent neighborhood and too far from the lake.

This simply isn't true. I have firsthand knowledge of many short-term rentals in residential neighborhoods not located near the lake in Laconia.

I live in a residential neighborhood in a bordering town and have a short-term rental exposure across the street from my house. Just like anything, there are good renters and bad renters, just like there are good neighbors and bad neighbors, good boaters and bad boaters, etc. If I had my druthers I'd prefer to not have a short-term rental located across the street from my home, but there are simply too many other things to worry about than to run down to Town Hall and put up a stink about it.

joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheVoiceOfReason

This simply isn't true. I have firsthand knowledge of many short-term rentals in residential neighborhoods not located near the lake in Laconia.

I live in a residential neighborhood in a bordering town and have a short-term rental exposure across the street from my house. Just like anything, there are good renters and bad renters, just like there are good neighbors and bad neighbors, good boaters and bad boaters, etc. If I had my druthers I'd prefer to not have a short-term rental located across the street from my home, but there are simply too many other things to worry about than to run down to Town Hall and put up a stink about it.

As stated previously I disagree as someone witch investors experience in Laconia, Florida, Pennsylvania North Carolina and Illinois.

Show me actually data that proved valued decline and I will reconsider. Investors again will pay at or above market if they receive there desired ROI

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Red apple · 12-11-2019, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheVoiceOfReason

This simply isn't true. I have firsthand knowledge of many short-term rentals in residential neighborhoods not located near the lake in Laconia.

I live in a residential neighborhood in a bordering town and have a short-term rental exposure across the street from my house. Just like anything, there are good renters and bad renters, just like there are good neighbors and bad neighbors, good boaters and bad boaters, etc. If I had my druthers I'd prefer to not have a short-term rental located across the street from my home, but there are simply too many other things to worry about than to run down to Town Hall and put up a stink about it.

Fully Agree. We had weekly renters we had next to us were always respectable as they were paying big money for the week. The short term 1-3 night people are just rude and do not respect anything. Now that is just what we and some others dealt with and everyone I am sure has different situations.

WinnisquamZ · 12-11-2019, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red apple

So they passed this now what...Anyone that lives in there home more than 150 days a year (good luck to the city proving you do not) and wants to rent under 14 days at a time needs to register with the city. Lets see how that goes and how many actually do this and if they do will they pass? I know that some that I know of are in lower levels of homes and people made a "bedroom" but the the room does not have a large enough window to meet today building codes for egress so will that pass??. Next if you have this type of a rental home next to you and do not want it as you live in a residential area the way it is written (or was) just need to have three legitimate complaints whether it is noise, people on your property, parking etc, etc....and then the town will issue a cease and desist and they can no longer rent and that home and that will stay with the property even when it is sold. So why even pass this law as before this it was the same way and the city only got involved when there was issues and then issued a cease and desist.. Seams like a lot ow work was done in the city on this but the outcome was not worth the time.

Enforcement will be one startup issue. If it was me I would inform those renting units they must issue a copy of the city permit with each rental agreement signed. Also, the city should make it known by advertising and other means that permits are required. This would cover some liability if a renter must be removed from a illegal rental unit

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joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

Enforcement will be one startup issue. If it was me I would inform those renting units they must issue a copy of the city permit with each rental agreement signed. Also, the city should make it known by advertising and other means that permits are required. This would cover some liability if a renter must be removed from a illegal rental unit

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Enforcement, especially by the above standard being set will end up costing the city a fortune. Just what Laconia needs, more negative cash flow.

Red apple · 12-11-2019, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

Enforcement, especially by the above standard being set will end up costing the city a fortune. Just what Laconia needs, more negative cash flow.

Along with opening them up for lawsuits now... As once permitted and a guest gets hurt and finds a building code violation they will go after the city as well as they homeowner.

WinnisquamZ · 12-11-2019, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red apple

Along with opening them up for lawsuits now... As once permitted and a guest gets hurt and finds a building code violation they will go after the city as well as they homeowner.

A legal rental must be inspected before a permit is issued. So how would the city be liable for a illegal rental or safety violation? I see the inspection process as a opening of a can of worms. Will the city use this tool as a enforcement for other issues that may arise

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Red apple · 12-11-2019, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

A legal rental must be inspected before a permit is issued. So how would the city be liable for a illegal rental or safety violation? I see the inspection process as a opening of a can of worms. Will the city use this tool as a enforcement for other issues that may arise

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Clarify- If the city inspects it and issues a permit and then its "legal" now the city can get sued if a renter got hurt. Of course they would need to prove the City is liable but still opening up the city.

fatlazyless · 12-11-2019, 01:07 PM

From the City of Laconia web site:

www.laconianh.gov/881/Short-Term-Rentals

... includes a link to the rental eligibility rules and home/building inspection procedure that was approved when the mayor cast his tie-breaking vote for a 4-3 approval vote on Tuesday, December 10 ..... just yesterday!

As they used to say about the building inspector's job in Boston, back in the 1970's ...... 'you know the salary stinks, but the pay is great!'

Biggd · 12-11-2019, 01:09 PM

No one likes government oversight but there are people that will take advantage and bend the rules/laws to their advantage, esp when money is involved. As you can see on this forum everyone has a different view of the situation.
If you just let everyone do what ever they want without oversight then it becomes a free for all.
Just like the Dive, many people like it as long as it's not in their back yard.

joey2665 · 12-11-2019, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggd

Just like the Dive, many people like it as long as it's not in their back yard.

Not in my case. I have had several neighbors in the past short term rent and I do not have an issue with it. Only once in 8 years did I have a issue and it was taken care of immediately.

As a property owner I do not believe the city has the right to tell me how I can and can't rent my property

Biggd · 12-11-2019, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joey2665

Not in my case. I have had several neighbors in the past short term rent and I do not have an issue with it. Only once in 8 years did I have a issue and it was taken care of immediately.

As a property owner I do not believe the city has the right to tell me how I can and can't rent my property

I also have a neighbor right across the street from me that rents all summer and I've had no issues in the 5 years I've been there. But I know of others in other areas that have lots of problems. So I see the need for some kind of oversight even though it doesn't affect me personally.
I actually know of some families that rent a large high end house on Winni every summer, $10,000 a week, and they think because they pay so much money they can do what ever they please. They have to find a new place every year because they are asked not to return.
They are wonderful people in their own neighborhood but they are the renters from hell.
This is one of the reasons I never rent out my place. I occasionally let friends use it free of charge but that is rare and only people I trust that I know will treat it like their own.

01-23-2019, 01:11 PM	#104
jetskier Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: North Reading, MA and South Down Shores Posts: 851 Thanks: 57 Thanked 183 Times in 114 Posts	Kicking the can down the road The issue is that city ordinance over arches any association rules. As such, the city ordinances take priority. Both SD and LB are essentially deferring to the city for any enforcement (of city ordinance). LB is restating the city ordinance and it is probably a stronger position than in the past. However, the city has indicated that enforcement is based upon complaints only. The issue for associations such as SD and LB is that when a property is rented, the owner is not around to deal with issues. All problems become the responsibility of the board and property manager. Essentially, the community bears the cost of the rental and the individual reaps the benefit. Some renters are terrific, but others feel that they can do whatever they want as they have paid for their vacation. It is a difficult situation as some homeowners do rely on rental income. Jetskier

01-24-2019, 06:16 AM	#105
TiltonBB Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Gilford, NH and Florida Posts: 3,007 Thanks: 699 Thanked 2,203 Times in 937 Posts	Laconia ZBA Rejects Rental Request From the Laconia Sun: https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...5975c80d6.html

01-24-2019, 08:36 AM	#107
Woodsy Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weirs Beach Posts: 1,966 Thanks: 80 Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts	Ultimately.... the signal from Laconia (and probably most other towns) is pretty clear. You can fly under the radar and we don't care. If you pop up on our radar due to a complaint, the party is over. What I would like to see is what the ZBA does in an area like the Weirs, as it is zoned CR not residential. Woodsy __________________ The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid.

01-24-2019, 08:55 AM	#108
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,753 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,010 Times in 736 Posts	https://www.laconianh.gov/255/Zoning-Maps : Click on the zoning map link at the top, and it shows bright yellow for the Weirs Beach residential waterfront area just to the north of The Pier, as well as to the south of the weirs channel. Isn't the yellow for shore front residential, and the red is for commercial, so's most of the Weirs single family homes could have their Air-bnb shut down with a nosy neighbor's single phone call complaint about short term renters making too much whoopie or something? Hellooooooo Laconia-911 ....... this is nosy neighbors John & Jane Doe over at 123 Serenity Ave ..... and the short term renters next door are way out of control ...... they are simply having tooooo much fun .....and we cannot stand it ...... any more ........ puh-lease ...... what can we do here? .............. ...... __________________ ... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake!

01-24-2019, 09:54 AM	#109
jetskier Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: North Reading, MA and South Down Shores Posts: 851 Thanks: 57 Thanked 183 Times in 114 Posts	Self limiting situation Hi Joey2665, Some years back I was in the Gables and renters completely trashed the pool area (broken glass on the deck, smashed the chairs etc...). The home owner did not deal with the issue. Just an example. There are great renters and poor renters. Some homeowners are great about vetting their renters and others are not. The other problem is many renters just don't know the rules or (in some cases, care). We have had renters show up to the beach with floatation devices that you can land an air craft carrier on...small beach, not cool. When there are issues or complaints, it ends up in a call to security, the management company or the board. I know that there are a lot of homeowners in LB very much against rentals because of issues and this has been a discussion at the board level. The other complexity is that it is extremely hard to know who should be in the community and who should not. This makes it difficult for security etc... As I previously said, at some level the motivation of people renting and those owning in communities like LB and SD become at odds. There are only so many nice summer days to enjoy. So, the way it stands now if someone is going to rent it is their responsibility to make sure that their renters don't cause an issue that is going to cause someone to complain to the city. The city is the only enforcement entity in this regard. So, this becomes a self correcting situation. Just my 2 cents. Bruce Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app[/QUOTE]

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01-25-2019, 09:00 AM	#110
Major Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Laconia Posts: 1,079 Thanks: 445 Thanked 1,018 Times in 424 Posts	I've got an idea Instead of short term rentals, maybe the owners should open boarding houses. Interesting articles in the Daily Sun. https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...b33670d60.html https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...c0cb8e394.html In all seriousness, as taxpayers, why are we investing in downtown Laconia when these types of "investments" are being encouraged by our City leaders and our media? The City is desperate for growth, and has encouraged Section 8 housing, drug rehab centers, and now boarding houses. This is okay, but why are we even considering investing in downtown, like the Colonial Theater or the WOW Trail?

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01-27-2019, 02:33 PM	#111
Kamper Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Thornton's Ferry Posts: 1,306 Thanks: 67 Thanked 171 Times in 127 Posts	I have to pay my taxes. They can pay theirs. In this case though, it's the renters who are supposed to pay and the home-owner is simply a collecting agent.

01-27-2019, 04:34 PM	#112
8gv Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 2,094 Thanks: 64 Thanked 744 Times in 478 Posts	Maybe take down the weed flag for 5 minutes while you get your picture taken for the newspaper? That picture does not advance their cause. https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...c0cb8e394.html

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01-30-2019, 08:01 PM	#113
jetskier Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: North Reading, MA and South Down Shores Posts: 851 Thanks: 57 Thanked 183 Times in 114 Posts	Latest and greatest from the city of Laconia https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...72f509f7c.html

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01-31-2019, 07:40 AM	#114
TiltonBB Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Gilford, NH and Florida Posts: 3,007 Thanks: 699 Thanked 2,203 Times in 937 Posts	All of this attention because of an insignificant number of complaints. The officials are once again talking about more regulation and expense to both the homeowner and the city. They suggest fire inspections and a local party to call if there is a parking or noise violation. Don't those parking and noise laws already exist? Isn't the police department capable of handling a noise or parking complaint? We don't need more regulation in the "Live Free or Die" state.

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01-31-2019, 07:06 PM	#116
greeleyhill Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 94 Thanks: 57 Thanked 22 Times in 11 Posts	Couldn't agree more with the comments above! Spot on. A very high percentage of the short term rentals in the area are managed and run the right way. For folks who are responsible and vet their renters thoroughly, they should be allowed to continue renting their property. Good for them - they've invested in Laconia real estate and are bringing business into the area...and Laconia definitely needs it! Most guests are families, in many cases, multi-generational, who are looking to rent a home and have all the amenities of home on their family vacation - not a stay at an old/dated and crowded hotel in the summer. Hotel options are very limited. If however, there are repeat offenders who rent their homes out as 'party homes', or allow 20 people to stay in a 2 bedroom home causing parking, noise and trash issues for the neighborhood then there should be a way for the town to step in and impose a heavy fine. I'm really just not a fan of the current stance which seems to be one complaint equals a ban from renting. Seems a bit heavy handed and "un-New Hampshire -like". Final point - what does the mandatory inspection process accomplish? Not sure that solves for noise, trash and parking issues.

02-18-2019, 07:24 AM	#117
TiltonBB Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Gilford, NH and Florida Posts: 3,007 Thanks: 699 Thanked 2,203 Times in 937 Posts	Complain to the City Council The Laconia Daily Sun: Marc Burrell complained to the City Council last week about any efforts to regulate short-term Airbnb-type rentals: “If you start regulating people and start wanting to charge to come in and inspect my house, I’m just going to stop doing it. If I feel that way, how many other people feel that way? This is a tourist town. It’s always had rentals. Now with the age of the Internet, people from all over the world come here. To start regulating it because of one or two people, you are just going to lose it. It brings a lot of revenue into this town.”

02-19-2019, 09:45 AM	#118
Woodsy Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weirs Beach Posts: 1,966 Thanks: 80 Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts	AirBnb & VRBO are great business ideas... they just need to abide by the same rules as everyone else. Operate in the proper zone... pay the room & meals tax... pay the income tax... Woodsy __________________ The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid.

02-19-2019, 07:19 PM	#121
Woodsy Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weirs Beach Posts: 1,966 Thanks: 80 Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts	Interesting take. NYC is def hostile to AirBnb....... Kind of takes the "tourist area" out of the argument. https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/19/tech/...ity/index.html Woodsy __________________ The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid.

03-13-2019, 06:51 AM	#122
TiltonBB Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Gilford, NH and Florida Posts: 3,007 Thanks: 699 Thanked 2,203 Times in 937 Posts	The Laconia Sun has an article with the Mayor's idea of someone needing the approval of neighbors before they can rent out their house. https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...3484b125f.html The City's thought process fails to take into account the financial contribution of short term visitors. From shopping and dining to boat rentals there is a lot of money spent in the area. And, many of those visitors enjoy the area enough that they come back year after year and some even move here and buy a house. I have a rental house on the lake and about 50% of the summer is taken every year by repeat visitors. I live next door and I notice how often they go shopping and come back with bags of groceries, clothing, or water toys for their kids. Many times they tell me about local restaurants they have found. Their shopping and spending helps keep local businesses going and local people working. I have one neighbor who complains about everything, and it has nothing to do with renting or tenants. The people I bought that house from many years ago also had years of problems with the same neighbor and they never rented the house. I would hate to think that one person with a bad attitude could determine whether the renting could continue. The city is making a big deal about isolated problems. We have noise regulations, parking regulations, and many other laws that help to enable people to live peacefully. If there are violations of current laws then address those violations. We don't need more rules and regulations and we don't need government increasing their reach into our lives.

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03-13-2019, 07:24 AM	#123
WinnisquamZ Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 2,061 Thanks: 210 Thanked 657 Times in 437 Posts	So will the neighbor that rejects a rental have to be identified? Appears to open up a case of harassment Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

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03-13-2019, 08:52 AM	#125
WinnisquamZ Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 2,061 Thanks: 210 Thanked 657 Times in 437 Posts	Agree, however, they also have the right to enjoy their space without being harassed by others. In my opinion If the city decides to identify these individuals they are making a mistake by putting neighbors vs neighbors Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

03-13-2019, 03:43 PM	#126
iw8surf Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 191 Thanks: 12 Thanked 94 Times in 55 Posts	I’ve totally forgotten what it’s like to “live free” in NH in this last decade..

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03-14-2019, 07:00 AM	#128
tis Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,726 Thanks: 752 Thanked 1,457 Times in 1,014 Posts	Unfortunately, Biggd, you are right!!

03-14-2019, 08:58 AM	#130
tis Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,726 Thanks: 752 Thanked 1,457 Times in 1,014 Posts	LOL, Bigg, you are right! But I think in this case, he is talking about FREEDOM not free things. As in the freedom to do what you want with your own property... WE don't own our property anymore. If we ever did.

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03-14-2019, 09:53 AM	#132
tis Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,726 Thanks: 752 Thanked 1,457 Times in 1,014 Posts	Yep and in this case if you want to rent your property out you might or might not be able to!!!

03-14-2019, 11:56 AM	#133
Red apple Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Laconia Posts: 109 Thanks: 65 Thanked 18 Times in 16 Posts	Oh you can rent it out....Until one person complains and yes they can do this anonymously and then you get a letter from Laconia saying to to cease and desist all rentals or you will be charged $250.00 per day. Actually not bad if your getting $10k a week! Then you can apply to go in front of the zoning board but good luck with them as they have shown there is no way to show a hardship for them to allow a rezoning. Its only a matter of time before someone with deep pockets hires the right attorney and finds a loophole to make this work. As far as state and local room taxes yes these should and need to be in forced. But now who is cheeking the home for safety items, bed bugs and everything else that hotel and motels get checked for?

03-14-2019, 12:27 PM	#134
Woodsy Senior Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Weirs Beach Posts: 1,966 Thanks: 80 Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts	I have no problem with short term rentals in places like the Weirs, where families have rented out their properties 2-3 weeks a year to help pay the taxes. it is 1-2 weeks a year and has been going on forever... But.... The AirBNB/VRBO model is a business model. People (sorry TiltonBB) should not be buying houses in residential areas and running them like unlicensed no tell motels. This has a very adverse effect on the neighborhood... higher rents as commercial landlords take long-term housing off the market to cash in on more lucrative short-term rental opportunities, loss of revenue for legitimate, regulated hotels/motels. Loss of tax income (both room & meals & business) for the state & city etc etc.... The the AirBnb/VRBO landlords cite existing laws regarding noise, parking etc as adequate protection for neighborhood. But we also have existing laws regulating short term rentals on the books... that is the law that the AirBNB/VRBO folks want to forget exists. This law is just as important as the noise & parking ordinances and also exists to protect the neighborhood. Woodsy __________________ The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid.

03-14-2019, 12:59 PM	#135
TiltonBB Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Gilford, NH and Florida Posts: 3,007 Thanks: 699 Thanked 2,203 Times in 937 Posts	Woodsy: No apology necessary, we can still be friends! The problem with leaving most of it to the hotels and motels is that may not be the type of place families are looking for. Many families want the home experience from the kids sleeping in their "own" bedrooms to grilling and family dinners at the kitchen table. In some situations, the atmosphere from a shared beach at a motel may not be what a family is looking for and by afternoon, with a lot of alcohol involved, it may present an unhealthy situation for children. Many families get together and rent a home that will fit all of them and it would be cost prohibitive, and not provide the family experience they are looking for, at a motel. They can rent a house that sleeps the whole family for less than the cost of several motel rooms. The contention that it has a very adverse effect on the neighborhood has not been my experience. On my street alone I am aware of several summer weekly rentals. Both from the street, and from the water, you would have no idea the property was not occupied by the owners. I know of three local agencies that together rent over 300 waterfront homes as weekly rentals. I have used them. They take a commission and collect and pay the rooms and meals tax to the state. One physician that rented my home called me after his vacation. It was his family's first time on the lake and they liked it so much they asked for a realtor recommendation to help them find a house. They bought a waterfront in Meredith. We have all probably had difficult and noisy neighbors at one time or another. You have a good chance of having a neighbor whose conduct and noise you don't approve of. You have to live with it or make complaints to whatever local authority has jurisdiction and that neighbor may be there 52 weeks a year. In the event someone in your neighborhood rents to a problem tenant, they are gone in a week. My situation may be different but I do not use AirBnB or similar sites, and I will not rent to anyone that I have not talked to first.

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