Sununu - 1,000 Cases Per Day - Covid-19

[joey2665]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I agree there is more control and less panic, at least here in New England but these health care workers are working 24/7 to keep people alive. The least we can do is help the cause by following the advice of the CDC.
My daughter is an RN, sorry but I will take her advice on this subject over yours.

I never said not to take any advice or follow any precautions. People should be diligent and taking care of themselves and others but I think it’s important to remember everybody has different levels of diligence I’m comfortable seeing my family With 20 people others might not be but that our choice everybody has to make their own

[uglytunasaloona]

Personal hospital experience:

My blood pressure and heart rate went haywire last Sunday. My wife took me to LRGH. From what I could tell there were several other people in the emergency room but it did not look like there was any wait to get in. No one was in the waiting area.They told me they do not have any cardiologists on staff and would send me to Concord Hosptal (a very sad state of affairs). They had to test me for covid before they could send me and it came up negative (GREAT!). I was in a room by my self in Concord (not the ICU or CCU) and I wore a mask when not sleeping. No mask when they checked my vital signs in the middle of the night or during any of the myriad tests and procedures. From what I could tell when they were wheeling around me there was a number of empty rooms. I was there until Tuesday and took numerous trips for procedures. Are they overwhelmed? I can't state definitively. With increased positives. Who knows? Just one person's experience.

[Garcia]

Originally Posted by joey2665

I never said not to take any advice or follow any precautions. People should be diligent and taking care of themselves and others but I think it’s important to remember everybody has different levels of diligence I’m comfortable seeing my family With 20 people others might not be but that our choice everybody has to make their own

I follow your logic and agree, to a point. I just sent out a note to the parents at my school. I did not tell people what they can and cannot do, but tried to make sure everyone understands that actions can have unintended consequences. If as a result of a Thanksgiving gathering a case of covid ends up in school, we have no choice but to go remote; we are very small and keeping all grades and staff apart is not possible. Right now we are one of the few area schools that is open full time; we want to keep it that way. One thing that seems odd to me is the spread is not occurring in schools, but is occurring in bars, restaurants, and gyms, Yet the focus is on closing schools and keeping other things open. Shouldn't we be closing the places where we know spread is occurring and allow schools to stay open? I don't have answers, just some Saturday thoughts.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Garcia

I follow your logic and agree, to a point. I just sent out a note to the parents at my school. I did not tell people what they can and cannot do, but tried to make sure everyone understands that actions can have unintended consequences. If as a result of a Thanksgiving gathering a case of covid ends up in school, we have no choice but to go remote; we are very small and keeping all grades and staff apart is not possible. Right now we are one of the few area schools that is open full time; we want to keep it that way. One thing that seems odd to me is the spread is not occurring in schools, but is occurring in bars, restaurants, and gyms, Yet the focus is on closing schools and keeping other things open. Shouldn't we be closing the places where we know spread is occurring and allow schools to stay open? I don't have answers, just some Saturday thoughts.

Students are definitely spreading it through sports and activities, but it's impossible to tell if at school. My school said we'd stay hybrid unless there was proof in-school transmission. The problem is that it's impossible, given the timing/asymptomatic potential/incubation period, to know where the spread actually occurred.

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[Garcia]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Students are definitely spreading it through sports and activities, but it's impossible to tell if at school. My school said we'd stay hybrid unless there was proof in-school transmission. The problem is that it's impossible, given the timing/asymptomatic potential/incubation period, to know where the spread actually occurred.

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Sports and activities, absolutely. Many schools here are curtailing sports but sports outside of school are continuing.

[Mr. V]

The virus cannot be stopped until a vaccine is in place and we all take it.

Until then, the best that can be done is to try to keep it at bay.

The interim question, or course, is "Which is of higher priority: saving lives or saving the economy?"

[TheProfessor]

Catch 22.

Might not be any economy if lives are not saved.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

Catch 22.

Might not be any economy if lives are not saved.

Yes--and your Moultonborough restaurant closure thread is a great example of how this works--one asymptomatic(?) person goes out to dinner on Saturday, and two days latter the restaurant is shut for weeks and two waiters are infected.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

The virus cannot be stopped until a vaccine is in place and we all take it.

Until then, the best that can be done is to try to keep it at bay.

The interim question, or course, is "Which is of higher priority: saving lives or saving the economy?"

#1 for me would be saving lives, #2 would be saving the economy. But I'm sure there are just as many people, maybe more, that would vote the other way around.

[tis]

You really can't say that though. It's like the chicken and the egg. People will die from the virus or die because they can't work because of the virus. Despite what some progressive legislators think, the government can't pay everybody to stay home forever. And if the grocery stores aren't open because the workers are at home, I think most people would have a hard time finding food on their own. If truck drivers and essential workers stay home, how will we live? The society depends on people working beyond financial considerations.

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by tis

You really can't say that though. It's like the chicken and the egg. People will die from the virus or die because they can't work because of the virus. Despite what some progressive legislators think, the government can't pay everybody to stay home forever. And if the grocery stores aren't open because the workers are at home, I think most people would have a hard time finding food on their own. If truck drivers and essential workers stay home, how will we live? The society depends on people working beyond financial considerations.

Spot on Tis. If I wanted to live in North Korea, I’d just move there. People need to face reality....sometimes bad things happen to good people.

[Jdarby]

Originally Posted by tis

You really can't say that though. It's like the chicken and the egg. People will die from the virus or die because they can't work because of the virus. Despite what some progressive legislators think, the government can't pay everybody to stay home forever. And if the grocery stores aren't open because the workers are at home, I think most people would have a hard time finding food on their own. If truck drivers and essential workers stay home, how will we live? The society depends on people working beyond financial considerations.

People won’t die just because they contracted the virus. Heck, many that contract the virus won’t die! There seems to be a sentiment that it’s all or nothing. You either are fine or you die. There is a significant population in the middle that requires intensive medical care and resources in order to survive. Those people eat up valuable resources during their care and there is then a cascade effect on the entire healthcare system when it becomes overwhelmed. There will then be unnecessary and otherwise preventable deaths due to heart attacks, strokes, and other normally treatable and survivable illness and injury. So this isn’t just about people dying from COVID...it’s about people dying because of a healthcare system that is at or beyond capacity. Yes, I’ve read the anecdotal reports of people who sought care at the local hospitals and everything seemed normal. I’ve even spoken to a few healthcare workers from local facilities and heard positive stories. But all healthcare facilities are not created equal nor have all the necessary services for the critically ill. So some of these facilities are not the best litmus test. They can have 50 open beds but if they don’t have invasive cardiology services, good luck surviving your heart attack. Forget the transfer to a hospital that can actually treat you as they are at capacity due to COVID patients....it quickly becomes a slippery slope. Be well.

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[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by tis

You really can't say that though. It's like the chicken and the egg. People will die from the virus or die because they can't work because of the virus. Despite what some progressive legislators think, the government can't pay everybody to stay home forever. And if the grocery stores aren't open because the workers are at home, I think most people would have a hard time finding food on their own. If truck drivers and essential workers stay home, how will we live? The society depends on people working beyond financial considerations.

You kind of miss the point--staying home and social distancing does not need to be 100%. If everybody just cuts back, transmissions will fall. Grocery stores, trucks, etc, should all roll. But you might want to get your haircut less often, and skip the bars and rock concerts

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

You kind of miss the point--staying home and social distancing does not need to be 100%. If everybody just cuts back, transmissions will fall. Grocery stores, trucks, etc, should all roll. But you might want to get your haircut less often, and skip the bars and rock concerts

You should tell that to the hundreds of out of staters that were climbing Mt. Major on Saturday.

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

You should tell that to the hundreds of out of staters that were climbing Mt. Major on Saturday.

The upsetting hypocrisy is that most of those people came from a state with higher Covid numbers that has banned NH visitors.

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[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

The upsetting hypocrisy is that most of those people came from a state with higher Covid numbers that has banned NH visitors.

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Bingo. "Hypocrisy" is the key. It's bad enough having to listen to all this coming from NH "authorities", but when the out of state people start preaching their "holier than thou" compliance protocols while sitting in the State of NH, that's the epitome of hypocrisy.

[Merrymeeting]

Originally Posted by DEJ

How do you know where "most of those people came from"?

Because when you drive by the hundreds of cars parked along Rt. 11, most are from our neighboring state.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by DEJ

How do you know where "most of those people came from"?

License plate is a dead give away!

Dan

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Gentlemen...? Please stop. Please return to the recent post asking what to expect after crossing the state line. Thank you.. (#106)
��

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

Gentlemen...? Please stop. Please return to the recent post asking what to expect after crossing the state line. Thank you.. (#106)
��

Sorry, friend.

In any case, as someone who lives in NH and works in MA, I've been thinking a lot about my own activities. For example, I was supposed to get my hair cut and grab some egg nog at a local farm where I grew up, but I'm not supposed to.

On the one hand, there's no way to really enforce it and, honestly, it's annoying since I come from a state with lower numbers.

On the other hand, I don't want to be part of the problem.

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[Sue Doe-Nym]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Sorry, friend—just trying to point out what DEJ was doing when he tagged me in a few subsequent posts.

In any case, as someone who lives in NH and works in MA, I've been thinking a lot about my own activities. For example, I was supposed to get my hair cut and grab some egg nog at a local farm where I grew up, but I'm not supposed to.

On the one hand, there's no way to really enforce it and, honestly, it's annoying since I come from a state with lower numbers.

On the other hand, I don't want to be part of the problem.

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I hear you....it’s a dilemma, for sure. We are being reasonably careful. We’ll be tested at Huggins today, and drive to MA Thursday if tests are negative. Pain in the derrière, but we feel it’s the least we can do. Happy Thanksgiving to all, wherever you land....even if Marie C is your chef!

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

I hear you....it’s a dilemma, for sure. We are being reasonably careful. We’ll be tested at Huggins today, and drive to MA Thursday if tests are negative. Pain in the derrière, but we feel it’s the least we can do. Happy Thanksgiving to all, wherever you land....even if Marie C is your chef!

I forgot to add a couple things: because of my recent close contact with students who either tested positive or were close contacts of students who tested positive, I'm to be "rapidly tested" at school tomorrow.

This also means that my in-laws will not be joining us for Thanksgiving, which my wife is terribly disappointed by.

It's definitely a year to find solace in the little things—we baked sugar cookies as a family the other night, which was wonderful.

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[DEJ]

Hope your test is negative tomorrow think.
Going to be a different Thanksgiving at the DEJ house this year also, no family, just the two of us. Seems like the responsible thing to do at least for us anyway.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

You should tell that to the hundreds of out of staters that were climbing Mt. Major on Saturday.

Yes, this is a good point, and I would tell it to in-staters as well. One thing that too many people on both sides of the political spectrum have in common is the willingness to forget about the numbers when it suits them. "I have to protest for an important cause" is not much different than "Nobody's going to tell me to stay away from that bike rally", or "But Thanksgiving is my favorite holiday".

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Hypothetical journey Moultonborough to any town, MA via Everett and 3: the authorities can check EZ pass records, but only to state line as there aren’t any tolls once you’re in MA. Therefore, one could claim a visit to someone in Nashua, for instance. Once you have crossed into MA, however, are we expected to produce a negative COVID result? Will they put up roadblocks for out of state vehicles? Random stops? Sheesh! This is making Marie Callender entrees sound better and better. Seriously...does anyone know what to expect? Thanks.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

Hypothetical journey Moultonborough to any town, MA via Everett and 3: the authorities can check EZ pass records, but only to state line as there aren’t any tolls once you’re in MA. Therefore, one could claim a visit to someone in Nashua, for instance. Once you have crossed into MA, however, are we expected to produce a negative COVID result? Will they put up roadblocks for out of state vehicles? Random stops? Sheesh! This is making Marie Callender entrees sound better and better. Seriously...does anyone know what to expect? Thanks.

You can invite FLL over and you can eat outside like the pilgrims.

[pondguy]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

Hypothetical journey Moultonborough to any town, MA via Everett and 3: the authorities can check EZ pass records, but only to state line as there aren’t any tolls once you’re in MA. Therefore, one could claim a visit to someone in Nashua, for instance. Once you have crossed into MA, however, are we expected to produce a negative COVID result? Will they put up roadblocks for out of state vehicles? Random stops? Sheesh! This is making Marie Callender entrees sound better and better. Seriously...does anyone know what to expect? Thanks.

I recommend the turkey pot pie. Yum !

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Sue Doe-Nym

Hypothetical journey Moultonborough to any town, MA via Everett and 3: the authorities can check EZ pass records, but only to state line as there aren’t any tolls once you’re in MA. Therefore, one could claim a visit to someone in Nashua, for instance. Once you have crossed into MA, however, are we expected to produce a negative COVID result? Will they put up roadblocks for out of state vehicles? Random stops? Sheesh! This is making Marie Callender entrees sound better and better. Seriously...does anyone know what to expect? Thanks.

Hi Sue,

You will not see or experience anything different crossing between Mass and NH. There are no police, no checkpoints, or anything like that. Happy trails!

[Winilyme]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Hi Sue,

You will not see or experience anything different crossing between Mass and NH. There are no police, no checkpoints, or anything like that. Happy trails!

Is this the same regardless of where you travel in New England? We have a trip planned to an Airbnb in Maine immediately after Christmas (spending two nights in ME). We will leave CT Saturday, 12/26, traveling I95 through MA/NH into ME. We're trying to do the right thing by getting tested beforehand. Thing is, getting the test done within 72 hours of the day we arrive in ME seems problematic. That would require getting tested on Thursday, December 24 (if we even can on that day - Xmas eve) and hoping to get results by Saturday morning before we leave. That seems to be an iffy proposition given (1) all the other people probably trying to get tested then for the same reasons we are and (2) the fact that things could be slower due to holiday staff shortages and shutdowns. Wife says we should get tested on Monday, December 21 (to ensure that we get the tests back) but that wouldn't comply with the 72-hour rule. I guess the fall back would be that we do NOT get tested at all and simply not go anywhere when in Maine (self-quarantine). But sitting around a house isn't why we signed up to go there - - we could do that in CT.

Any suggestions? We want to do the right thing but if we can't do it perfectly, is anyone really checking?

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Winilyme

Is this the same regardless of where you travel in New England? We have a trip planned to an Airbnb in Maine immediately after Christmas (spending two nights in ME). We will leave CT Saturday, 12/26, traveling I95 through MA/NH into ME. We're trying to do the right thing by getting tested beforehand. Thing is, getting the test done within 72 hours of the day we arrive in ME seems problematic. That would require getting tested on Thursday, December 24 (if we even can on that day - Xmas eve) and hoping to get results by Saturday morning before we leave. That seems to be an iffy proposition given (1) all the other people probably trying to get tested then for the same reasons we are and (2) the fact that things could be slower due to holiday staff shortages and shutdowns. Wife says we should get tested on Monday, December 21 (to ensure that we get the tests back) but that wouldn't comply with the 72-hour rule. I guess the fall back would be that we do NOT get tested at all and simply not go anywhere when in Maine (self-quarantine). But sitting around a house isn't why we signed up to go there - - we could do that in CT.

Any suggestions? We want to do the right thing but if we can't do it perfectly, is anyone really checking?

I know there are no checkpoints on the road between Mass and Maine. I don't know what you will find on arrival in Maine--I have heard that people have been met with a chilly reception at some inns.

On the "right" thing to do--I think we need to recognize that some of the rules are good in spirit, but need to be adapted to reality. The COVID test is a good example. I think you should be tested as late as possible while still allowing time to receive your result before departure. But that may not match the letter of the law or get you past a hotel clerk.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

I know there are no checkpoints on the road between Mass and Maine. I don't know what you will find on arrival in Maine--I have heard that people have been met with a chilly reception at some inns.

On the "right" thing to do--I think we need to recognize that some of the rules are good in spirit, but need to be adapted to reality. The COVID test is a good example. I think you should be tested as late as possible while still allowing time to receive your result before departure. But that may not match the letter of the law or get you past a hotel clerk.

If the hotel or inn took your money for a reservation knowing all along you were from a different state they shouldn’t have any reason to be chilly...

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Originally Posted by Winilyme

Is this the same regardless of where you travel in New England? We have a trip planned to an Airbnb in Maine immediately after Christmas (spending two nights in ME). We will leave CT Saturday, 12/26, traveling I95 through MA/NH into ME. We're trying to do the right thing by getting tested beforehand. Thing is, getting the test done within 72 hours of the day we arrive in ME seems problematic. That would require getting tested on Thursday, December 24 (if we even can on that day - Xmas eve) and hoping to get results by Saturday morning before we leave. That seems to be an iffy proposition given (1) all the other people probably trying to get tested then for the same reasons we are and (2) the fact that things could be slower due to holiday staff shortages and shutdowns. Wife says we should get tested on Monday, December 21 (to ensure that we get the tests back) but that wouldn't comply with the 72-hour rule. I guess the fall back would be that we do NOT get tested at all and simply not go anywhere when in Maine (self-quarantine). But sitting around a house isn't why we signed up to go there - - we could do that in CT.

Any suggestions? We want to do the right thing but if we can't do it perfectly, is anyone really checking?

We were able to get tested in Wolfeboro (Huggins) and had negative results the next day. If you can schedule something similar for 12/23 in CT, hopefully you would have results in plenty of time. We printed out the results and had them in the glove compartment in case we were stopped going round trip NH to MA, but we didn’t need them. Good luck!

[Flylady]

Please remember that a negative test means only one thing! You are negative on the day the sample was collected. It is no guarantee that you have not picked up the virus the day of or after testing.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by Flylady

Please remember that a negative test means only one thing! You are negative on the day the sample was collected. It is no guarantee that you have not picked up the virus the day of or after testing.

There was a great piece on the radio a week ago describing the "Swiss Cheese Defense" against COVID. Each thing we do to reduce transmission--testing, face masks, closing bars, etc--is like a single piece of Swiss cheese--it has holes. But if we stack multiple slices atop each other, every new slice reduces the chance of something getting through the holes. So just keep a few slices between you and COVID, and your chances are really good.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by Flylady

Please remember that a negative test means only one thing! You are negative on the day the sample was collected. It is no guarantee that you have not picked up the virus the day of or after testing.

So why all the hubbub about getting tested?... seems like a waste of time.

Dan

[Winilyme]

Originally Posted by ishoot308

So why all the hubbub about getting tested?... seems like a waste of time.

Dan

See 'Swiss Cheese Defense' - post 120.

[Sue Doe-Nym]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Hi Sue,

You will not see or experience anything different crossing between Mass and NH. There are no police, no checkpoints, or anything like that. Happy trails!

Amazingly easy trip one way....hardly any traffic....just heavy rain. Hope it’s as easy on the return trip. Thanks for your comments, Flying

[gillygirl]

Originally Posted by tis

You really can't say that though. It's like the chicken and the egg. People will die from the virus or die because they can't work because of the virus. Despite what some progressive legislators think, the government can't pay everybody to stay home forever. And if the grocery stores aren't open because the workers are at home, I think most people would have a hard time finding food on their own. If truck drivers and essential workers stay home, how will we live? The society depends on people working beyond financial considerations.

But it’s not one or the other. It’s a middle ground where people go out for essentials, and hopefully plan well enough so those trips are infrequent, and then stay home or in relatively isolated situations until things settle down. Progressives aren’t asking for everyone to be paid while they stay at home. They’re realistic that some people in the workforce aren’t essential but can’t work from home, so they need a safety net until this blows over. Why are you trying to make this black or white, when life is never like that, Covid or not?

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[ApS]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

The virus cannot be stopped until a vaccine is in place and we all take it. Until then, the best that can be done is to try to keep it at bay. The interim question, or course, is "Which is of higher priority: saving lives or saving the economy?"

Vaccine is to get to health workers in a few weeks...

https://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/ar...eerepublic.com

[mswlogo]

Originally Posted by Mr. V

The virus cannot be stopped until a vaccine is in place and we all take it.

Until then, the best that can be done is to try to keep it at bay.

The interim question, or course, is "Which is of higher priority: saving lives or saving the economy?"

That's not quite true. It would eventually burn itself out. As did pandemics in past history. But the death toll would be very high and it could take 5, 10 years.