"Social Distancing" at the Lake

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Major

Here is a picture from the Kendall Square T station. Easy commute today into work!

Attachment 15679

Wow, things are going sideways in MA for real!

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[Major]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

A section from my reading this morning seems apt. Excerpt from Where You'll Find Me: Risk, Decisions, and the Last Climb of Kate Matrosova.Attachment 15677Attachment 15678

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I've said it before, and I'll say it again, what was our response to the much worse (at least as of right now) H1N1 virus. We did not overreact then and destroy our economy. Did you think that event was mismanaged? Probably not since we did not have the media and social media whipping us into a frenzy.

And you assume that I haven't adapted. That isn't true. We offered our employees the option of working from home on Monday. Since last Thursday (3/12), we surveyed our employees technologies from home, outfitted them with the hardware and software to work from home, and conducted a test of our systems to make sure that it could handle the load. All went well and roughly 3/4 of our staff is working from home. Personally, I chose to work from the office.

[Major]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Wow, things are going sideways in MA for real!

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Yeah, I couldn't get the picture to rotate. It is fine on my desktop but when I uploaded it, it rotated. My apologies. Let me know if you know how to fix it.

[Top-Water]

Here you go.

[Biggd]

The best case outcome is when this has passed all the people that are preaching that we are overreacting can say "I told you so". Let's all pray that this is the the outcome because the alternative is much worse.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Major

Yeah, I couldn't get the picture to rotate. It is fine on my desktop but when I uploaded it, it rotated. My apologies. Let me know if you know how to fix it.

Just messin' with ya. I'm not totally against your way of thinking—remember I was still willing to hit up the boat show if it looked ok. My concern is that the number of cases is looking to be doubling every couple days...even with the restrictions in place.

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[Garcia]

Originally Posted by Major

Here is a picture from the Kendall Square T station. Easy commute today into work!

Attachment 15679

Just curious - do you commute from Laconia to Boston? I've always assumed from your posts you live in Laconia. If you are commuting, my guess is that not only is no one on the T, traffic on 93 is minimal as well.

[Major]

Originally Posted by Garcia

Just curious - do you commute from Laconia to Boston? I've always assumed from your posts you live in Laconia. If you are commuting, my guess is that not only is no one on the T, traffic on 93 is minimal as well.

Thanks for asking. I live in Laconia. I have an apartment in Cambridge, where my office used to be for 16 years. Our office recently moved to State Street.

My normal routine is that I drive down Monday morning and stay in the apartment Monday-Wednesday, and return home Thursday evening where I work from home on Friday. I have been doing this for 12 years, and the last three I have shared the apartment with my youngest son who also works on State Street.

It's tough, but I make the most of it on weekends. When I'm down here, I'm here to work. The last few days I've had a chance to catch up with the Forum, which as I can tell by the responses to my posts, everyone is thrilled!

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Just messin' with ya. I'm not totally against your way of thinking—remember I was still willing to hit up the boat show if it looked ok. My concern is that the number of cases is looking to be doubling every couple days...even with the restrictions in place.

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The increase in reported cases may be due to more testing, at least in part.


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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

And you assume that I haven't adapted. That isn't true. We offered our employees the option of working from home on Monday. Since last Thursday (3/12), we surveyed our employees technologies from home, outfitted them with the hardware and software to work from home, and conducted a test of our systems to make sure that it could handle the load. All went well and roughly 3/4 of our staff is working from home. Personally, I chose to work from the office.

Nice that your business has complied with the recommendations. But with all due respect, you have made it very clear to the group that you have not adapted personally. You noted this on restaurants a day or two ago, and you note it on work today.

[webmaster]

Originally Posted by Major

Yeah, I couldn't get the picture to rotate. It is fine on my desktop but when I uploaded it, it rotated. My apologies. Let me know if you know how to fix it.

I've rotated it for you using an image editor. If you're interested here's an article explaining why this happens (usually with cell phone pictures):

https://www.howtogeek.com/254830/why...ectly-rotated/

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Nice that your business has complied with the recommendations. But with all due respect, you have made it very clear to the group that you have not adapted personally. You noted this on restaurants a day or two ago, and you note it on work today.

As far as I know, I still have the right to go to work. It is a recommendation only. That may change, however. I heard Tall Deval is speaking right now.

[PENIVISA]

Some people are more selfish than others.
Not being critical,just stating a fact.
Either your part of the problem or part of the solution.
I`m sure there is a grey area were we are sometimes part of one and part of another.
I`m doing my part and waiting for ice out.
Be safe,stay healthy and be kind to one another

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Nice that your business has complied with the recommendations. But with all due respect, you have made it very clear to the group that you have not adapted personally. You noted this on restaurants a day or two ago, and you note it on work today.

As far as I know you are under no legal obligation to comply with a recommendation as such Major should not be chastised as he is not breaking the law and if he, which I am pretty sure he is, taking the proper precautions while traveling and at work there should be no issue.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

As far as I know, I still have the right to go to work. It is a recommendation only. That may change, however. I heard Tall Deval is speaking right now.

Absolutely you have the right, but that was not the point of Think's thought-provoking post. The point was that different personalities choose different paths when faced with new information/decision points.

I'm not sure if it's ironic or completely predictable that you've now pushed back twice while seeming to have ignored the central idea...which is largely about ignoring...

[Major]

Originally Posted by PENIVISA

Some people are more selfish than others.
Not being critical,just stating a fact.
Either your part of the problem or part of the solution.
I`m sure there is a grey area were we are sometimes part of one and part of another.
I`m doing my part and waiting for ice out.
Be safe,stay healthy and be kind to one another

I fail to see the selfish part. I have a family. Our business has 50+ employees. We need to process payrolls, regardless of the Chinese coronavirus and the restrictions on our liberties placed on us by our government. As Joey stated, I'm not breaking the law.

I refuse to be scared. This is a complete overreaction in my opinion. As long as I have the RIGHT to go to work, I will. You can label me all you want. You don't want to hear how I would label you.

[thinkxingu]

https://www.wmur.com/article/lawsuit...ings/31783947#

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[TheRoBoat]

Reported cases/Population

NH - 39/1.3M

Maine - 42/1.3M

CA - 900/40M

While it is very early, both NH and ME are reporting a higher rate of infection than CA. Our number will go up a lot in the coming weeks.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by TheRoBoat

Reported cases/Population

NH - 39/1.3M

Maine - 42/1.3M

CA - 900/40M

While it is very early, both NH and ME are reporting a higher rate of infection than CA. Our number will go up a lot in the coming weeks.

And you now this with certainty because..........

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by Major

I refuse to be scared. \

Right there with you. In fact I have been at work every day since this thing broke pulling very long hours. Ironically enough..... there is a good reason for it. I happen to work for a Pharma company that specializes in hosting clinical trials for the big drug companies. Over the past week and a half there have been several of us who have been here engineering and setting up the necessary infrastructure to support 3 new clinical trials for COVID-19 treatments. This required us to be on site to get this done.

This is going to benefit everyone potentially and I'll be damned if I would sit at home and cower in fear when there is work to be done. Many are out there risking exposure to save or help others, and to them all THANK YOU! Our medical professionals and scientists especially are owed a great deal of gratitude for what they do.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by joey2665

And you now this with certainty because..........

Clearly NH is not sufficiently "socially distanced" from CA.

[Major]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

Right there with you. In fact I have been at work every day since this thing broke pulling very long hours. Ironically enough..... there is a good reason for it. I happen to work for a Pharma company that specializes in hosting clinical trials for the big drug companies. Over the past week and a half there have been several of us who have been here engineering and setting up the necessary infrastructure to support 3 new clinical trials for COVID-19 treatments. This required us to be on site to get this done.

This is going to benefit everyone potentially and I'll be damned if I would sit at home and cower in fear when there is work to be done. Many are out there risking exposure to save or help others, and to them all THANK YOU! Our medical professionals and scientists especially are owed a great deal of gratitude for what they do.

I would thank you, but the thank button is broken!

[Jeanzb1]

One of my sons live out in Washington state, and he is 95% sure he has coronavirus. He has been keeping a journal for the last week of all his symptoms. He tells me the hospitals request you stay home and self-quarantine, even if you think you are infected, because
1) they don’t want you to spread the virus;
2) there are nowhere near enough testing kits except for the very sickest patients; 3) there’s nothing they can do to help. You should ONLY go to the hospital if you are having trouble breathing. He also tells me it is so prevalent out there that if you haven’t already gotten it, you probably will very soon. So the point I want to make is that, in reality, the numbers of reported cases in the media are FAR FAR HIGHER.


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[Top-Water]

Originally Posted by Major

I would thank you, but the thank button is broken!

Just an FYI ...... there is a limit on how much you can use it in one day.


I think it is limited to 4 or 5 times per day.

[TheRoBoat]

Which part? The numbers, or the prediction that CA’s number of infected is going to go up?

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by TheRoBoat

Which part? The numbers, or the prediction that CA’s number of infected is going to go up?

The prediction and you didn't specify which states numbers would significantly increase

[Top-Water]

Gentlmen sincerly I enjoy all of your postings, you all seem to have good souls.

However ....... have a cookie, ... I promise by the the time your done eating it "you will feel right as rain'.




Sadly this whole thing is driving us all nuts. There are valid argumnets on both sides of this.

Like Tic tack toe ,,,,,,, you cant win.

[TheRoBoat]

Sadly, all state's numbers are going to go up.

The prediction?

In California, we are required, by law, to know how to operate tarot cards, crystal balls, and Ouija boards.

After this, I’m sure we will be required to own them as well.

Damn government.

[Biggd]

I just read a perfect quote, "it's sure easy to hate government until you need them".

[Merrymeeting]

This thread is a classic example of internet arguments where both (several?) sides are dug in, advocating their beliefs, in the hope that they will sway the other side...which rarely happens.

It's also a case where I hope those who claim we are overreacting are right. When all is said and done, if its a minimal event, they will be "right". But maybe they will be "right" because of the steps that were taken. Either way, I hope it becomes a non-event. Kind of like Y2K, which I was intimately involved in. It was a non-event. But only because many, many people prepared for a long time to make sure it wasn't.

Should you have any doubt that we need to do something, read here. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...-scenario.html

Use the slider to show how things could change if the infection rate is 30% and fatality rate is 1%. It's eye opening. Theoretical? Yes.

But I hope all the models are wrong, all the steps are "wrong", and we have another "non-event"

[JEEPONLY]

Originally Posted by joey2665

As far as I know you are under no legal obligation to comply with a recommendation as such Major should not be chastised as he is not breaking the law and if he, which I am pretty sure he is, taking the proper precautions while traveling and at work there should be no issue.

The law v. moral obligation!

Thank you. Major = The man with the unknown name! Love him or hate him!

[Major]

Originally Posted by JEEPONLY

The law v. moral obligation!

Thank you. Major = The man with the unknown name! Love him or hate him!

I would hope I’m not hated just because I have differing opinions from time to time! By the way, my name is Keith.


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[Major]

https://video.search.yahoo.com/video...sigi=12oge8qap


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[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Major

https://video.search.yahoo.com/video...sigi=12oge8qap


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Keith that is awesome!!!!!!

[JEEPONLY]

I was thinking more this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-k_BW8iLkk

[erick26]

Originally Posted by Major

I would hope I’m not hated just because I have differing opinions from time to time! By the way, my name is Keith.


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Opinions and actions are different - your opinions won’t hurt someone but your actions can


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[Major]

Originally Posted by erick26

Opinions and actions are different - your opinions won’t hurt someone but your actions can


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Do you know for sure? Sounds like an opinion to me.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

Do you know for sure? Sounds like an opinion to me.

I'm with you on it being an opinion.

But it is an opinion shared by virtually every medical and political leader in the entire world. This would include Donald Trump, and what I would assume is your favorite TV source, Fox News. Here's an overview of how their opinions have evolved over the past few weeks. You can skip the editorial if you'd like to avoid bias, but the video clips are all facts (i.e. it's a fact that certain people said certain things at certain times).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/video...8c0_video.html

I look forward to your opinion on their more recent statements

[PENIVISA]

Originally Posted by Major

I fail to see the selfish part. I have a family. Our business has 50+ employees. We need to process payrolls, regardless of the Chinese coronavirus and the restrictions on our liberties placed on us by our government. As Joey stated, I'm not breaking the law.

I refuse to be scared. This is a complete overreaction in my opinion. As long as I have the RIGHT to go to work, I will. You can label me all you want. You don't want to hear how I would label you.

Major,
So I was just stating a fact about people. If the shoe fits wear it.
Show your true colors and label me.

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

I'm with you on it being an opinion.

But it is an opinion shared by virtually every medical and political leader in the entire world. This would include Donald Trump, and what I would assume is your favorite TV source, Fox News. Here's an overview of how their opinions have evolved over the past few weeks. You can skip the editorial if you'd like to avoid bias, but the video clips are all facts (i.e. it's a fact that certain people said certain things at certain times).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/video...8c0_video.html

I look forward to your opinion on their more recent statements

Unfortunately, our president had no choice. The media and social media has whipped us up into such a frenzy that politically he could not take more metered actions to avoid destroying what otherwise was a booming economy. I'm not sure he really believes it. However, he has to politically.

I am not impressed by the so-called experts, who for the most part are government employees who have a vested interest in making a mountain out of a molehill. I've made the comparison before, but there are so-called experts who say that manmade climate change is an existential threat.

I've asked this many times with absolutely no response. Where was all of the hand waving and hysteria for the much worse H1N1 virus? Don't tell me the Chinese coronavirus is worse, the comparative numbers do not bear it out. Where are the Forum threads demanding that we destroy our economy to save lives.

As stated before by many others, I think we've exhausted this topic. I have my opinion, everyone else has theirs. I am as resolute if not more so than before just as others are with their views. The one good thing from this is that the President's approval rating is skyrocketing, which given the press against him, is a pretty good result. Even political rivals are praising him. I think history will treat him well on this.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

Unfortunately, our president had no choice. The media and social media has whipped us up into such a frenzy that politically he could not take more metered actions to avoid destroying what otherwise was a booming economy. I'm not sure he really believes it. However, he has to politically.

I am not impressed by the so-called experts, who for the most part are government employees who have a vested interest in making a mountain out of a molehill. I've made the comparison before, but there are so-called experts who say that manmade climate change is an existential threat.

I've asked this many times with absolutely no response. Where was all of the hand waving and hysteria for the much worse H1N1 virus? Don't tell me the Chinese coronavirus is worse, the comparative numbers do not bear it out. Where are the Forum threads demanding that we destroy our economy to save lives.

As stated before by many others, I think we've exhausted this topic. I have my opinion, everyone else has theirs. I am as resolute if not more so than before just as others are with their views. The one good thing from this is that the President's approval rating is skyrocketing, which given the press against him, is a pretty good result. Even political rivals are praising him. I think history will treat him well on this.

Once again you have evaded the central question of a post that disagrees with you. The link has a series of quotes from Fox news--an organization that has evolved remarkably as new information has come in. I hope you will let us know if you agree with their recent opinions.

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Once again you have evaded the central question of a post that disagrees with you. The link has a series of quotes from Fox news--an organization that has evolved remarkably as new information has come in. I hope you will let us know if you agree with their recent opinions.

No I don't. There's a lot of money involved in hyping the Chinese coronavirus. They are jumping on the bandwagon.

Now answer my question, where were you and everyone else for the much worse H1N1 virus? Did the fact that we had a savior as president and a complicit press have anything to do with it?

[coolyourjets]

Originally Posted by Major

No I don't. There's a lot of money involved in hyping the Chinese coronavirus. They are jumping on the bandwagon.

Now answer my question, where were you and everyone else for the much worse H1N1 virus? Did the fact that we had a savior as president and a complicit press have anything to do with it?

https://www.livescience.com/covid-19...swine-flu.html

It's science. And yes the dinosaurs existed and no, the earth is not flat.

[Major]

Originally Posted by coolyourjets

https://www.livescience.com/covid-19...swine-flu.html

It's science. And yes the dinosaurs existed and no, the earth is not flat.

The article proves my point, as of TODAY, the raw numbers for H1N1 was much worse. I know science and I know math. I went to college for engineering.

[thinkxingu]

Hahahaha!


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[Lakegeezer]

The summer is probably going to be tougher than most people can remember, but in my view, there are bright spots....

1. More people with second homes in the lakes region will take shelter here, and earlier than usual. Schools that have switched to virtual for the rest of the year mean no waiting until late June to opening up. This will bring more business than normal to the those that are able to stay open.
2. Unlike previous epidemics, we have high-speed internet available in most areas. This means people can learn what businesses are open and order products and services online. It doesn't make the economy boom, but keeps it from sinking as low as it could have.
3. The lake is great for social distanced entertainment. The beaches won't be packed, but families can enjoy together time out on the water.
4. There is hope that the scientific and medical communities will come up with treatments before the summer that while not stopping the virus, lower the risk of it becoming serious.
5. The storm is still brewing and the lakes region will likely be hit hard, but after it is over, people will be wanting to make up for lost time. There won't be as much disposal income, but the lakes region will be an attractive place to spend what is available.

In the words of Coach Belichick, "It is what it is". Now let's win the game.

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by Major

The article proves my point, as of TODAY, the raw numbers for H1N1 was much worse. I know science and I know math. I went to college for engineering.

Well, I know science and I know math, too, and I know you can’t compare numbers for a pandemic which has run its course, and one that is still developing. You also can’t ignore everything that you don’t like or agree with. That’s not very scientific.


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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

The summer is probably going to be tougher than most people can remember, but in my view, there are bright spots....

1. More people with second homes in the lakes region will take shelter here, and earlier than usual. Schools that have switched to virtual for the rest of the year mean no waiting until late June to opening up. This will bring more business than normal to the those that are able to stay open.
2. Unlike previous epidemics, we have high-speed internet available in most areas. This means people can learn what businesses are open and order products and services online. It doesn't make the economy boom, but keeps it from sinking as low as it could have.
3. The lake is great for social distanced entertainment. The beaches won't be packed, but families can enjoy together time out on the water.
4. There is hope that the scientific and medical communities will come up with treatments before the summer that while not stopping the virus, lower the risk of it becoming serious.
5. The storm is still brewing and the lakes region will likely be hit hard, but after it is over, people will be wanting to make up for lost time. There won't be as much disposal income, but the lakes region will be an attractive place to spend what is available.

In the words of Coach Belichick, "It is what it is". Now let's win the game.

Agreed on most points. I'm thinking that those who own homes will spend more time at the lake, and those who do not will spend far less, a fraction of last year. If I owned a business dependent on tourist dollars, I'd be estimating the pain of deciding now to stay shuttered vs making the financial commitment to open and then risking a summer with 0-50% of typical revenue.

Like a number of others on this board, I work in drug development. I'm sure they would agree with me that there is zero chance of even an already existing drug to be proven effective and manufactured for all by July 1, 2020. Even July 1, 2021 would be fast.

[The Real BigGuy]

Originally Posted by Major

It's tough, but I make the most of it on weekends. When I'm down here, I'm here to work. The last few days I've had a chance to catch up with the Forum, which as I can tell by the responses to my posts, everyone is thrilled!

Personally, I’m glad you have time to input your thoughts. I may not agree with you, and may even think your positions are crazy, but if everyone had the same point of view the forum would be awfully boring. Keep up the ridiculous comments (sorry, I just had to&#129322



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[Major]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

Well, I know science and I know math, too, and I know you can’t compare numbers for a pandemic which has run its course, and one that is still developing. You also can’t ignore everything that you don’t like or agree with. That’s not very scientific.


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You are right you cannot compare numbers for H1N1 and the Chinese coronavirus until the Chinese coronavirus has run its course. Here are the FACTS to date:

H1N1
Estimated cases worldwide -- 700,000,000 to 1,400,000,000
Deaths worldwide -- 151,700 to 575,400
Estimated cases U.S. -- 1,000,000
Deaths U.S. -- 7,070 to 13,930

Chinese coronavirus
Estimated cases worldwide -- 287,125
Deaths worldwide -- 11,890
Estimated cases U.S. -- 19,823
Deaths U.S. -- 276

These numbers clearly support the notion that perhaps the Chinese coronavirus is not as severe as the H1N1 virus. Perhaps our response was excessive and an overreaction.

Anyway, I ran into a small business owner who had to lay off her entire staff and is looking for loans to keep her business afloat. The toll on small businesses is astronomical. I don't understand why it is such heresy to consider, perhaps, there may have been a better, more metered approach.

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by Major

You are right you cannot compare numbers for H1N1 and the Chinese coronavirus until the Chinese coronavirus has run its course. Here are the FACTS to date:

H1N1
Estimated cases worldwide -- 700,000,000 to 1,400,000,000
Deaths worldwide -- 151,700 to 575,400
Estimated cases U.S. -- 1,000,000
Deaths U.S. -- 7,070 to 13,930

Chinese coronavirus
Estimated cases worldwide -- 287,125
Deaths worldwide -- 11,890
Estimated cases U.S. -- 19,823
Deaths U.S. -- 276

These numbers clearly support the notion that perhaps the Chinese coronavirus is not as severe as the H1N1 virus. Perhaps our response was excessive and an overreaction.

Anyway, I ran into a small business owner who had to lay off her entire staff and is looking for loans to keep her business afloat. The toll on small businesses is astronomical. I don't understand why it is such heresy to consider, perhaps, there may have been a better, more metered approach.

Well, I won’t compare numbers until the Coronavirus has run its course. You have to remember that testing in many countries is still limited, so the estimates are likely very low.

My heart breaks for all the small businesses and people who are seriously financially affected by this. My niece thinks student loans should be forgiven at this point. Mind you, she’s still getting paid while working remotely. If I were up north, I’d smack her in her self-absorbed face.


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[Lakegeezer]

Originally Posted by Major

You are right you cannot compare numbers for H1N1 and the coronavirus until the coronavirus has run its course. Here are the FACTS to date:

coronavirus
Estimated cases worldwide -- 287,125
Deaths worldwide -- 11,890
Estimated cases U.S. -- 19,823
Deaths U.S. -- 276

The Major’s post got me interested in doing some research. The CDC has a great archive article on the N1H1 flu. https://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/cdcresponse.htm.

There are significant differences in the H1N1 pandemic of 2009 and the Covid-19 cases of 2020.

With N1H1, several effective anti-viral drugs that were quickly identified, greatly reducing the fear and need to shut down the economy. About a third of people over 60 were immune, having been exposed to similar viruses along the way. Finally, the government response was quick. Masks and anti-viral drugs were shipping from stockpiles within 10 days of the virus identification. There was more confidence and understanding of how to deal with it, so less panic. Within 5 months, there was a vaccine and by the end of the year, most of the people at greatest risk were protected.

This Covid-19 epidemic is still out of control. No antiviral drugs approved for treatment, shortage of protective gear and testing kits and no known groups with immunity. At this point, it could just vanish, or maybe the scientific community will some up with some solutions, but it seems likely that things will get worse for at least the next month or so. Let’s hope we can reboot the economy soon.

In just eight hours after the Major’s post of Covid-19 global numbers, things are different. Instead of 287,125 global cases, there are 303,816. 16,691 more, or 5.8% more. Instead of 11,890 global deaths, there are 12,996. 1106, or 9% more. In eight hours.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by gillygirl

My niece thinks student loans should be forgiven at this point. Mind you, she’s still getting paid while working remotely. If I were up north, I’d smack her in her self-absorbed face.

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Ask your niece if they should forgive mortgages and car loans too. I would be all in!

[kawishiwi]

Originally Posted by Major

Unfortunately, our president had no choice. The media and social media has whipped us up into such a frenzy that politically he could not take more metered actions to avoid destroying what otherwise was a booming economy. I'm not sure he really believes it. However, he has to politically.

I am not impressed by the so-called experts, who for the most part are government employees who have a vested interest in making a mountain out of a molehill. I've made the comparison before, but there are so-called experts who say that manmade climate change is an existential threat.

I've asked this many times with absolutely no response. Where was all of the hand waving and hysteria for the much worse H1N1 virus? Don't tell me the Chinese coronavirus is worse, the comparative numbers do not bear it out. Where are the Forum threads demanding that we destroy our economy to save lives.

As stated before by many others, I think we've exhausted this topic. I have my opinion, everyone else has theirs. I am as resolute if not more so than before just as others are with their views. The one good thing from this is that the President's approval rating is skyrocketing, which given the press against him, is a pretty good result. Even political rivals are praising him. I think history will treat him well on this.

So, what you are saying is, we WAIT until covid-19 actually becomes worse than H1N1, THEN we do something about it?

I think this will be what history remembers about Trump...

February 26th, 2020. President Trump: “When you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done.”

March 20th, 2020. Confirmed cases in the United States rise to 16,064.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

I'm with you on it being an opinion.

But it is an opinion shared by virtually every medical and political leader in the entire world. This would include Donald Trump, and what I would assume is your favorite TV source, Fox News. Here's an overview of how their opinions have evolved over the past few weeks. You can skip the editorial if you'd like to avoid bias, but the video clips are all facts (i.e. it's a fact that certain people said certain things at certain times).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/video...8c0_video.html

I look forward to your opinion on their more recent statements

Yep it's just Fox News..... just watch how the rest of the media has remained consistent in their reporting as well. No political agenda on display there either. How ironic the last clip is of the master of objectivity himself Jim Acosta.

https://twitter.com/mrctv/status/1238186498433966081

[Major]

Originally Posted by kawishiwi

So, what you are saying is, we WAIT until covid-19 actually becomes worse than H1N1, THEN we do something about it?

I think this will be what history remembers about Trump...

February 26th, 2020. President Trump: “When you have 15 people, and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that’s a pretty good job we’ve done.”

March 20th, 2020. Confirmed cases in the United States rise to 16,064.

So the only option we had was to destroy a thriving economy? There was no intermediate, or metered option? I'm no genius, but 16,064 seems to be a lot less than over 1,000,000. Is there any potential that the Chinese coronavirus may be less of a crisis than the H1N1 crisis?

[erick26]

Originally Posted by Major

So the only option we had was to destroy a thriving economy? There was no intermediate, or metered option? I'm no genius, but 16,064 seems to be a lot less than over 1,000,000. Is there any potential that the Chinese coronavirus may be less of a crisis than the H1N1 crisis?

Or that the numbers are lower because most people obeyed the social distancing and reduced the spread. Chicken and egg here as people that think we are over reacting will push the case further based on the reduction and we will never know how bad it would have been if we did nothing. Chill for a couple of weeks and keep your distance and let this thing play out. The longer people keep doing their everyday thing the longer it will drag out and the worse the repercussions will be. If they had just shut everything down for 2 weeks in the beginning we would be mostly through this and starting to get back to normal but instead we are stuck in the middle and just pointing fingers at each other. It sucks for everyone - do what you really feel is right as long as you can sleep better at night. I’m taking one for the team and I hope in the long term it’s the right decision.


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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

Yep it's just Fox News..... just watch how the rest of the media has remained consistent in their reporting as well. No political agenda on display there either. How ironic the last clip is of the master of objectivity himself Jim Acosta.

https://twitter.com/mrctv/status/1238186498433966081

I did not post that just to troll my Fox-ish pen pals on consistency. (I try to refrain from that sort of thing.)

I posted it to push Major and others to recognize that even Fox News asserts that we are in a crisis situation. I hope all of you will come around soon to the current Fox talking points from the video.

[Major]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

I did not post that just to troll my Fox-ish pen pals on consistency. (I try to refrain from that sort of thing.)

I posted it to push Major and others to recognize that even Fox News asserts that we are in a crisis situation. I hope all of you will come around soon to the current Fox talking points from the video.

Nope. I’m more resolute than ever. This is completely overkill, especially in New Hampshire.


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[erick26]

Originally Posted by Major

Nope. I’m more resolute than ever. This is completely overkill, especially in New Hampshire.


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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Major

Nope. I’m more resolute than ever. This is completely overkill, especially in New Hampshire.


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You take "live free or die" to the extreme.

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[Charlie T]

Originally Posted by Major

Nope. I’m more resolute than ever. This is completely overkill, especially in New Hampshire.

Sadly you will never know or be held responsible for the damage you may be doing to others due to your stubbornness, You have dug in and don't appear to even consider any view other than your own. you refuse to put the needs of society over your personal needs and desires.

I understand the need to keep your business alive but consider this, Is your profession to be found in the graphic below?

I too own a business and my plan is to furlough my staff in order to keep them and their families safe. I'll to the best of my ability continue to pay my employees as loyalty is a 2 way street. Those of us who can work remotely from home have an obligation to society to do so.

Please minimize your travel and don't expose others due to your need to be right. With any luck we will keep this somewhat contained and those of you who call it a hoax will get to say "I told you so". The alternative is frightening.

]

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Charlie T

Sadly you will never know or be held responsible for the damage you may be doing to others due to your stubbornness, You have dug in and don't appear to even consider any view other than your own. you refuse to put the needs of society over your personal needs and desires.

I understand the need to keep your business alive but consider this, Is your profession to be found in the graphic below?

I too own a business and my plan is to furlough my staff in order to keep them and their families safe. I'll to the best of my ability continue to pay my employees as loyalty is a 2 way street. Those of us who can work remotely from home have an obligation to society to do so.

Please minimize your travel and don't expose others due to your need to be right. With any luck we will keep this somewhat contained and those of you who call it a hoax will get to say "I told you so". The alternative is frightening.

]

A parrot doesn't really think for himself. He just repeats what ever comes out of his trainers mouth.

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[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Ask your niece if they should forgive mortgages and car loans too. I would be all in!

My sister sarcastically asked about her car loan, and her son reemed her a new one. Needless to say, he got a phone call from me.

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[Major]

Originally Posted by Charlie T

Sadly you will never know or be held responsible for the damage you may be doing to others due to your stubbornness, You have dug in and don't appear to even consider any view other than your own. you refuse to put the needs of society over your personal needs and desires.

I understand the need to keep your business alive but consider this, Is your profession to be found in the graphic below?

I too own a business and my plan is to furlough my staff in order to keep them and their families safe. I'll to the best of my ability continue to pay my employees as loyalty is a 2 way street. Those of us who can work remotely from home have an obligation to society to do so.

Please minimize your travel and don't expose others due to your need to be right. With any luck we will keep this somewhat contained and those of you who call it a hoax will get to say "I told you so". The alternative is frightening.

As of right now, 0.01% of Americans have tested positive for the Chinese coronavirus. I’m pretty sure I’ve infected no one, nor am I likely to be infected. This is especially true in NH where the rates are much lower. This is a complete overreaction. The numbers support my position.


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[Major]

Originally Posted by Major

As of right now, 0.01% of Americans have tested positive for the Chinese coronavirus. I’m pretty sure I’ve infected no one, nor am I likely to be infected. This is especially true in NH where the rates are much lower. This is a complete overreaction. The numbers support my position.


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By the way, I look forward to going to my office in Boston tomorrow.


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[Glendale Deli Boy]

I currently live in Hong Kong where we have been dealing with the virus for a couple of months now. Fortunately, Hong Kong was well prepared and moved quickly early on to contain the virus as best as possible. Crucial to their plan was early testing, transparency, quarantining protocols, and reduced social interaction. They asked people to work from home as much as possible, stay off public transportation as much as possible, and wear masks. Today almost 100 percent of folks wear masks when outside or in close quarters with others.

No disrespect intended but had Major’s approach been the prevailing practice two months ago here in HK, it is indisputable that the number of positive cases, strain on the medical system, deaths, and economic damage here would have been far greater. Because HK and its people took action early on they were able to keep restaurants and businesses open, and people are going about their lives and not subject to stay at home orders. That said some small businesses and restaurants have shuttered since there are no tourists and many folks are choosing to stay closer to home.

I pray that we don’t see an Italy type scenario in parts of the US. It is truly horrifying when doctors have to decide who lives and dies based on the number of ventilators they have access to. Hopefully it never gets that bad in the U.S.

Stay safe all. Wishing everybody the best and I can’t wait until this passes and I can get back to the Lake, my favorite place in the world.

[ApS]

Well, now we've heard it from Hong Kong itself.

Two new developments:

1) If pressed by unacceptable results after this "sheltering", government has the ability to follow a person who has contracted Covid-19 by cellphone.
Science Magazine:

"...owners of any other phones that recently came close to that phone get notified of their risk of infection and are advised to self-isolate".

(Close=within one-meter distance).

2) An Israeli doctor volunteering in Italy posted, "We're not sending Covid-19 victims over the age of 60 to our hospital's ventilators".

[Glendale Deli Boy]

Originally Posted by ApS

Well, now we've heard it from Hong Kong itself.

Two new developments:

1) If pressed by unacceptable results after this "sheltering", government has the ability to follow a person who has contracted Covid-19 by cellphone.
Science Magazine:

In Hong Kong anybody arriving from overseas is fitted with a wristband tracker and required to self-quarantine for 14 days at home. They download an app and the government can track whether they break quarantine. This system is effective but might be a bridge too far for the U.S.!!!

[JEEPONLY]

Originally Posted by Major

Nope. I’m more resolute than ever. This is completely overkill, especially in New Hampshire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8smllfYB9KY

Demoted!

[Reilly]

Originally Posted by Major

By the way, I look forward to going to my office in Boston tomorrow.


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Pretty sure & Likely are not positive words ??? Do us all a favor & stay in Boston & pretty sure its safer there & your not likely to be infected

[Billy Bob]

When you walked into the empty train station did it ever cross your mind that you might be on the wrong side of this issue ?

[The Real BigGuy]

Let me answer for him🤪: NEVER!


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[thinkxingu]

Well, I mean, if it's empty he's social distancing!

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[Major]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Well, I mean, if it's empty he's social distancing!

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Unfortunately, and I'm not making this up, that morning when I entered the Kendall Square station, a meth head was waiting at the kiosk. He at least had the courtesy to ask me if he could jump through behind me. I said I don't care. If you look closely you can see him on the left-hand side of the picture. I have to admit I was a little worried about being so close to him, but I would have felt that way under the threat of Chinese coronavirus or not.

[thinkxingu]

I thought meth was a backwoods drug?!

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[The Real BigGuy]

MA governor just issued shelter in place order closing all non-essential businesses.


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[The Real BigGuy]

Sorry, it’s a stay-at-home advisory thru 4/7. Still closes non-essential business “according to federal guidelines”


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[Biggd]

That's the straw that broke the camel's back. Major is going to off the rails now.🤣

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[Hillcountry]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

I thought meth was a backwoods drug?!

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Look up and watch “Breaking Bad” on Netflix...we are binge watching it and in addition, “Better Call Saul” started a new season...9pm Monday’s on AMC!
Great stuff!

[Descant]

Originally Posted by Major

By the way, I look forward to going to my office in Boston tomorrow.

I thought you were going to FL? Trip cancelled?

[Major]

Originally Posted by Descant

I thought you were going to FL? Trip cancelled?

Trip got postponed to May 7th. Hopefully things will be okay then.

Wrapping up at work today. We just found out that our building isn't closing, so I will be coming into work after my dentist's and doctor's appointments this week. Most likely next week. That is unless there are armed guards protecting the building! Hard to enforce since essential personnel isn't defined.

[Wifi-1]

Boy, what some people will risk to say "I told you so", after the fact

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Major

Trip got postponed to May 7th. Hopefully things will be okay then.

Wrapping up at work today. We just found out that our building isn't closing, so I will be coming into work after my dentist's and doctor's appointments this week. Most likely next week. That is unless there are armed guards protecting the building! Hard to enforce since essential personnel isn't defined.

Thank God the lawyers will be able to get to work

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Thank God the lawyers will be able to get to work

Why? Do you think that would stop them from billing you at the customary hourly rate?

[JEEPONLY]

Originally Posted by Major

Trip got postponed to May 7th. Hopefully things will be okay then.

What "things" will be OK?

[Mr. V]

Thank God the lawyers will be able to get to work

I am not going to the office daily due to the pandemic.

Besides, out west the courts are closed, people have hunkered down for the duration.

[Major]

Originally Posted by JEEPONLY

Trip got postponed to May 7th. Hopefully things will be okay then.

What "things" will be OK?

Mainly the restaurants and Pompano Beach being open.

[The Real BigGuy]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Thank God the lawyers will be able to get to work

Not all lawyers. My daughter’s law office is shut down.

Be interesting to see if/how MA enforces the order. A friend of my daughter’s is a pharmacist and has a letter from CVS that reads like driving pass.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Trip got postponed to May 7th. Hopefully things will be okay then.

Wrapping up at work today. We just found out that our building isn't closing, so I will be coming into work after my dentist's and doctor's appointments this week. Most likely next week. That is unless there are armed guards protecting the building! Hard to enforce since essential personnel isn't defined.

For a purported lawyer running a business, you are irresponsible. You said just a couple days ago that you wouldn’t take this seriously until there are 1500 deaths in the US. There was 100 in one day, and everyone (except perhaps you) acknowledges this is going to get much worse before it gets better, and that assumes people are not idiots and start accepting their collective responsibility to their neighbors to stay home.

It is people like you that are causing this to spread beyond the capacity of our medical system and are literally killing people. I hope your doctor’s appointment is not for a preexisting medical condition.

If people would just stay home and let this get under control, we could get through this faster and with less loss of life. But that’s apparently not your concern (until it is, when its too late and hits you or your family).

[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Hard to enforce since essential personnel isn't defined.

And, by the way, Major, if you are so convinced of the inapplicability of the Governor’s order to you and your disregard for the consensus of the ENTIRE public health community, step out from behind your screen name. Tell us your name and your law firm. If you have the courage of your convictions, I am sure your clients would agree with your decisions and leadership here.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

For a purported lawyer running a business, you are irresponsible. You said just a couple days ago that you wouldn’t take this seriously until there are 1500 deaths in the US. There was 100 in one day, and everyone (except perhaps you) acknowledges this is going to get much worse before it gets better, and that assumes people are not idiots and start accepting their collective responsibility to their neighbors to stay home.

It is people like you that are causing this to spread beyond the capacity of our medical system and are literally killing people. I hope your doctor’s appointment is not for a preexisting medical condition.

If people would just stay home and let this get under control, we could get through this faster and with less loss of life. But that’s apparently not your concern (until it is, when its too late and hits you or your family).

He is causing the spread? That is a tremendous accusation.

Major is doing nothing wrong and not breaking any laws. His job was deemed essential and he is going to work and taking care of his business.

All he needs to be is vigilant as he goes about work. For you to accuse him is completely off base. Your should go after ALL the essential workers in that case.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by joey2665

He is causing the spread? That is a tremendous accusation.

Major is doing nothing wrong and not breaking any laws. His job was deemed essential and he is going to work and taking care of his business.

All he needs to be is vigilant as he goes about work. For you to accuse him is completely off base. Your should go after ALL the essential workers in that case.


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His business is not an essential business. The entire Boston legal community is shut down, and Major decided it doesn’t apply to him. From the governor’s order as to what constitutes essential for lawyers:

Professional services (such as legal and accounting services) and payroll and employee benefit services, when necessary to assist in compliance with legally mandated activities and critical sector services or where failure to provide such services during the time of the order would result in significant prejudice.

The fact is that he can work from home, but chooses not to, which demonstrates the point.

If you are not part of the solution on this, you are the problem.

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

His business is not an essential business. The entire Boston legal community is shut down, and Major decided it doesn’t apply to him. From the governor’s order as to what constitutes essential for lawyers:

Professional services (such as legal and accounting services) and payroll and employee benefit services, when necessary to assist in compliance with legally mandated activities and critical sector services or where failure to provide such services during the time of the order would result in significant prejudice.

The fact is that he can work from home, but chooses not to, which demonstrates the point.

If you are not part of the solution on this, you are the problem.

And you know this? You know his firm and the type of law it practices? You know he can work from home?

That’s a lot to know about a person from some posts on a forum page


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[Major]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

And, by the way, Major, if you are so convinced of the inapplicability of the Governor’s order to you and your disregard for the consensus of the ENTIRE public health community, step out from behind your screen name. Tell us your name and your law firm. If you have the courage of your convictions, I am sure your clients would agree with your decisions and leadership here.

Calm down Cow! Geez, what are you going to do? Dox me and call my clients? Lt Gov Dan Patrick (Texas) just issued a statement that summarizes my position on this exactly. Yes we may shorten the curve or whatever metaphor is being bantered about but at what cost? Our children’s and grandchildren’s future?

By the way most of my work is for Raytheon, Schneider Electric and Illinois Tool Works. I highly doubt they would care one bit what you think. Believe it or not they love me!


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by joey2665

And you know this? You know his firm and the type of law it practices? You know he can work from home?

That’s a lot to know about a person from some posts on a forum page


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Actually, Joey, he said it himself. On a different thread where he lambasted the closing of restaurants, he said that he and his entire firm can work remotely. So hard to see how being in the office can be “necessary.”

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Major

Calm down Cow! Geez, what are you going to do? Dox me and call my clients? Lt Gov Dan Patrick (Texas) just issued a statement that summarizes my position on this exactly. Yes we may shorten the curve or whatever metaphor is being bantered about but at what cost? Our children’s and grandchildren’s future?

By the way most of my work is for Raytheon, Schneider Electric and Illinois Tool Works. I highly doubt they would care one bit what you think. Believe it or not they love me!


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I agree 1000%. We are sacrificing the future on many for the potential benefit of a few.


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[Major]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

Actually, Joey, he said it himself. On a different thread where he lambasted the closing of restaurants, he said that he and his entire firm can work remotely. So hard to see how being in the office can be “necessary.”

Paying bills for one thing. Only partners can write checks. Dealing with mail is another. There are countless things that need to be done in the office. We cannot just vacate the office for two weeks. Deadlines don’t go away because of the Chinese coronavirus.


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[CowTimes]

Originally Posted by Major

Paying bills for one thing. Only partners can write checks. Dealing with mail is another. There are countless things that need to be done in the office. We cannot just vacate the office for two weeks. Deadlines don’t go away because of the Chinese coronavirus.


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Got it. So it is not to provide legal services “when necessary to assist in compliance with legally mandated activities and critical sector services or where failure to provide such services during the time of the order would result in significant prejudice.”

Just to be clear here, the governor’s order is unambiguous, and you’re just choosing to disregard it. So, yes, Joey, he is doing something illegal.

[Major]

Originally Posted by CowTimes

Got it. So it is not to provide legal services “when necessary to assist in compliance with legally mandated activities and critical sector services or where failure to provide such services during the time of the order would result in significant prejudice.”

Just to be clear here, the governor’s order is unambiguous, and you’re just choosing to disregard it. So, yes, Joey, he is doing something illegal.

Certainly failure to perform services in my case would result in significant prejudice, i.e., loss of rights. My work involves critical sector services.


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